We can't cut education

[AROCES]

Federal government has no constitutional authority to have anything to do with education. And we were #1 in the world, before the fed got involved.

It's control.

The truth to it all is you control the mind of the population to be in power, the young mind is the main target.

Edited March 24, 2011 by AROCES

[Ignus Fatuus]

I see you didn't answer the question. Just "teaching" them does NOT determine how well they are doing. They have to be tested as well. Individual development doesn't really tell us anything about how the student is doing.

Really??? Never stated that their papers would not be graded, weekly tests will not be graded, their reading level would not be measured.

Never ever stated get rid of all testing ... just the one big multiple guess test at the end of the year which states how well a school is doing, how much money they will get etc, telling teachers that all students are to be taught the same way. Sometimes I do not believe certain folks read all of my statements and then take me out of context.

Do you even know what a individual development plan is??? As of now I do one with each of my special education students. However this leaves out those who barely make the cut not to be in special ed and get much needed extra help in a smaller classroom for math and reading. Cuts the middle man out so to say. You test a child, observe a child and then determine what he or she needs.

[Wookietim]

See, now you throw in guns but a car you won't.

Confused again? There is no way out of it for you are defending what is indefensible.

"See, now you throw in guns but a car you won't."

Now, read that and tell me that your posts aren't just random word groupings at this point.

[AROCES]

Really??? Never stated that their papers would not be graded, weekly tests will not be graded, their reading level would not be measured.

Never ever stated get rid of all testing ... just the one big multiple guess test at the end of the year which states how well a school is doing, how much money they will get etc, telling teachers that all students are to be taught the same way. Sometimes I do not believe certain folks read all of my statements and then take me out of context.

Do you even know what a individual development plan is??? As of now I do one with each of my special education students. However this leaves out those who barely make the cut not to be in special ed and get much needed extra help in a smaller classroom for math and reading. Cuts the middle man out so to say. You test a child, observe a child and then determine what he or she needs.

And what to teach.....

There I think is the main problem that led to the collapse it all. Some suppose to be Professional in Washington with an ideology agenda decided what all Teachers should do.

AND now they say we will pay you more, just keep doing the same thing and it will work.

Edited March 24, 2011 by AROCES

[AROCES]

"See, now you throw in guns but a car you won't."

Now, read that and tell me that your posts aren't just random word groupings at this point.

Your words

Yes - because fixing cars and plumbing is absolutely no different than fixing education, right?

It's simplistic thinking like that that is destroying this country.

Your words, AFTER a minute

Other countries also have UHC and have strict gun control... But I suspect that you would be against following suit on those points.

Told you there is no way out of it........

[Wookietim]

Your words

Yes - because fixing cars and plumbing is absolutely no different than fixing education, right?

It's simplistic thinking like that that is destroying this country.

Your words, AFTER a minute

Other countries also have UHC and have strict gun control... But I suspect that you would be against following suit on those points.

Told you there is no way out of it........

And how do you connect sarcasm that I used in one post with me pointing out facts about other countries in a later post? I have to assume that I was correct in my assumption earlier - *Snip*

Edited March 24, 2011 by Karlis
Deletedad hominem

[zenfahr]

We spend the most in education than any country in the world.

Go figure if your conclusion makes sense.

Do some research before you speak.

we rank 37th in the world

My link

[zenfahr]

And how.....

There I think is the main problem that led to the collapse it all. Some suppose to be Professional in Washington with an ideology agenda decided what all Teachers should do.

AND now they say we will pay you more, just keep doing the same thing and it will work.

Teachers put in so many hours at work and on their free time. They need to compensated for what they do.

[AROCES]

Teachers put in so many hours at work and on their free time. They need to compensated for what they do.

We all feel we need to be compensated for what we do.

Why are Teachers suddenly above us all? Teachers before go in that Profession out of love of teaching and the pay was not great but they do it for the passion of it. Now the left have planted in everyone's mind that Teachers can't teach well if they are not paid what the Politicians think they deserve.

Do you see the damage you lefty have done to Education at all?

Edited March 24, 2011 by AROCES

[AROCES]

Do some research before you speak.

we rank 37th in the world

My link

And did you do a thorough research?

We rank 3rd per student spending. Alright we are not number one anymore in spending. Shucks!

http://www.nationmas...-school-student

Edited March 24, 2011 by AROCES

[zenfahr]

We all feel we need to be compensated for what we do.

