Dead birds keep falling from the sky

[ohio state buckeyes]

I really have no idea anymore what to say to people who just refuse to read facts....

You have Witnesses , you have Evidence , you Have Documented Facts , You have Witnesses ( oh , said that )...

You gave opinion , not facts......Show me documents of it being debunked please , not opinions....

Go read this , it explains most of this thread....

Facts regarding fish and bird kills

People are getting caught up in the hype with out question but I think people have hard time

believing it was fireworks and I would agree with them. People have shot professional fireworks in residential before and no mass bird deaths.

[Mr.United_Nations]

The fireworks theory has not been debunked. It has been confirmed. Please be sure to read the many posts where Sakari has repeated this over and over again.

So how can only blackbird be affected and not any other type of bird? Why not robins? or birds the size of blackbird? Remmber these deaths around the world was after New Years, Tuesday, Monday and Wednesday.

[Michelle]

I actually let fireworks off before too, actually it was people I was with that let them off, because I was younger, it was actually in the evening too, but nothing died in the woods near his house.

You're missing one piece of pertinent information....was there a flock of tens of thousands of birds there at the time?

[Sakari]

With respect to Sakari, I've let pretty expensive fireworks off right under birds before (I was a stupid kid don't flame me lol) and it never caused this kind of thing. Fireworks of all kinds are let off near birds all the tie and it doesn't cause this.

I'm not saying it was Aliens, the government or anything. Just that fireworks in my opinion is BS and not even a very clever answer. My money would have been on weather or somehting like that to be honest. But the fireworks thing makes me think it's more likely a cover up becuase that is just rubbish and laughable.

Coffey ,

With respect to you also...

Because you shot off fireworks and this did not happen , does not mean it did not happen there.There are witnesses of the birds flying in a panic off of the roost , and hitting things.

I doubt you shot off 2 inch ( or bigger ) Mortors right under roosts of 10,000 plus birds.Even the slight chance you did , I doubt you had a bunch of other people shooting off even more.

I shoot off 2 inch mortors every year in Idaho , under trees , and where there are birds.

You need to look at this as a individual , isolated incident....

What kind of " cover up " could even be possible?....How could all of the witnesses be involved in said cover up?

Please go look at this fish and bird kill facts and read it through.

If you still think all of this is a " cover up " , and have any facts to show different than what I have stated , please share.

If you really still think after reading all of that information ( and trust me , I could post more , but see no reason too ) that there is a " cover up " , I doubt I can change your mind , or that anyone can.

Again , the Arkansas one has witnesses , facts , and evidence to show that Fireworks caused it.....I was also at first convinced weather , until more information came out , and showed what the cause was.....

As for the rest , it is answered also in my link , if one is willing to read it and look at facts and History.

I wish I got paid for this kind of work , it really is challenging , and almost not worth doing for free.

[Mr.United_Nations]

Coffey ,

With respect to you also...

Because you shot off fireworks and this did not happen , does not mean it did not happen there.There are witnesses of the birds flying in a panic off of the roost , and hitting things.

I doubt you shot off 2 inch ( or bigger ) Mortors right under roosts of 10,000 plus birds.Even the slight chance you did , I doubt you had a bunch of other people shooting off even more.

I shoot off 2 inch mortors every year in Idaho , under trees , and where there are birds.

You need to look at this as a individual , isolated incident....

What kind of " cover up " could even be possible?....How could all of the witnesses be involved in said cover up?

Please go look at this fish and bird kill facts and read it through.

If you still think all of this is a " cover up " , and have any facts to show different than what I have stated , please share.

If you really still think after reading all of that information ( and trust me , I could post more , but see no reason too ) that there is a " cover up " , I doubt I can change your mind , or that anyone can.

Again , the Arkansas one has witnesses , facts , and evidence to show that Fireworks caused it.....I was also at first convinced weather , until more information came out , and showed what the cause was.....

As for the rest , it is answered also in my link , if one is willing to read it and look at facts and History.

I wish I got paid for this kind of work , it really is challenging , and almost not worth doing for free.

Wow one witness, and somehow everyone belives the witness? Ok what the ones ins Sweden?

