N. Korea fires on S. Korea, killing 1

[jesspy]

Seoul, South Korea (CNN) -- North Korea fired artillery toward its tense western sea border with South Korea on Tuesday, killing at least one South Korean soldier, the Yonhap news agency reported.

Two civilians and 13 other South Korean military personnel were injured, with three of the soldiers seriously hurt, Yonhap said.

link

another story

Im sure it will all just blow over again. more talks more sanctions etc.

Edited November 23, 2010 by jesspy

[wetchickenlip]

china is the pain in the **** in all this keep vetoing new sanctions

[ships-cat]

The BBC News website is speculating that this is all to do with internal North Korean politics, and trying to strengthen the hand of Kim Jong-un. ( article link .

Seems a bit drastic.. couldn't they have just .. dunno.. had a TV advertising campaign or something instead ?

It's all very well, but these things can sometimes escalate out of hand .. it starts off with a few artillary shells, then one side or the other send aircraft over to attack the artillary, and before you know it the tanks are rolling.

meow purr

[Mr.United_Nations]

2 people have died, not one. South Korea was testing guns but firing West not North, Hence N.Korea thought they were attacking them.

[Corp]

The BBC News website is speculating that this is all to do with internal North Korean politics, and trying to strengthen the hand of Kim Jong-un. ( article link .

Seems a bit drastic.. couldn't they have just .. dunno.. had a TV advertising campaign or something instead ?

It's all very well, but these things can sometimes escalate out of hand .. it starts off with a few artillary shells, then one side or the other send aircraft over to attack the artillary, and before you know it the tanks are rolling.

meow purr

Well given that the general population is taught that the Kim's are gods any internal issues likely have to do with the various generals.

Anyway China needs to do a better job at controling Best Korea before the South decide that enough is enough and do it for them. At which point everything will be blamed on the Americans.

[Mr Gold]

It's all very well, but these things can sometimes escalate out of hand .. it starts off with a few artillary shells, then one side or the other send aircraft over to attack the artillary, and before you know it the tanks are rolling.

Apparently F-16's were scrambled so now we're just waiting for the tanks to roll in haha.

[danielost]

The BBC News website is speculating that this is all to do with internal North Korean politics, and trying to strengthen the hand of Kim Jong-un. ( article link .

Seems a bit drastic.. couldn't they have just .. dunno.. had a TV advertising campaign or something instead ?

It's all very well, but these things can sometimes escalate out of hand .. it starts off with a few artillary shells, then one side or the other send aircraft over to attack the artillary, and before you know it the tanks are rolling.

meow purr

sorry but when the north killed 2 people and injured others that was a declaretion of war.

[Mr.United_Nations]

sorry but when the north killed 2 people and injured others that was a declaretion of war.

The war is still ongoing hence the treaty and the borderd fence.

[Leah G.]

It's going to get worse before it gets better.

[danielost]

The war is still ongoing hence the treaty and the borderd fence.

yes i know, but many think it ended.

[Admiral Danger]

i do have a hunch that this will develop into a war

but then again, i do hope someone puts a stop to kim jong il's reign, because the stories that are coming from north korea are just ridiculous.

Edited November 23, 2010 by The Almighty Sparrow

[Karlis]

And another article on:

North Korean Artillery Attack on a Southern Island

From Stratfor.com article

[Mr.United_Nations]

i do have a hunch that this will develop into a war

but then again, i do hope someone puts a stop to kim jong il's reign, because the stories that are coming from north korea are just ridiculous.

N.Korea won't change even if he dies, his son will be under pressure from the high up genrals.

[Karlis]

N.Korea won't change even if he dies, his son will be under pressure from the high up genrals.

From what I have been reading, the "higher up generals" in North Korea do not all agree with the present policies. There could well be a change in attitude with the demise of the present ruler-dictator.

On the other hand, I may well be wrong,

Karlis

[Admiral Danger]

N.Korea won't change even if he dies, his son will be under pressure from the high up genrals.

it's not just kim jong il to go, its about putting the country under a complete different rule. if you get what im trying to say

[Belial]

The south should just turn off there trade supplies including gas/oil and water to the north, starve them out.

[Karlis]

The south should just turn off there trade supplies including gas/oil and water to the north, starve them out.

The "average" North Koreans are on the verge of starvation now, and have been so on-and-off, time and time again. The military eat well, nomatter what sanctions are imposed.

Do s a simple Google search, and weep for these poor folks,

Karlis

[sear]

"The south should just turn off there trade supplies including gas/oil and water to the north, starve them out." Bel

Not a bad idea.

The reason to not do it all at once is, it leaves no room to maneuver, to escalate.

But significant reductions, not a bad idea.

