Armistice Day: protesters burn poppy

[ploppy]

Being Irish you therefore don't know what it's like to have a proper army. That means you don't know what it's like to have hundreds of troops being killed every year in a faraway land in a war that many of the troops don't agree with (although, because I know right from wrong, I think both of the wars in Iraq and Afghanistan were entirely justified).

The British, unlike the Irish, therefore have an event every 11th November where we have a minute's silence at 11am to remember the thousands of British troops who have died in service of their country since WWI. And we also have Rememrance Sunday (which is today) which is held on the nearest Sunday to 11th November in which ceremonies to remember and respect our war dead are held all over the country and thousands of veterans march past the Cenotaph in London watched by crowds of thousands.

It's also at this time of year that millions of British people wear paper poppies to show their respect to the troops. These are now incredibly popular and I've even seen young girls wearing them in their hair. All money raised on them goes to the Royal British Legion.

And none of these events and the wearing of the poppy are a means of celebrating wars. They are a means of showing respect to the hundreds of thousands of British service personnel who have died over the past 100 years in wars that all of them were ordered to fight in whether they wanted to or not.

People don't have to respect soldiers, although I can't understand why people wouldn't when these soldiers are putting their lives on the line for their country.

And, being Irish, you should show respect to the poppy too because, with what is now the Republic of Ireland once being a part of the UK, you most probably have an ancestor who fought in the British Army in the mud and trenches of WWI.

And it is the modern British Army that will come to the Republic of Ireland's aid (even though you weren't of much help during WWII) should it ever be invaded or threatened with invasion. You'll not get much help from the French or Germans.

Oh another production of "If you're not with us, you're against us" tag lines.

"Being Irish" ect....is the most pointless and inappropiate reason you could come up with to tell me how I should think. I don't have respect for any soliders, mainly modern ones. I have respect for the men and women of my own country that fought it repel invaders and did it all on their own soil. Not going to a foreign land and doing what you like, including killing families.

How/why wars are fought now is different that what it was. I could use the very valid "Being Irish we've put up with and rid (finally) the British after 8th Centuries. Your points are slightly disgraceful.

What does the size of army have to do with appreciating or not appreciating soliders.

Being Irish means I understand quite well, we've have men and women that fought against the UK in their own solo runs and armies for centuries. How awful for you that we never just shut up and let you ruin us.

You seem to think that having hundreds of troops killed in a relatively short time outweighs the thousand upon thousands of Irish people that died under British rule for centuries. If we're playing that pathetic game, we win. Oh joy, we've have more people murdered than you.

It's one thing to defend your country, it's another to invade another and kill it's inhabitants. Something the British Empire is very good at.

I'll never respect soliders or say hoo-rah to them, but that does not mean I wish harm to any of them. And they have done nothing for me or my loved ones, before that ridiculous hive-mind/hive treatment comes into place.

The UK will not come to our aid, you don't even come to the aid of those under your kingdom that suffer the taint of fellow citizens bombing and terrorising people. As much as I'm glad we're not part of the North, so many people there put up with a lot of crap.

No one will come to anyones aid, if there's a WWIII, we'll all be wrecked and savaged. The UK will ask America "What are we allowed to do Mr.President". The UK is no saving grace to anyone, your pride is admirable to your peers, but means nothing to people who think the opposite.

Blackwhite- DeValera was as crooked as they come (he had Michael Collins killed for God sake), despite all that he did in the fight for freedom. Most people here are aware of that, but they find it hard to verbalize because at the end of the day he was pivotal in a lot of major events and our first Taoiseach.

Edited November 14, 2010 by ploppy

[Shanks91]

Oh another production of "If you're not with us, you're against us" tag lines.

"Being Irish" ect....is the most pointless and inappropiate reason you could come up with to tell me how I should think. I don't have respect for any soliders, mainly modern ones. I have respect for the men and women of my own country that fought it repel invaders and did it all on their own soil. Not going to a foreign land and doing what you like, including killing families.

How/why wars are fought now is different that what it was. I could use the very valid "Being Irish we've put up with and rid (finally) the British after 8th Centuries. Your points are slightly disgraceful.

What does the size of army have to do with appreciating or not appreciating soliders.

Being Irish means I understand quite well, we've have men and women that fought against the UK in their own solo runs and armies for centuries. How awful for you that we never just shut up and let you ruin us.

You seem to think that having hundreds of troops killed in a relatively short time outweighs the thousand upon thousands of Irish people that died under British rule for centuries. If we're playing that pathetic game, we win. Oh joy, we've have more people murdered than you.

