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Italy next European country to ban burka


Still Waters

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Italy is set to become the next European country to ban the burka after a government report ruled in favour of the proposed legislation.

MPs from the anti-immigration Northern League party, a member of Prime Minister Silvio Berlusconi’s ruling right wing coalition, have presented the proposal in a bill.

It comes just weeks after France banned the wearing of burkas and other forms of face veils - a decision which prompted al Qaeda terrorists to vow revenge.

An Interior Ministry report now being considered by the Constitutional Affairs Commission says that if introduced the law should make clear burkas and other face coverings were being banned not for 'religious reasons but for security reasons.'

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This isn't surprising at all considering the Northern League is a National Party with a racially motivated agenda to distance themselves from Southern Italy and make Milan the capital. I believe their proposition against the wearing of the burka is more racially motivated than ethical.

Edited by BlackRedLittleDevil
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This isn't surprising at all considering the Northern League is a National Party with a racially motivated agenda to distance themselves from Southern Italy and make Milan the capital. I believe their proposition against the wearing of the burka is more racially motivated than ethical.

How can it be 'racially motivated'? Islam isn't a race, it's a religion. Using that logic Islamic countries like Egypt that Saudi that actively discourage the teaching of christianity are racist.

Admittedly lots of muslims use it to further their own purposes including using it to pull the race card, as you have so brilliantly demonstrated above.

Edited by itsnotoutthere
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Oh this is going to cause confusion and it shows the ignorance of the law makers and the authors of this story. The law makers could be in trouble to if they use the wrong terminology and someone takes them to court.

There are different types of muslim face coverings for women .... the Burqua and the Abaya. The picture they show in the article is an Abaya. indonesian muslim women have their own style of covering, typically white although they don't often cover their faces.

If both are outlawed, they need to say that. Predominately, Saudi women wear Abaya's which may or may not include a face veil. Law makers and reporters look stupid when they use the wrong terminology.

This is a Burqa. I've seen women wearing them. I saw 2 or three women in them when I was in Turkey last summer, and I have in one insance seen a little girl, around the age of 9 I'd guess in a Burqa in Seattle. Those are the only instance where I can recall seeing women in Burqa's. Of course I've seen many many women in full Abaya's with the face veil. Most recently, two east African women (I'm guessing though, but they were clearly African, not Arab) at the Department of Licencing renewing car tags. Lord only knows how they could see to drive at all.

burqa.jpg

Edited by MissMelsWell
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How can it be 'racially motivated'? Islam isn't a race, it's a religion. Using that logic Islamic countries like Egypt that Saudi that actively discourage the teaching of christianity are racist.

Admittedly lots of muslims use it to further their own purposes including using it to pull the race card, as you have so brilliantly demonstrated above.

I agree its not racially motivated, that is just the accusation and tactic of those who support the tyrannical and destructor of all cultures multiculturalism.

Although I think banning the Burka would be good for slowing down and reversing the current immigration monstrosity we see today in the UK, as it would force many Islamic immigrants to reconsider coming here, or staying here, I would not agree with banning it as I strongly support a democracy.

I do however think that it should not be worn by teachers or DRs etc for the simple fact that its important those under their care see their faces. The laws of the UK, should apply to everyone living here, if you do not like that, simply get lost and live somewhere else. :ph34r:

Edited by Faeden
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Ok, so banning the burka (full body, beekeeper outfit) for security reasons works for me but at the same time it better be illegal under the same laws to wander around with a pillowcase over your head.

If this (below) isn't considered the same as a burka then I would say that the law is religiously biased.

Charlie-Brown-Ghost-Costume.jpg

Nibs

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Ok, so banning the burka (full body, beekeeper outfit) for security reasons works for me but at the same time it better be illegal under the same laws to wander around with a pillowcase over your head.

If this (below) isn't considered the same as a burka then I would say that the law is religiously biased.

Nibs

Excellent point!

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See, I just made myself look semi-stupid.... this is a good photograph explaining the difference.

The full dress of Saudi women is called an Abaya. The veil itself is called a niqab.

58754431-muslim-women.jpg

Top left to bottom right:

Hidjab (top left), a Niqab (top right) a Tchador (bottom left) and a Burqa (bottom right)

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how many countries in europe have now banned the burka or plan too? it seems the majority of citizens in these countries agree with the ban. - are politicians listening to the people.

