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God's Hand?


Persia

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That is why most of the times, it is better to be simple, poor people always pray to god always at peace and feel secured while rich people gets panicked when their stocks are down never feel secured and contented. Japan is a wealthy nation and I remember one Japanese said before I have everything but after the earthquakes all are gone, I have nothing even a glass of water. Does he ever realized God shows him how he controls everything, that he needs him in more ways than any other things in this world. My statement is only my beliefs and no intention to influence others.

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Wow. I'm the only one here that believes in God I guess. And, to answer some of your questions about this being none of you know about "God and his word."

God does not create disasters, pain, turmoil etc. That's a fallacy and unfortunately, many "Christians" don't even know the truth. Going by his word (The Bible) God created earth and all of us to live in his grace. Pure heaven on earth so to speak. Never intended for anything bad to ever happen to anyone. However, when Adam sinned, that took us from God's grace, his protection, and into a world he didn't want us to be in. (Although he knew it was coming, we (adam) still had free will to choose whatever he wanted. So, because Adam (we) sinned, that brought about pain, suffering, death, decay, all the terrible things that we go through. God isn't causing it. We caused it! And because we are no longer living in his Grace, or Eden, we are subject to all this. The best we can do is be faithful, pray to him, and ask for his help during terrible times. God does deliver people from a lot. Protects, heals etc. The issue is, God can only do as much as we are willing and allowing him to do. All these terrible things aren't his doing. It's our own.

That's what a true, and knowledgeable christian knows.

I also take offense to you saying people who believe in God are not intelligent, etc etc. That's ridiculous and shows your own ignorance and feeble mind at work. I have a Major in applied sciences and a bachtoral in Psychology. I've also accomplished at lot, as well as dedicated my life to serving this country in a tactical manor. You cannot be where I'm at without having a high IQ and being very educated.

And I'm not alone. I know very VERY many Christians who are scientists, doctors etc etc. So, generalizing and speaking this ignorance is nothing but being feeble minded and doltish.

the main criticism was of the traditional view of god being omnipotent. if god cannot prevent this, he is not omnipotent. if he can prevent it, he doesn't care enough about us to do so.

of course, its easy enough for a christian to say that god isnt omnipotent at all, and many do.

those pondering on whether god actually causes natural disasters were only doing so (in my understanding) in response to the article. they were not expressing personal beliefs, simply mocking those of others; the same ones you have just 'corrected' (though i would like to point out that the bible is not necessarily truth, and thus you may very well be wrong).

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Whatever is going to happen will happen without all the fire and brimstone preachers in our world. Bring it on!

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That is why most of the times, it is better to be simple, poor people always pray to god always at peace and feel secured while rich people gets panicked when their stocks are down never feel secured and contented. Japan is a wealthy nation and I remember one Japanese said before I have everything but after the earthquakes all are gone, I have nothing even a glass of water. Does he ever realized God shows him how he controls everything, that he needs him in more ways than any other things in this world. My statement is only my beliefs and no intention to influence others.

If you study the history of civilizations, any or all of them for that matter - you will find quite definitively that it is NOT better to be simple or poor.

Stupid, poor, and crushed beneath the hungry wheels of an oligarchy is no way to go through life, son.

To your point of the Japanese man bemoaning his lack of possessions, would you say it is more likely that God decided this man needed to be taught a lesson, or more likely that a natural disaster simply screwed this guy (and hundreds of thousands of others) over.

Think it through.

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Earthquakes, volcanoes are all about plate tectonics. There aren't anymore earthquakes now than there has been in the past. People need to watch more science documentaries, then they would know this stuff. We are having an impact on the atmosphere. You can't put all that garbage in the air and not have an impact. Other than that we don't have much influence on the inner structure of the planet. What until Yellowstone blows, then you'll think its the end of the world and it might be the end of the human world. As far as the Gods go I don't think they really care. Good luck folks. ;)

Edited by Darkwind
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What until Yellowstone blows, then you'll think its the end of the world and it might be the end of the human world. As far as the Gods go I don't think they really care. Good luck folks. ;)

Yep, that's agnosticism.

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Yep, that's agnosticism.

They may have something, I like their Honesty, hopeefullness and Love which is not dictated, but genuine.

Love Omnaka

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They may have something, I like their Honesty, hopeefullness and Love which is not dictated, but genuine.

I'm not sure if you're referring to the gods or to his agnosticism, but I'm equally inspired.