[Sakari]

People are getting caught up in the hype with out question but I think people have hard time

believing it was fireworks and I would agree with them. People have shot professional fireworks in residential before and no mass bird deaths.

So how can only blackbird be affected and not any other type of bird? Why not robins? or birds the size of blackbird? Remmber these deaths around the world was after New Years, Tuesday, Monday and Wednesday.

I really wish I could sit you guys in a room with a Monitor , and I mean that....

Read my replies , they answer the questions you keep asking , and not one of you has tried to show any evidence to support what is answered is not fact....Not one.

I get tired of answering it , but feel compelled to help you.

Arkansas was a ISOLATED INCIDENT!!!!!!!!!!!!! ....It can not answer the other incidents ( but my link can ).

People including myself ( read reply to Coffey ) have and do shoot off fireworks , but not under 10,000 plus roosting starlings and blackbirds !!!!!...And not in THAT neighborhood......Keep in mind , not all of the birds died , half or more made it back to " solid ground " without killing themselves.....

You can not keep using " it didn't happen here , or there " as a excuse to the facts of one isolated incident......

Go find 10,000 plus roosting blackbirds and starling , shoot off 2 inch plus Mortors right by them , in the same conditions that were there , same house set up , trees , obstacles , and darkness.......Impossible huh?......Damn near.....This is why it is a " isolated incident " , and not your answer for everything else......

I am trying to explain this the best I can , I realty am...

[Sakari]

Wow one witness, and somehow everyone belives the witness? Ok what the ones ins Sweden?

More than one witness....

Look , for you I can try to reach out even more.....I have free long distance , and since you are not capable of reading everything posted answering the question you just asked ( how many times will it be asked without looking at the information given ) I am more than happy to call you and explain it ,and even read it to you.......

[Mr.United_Nations]

Ok say if it was April, again this happens, the birds, fish etc, the same countries and towns. What would you think it could be?

[ohio state buckeyes]

You're missing one piece of pertinent information....was there a flock of tens of thousands of birds there at the time?

So there has never been any major flocks around fireworks before ? I'm not saying it couldn't have happened but I find it odd after scientist not having a clue then all the sudden yep it was the fireworks. They tried the thunder theory at first but the time line didn't line up. That raises the question why didn't the thunder freak them and the fireworks did ?

Edited January 6, 2011 by ohio state buckeyes

[booNyzarC]

With respect to Sakari, I've let pretty expensive fireworks off right under birds before (I was a stupid kid don't flame me lol) and it never caused this kind of thing. Fireworks of all kinds are let off near birds all the tie and it doesn't cause this.

I'm not saying it was Aliens, the government or anything. Just that fireworks in my opinion is BS and not even a very clever answer. My money would have been on weather or somehting like that to be honest. But the fireworks thing makes me think it's more likely a cover up becuase that is just rubbish and laughable.

I understand what you are saying Coffey, and I wouldn't say that I disagree with the intention to question this explanation at all. It is important, I believe, to question explanations or assertions in general. That process of validation and/or falsification if you will, is actually a critical element in uncovering the truth of many things. But the explanation here which Sakari has provided is confirmed for the Arkansas instance. Multiple witnesses, the fact that this isn't the first time, etc... It happened and has happened before.

The other cases that people are going on about most likely have very similar, if not identical, prosaic explanations. Perhaps someone will track down the explanations that relate to each particular case.

I honestly don't understand the need for people to twist this, like so many other things, into some bizarre conspiracy theory. And what is happening in this thread is very interesting. Now every death of any animal is being lumped into this as though it is related, but with absolutely no evidence to back up the notion that these are related in any way. But to each his own I suppose.

I respect your point of view mate and appreciate your curiousity about this oddity. Cheers.

[Mac E]

When all the local incidents become a whole lot of local incidents like what is happening now with multiple causes to blame, you know something is up. Maybe it is animals saying screw you humans, we don't want to live in your polluted and manipulated world. Just saying...

[S2F]

Now every death of any animal is being lumped into this as though it is related, but with absolutely no evidence to back up the notion that these are related in any way.

Ding! Ding! Ding! Ding!

Give that man a prize!

[Sakari]

Ok say if it was April, again this happens, the birds, fish etc, the same countries and towns. What would you think it could be?

