eqgumby Posted April 29, 2011 #376 Share Posted April 29, 2011 I cannot imagine they haven't in some way or form. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Knight Of Shadows Posted April 29, 2011 Author #377 Share Posted April 29, 2011 hi sorry for the delay i had to step out for a while and research things deeper also i have come to a big shift of pointviews through based on real events real people i knew has fallen vicitms through this i was like many supporter of the current goverment and like the many that support stopped with the fact that security forces indeed killing off our fellows syrians i hate to say it .. but that's the fact a relatives of our neighbors two of them actually young men been tortured on electric chairs after they have been arrested and shot at they didn't go free until they were forced to say " unlike reality " that they have no idea who shot them .. while they exactly knew who shot them a friend of mine whos now doing his military service time got orders to shoot anyone walking out at night orders say : even if it was your father otherwise you'd be shoot if not followed order it's such a disgrace to think they can force people into killing off their people by fear and to think they would actually kill their own people it's just disgusting there's speaks of gangs and criminals groups terrorising people well .. phones been cut off last night from 12 midnight Thursday till Friday 6 Pm land phones as well mobiles now in case those gangs were real shouldn't they leave phone on for people to call police if one of those gangs attacked the people .. ? ohh and the phone were cut off in certain areas in damascus countryside where protests are happening before friday for obvious reasons what they need to realize they cannot crush people like animals and expect they can rule people by fear instead ? therefore i take back what i said in this topic till certain point it was truth that people " massive majority " including me supported the goverment but after this much of innocent bloodshed no human can stomach will no longer support such acts .. those people whom been killed are our own people some of them are close friends as well they cannot hide the truth forever .. it's their fault after all to think they can solve this by killing of people giving the thought i was a big supporter and the golden chance they got to win even more support they blew it by killing people violently did they solved things different way they would have won the people support had they stopped the violent acts they'd ear people respect but that's not what they want in my view and research of things they want to rule people by fear till a level people are afraid even to speak there's no excuse for such behavior a bit on notice that i won't discuss it deeper is President is helpless to stop it suffice to say there's parties who want to use the violent solution and they have more power than the president plus control over the army that's about all i can say about that still the news channels made things bigger than they are previously i know but Now things are indeed big the people lives above all .. and things won't ever get better as long there's victims and death it's time to stand neutral and hope for the best for syria Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
FLOMBIE Posted April 29, 2011 #378 Share Posted April 29, 2011 It is not easy to admit you have been wrong on something, especially when you have been defending something you love. I salute you for that, and hope you and your people will find a way to live in freedom and peace. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Corp Posted April 29, 2011 #379 Share Posted April 29, 2011 Good to see you're still around Knight, and I'm glad that you were able to go out and see for yourself what's going on with your country. I hope it quiets down quickly and the people can restore order to their government. Stay safe over there. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
MichaelW Posted April 30, 2011 #380 Share Posted April 30, 2011 hi sorry for the delay i had to step out for a while and research things deeper also i have come to a big shift of pointviews through based on real events real people i knew has fallen vicitms through this i was like many supporter of the current goverment and like the many that support stopped with the fact that security forces indeed killing off our fellows syrians i hate to say it .. but that's the fact a relatives of our neighbors two of them actually young men been tortured on electric chairs after they have been arrested and shot at they didn't go free until they were forced to say " unlike reality " that they have no idea who shot them .. while they exactly knew who shot them a friend of mine whos now doing his military service time got orders to shoot anyone walking out at night orders say : even if it was your father otherwise you'd be shoot if not followed order it's such a disgrace to think they can force people into killing off their people by fear and to think they would actually kill their own people it's just disgusting there's speaks of gangs and criminals groups terrorising people well .. phones been cut off last night from 12 midnight Thursday till Friday 6 Pm land phones as well mobiles now in case those gangs were real shouldn't they leave phone on for people to call police if one of those gangs attacked the people .. ? ohh and the phone were cut off in certain areas in damascus countryside where protests are happening before friday for obvious reasons what they need to realize they cannot crush people like animals and expect they can rule people by fear instead ? therefore i take back what i said in this topic till certain point it was truth that people " massive majority " including me supported the goverment but after this much of innocent bloodshed no human can stomach will no longer support such acts .. those people whom been killed are our own people some