It's one thing to defend your country, it's another to invade another and kill it's inhabitants. Something the British Empire is very good at.

I'll never respect soliders or say hoo-rah to them, but that does not mean I wish harm to any of them. And they have done nothing for me or my loved ones, before that ridiculous hive-mind/hive treatment comes into place.

The UK will not come to our aid, you don't even come to the aid of those under your kingdom that suffer the taint of fellow citizens bombing and terrorising people. As much as I'm glad we're not part of the North, so many people there put up with a lot of crap.

No one will come to anyones aid, if there's a WWIII, we'll all be wrecked and savaged. The UK will ask America "What are we allowed to do Mr.President". The UK is no saving grace to anyone, your pride is admirable to your peers, but means nothing to people who think the opposite.

Blackwhite- DeValera was as crooked as they come (he had Michael Collins killed for God sake), despite all that he did in the fight for freedom. Most people here are aware of that, but they find it hard to verbalize because at the end of the day he was pivotal in a lot of major events and our first Taoiseach.

Thats pathetic man, how can you hold a grudge against somethink that happened before you were born and before the populouses living memory? I don't understand why some Irish do have a problem with English people but its more to do with history, going back 800 years ago, let histoy be history. The modern day British army and the people(well the majority of the people) are good my Uncles is other there now, he's a Royal Combat Engineer building a small dam to power a village for the local people, the problem is tho the Taliban keep trying the blow it up, so whats so evil about my Uncle? He's killed a few people but all in the greater good of trying to protect people (his mates and the locals).

Your British hating Bigotory is outdated, alot of Irish people have moved on so should you.

[Blackwhite]

" I have respect for the men and women of my own country that fought it repel invaders and did it all on their own soil. Not going to a foreign land and doing what you like, including killing families.

It's a pity the Irish didn't put as much effort into fighting the Nazis as you did the "evil" British. Who knows, maybe Ireland would have contributed a lot to the Allied cause if it had fought alongside us rather than staying neutral and having politicians making speeches in your parliament vowing to kick out all Jews.

What does the size of army have to do with appreciating or not appreciating soliders.

Size of army isn't important. Although with Ireland's longstanding neutrality the Irish people have forgotten what it's like to have their troops dying in a foreign land. If you did, you may show more respect to them.

You seem to think that having hundreds of troops killed in a relatively short time outweighs the thousand upon thousands of Irish people that died under British rule for centuries.

No, I don't. Where did I say that?

It's one thing to defend your country, it's another to invade another and kill it's inhabitants. Something the British Empire is very good at.

In my opinion, the war in Iraq was justified as it got rid of an evil dictator. I'm sure millions of Iraqis would agree with me. The war in Afghanistan was justified as it's a war against the Taliban, a brutal regime that treats Afghans, especially women, brutally. We have the full support of the Afghan government and are doing a good job training the country's army and police force so that, hopefully, we'll one day be able to leave and let the Afghans battle the Taliban effectively. Also, Britain sent troops to Afghanistan as it is a NATO operation, backed by the UN, and Britain is a member of NATO.

Also, the Irish were just as willing empire-builders and administrators of the empire as the rest of the UK was. Remember, it was a BRITISH Empire.

The UK will not come to our aid

If our nearest neighbour is threatened by another country you can bet on it that Britain will come to your aid. Ireland lives under the protection of the British military umbrella, as Canada does under America's. Put it this way, it's far more likely the British will help you out than the French, Germans, Italians, Spanish, Belgians, Luxembourgians, Andorrans or any other Europeans.

The UK is no saving grace to anyone.

Try telling that to the people of countries such as France, Belgium and Holland who we helped liberate from the Germans in the 1940s, and the people of the Falkland Islands who we helped liberate from the Argentines in 1982. I've been given free drinks in several European countries, such as France, as a thank you for what my country did to help them rid the Nazis.

Edited November 14, 2010 by Blackwhite

[Mr.United_Nations]

Are we talking all the wars in Britains history, or all the wars since WW1? Because either way they've all just been imperialistic BS with the sole exception of World War Two.

The wars that the british have been involved in, ;Like the Korean war

[Mr.United_Nations]

Thats pathetic man, how can you hold a grudge against somethink that happened before you were born and before the populouses living memory? I don't understand why some Irish do have a problem with English people but its more to do with history, going back 800 years ago, let histoy be history. The modern day British army and the people(well the majority of the people) are good my Uncles is other there now, he's a Royal Combat Engineer building a small dam to power a village for the local people, the problem is tho the Taliban keep trying the blow it up, so whats so evil about my Uncle? He's killed a few people but all in the greater good of trying to protect people (his mates and the locals).