Edited by stevewinn
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how many countries in europe have now banned the burka or plan too? it seems the majority of citizens in these countries agree with the ban. - are politicians listening to the people.

Have they banned the burka or all full head/body coverings?

Nibs

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how many countries in europe have now banned the burka or plan too? it seems the majority of citizens in these countries agree with the ban. - are politicians listening to the people.

Do they ever? .....Lisbon treaty anyone!

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Banning a form of control from within a religous sector is no bad thing i say, all it does is create a barrior between cultures. And an over whelming tense atmosphere between said groups of people, yes it is the right of the people to wear what they so choose, but the majority do it through pressure from elders to begin with, and that is wrong.

All countries should consider the ban and with that hopefully rub out this ancient and to be honest cruel form of religous control.

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Have they banned the burka or all full head/body coverings?

Nibs

Precisely. If they just ban the Burqa, then that's not gonna get them far. I was all over Italy last summer and didn't see a single woman in a Burqa and in fact only saw 2 in Turkey, a predominately muslim nation. I did see a few women in Niqab's in Italy though--but not many (and they were clearly tourists), and plenty in Turkey who also were largely tourists.

These lawmakers need to be MUCH more clear about their taxinomy... because right now, if they just ban the Burqa, it won't do anything about the women who wear Niqab's. LOL. The Devil is in the Details so to speak.

I don't have an opinion one way or another about whether they ban them. I haven't made up my mind. But if they're going to take such drastic steps to ban articles of clothing, they better get the terminology right.

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The Burqua is anti-social. I can't imagine that women who are not being forced by nutty sexist insecure freako husbands would wear one. There is a woman I see downtown almost everyday wearing one and it absolutley gives me the creeps. She is like some evil spirit gliding among the living. And Nibs, since the burqua is not proscribed in the koran it is not religious it is cultural.

Actually what the woman I see wearing is a tchador. Thanks MMW.

(and still creepier than the creepiest creep in creepville)

Edited by OverSword
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The Burqua is anti-social. I can't imagine that women who are not being forced by nutty sexist insecure freako husbands would wear one. There is a woman I see downtown almost everyday wearing one and it absolutley gives me the creeps. She is like some evil spirit gliding among the living. And Nibs, since the burqua is not proscribed in the koran it is not religious it is cultural.

Actually what the woman I see wearing is a tchador. Thanks MMW.

(and still creepier than the creepiest creep in creepville)

Oh I was in White Center a couple of years ago having breakfast at Young's Diner. There's an Afghanistani food mart right next to the diner which sells only imported arabic foods. I saw a guy hustling a little girl of about 9 years old out of that place who was dressed in a full Burqa. Oddly, it wasn't the traditional blue color you generally see the grown women wearing like the photo posted above. Her's was actually very ornate, olive green and blue, silk and trimmed with gold bullion braid. It was very clearly a Burqa though. The netted eyeslits, the one piece covering that literally looks like a ghosts costume from head to toe. (the Abaya is a 3 piece affair, but Burqa is just one piece).

That was creepy. This guy had a hold of that little girl and was attemping to use his whole body to shield her from anyone looking at her. It was just such an odd thing to see in Seattle. The women I saw in Turkey last summer were wearing the blue burqa made of heavy blue silk or cotton.

Our tour guide in Istanbul was a muslim woman but she chose not to wear traditional muslim garments and was in fact in jeans and a modest t-shirt... I could feel every muscle in her body tense up when she noticed that we noticed the women in the burqa's. She was pretty much seething and announced to us that the forced donning of a burqa or niqab in this day and age was an OUTRAGE to her and most other Turkish muslim women. I could almost feel her shaking at the sight of them. It was sorta weird. There's obviously tension in many muslim countries over the dress code. Not only is it a battle with other western cultures, but it seems to be a battle within their own cultures as well.

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58754431-muslim-women.jpg

The lady in the top right photo has sexy eyes. Oh mumma!!! :devil:

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The tchador, or something similar to it, is actually fairly common among a lot of different religions, even in some Christian women cover their heads with a head covering scarf (Mennonites do, and even many Catholic women will when in a Cathedral). Some hindu women wear a head covering that looks very much like a tchador, conservative jewish women will often cover their heads with scarves which look similar too.

The tchador doesn't bother me, it's just a scarf. The Abaya (with or without the Niqab), Burqa and other full robes which completely obscure the face seem very very uncessary. If women WANT to wear them, well, I guess that's their choice, but I don't want to see any woman have that choice made FOR her.