of them are close friends as well they cannot hide the truth forever .. it's their fault after all to think they can solve this by killing of people giving the thought i was a big supporter and the golden chance they got to win even more support they blew it by killing people violently did they solved things different way they would have won the people support had they stopped the violent acts they'd ear people respect but that's not what they want in my view and research of things they want to rule people by fear till a level people are afraid even to speak there's no excuse for such behavior a bit on notice that i won't discuss it deeper is President is helpless to stop it suffice to say there's parties who want to use the violent solution and they have more power than the president plus control over the army that's about all i can say about that still the news channels made things bigger than they are previously i know but Now things are indeed big the people lives above all .. and things won't ever get better as long there's victims and death it's time to stand neutral and hope for the best for syria Finally. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Knight Of Shadows Posted April 30, 2011 Author #381 Share Posted April 30, 2011 i'd like to explain what happened and how it started in Daraa now it has came to me clear how it all started a few kids wrote on the walls something against the president " your turn now doc " the kids were arrested and taken and tortured the leaders of tribes in that area went to the intelligence leader who's in charge there when i say leaders of tribes it means people of that area hold so much respect for them like elders ... they told the person in charge it's enough already and that they want the kids to go back home now .. they asked that with alot of respect and in very well manners things are beyond english describtions for them however the person in charged said to them : if you want those kids bring the women of your town and then you can take the kids " great insult for the honor of these elders " that what set them off .. and to make it worse when things started that same man said he'll put their uprise down with his shoes on their heads that's how it came to me .. although am not sure 100% i mean what do they think people are slaves for them ? who do they think they are to treat people like that ? without those people those people in high power seats would never have gotten that much the person's dignity is above all .. and they think they can steal it away i been ferious about it last few days even hesitated to put it here in case they're watching .. yeah i could actually get arrested but it longer matters many people have died already they can no longer shut people down and let them reap the harvest of blood they planted Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Knight Of Shadows Posted April 30, 2011 Author #382 Share Posted April 30, 2011 Finally. don't get too happy i'll probably keep disagreeing with you on many other things but on this matters it'll be a disgrace for the souls of the people who have died to support such act especially after knowing the truth Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
MichaelW Posted April 30, 2011 #383 Share Posted April 30, 2011 don't get too happy i'll probably keep disagreeing with you on many other things but on this matters it'll be a disgrace for the souls of the people who have died to support such act especially after knowing the truth It's fine. I don't expect anything more. Have you heard of a cult of personality? Might explain why people still supported the President (and still do). Because what I've seen with Hafez al-Assad and increasingly his son, is such a entity. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Ealiar101 Posted April 30, 2011 #384 Share Posted April 30, 2011 Yesterday in front of Al-Radwan mosque, three people were calling for freedom..people instantly rushed into them and started beating them up, then some men in causual clothes tazed them, throwed them in a car and went by..I saw it with my bare eyes. :L Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Knight Of Shadows Posted April 30, 2011 Author #385 Share Posted April 30, 2011 michael the reason people support the president is the fear to know that something they love and believed in for a long time has been wrong so they'd prefer to be indenial coz it's eaiser than to deal with the fact that what they knew and loved for long time was was not like they thoughts for long time beside trust me the president is helpless toward the situation it's the people around him who focused on using force the people who been discussed by the EU Ealiar yeah it's painful reality i also seen many cases with my eyes which made me shift my pointview like this the thing they're not realizing is force never works they'll only get people like me who used to support them to change sides coz the force and violence they're using Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
dekker87 Posted May 2, 2011 #386 Share Posted May 2, 2011 KoS - kudos to you for being honest and having your eyes opened at last. <tips hat> just be very careful what you post on here for the foreseeable future my friend. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Black Red Devil Posted May 2, 2011 #387 Share Posted May 2, 2011 KoS - kudos to you for being honest and having your eyes opened at last. <tips hat> just be very careful what you post on here for the foreseeable future my friend. HA HA. Don't ever take that hat off mate. You're going to end up going places. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