Your British hating Bigotory is outdated, alot of Irish people have moved on so should you.

No argueing with someone who hates the British, she will never be happy towards all British people.

[ploppy]

Thats pathetic man, how can you hold a grudge against somethink that happened before you were born and before the populouses living memory? I don't understand why some Irish do have a problem with English people but its more to do with history, going back 800 years ago, let histoy be history. The modern day British army and the people(well the majority of the people) are good my Uncles is other there now, he's a Royal Combat Engineer building a small dam to power a village for the local people, the problem is tho the Taliban keep trying the blow it up, so whats so evil about my Uncle? He's killed a few people but all in the greater good of trying to protect people (his mates and the locals).

Your British hating Bigotory is outdated, alot of Irish people have moved on so should you.

What thread were you reading. I don't hate Britain at all, I never said I did. Stop making up your own sentences It wasn't me who started the "you should be grateful thing" I was simply throwing back perfectly good reasons. Read other members posts. You can expect everyone to see things the way you or I do.

And using "fight the nazi's instead of british" is pathetic and irrelevant. No wait you're right, instead of fighting for our freedom and we should of been focusing on a time travel device, to teleport us to the moment that Hitler was born and kill him. Sorry about that.

It doesn't matter if things happened in the past, the world wars happened in the past and you honour your fallen. But why should everyone do that?

Should we not honour every man, woman or child that is killed raped and decimated every day on this planet? Oh no because it's not soliders of a certain country, that's when it's disgraceful.

[ploppy]

Pompey_Lad_18 - I'm engaged to an English man and have many English friends. Stop talking absolute rubbish just to seem like you have a clue what's going on. I didn't know that a primarily paranormal board sported members who had abilities such as telepathy and the power of knowing what's best for the world.

The God versus Science threads are more enjoyable and less spiteful that this thread. You'll claim I hate the English, firstly wrongly and secondly, as if the British are hard-done by and innocent. Killing jews, killing irish, killing muslims, killing british, american...anyone no one is the good guy. You keep on believing your country is pure and shouldn't be answerable and the rest of us will live in the real world were no country is without glaring faults.

[Mr.United_Nations]

Pompey_Lad_18 - I'm engaged to an English man and have many English friends. Stop talking absolute rubbish just to seem like you have a clue what's going on. I didn't know that a primarily paranormal board sported members who had abilities such as telepathy and the power of knowing what's best for the world.

The God versus Science threads are more enjoyable and less spiteful that this thread. You'll claim I hate the English, firstly wrongly and secondly, as if the British are hard-done by and innocent. Killing jews, killing irish, killing muslims, killing british, american...anyone no one is the good guy. You keep on believing your country is pure and shouldn't be answerable and the rest of us will live in the real world were no country is without glaring faults.

Liking some Englishmen does not mean you like all of them. Did i have any proof you hate the english? No and you still took it fully and im not fully British so that final sentenace towards me is false.

[Shanks91]

What thread were you reading. I don't hate Britain at all, I never said I did. Stop making up your own sentences It wasn't me who started the "you should be grateful thing" I was simply throwing back perfectly good reasons. Read other members posts. You can expect everyone to see things the way you or I do.

And using "fight the nazi's instead of british" is pathetic and irrelevant. No wait you're right, instead of fighting for our freedom and we should of been focusing on a time travel device, to teleport us to the moment that Hitler was born and kill him. Sorry about that.

It doesn't matter if things happened in the past, the world wars happened in the past and you honour your fallen. But why should everyone do that?

Should we not honour every man, woman or child that is killed raped and decimated every day on this planet? Oh no because it's not soliders of a certain country, that's when it's disgraceful.

Its simple, soldiers sacrafice alot, even their life for the greater good, for our freedoms, demcratic society for generations to come. I can not think of any way we or anyone could repay them for what they have done for us, Rememberance and Armistice day is a start and it means a lot to the current soldiers fighting abroad.

[Mr.United_Nations]

Pompey_Lad_18 - I'm engaged to an English man and have many English friends. Stop talking absolute rubbish just to seem like you have a clue what's going on. I didn't know that a primarily paranormal board sported members who had abilities such as telepathy and the power of knowing what's best for the world.

The God versus Science threads are more enjoyable and less spiteful that this thread. You'll claim I hate the English, firstly wrongly and secondly, as if the British are hard-done by and innocent. Killing jews, killing irish, killing muslims, killing british, american...anyone no one is the good guy. You keep on believing your country is pure and shouldn't be answerable and the rest of us will live in the real world were no country is without glaring faults.