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The thing that gets me is the theory behind it is modesty, but if you are the only person around wearing something like this you draw attention. The woman I see wearing this extreme garb in seattle every day would probably just be another girl walking around in a head scarf if she was following the dictates of islam, and therefore not be much noticed by anyone, but I can see people get very uncomfortable whenever she walks by, and everyone notices her that's for sure. Seems like the outfit actually defeats the purpose, although now that I think about it, I wonder what she looks like naked! Just kidding! please no kill I.

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The thing that gets me is the theory behind it is modesty, but if you are the only person around wearing something like this you draw attention. [...] Seems like the outfit actually defeats the purpose, although now that I think about it, I wonder what she looks like naked! Just kidding! please no kill I.

It's kind of funny you mention this... it's suppose to be not necessarily for modesty reasons, but more for the apparent belief that men have no self control.

In all honesty, most Saudi women, when they leave their country--fold their Abaya's up and put them into their suitcase and don't put them back on again until they are a few minutes away from landing in Rhiad. When they're outside of their home country they tend to break out the blue jeans, the t-shirts, and kick it like most western women, athough they're generally more modest and some will even choose to wear the head scarf... covering the hair is a belief that has it's roots in the old testament of the Bible as well as the Qu'ran.

But full body coverings? And face coverings? Neither of those have any basis in any scripture that I've ever seen. The Burqa and Niqab are purely cultural.

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The lady in the top right photo has sexy eyes. Oh mumma!!! :devil:

Are you sure its a lady??:devil: Must be a Pompey supporter:blush:

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Yeah, the head scarf comes from the jews not wanting the sons of god taking thier daughters for wives. It was in the book of Enoch I believe that stated it was the hair of the daughters of men which attracted the angelic beings who left thier original state.

Are you sure its a lady??:devil: Must be a Pompey supporter:blush:

DUDE! :lol:
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I´m gonna start a new religion..lets call it Hockey/Ski-mask Defenders of The Faith..or something.

Everyone haft to wear a Jason mask (or a ski-mask for the less dogmatic, and for those practitioners in the northern hemispheres).

jason-voorhees.jpg

If so much as a single **cker even dare to protest against me wearing the hockey/ski-mask when I do my daily withdrawals at the local bank, or even breath a single syllable and dare challenge my rights to wear the mask passing customs, boarding the aeroplane at the airport I will scream bloody-murder and cry out against religious segregation and discrimination.

I will declare Jihad...or Ski-had, on the faithless dogs who refuses to see the true path, praise be Jason.......Jason Akbar.

...or maybe I just dont, and try to be a functioning part of the society and realise that not everyone are out to get me, and understand the arguments against wearing a mask in everyday situations.

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In a society that is supposed to be democratic and free people should be able to wear what they feel comfortable with. I dont understand why these european gov. have such a problem with a simple cloth. Live and let others live. It's not that a woman fully covered hurts anyone. Besides I think there are far bigger problems in societies than veils, especially in Italy...

Btw. Covering the face belongs to Islam, though it's also related to Persian culture. In fact it is a controversial issue between Islamic scholars if the faceveil is wajib (obligatory), or merely mustahab (recommended).In both cases- it exists.

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In a society that is supposed to be democratic and free people should be able to wear what they feel comfortable with. I dont understand why these european gov. have such a problem with a simple cloth. Live and let others live. It's not that a woman fully covered hurts anyone. Besides I think there are far bigger problems in societies than veils, especially in Italy...

Btw. Covering the face belongs to Islam, though it's also related to Persian culture. In fact it is a controversial issue between Islamic scholars if the faceveil is wajib (obligatory), or merely mustahab (recommended).In both cases- it exists.

Well I agree, if I want to walk around in a halloween mask every day everywhere I go I should be able to. However, in the United States you are no longer able to wear even sunglasses or hat at the bank. If you do they won't help you unless you remove them so that they can get a recording of who you are.

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Well I agree, if I want to walk around in a halloween mask every day everywhere I go I should be able to. However, in the United States you are no longer able to wear even sunglasses or hat at the bank. If you do they won't help you unless you remove them so that they can get a recording of who you are.

Really? Intersting. But it might be due to the fact of bank robbery? As far as I am concerned there are/were lots of such cases. As you said they just need your face for identification purposes. From what you've written they don't seem to forbid you wearing a hat/sunglasses, they simply won't serve you.

Edited by thermodynamics
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