MichaelW Posted May 3, 2011 #388 Share Posted May 3, 2011 michael the reason people support the president is the fear to know that something they love and believed in for a long time has been wrong so they'd prefer to be indenial coz it's eaiser than to deal with the fact that what they knew and loved for long time was was not like they thoughts for long time That's actually a very good point you made. Now I understand completely. So, still want democracy for Syria? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Knight Of Shadows Posted May 3, 2011 Author #389 Share Posted May 3, 2011 (edited) i haven't said that i took theh opposite side of things michael i said i no longer support such acts on people and that i took neutral stand i find my self stuck between two things 1- support oppositions by doing so taking a risk of a new goverment that comes which will eventally turn into puppets to the western hands " such as saudia " which i'd be ashamed of till the end of times 2- support goverment which i stand 100% with it's policy toward the west but the only way i see am taking the goverment's side is that they treat people differnetly with more respect for the human life so i think the neutral is the best thing to be now Edited May 3, 2011 by Knight Of Shadows Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Corp Posted May 3, 2011 #390 Share Posted May 3, 2011 What makes you think a new government is going to be Western puppets? If a government is put into power by the people, and those people don't want to be "puppets" than there's little reason foreign policy would change. Besides I'd think that having a government that decides to improve relations with other countries would be better than a government that decides to gun down their own people. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Knight Of Shadows Posted May 3, 2011 Author #391 Share Posted May 3, 2011 you see the reason i think such way is because not all protests are out of good heart some of those protests are indeed had guns and such i am intended to look at both sides of things not one now i reliazed that security forces indeed killing some people while i also know that there is groups who's killing people and attacking military bases so it results that those protests are mix of people claiming their just rights and on the mix you got people who want to bring the down system " at any cost " they have not given any demands .. they didn't say what they want they just march and scream " bring down the current system " beside not to mention armed groups which i think their existance is not " all " a fake now as you see i would think the best solution is people have all their rights 1- speak freely 2- stop random arrests 3- better life conitions on all levels 4- stop the rich employers who are making kill of the situation " to be more exact on this person who used to work for say 14000 SP per month when more people where out of job the rich b******* made that payment 8000 per month if that person don't like it .. they'll kick him out due to more people out of job some one else would wanna work out of desperation " 5- and most important " stop corruption " which is the worst of all " you go to goverment department to make some paperworks and the person in charge treat people like dogs .. this must be dealt with " now with those dealt with people who protest with demands have no more demands but let's look about protests without demands i have no doubt the second class of protests are pushed from outside now i don't know if you reliaze syria's position in the area and how much it gave the western presence a trouble let's compare Saudia versus Syria Saudia : peace with israel , peace with usa , we exactly know that saudia is mere puppet or pawn that says and act what the usa tells them to any one who would disagree with this is neither really ignorant of things or indenial eiather ways .. it's fact Syria : against usa policy in the area , officially at war with israel , syria was among the few countries who didn't approve and refused to be part of war on iraq which p***ed of the usa syria supported resistance in so many cases syria does not bend to usa will and syria does not take orders from an occupying country living off leeching people's oil there is different between the two above you see .. big differnt now " must " of syria peoples are stuck the same way i am they see them self very proud arabs of a country that has long stood in face of western forces and refused to be pawns like so many arabic countries on the other hand the force those protests were met made people feel bad they are not ready yet to depart from support .. but the fear of new goverment that will turn into puppet to the west influence personaly now for me .. i'd want the things above i listed to happen and our current president to stay with our current stands and policy sorry it tooks long but i couldn't skip the details for the meaning and the clear idea is within the details Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
MichaelW Posted May 4, 2011 #392 Share Posted May 4, 2011 i haven't said that i took theh opposite side of things michael i said i no longer support such acts on people and that i took neutral stand i find my self stuck between two things 1- support oppositions by doing so taking a risk of a new goverment that comes which will eventally turn into puppets to the western hands " such as saudia " which i'd be ashamed of till the end of times 2- support goverment which i stand 100% with it's policy toward the west but the only way i see am taking the goverment's side is that they treat people differnetly with more respect for the human life so i think the neutral is the best thing to be now I doubt that the current administration has much respect for human life and somehow I doubt they'll change. The people want democracy and freedom and come hell or high water, they'll get it. Besides, Saudis are happy with their lives. Only lunatics like Osama bin Laden (who is a Saudi national) would object. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Knight Of Shadows Posted May 4, 2011 Author #393 Share Posted May 4, 2011 how can you tell ? i have a saudi friend who went furious last few days even furious enough to start protest they wouldn't allow him to marry the girl he love because she's shaia muslim you don't hear of protests in saudia because saudia is usa puppet and therefore it's goverment is needed to exist the way it is not to mention " al jazeera " which saved no effort on broadcasting the events in syria .. did not even said not even a little about protests in saudia ? now why do you think that ? certinally not coz al jazeera are owned by saudia ? however they might be happy .. or not .. with their life i don't care for what's important to me not to kowtow to the western influence and become a pet for them that's what keeps syrians all together under the current goverment that's another reason for the goverment to change it's methods and it has been noticeable last few days things improved from the prospective of where i live and things around me i mean and from what i hear from friends but it's far from over yet beside the goverment has lanuched alot of projects of reform i say give it a time to take the effect before judging Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Corp Posted May 4, 2011 #394 Share Posted May 4, 2011 There are many who would argue that it's the US that kowtows to the Saudis. That due to their oil reserves the Saudis can do whatever they want and the US wouldn't say a word out of fear that oil production might get cut. So I don't see the Saudis as puppets at all. Perhaps their national interests just differ from Syria's. That being friendly with the US helps to further their goals and build up their country. Just because a country has a different outlook doesn't make them puppets of a foreign power. Now as for Syria I'm sorry to say but I just don't think the US sees them as that important within the region. Iran is seen as the much bigger threat. The general tone that is taken is that when it comes to general anti-Western actions in the Middle East that Iran is the biggest problem with Syria has kind of a junior partner. A possible threat yes but not the main one. Getting Syria to shift their diplomatic outlook would be seen as important because it would have taken away an Iranian ally, not because it would help Israel. And while I'm sure that the US would love for the current Syrian government to be replaced with one that's more friendly I don't think it's a high enough of a priority to get them deeply involved in the protest movement. Their focus is just elsewhere. There hasn't be any sign in any of the news stories about the Syrian protests that the Western governments are doing anything other than watching and condemning the violence. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Knight Of Shadows Posted May 4, 2011 Author #395 Share Posted May 4, 2011 you see corp that's where you're wrong on the first point about saudia most of arabs knows this saudia only play the rule usa tells them to .. say what usa want them to i reliaze the powerful weapon in saudia hands but as they say here a weapon in shaking hands doesn't do much however my best guess would be that saudia don't want to bring troubles to their people i reliaze that every now and then they make good stands but those stands unfortunatly aren't so many however like i said you're wrong saudia does not have impact on usa coz of oil i reliaze if that oil flow otherplaces it would make things harder for the usa but it will never does now for syria and i have to say you're wrong about this syria is one of the biggest throns in the area for the usa in previous war on lebanon syria and it's supply for hezboallah was the main reason that israel lost it's war some people might claim israel did not lost but am sure you're sane enough to admit that israel lost and lost big time for it was fighting a small milita and could not win not an army .. not a nation or a country just a miltia with limited numder of memebers let's also not forget it's previous support for hamas and resistance now hamas i think has turned to egypt which i have to say it's not bad thing am very happy about egypt egypt has came back good old egypt they are taking stands again egypt was the biggest ally of the west in the area but now egypt is different and am happy about it now if you actually looked at the results the usa + israel presence in the area was not in a good condition at all especially coz of egypt change also usa has confessed financing opposition groups in syria plus a tv channel of oppositions in syria usa greedy hands will keep reaching so far until they're cut off and mark my words had been there a suggestion of western military interfernce in syria .. the syrian people will turn their attention from protests to fighting off the western forces there might be protests now but when the time is right and if military interfernce ever happened no syrian will agree to it therefore it'll be a war on syrian goverment as well as people not a pretty sight Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Corp Posted May 4, 2011 #396 Share Posted May 4, 2011 That might be your view of it Knight but I can tell you as someone who lives a few hours from the US that the popular view is that the Saudis hold as much, if not more, influence over the US than the US holds over the Saudis. There are a lot of people who don't like the alliance the two countries have with each other and others who feel that following 9/11 that Saudi Arabia was a much more reasonable target than Afganistan. You might believe that the Saudis are just puppets of the US but there are a lot of Americans who believe otherwise. And yes Israel did lose that war, though it was largely due to political reasons than military ones. But again as someone to lives right near the US I can tell you that Syria just isn't very high on their worry list right now. Pakistan, Afghanistan, Iran, Iraq, Egypt, Yemen, and Libya is where their focus is right now. I'm sure the US would love to see a more friendly government in place in Syria but I'm sure they see as getting deeply involved in the opposition movements, trying to control them, as being not worth the risk. Now as for Egypt it's still an open question about the kind of government that will be formed in the coming months. After all our one Egyptian member clearly said the protests were only about internal issues, not about foreign policy at all. Could be that opening the Gaza border is all they do or they could do more. Really too soon to say what kind of foreign political outlook they're going to take. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Knight Of Shadows Posted May 5, 2011 Author #397 Share Posted May 5, 2011 you see the americans don't know except what their goverment wants them to know .. so i wouldn't count on their opinion on the matter as facts it's their opinion which happens to not agree with mine it's fair enough but like i already mentioned the media control all every type of media is biased to suit their agenda don't get me wrong that include syrian media too however the 9/11 events not worth of mentioning coz personally i think that was just big bluff most arabs or at least people i know thinks the same after all it's clear who profit from the 9/11 events to the most many questions went unanswered from the start of the event till the end " death of osama " i mean what do they take us ? to believe such crap about his death anyway sorry to address so many points and drifting away but that's my personal opinion for egypt however it's enough for me till now what they've done i said my personal thoughts and opinions about new egypt it would be great if egypt no longer support the western influnce however about syria you still fail to see the importance of syria let's look at the surrounding area of israel "usa allies " let's look what who does not support usa or israel ? iraq ? hehe ? there's only syria " Only " lebanon isn't worth mentioning they're not powerful enough syria is the link between iran . hezboallah . resistance you mention iran more important than syria which i agree but do you think usa would attack iran directly ??? if you wanna weaken iran existance in the area .. you go to their allies who's syria .. you wanna cut off iran from hezboallah ? it's syria the key .. you wanna cut off support for resistance in palestine from the world ? again syria is the key .. iran turn is coming in the westerns plans but not yet not as long have strong presence in the area through syria iraq not worth of mentioning it's already under usa control egypt is worth of the attention but only recently lybia really ? lybia is not worth of attention beside it's away from the area but .. it has oil .. so you might right yemen ? they lack the power or the connections it's all about syria however i told you usa already interfered in syria oppositions by supporting it and finance a tv channel of oppositions it's no secret no more that usa interfer in syrian affairs Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Corp Posted May 5, 2011 #398 Share Posted May 5, 2011 Well by that logic does that not mean that Syria interfers with Lebanese affairs due to their funding of Hezboallah? That if Hezboallah gain power then Lebanon would then be a puppet of Syria. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Knight Of Shadows Posted May 6, 2011 Author #399 Share Posted May 6, 2011 in a way that seems right but let's rememeber that syrian helping out hezboallah started when lebanon .. well part of it was under israel control aslo .. let's also not forget that it was thanks to hezboallah which israel left the lebanon lands but you have to keep in mind that lebanon in that period of time did not had the power to defend it self against israel however there's benfits for both sides but the most important thing is that benfit does not include treason what i mean by treason is to keep silence about the wrong actions by the west in the area .. the silence about palestinians rights among many other things let me put it in simple way .. personally i think the west " regardless " of what nation wheather usa or another have no right to meddle in middle east their presence is not welcome speaking of which there's few protests in syria today and the day before which the reason for is to decline the american interfernce of syria and to tell usa to mind it's own bussiness before lecturing about human rights in syria they should look at human rights they violated and still do i think it's very much a hippocrate like of the usa to mention human rights while they above all nations violated those human rights don't you agree ? i just don't get on which common sense the usa operate could you help with that ? they wanna teach syria about human rights syria a country without invasions history of some sort while usa on the other side a country with history filled with violence and wars and unjustifed invasions of other countries they wanna lecture us about human rights ? the very nerve ! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Corp Posted May 6, 2011 #400 Share Posted May 6, 2011 Well you stated that you didn't want to support the opposition movement because they got some funding from the US and that might turn them into Syrian puppets. At the same time we have an opposition movement in Lebanon being funded by Syria. So if Syria doesn't want to influence/control/annex Lebanon as you've said in the past, then logically there is no reason to believe that the US would want to make Syria a puppet. As for the whole human rights thing while Syria does have the US beat on not invading other countries they'd doing very badly on the whole don't shoot protesters and jail people just on their political outlook. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Recommended Posts
Create an account or sign in to comment
You need to be a member in order to leave a comment
Create an account
Sign up for a new account in our community. It's easy!
Register a new accountSign in
Already have an account? Sign in here.
Sign In Now