Pompey_Lad_18 - I'm engaged to an English man and have many English friends. Stop talking absolute rubbish just to seem like you have a clue what's going on. I didn't know that a primarily paranormal board sported members who had abilities such as telepathy and the power of knowing what's best for the world.

The God versus Science threads are more enjoyable and less spiteful that this thread. You'll claim I hate the English, firstly wrongly and secondly, as if the British are hard-done by and innocent. Killing jews, killing irish, killing muslims, killing british, american...anyone no one is the good guy. You keep on believing your country is pure and shouldn't be answerable and the rest of us will live in the real world were no country is without glaring faults.

Liking some Englishmen does not mean you like all of them. Did i have any proof you hate the english? No and you still took it fully and im not fully British so that final sentenace towards me is false.

Edited November 14, 2010 by Pompey_Lad_18

[BaronHunt]

I'm a lurker here but I just wanted to say:

Blackwhite: I'm an Englishman, born and bred and while I am proud of that fact, I am also troubled by our past and don't see why I should forget about it. We took land from people by force and killed people. How are we any better (or worse) than any other country that has done it?

Ireland was one of those countries and I find the honesty expressed by Irish people, in that they don't care about British troops but at the same time wish no ill on them or want any killing, to be quite refreshful and unthreatening. You're putting a lot of us to shame by expecting people who suffered under OUR countrys rule to forcibly have any emotions whatsoever towards a foreign countries armed forces.

Pompey_Lad: what exactly do you know about the Anglo/Irish relations to be making claims that a member here hates (a strong word) and entire country of people?

[Mr.United_Nations]

I'm a lurker here but I just wanted to say:

Blackwhite: I'm an Englishman, born and bred and while I am proud of that fact, I am also troubled by our past and don't see why I should forget about it. We took land from people by force and killed people. How are we any better (or worse) than any other country that has done it?

Ireland was one of those countries and I find the honesty expressed by Irish people, in that they don't care about British troops but at the same time wish no ill on them or want any killing, to be quite refreshful and unthreatening. You're putting a lot of us to shame by expecting people who suffered under OUR countrys rule to forcibly have any emotions whatsoever towards a foreign countries armed forces.

Pompey_Lad: what exactly do you know about the Anglo/Irish relations to be making claims that a member here hates (a strong word) and entire country of people?

Member?

[Shanks91]

Pompey_Lad_18 - I'm engaged to an English man and have many English friends. Stop talking absolute rubbish just to seem like you have a clue what's going on. I didn't know that a primarily paranormal board sported members who had abilities such as telepathy and the power of knowing what's best for the world.

The God versus Science threads are more enjoyable and less spiteful that this thread. You'll claim I hate the English, firstly wrongly and secondly, as if the British are hard-done by and innocent. Killing jews, killing irish, killing muslims, killing british, american...anyone no one is the good guy. You keep on believing your country is pure and shouldn't be answerable and the rest of us will live in the real world were no country is without glaring faults.

So your basically saying Ireland is morrally supieror?

I don't think we are hard done by, your just putting your words in are mouth, Ireland always act like the victim "because the British invaded us, and used us ect.." well the true is that Britian never invaded Ireland...

Starting in 1169, Norman forces invaded Ireland to help Diarmaid Mac Murchada (in English, Dermont Mac Murrough), the King of Leimster, who had been driven out by his enemies. However, they did not then leave, but stayed and established themselves in Leimster. Henry II then claimed Ireland as part of his kingdom.

However, the whole of Ireland did not really come under full English control as such until the 17th century. For a long time, English rule was not effective except in a small region around Dublin known as the Pale. After the Nine Years' War, however, the last of the great Gaelic lords were forced to emigrate (the Flight of the Earls)allowing the British to take over Ulster, which was the final bastion of the old Irish kings.

Other than during various rebellions, the British rule remained in place from the 17th century until the Irish War of Independence started in 1919. In 1922, the war came to an end with the British recognising the independence of 26 of the 32 counties of Ireland.

See Britain just ran your country for a few centuries, don't have a pop at us have a pop at the Normans, well the French now I think.

[BaronHunt]

Um clearly ploppy *looks at your last couple of posts*.

I can't believe your asking someone to prove that they don't hate all English people. My friend once got punched in the face by an african american kid that lived next door. He really didn't like that kid from then on, but I doubt he hated all black people and needed a damn reason to prove otherwise.

[ploppy]

So your basically saying Ireland is morrally supieror?

Pompey_Lad_18 - You keep on believing your country is pure and shouldn't be answerable and the rest of us will live in the real world were no country is without glaring faults.