Why are Teachers suddenly above us all? Teachers before go in that Profession out of love of teaching and the pay was not great but they do it for the passion of it. Now the left have planted in everyone mind that Teachers can't teach well if they are not paid what the Politicians think they deserve.

Do you see the damage you lefty have done to Education at all?

above all of us? how is wanting to be compensated for your degree above everyone? Teachers have to continually update their eductation, similar to doctors. And you really must be outside your mind if you think that the love of teaching should be motivation. BS. Every person who enters a career does it out of love for that career. Be it in Eductation, Health, Politics, Music, Sports, or Art. Why should teachers expect less.

[AROCES]

above all of us? how is wanting to be compensated for your degree above everyone? Teachers have to continually update their eductation, similar to doctors. And you really must be outside your mind if you think that the love of teaching should be motivation. BS. Every person who enters a career does it out of love for that career. Be it in Eductation, Health, Politics, Music, Sports, or Art. Why should teachers expect less.

How were they able to do it before when Education is not where it is now?

Why are Private school teachers not having the same problem as Public teachers without your concern for more pay and dictating how much they should get paid?

Like I said, you lefty have destroyed Public Education and you won't let it go for the control of the young mind is vital for the future of Liberalism.

And let me add, after you demand more pay for this and that, next is you complaining that everything is expensive.

So you demand the evil rich pays for it.

Edited March 24, 2011 by AROCES

[zenfahr]

And did you do a thorough research?

We rank 3rd per student spending. Alright we are not number one anymore in spending. Shucks!

http://www.nationmas...-school-student

Hey im not the one making stupid comments. So we spend 7 grand per student big deal,

we are still 37th in overall spending, Kudos for us for spending more on the student, who has to be taught by teachers who are struggling to make ends meet, and in most cases cant even afford to live in the same neighborhood, who are learning in an facility that are run down and very old, using books that are outdated, eating food that preprepared, using technology that is out dated, being taught in classes that teach to the lowest student achiever, (because there is no money to pay for a teacher to an upper level class, who ride to school on buses that are very outdated and questionably safe and more. Shucks I guess you got me there.

[zenfahr]

How were they able to do it before when Education is not where it is now?

Why are Private school teachers not having the same problem as Public teachers without your concern for more pay and dictating how much they should get paid?

Like I said, you lefty have destroyed Public Education and you won't let it go for the control of the young mind is vital for the future of Liberalism.

And let me add, after you demand more pay for this and that, next is you complaining that everything is expensive.

So you demand the evil rich pays for it.

*Snip* Private school teachers do not get paid much because there is no need for them to be certified, nor do they have to teach to state and national standards. Private education does not mean you get a better education.

As far as your lefty comment, I do believe it was your God a savior Bush that implemented No Child Left Behind. Which has done more damage to the educational system that anything else.

And do you live in a hole or what? Everything is expensive, remember that resession Bush caused? Have you seen the price of gas lately? When Gas goes up so does everything else.

Edited March 24, 2011 by Karlis
Deleted inflammatory comment

[Ignus Fatuus]

And what to teach.....

There I think is the main problem that led to the collapse it all. Some suppose to be Professional in Washington with an ideology agenda decided what all Teachers should do.

AND now they say we will pay you more, just keep doing the same thing and it will work.

Ideology agenda is an understatement. The same thing has brought up test scores nearly every year for us, yet we continue to fall in comparison with other countries like China.

Like in science today when my special needs students were taught the Bores Elemental Chart ... because there are questions on that one test connected with it. If only people could see their faces!!! What .. .. huh .. .. WHY!!!

Kids do not like to fail, therefore what is their behavior??? They start trouble, ignore and interupt the lesson and sometimes as I have seen worse. This happens so many times when my students and former students are taught something they cannot grasp ... a trip to detention and sometimes even worse. Sick, sad and pathetic, yet no kid left behind ..

[Ignus Fatuus]

Teachers put in so many hours at work and on their free time. They need to compensated for what they do.

Much agreed .. I even go to my students homes to tutor them after hours and some of their moms and dads with how to deal with their substandard issues and what they need to learn.

Then on top of that I bring them Papa Johns pizza or McDonalds because they really do not want to spend time after 8 hours of school to do more studying.

Yet this is one reason I prosper and so many other teachers fail. I put in extra effort .. for free. They have children and other issues and cant do this. Yet if we were paid more for extra duties I grant you that they would raise their hands to do so!!!