Look up " isolated Incident "......I can call you if reading does not get through

So there has never been any major flocks around fireworks before ? I'm not saying it couldn't have happened but I find it odd after scientist not having a clue then all the sudden yep it was the fireworks. They tried the thunder theory at first but the time line didn't line up. That raises the question why didn't the thunder freak them and the fireworks did ?

There probably have not been roosts of 10,000 plus blackbirds and starlings under fireworks in close proximity....Hence " isolated incident ".....

Thing about it , someone walked out in the dark with their mortors and tubes " this looks like a good spot "....Lock and Load...In a Neighborhood ( mortors )...

How often do you see people lighting off Mortors in a area like this?......Add in with 10,000 plus birds roosting in the dark?

Not very often I am sure.....Most Fireworks are set up professionally , and if not , most are lit with safety in mind , and not around trees and such....And even so , the chances of 10,000 plus blackbirds and starlings being under all of these fireworks you and I , and others have had?.....

Hell , what are the chances that any of us even see 10,000 plus blackbirds and starlings roosting , without death involved?..Right above our heads?......That alone is pretty slim , and that is why all of these " other fireworks " are not killing other animals and birds. ( although yes , fireworks probably have killed a few more in other places ).....

Everyone else I know buy lottery tickets , how come not everyone else wins the lottery?.....But someone seems to every week or so?

What is odd , the " scientists " ( really fish and game biologists ) first said " possible " storms were the cause , and said " still under investigation".....

Thunder does not freak them out like this because thinder happens quite often.....Now , if said thunder and lightning happened directly where those 10,000 plus birds were roosting , yup , I am sure they would have freaked out.....Wouldn't you?

[Sakari]

The other cases that people are going on about most likely have very similar, if not identical, prosaic explanations. Perhaps someone will track down the explanations that relate to each particular case.

Working on that Boony , but it is being missed or ignored ...here is link again.

Fish and Bird Kills facts

[kelunexplained]

You're missing one piece of pertinent information....was there a flock of tens of thousands of birds there at the time?

Of course there were, it was in July, and his backyard is a wooded area.

[ohio state buckeyes]

Dead Crabs Wash Ashore By Thousands On England Beaches

http://www.huffingtonpost.com/2011/01/06/dead-crabs-wash-ashore-by_n_805211.html

[S2F]

I see dead animals on the side of the road sometimes. What could have possibly killed them all!?!? It couldn't have been fireworks or weather. Maybe some sort of biological attack or government experiment?

Sorry, just trying to go with the apparent spirit of this thread.

[Mr.United_Nations]

This topic isnt about Arkansas this about the world.

[Michelle]

So there has never been any major flocks around fireworks before ? I'm not saying it couldn't have happened but I find it odd after scientist not having a clue then all the sudden yep it was the fireworks. They tried the thunder theory at first but the time line didn't line up. That raises the question why didn't the thunder freak them and the fireworks did ?

I'm just talking about the Arkansas case and I won't pretend to be an expert on animal behavior, but I think it's very likely to be fireworks. During a lighting storm animals usually hunker down, but a continuous stream of commercial fireworks will make them scatter irrationally. Having a small farm behind an amusement park growing up, where they shot off fireworks twice a year, I've seen it wreak havoc on fowl and a few that actually dropped dead from fright. If we didn't have them locked up, they would run blindly and constantly bump into things trying to get away. I can see a disoriented flock of birds flying into one another causing their deaths.

I think this story caught the news, on a slow news day, and the internet caused the spread of the information. In turn, other places that had had mass amounts of fish and birds dying reported it simply because it was a coincidence, not because it is particularly uncommon.

[Sakari]

This topic isnt about Arkansas this about the world.

Yup , and for the 4th time , those topics have been answered if you could just read......

Someone asked me to look at " their " links and answer them , I spent over 2 hours doing this , go back and look....

How often do birds fly into things and die?....Go look at the links I posted , I believe there are over 1400 million deaths a year....Not sure on the millions on millions that kill themselves flying into things....