The "average" North Koreans are on the verge of starvation now, and have been so on-and-off, time and time again. The military eat well, nomatter what sanctions are imposed.

Karlis

NK can't give more than 100% of its domestic food output to its most favored. If it wants to exceed 100%, it will have to import.

And that's where trade sanctions, and embargoes come in.

Ironically, China may play a role here, in the U.S.' favor.

It's not China's great love for the Kim Jong dynasty.

It's merely that China doesn't want a flood of millions of physically dwarfed, mentally handicapped North Korean refugees flooding over the NK / China border.

What I'd like to know is: is there a military solution here? North Korea has already committed acts of War. The sinking of the SK ship earlier this year. And now this attack?

Could SK evacuate Seoul fast enough, avoiding detection, perhaps masquerading as a New Year's Eve celebration, and then take out Pyongyang? Then neutralize the DMZ NK artillery before it could do much harm to evacuated Seoul?

That might be better than allowing North Korea to go ahead with its nuclear weapons programs.

[MichaelW]

First off, no one could prove who was behind the sinking of the Cheonan. The North couldn't deny it and the South couldn't prove it.

Seoul has around 18-20 million people living in it, all within range of various calibre North Korean artillery howitzers and rocket launchers. The North could never invade the south. They neither have the capabilities nor the resources to do so. A brief border conflict they could manage, but never a full scale war. China doesn't like the North because of the same/similar reasons the US does. They do not like a rogue neighbour with possible nuclear weapons (though whether this has been proven is still up for debate since neither Russia or China sold them any technology). There are already thousands of North Koreans living in China but there are real fears, as you said sear, in the upper echelons of Beijing that there could be a mass exodus if a war should break out.

Most of the artillery is protected in large underground bunkers with some capable air defences. But North Korean jets would be able to scramble when the strikes begin. Seoul could never be evacuated in less than a month.

[Corp]

Yeah in came of war Seoul would be more or less toast. There was talk of building a new SK capital out of range of the guns but not sure if anything actually happened. Of course once millions of civilians started dying even China might turn a blind eye to what happens to Best Korea next.

[jesspy]

sorry but when the north killed 2 people and injured others that was a declaretion of war.

The war is still ongoing hence the treaty and the borderd fence.

People on twitter were saying we need to stop this before it turned to war. I told them pretty much what PL18 just said the war never ended there was a cease fire pretty much.

N.Korea won't change even if he dies, his son will be under pressure from the high up genrals.

The generals could over throw him or even kill him and take power. But i think kim is a puppet for generals anyway.

The south should just turn off there trade supplies including gas/oil and water to the north, starve them out.

true but then they would get CHina to give them what they need.

[Mr.United_Nations]

The south should just turn off there trade supplies including gas/oil and water to the north, starve them out.

that would create more problems

[acidhead]

I love how all the so-called 'experts' are paraded on all the various western news networks 'speculating' what happened, why, and what will happen next.

[scar7]

"The North accused South Korea of having started the exchange by firing shells inside North Korean territory during a set of South Korean military exercises that the North called "war maneuvers." The South denies that charge, saying that its soldiers were merely conducting military drills and that no shots fell in North Korean territory." Yahoo News

"North accused South Korea".

There have only been two sources cited by our "reporters" and that is the Korean Central News Agency(KCNA) which is the state news agency of North Korea and has existed since December 5, 1946. KCNA is headquartered in the capital city of Pyongyang. In South Korea access to KCNA website is blocked by the government...Since December 1996, KCNA has been publishing its news articles on the Internet with its web server located in Japan.... Wiki-KCNA

But NO where do I see N.Korea accusing anyone or admitting to anything. So where are the quotes coming from?

Then another source they cite are "South Korean officials". So again, where is the BEEF???? It's who, what, where, and how? Not just who :lol:

I just hear blabber, but it does sound like reporting

IF YOU ARE GOING TO ATTACK, you do it because you know you were attacked for a reason. You don't call a seize fire. This is not go fish, no I dont have a King, go fish again. You ATTACK. So why have N. Korea not attacked already since we have attacked them in "retaliation"? They APPARENTLY have killed 48 S.Korean soldiers since March this year? And we have helped our S.Korea allies before keeping the border steady, and now, NOW?

Honestly, I don't want any of this attacking business, but what is up with the Go Fish game here. Something smells fishy. GO FISH!

Edited November 24, 2010 by scar7

[Varelse]

I would think NK would be pretty easy to defang. Napalm and other air fuel bursts take out the personnel on the arty, half their air force defects the second they get a chance.

The mines and SK's fighter jets will pick anything off that tries to cross the dmz. The technological gap between the two countries ispretty wide, NK land based communications are also pretty easily disrupted.