Edited to correct stupid mistakes ... hmmm, here comes my little demons. Time for math!!! Oh how these kids love their math ..

Edited March 24, 2011 by Ignus Fatuus

[AROCES]

*Snip* Private school teachers do not get paid much because there is no need for them to be certified, nor do they have to teach to state and national standards. Private education does not mean you get a better education.

As far as your lefty comment, I do believe it was your God a savior Bush that implemented No Child Left Behind. Which has done more damage to the educational system that anything else.

And do you live in a hole or what? Everything is expensive, remember that resession Bush caused? Have you seen the price of gas lately? When Gas goes up so does everything else.

State and National Standard? And who's standard? Very same people responsible for it's failure.

Do you see how deep you are in a hole in your belief that you don't even see you are in one?

Who told you I was applauding No Child left behind written by the late Ted Kennedy?

No Child left behind? The only way to accomplish that is to drag the rest with those left behind.

Edited March 24, 2011 by Karlis
Deleted inflammatory comment

[AROCES]

Much agreed .. I even go to my students homes to tutor them after hours and some of their moms and dads with how to deal with their substandard issues and what they need to learn.

Then on top of that I bring them Papa Johns pizza or McDonalds because they really do not want to spend time after 8 hours of school to do more studying.

Yet this is one reason I prosper and so many other teachers fail. I put in extra effort .. for free. They have children and other issues and cant do this. Yet if we were paid more for extra duties I grant you that they would raise their hands to do so!!!

Edited to correct stupid mistakes ... hmmm, here comes my little demons. Time for math!!! Oh how these kids love their math ..

And as soon as they feel under paid again?

You telling us they be back to not doing extra effort?

[AROCES]

IKids do not like to fail, therefore what is their behavior??? They start trouble, ignore and interupt the lesson and sometimes as I have seen worse. This happens so many times when my students and former students are taught something they cannot grasp ... a trip to detention and sometimes even worse. Sick, sad and pathetic, yet no kid left behind ..

YUP

Everyone is left behind, fair and even.

[Karlis]

We all feel we need to be compensated for what we do.

Why are Teachers suddenly above us all? Teachers before go in that Profession out of love of teaching and the pay was not great but they do it for the passion of it. Now the left have planted in everyone's mind that Teachers can't teach well if they are not paid what the Politicians think they deserve.

Do you see the damage you lefty have done to Education at all?

Aroces, do you feel that teachers should have (or need not have) their pay rates brought up to levels similar to parallel professional fields? I'm asking you this because you say that teachers went into the education field "out of love" for teaching rather than for the salaries; and now they should not campaign for "equal pay".

Your thoughts?

Karlis

[AROCES]

Aroces, do you feel that teachers should have (or need not have) their pay rates brought up to levels similar to parallel professional fields? I'm asking you this because you say that teachers went into the education field "out of love" for teaching rather than for the salaries; and now they should not campaign for "equal pay".

Your thoughts?

Karlis

Ever heard of working hard to earn more?

You seem to believe in earning more to work hard.

Edited March 24, 2011 by AROCES

[Karlis]

Ever heard of working hard to earn more?

You seem to believe in earning more to work hard.

That does not seem very explicit regarding the situation with this thread about teachers and their pay level. Care to give some more details?

[AROCES]

That does not seem very explicit regarding the situation with this thread about teachers and their pay level. Care to give some more details?

So you want to raise the pay to what you think they deserve, correct?

How about letting the market dictate it and let's see what families can afford, instead of you deciding base on what you think just because of other profession.

If the pay is too low then you won't have much teachers, then you raise the pay to attract more teachers. You let them decide how much they are willing to accept.

See how it should work?

[danielost]

Pay should be high enough that an average person can work just one job and still pay their bills. But that is not the topic of this thread. Even though I know that you conservatives have a utopia where the rich hold all the power and there is no such thing as a middle class, that is not a future most people are excited to work towards.

or taxes should be low enough so you dont have to work one job for you and one job for the government. by the way i m on that poor side of things. and i live on 780 a month, of course i am not paying taxes directly.

[danielost]

That does not seem very explicit regarding the situation with this thread about teachers and their pay level. Care to give some more details?

this was like 8 years ago, but the average pay for teachers was 150,000 a year and lawers was 180,000 a year in utah.