So , if we have established fact that birds do fly into things and die ( we have ) , and we establish facts that birds are scared of loud noises such as thunder and guns ( we have , or I will below )........Can we safely say that put said sound under 10,000 roosting / un suspecting birds ( that can not see well at night ) that they will get scared ( from facts ) , and they will hit obstacles ( from facts )?

Here is a question for you " why would thunder or fireworks scare birds "......It happens all the time....

So , my question......Why would a device that replicates sounds of thunder and guns be sold and purchased to scare birds away from Airports / farms / factories?....Why are these sold and used if " thunder and Fireworks " do not scare them?.....

Propane Cannon for Airports, Fields and Large Open Areas

(propane tank not included, tripod sold separately). A lightweight portable propane-fired cannon emits automatic thunderclaps that deter birds and other nuisance wildlife. The intervals between detonations can be adjusted from 2 minutes to 30 minutes. The Zon Gun operates on LP gas and uses a 'piezo' lighter for ignition, which is good for 100,000 sparks. Each 10kg bottle of propane produces 12-15,000 detonations. Model A is a standard ground mounted unit and Model B is a standard unit on a tripod with propane tank. Standard Model: Fully automatic, ground mounted, simple, practical, effective, rotates 360 degrees.

[Michelle]

Of course there were, it was in July, and his backyard is a wooded area.

I have birds in the five thousand wooded acres behind my house too...as a matter of fact it is a government park bird sanctuary, but very rarely are there huge flocks of birds.

Edited January 6, 2011 by Michelle

[S2F]

Ooooh, I want one!

Good point Sakari, these had been mentioned in a previously posted article as a possible culprit. It was apparently dropped in favor of fireworks.

[Sakari]

Ooooh, I want one!

Good point Sakari, these had been mentioned in a previously posted article as a possible culprit. It was apparently dropped in favor of fireworks.

Hope this maybe can get the point home......

Now I am afraid people will not be able to understand my point , and think I am saying it was one of these.....

Nope folks , used this to help educate people , Arkansas was Fireworks ( the noise from them) , not a cannon.....

Slave , some people about 6 miles North of us sell Blue Berries , they have one of these , goes off starting 30 minutes before sunrise , until 30 minutes after sunset....It get's very annoying....When they first got it , they had problems , and it would go off during the night , shoots every 10 minutes.......

[booNyzarC]

Dead Crabs Wash Ashore By Thousands On England Beaches

http://www.huffingtonpost.com/2011/01/06/dead-crabs-wash-ashore-by_n_805211.html

I don't suppose you actually read the article did you? Where it says the following...

The events are likely unrelated, however, and the BBC notes that this is the third year in a row thousands of dead devil crabs, also known as velvet swimming crabs, have turned up on the coastline near Kent, England. It is estimated that 40,000 of the dead crabs have washed up on the beaches this year.

According to LiveScience, experts believe cold weather is to blame for the massive crab deaths. Tests conducted in past years have turned up no results for disease or similar problems, leaving the cause an unexplained mystery, though hypothermia is conjectured.

[Sakari]

Dead Crabs Wash Ashore By Thousands On England Beaches

http://www.huffingto...y_n_805211.html

Edited to add :

Boony , I hit reply and you all ready had this posted ( great minds think a like )....

I am going to leave it , considering it seems not many can get it on the first read.

This is happening all over this thread , people are tossing out everything they can find , and 90% of them have the answer in the article , how conveniant they leave the important info out of their post.

Ok , why do you guys leave out the important information from your links?....

You can not tell me you do not read them , adn that you are not just trying to stir up more un-needed BS?

Let me help , from your link :

As if thousands of dead birds falling from the sky and millions of fish turning up dead across the world in the last week weren't enough, the Thanet Coast in the UK is now littered with tens of thousands of dead crabs that have washed ashore.

The events are likely unrelated, however, and the BBC notes that this is the third year in a row thousands of dead devil crabs, also known as velvet swimming crabs, have turned up on the coastline near Kent, England. It is estimated that 40,000 of the dead crabs have washed up on the beaches this year.

According to LiveScience, experts believe cold weather is to blame for the massive crab deaths. Tests conducted in past years have turned up no results for disease or similar problems, leaving the cause an unexplained mystery, though hypothermia is conjectured.

Edited January 6, 2011 by Sakari