Yeah that's what I said. Clearly.

[The Silver Thong]

@%$# the IRA and %$@# the church....... lets get past the lies and the bull#$@%.....

[BaronHunt]

The church? We're going to start arguing over everything on earth in a minute. I hate bumblebees.

[ploppy]

I don't enjoy arguments. I hate NBC. And whoever cancelled Caprica.

[Shanks91]

I'm a lurker here but I just wanted to say:

Blackwhite: I'm an Englishman, born and bred and while I am proud of that fact, I am also troubled by our past and don't see why I should forget about it. We took land from people by force and killed people. How are we any better (or worse) than any other country that has done it?

Ireland was one of those countries and I find the honesty expressed by Irish people, in that they don't care about British troops but at the same time wish no ill on them or want any killing, to be quite refreshful and unthreatening. You're putting a lot of us to shame by expecting people who suffered under OUR countrys rule to forcibly have any emotions whatsoever towards a foreign countries armed forces.

Pompey_Lad: what exactly do you know about the Anglo/Irish relations to be making claims that a member here hates (a strong word) and entire country of people?

Thats not true, go on the Celtic forum and a good majority of Irish people on there were "buzzin" about that hurtfull banner they put up in the SPL, they hate everthink British and English, same with the some people on the Liverpool forum to sadly who wished harm would come to "us", at the same time I know Irish people who feel the way I do that the whole British/English resentment thing is well old.

[Mr.United_Nations]

Thats not true, go on the Celtic forum and a good majority of Irish people on there were "buzzin" about that hurtfull banner they put up in the SPL, they hate everthink British and English, same with the some people on the Liverpool forum to sadly who wished harm would come to "us", at the same time I know Irish people who feel the way I do that the whole British/English resentment thing is well old.

Saw that very sad and a disgrace to all Irish.

[Shanks91]

I don't enjoy arguments. I hate NBC. And whoever cancelled Caprica.

Lets forget about this its kinda pointless the whole Anglo/Irish hatried thing, I had this same debate on the LFC forum and it just never ended.

Later the X factors on, I know I'am sad.

[itsnotoutthere]

Lets all calm down a bit, there's no need to be at each others throats, we can all be friends at the end of the day, there's no need to argue......we can all stick together........& beat up the muslims JOKE JOKE...I WAS ONLY JOKING.

[ploppy]

Celtic and Ranger fans are generally a disgrace (and big beer-bellies), regardless if they're Irish, Scottish, English or *insert here*. There's something to be said for culling. Footie yobs, chavs, anyone on Jeremy Kyle show and the audience and fans of X-Factor.

[The Silver Thong]

The church? We're going to start arguing over everything on earth in a minute. I hate bumblebees.

If Bumblebees were the root cause I would get a can of raid

[RamblingRebel]

This is where people get it really wrong. They're two different things.

The IRA was originally the Irish Republican Army, the national army of the country, derived from the IRB ( Irish Republican Brotherhood). So you've got the United States Army, we 'had' the IRA.

The IRA of today is a totally DIFFERENT lot of people simply using the term as a means of justifying themselves.

It's as if I joined the KKK and killed and ate the most Aryan looking babies. I may call myself the KKK but I'm clearly nothing to do with them and they would be ashamed

So yes the terrorist IRA are British, we have nothing to do with them. We are our own country that have a state nbelonging to another attached to us. You wouldn't say Germany and France are the same country and they're joined at the hip too.

So I'm not blaming the British, but if people want to blame someone, don't blame the Irish. We a different fecking place! I'll just go and blame a random Japanese man for running over my cat 3 years ago, when in reality it was the Scottish neighbour who lived beside me.

I should copy and paste this post, the amount of times I have to recite it and to people who should know their own history. It's frustrating to be confused with other people, especially people that commit such atrocities.

Good post. Except they are Irish! I don't blame you for not wanting them to be associated with your country, but unfortunately they are whether you like it or not!

The 'terrorist' IRA, or RIRA as they are known, were formed in Oldcastle, Co.Meath (which I do believe is in the Republic). The bloke who formed this group, Michael McKevitt was a native of Co.Louth (again in the Republic). Although membership was made up by people from both sides of the border.

Hope this helps. So next time you have to explain to people who should know their own history, perhaps you should use this post.

I'm English by the way, I just live in this wonderful land, full of wonderful people. So if any Brits out there who actually think the Irish hate us, you couldn't be more wrong...

...Eh up, 5 people with balaclavas and guns are walking up my drive, I'd better go see what they want!