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I'm not sure if you're referring to the gods or to his agnosticism, but I'm equally inspired.

Awsome!, I would say both.

God bless you KRS_One!

Love Omnaka

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So every human is put through pain and suffering because one human made a mistake? So god, in his infinite wisdom, punishes all humans for all eternity, because of the actions of one? Do you realise how ridiculous that sounds?

That would be like us locking up every German in the world because of the actions of the Nazi's in world war II. Or if one dog attacks and kills someone, we must kill every single one.

I think what was meant was "Adam" is humanity, humanity fell from Grace, Adam being the representative in the parable for us all. It is indicative of our

state as a people that none of us reside in Eden, not just because of Eve (the feminine aspect of humanity) gave Adam an apple but because humanity took on the knowledge of all that is good and evil when God specifically said - Hey, don't go there ... you won't like it there, not good for you, leave it alone yadi yada.

But we always do go there dont we, in fact, we live there.

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I think what was meant was "Adam" is humanity, humanity fell from Grace, Adam being the representative in the parable for us all. It is indicative of our

state as a people that none of us reside in Eden, not just because of Eve (the feminine aspect of humanity) gave Adam an apple but because humanity took on the knowledge of all that is good and evil when God specifically said - Hey, don't go there ... you won't like it there, not good for you, leave it alone yadi yada.

But we always do go there dont we, in fact, we live there.

Seems like it was all part of a plan huh?

God's plan? God never intended stupid children. Separating wheat from chaff,, means we are breeding up, better and better.

Love omnaka

Edited by Omnaka
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Seems like it was all part of a plan huh?

God's plan? God never intended stupid children. Separating wheat from chaff,, means we are breeding up, better and better.

Love omnaka

Hhmm, maybe he never had a plan, what if he just had faith - in us, we were supposedly made in his image ie: we are a reflection of him, as above so below,

yes I guess the wheat would get separated from the chaff by default as we progressed and found our way back home - or not.

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Theonly problem with the idea that the changes in weather/climate are signs from God is that, every generation, as far back as when humans 1st arrived on this planet have experienced weather/climate changes. I still haven't seen any evidence that the raises in temperatres and the seemingly "out of wack" seasons is anything unnique, or if it is unexplained.

I do however agree that the recent surge of earathquakes may be a more direct Sign. As far as we know, nothing that we do, can prevent, or cause earthquakes, and I do not think that there is anyone whom would argue that in that past 5 years, we have had an unusually large amount of rather serious earthquakes...

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Hhmm, maybe he never had a plan, what if he just had faith - in us, we were supposedly made in his image ie: we are a reflection of him, as above so below

You are stating that an omnipotent all knowing being never had a plan. Then that omnipotent being, all knowing was flawed. As we are flawed.

yes I guess the wheat would get separated from the chaff by default as we progressed and found our way back home - or not.

What flawed wheat would we be, sowed by a flawed farmer.

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I think what was meant was "Adam" is humanity, humanity fell from Grace, Adam being the representative in the parable for us all. It is indicative of our

state as a people that none of us reside in Eden, not just because of Eve (the feminine aspect of humanity) gave Adam an apple but because humanity took on the knowledge of all that is good and evil when God specifically said - Hey, don't go there ... you won't like it there, not good for you, leave it alone yadi yada.

But we always do go there dont we, in fact, we live there.

In the end isn't that human nature? Curiousity, inquisiteness, a thist for knowledge.

God in this story knew in advance that Adam would eat from the tree, but he still put the tree there. If 'god' didn't want people eating from the tree, then he could easily have made it so right?

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You are stating that an omnipotent all knowing being never had a plan. Then that omnipotent being, all knowing was flawed. As we are flawed.

What flawed wheat would we be, sowed by a flawed farmer.

Since when is the lack of a plan an indication of being flawed? It's just one way of approach and also based on our human perception, given he is above human and omnipotent, I don't see the issue, it's just as reasonable for an omnipotent being to know better than to plan anything as it is for him to believe everything requires planning.

If we believe he is a flawed farmer are we sure that what we believe is necessarily evidence of this? In the world according to who? What makes our personal view of what is wise or logical right? What about all the stuff that we don't know that we don't know?

Also, I am not "stating" that an omnipotent being did not have a plan I am just saying "what if" he did not have a plan? I would be interested to dealve into that possibility and not discount it. He seems to require faith in his good book quite alot and I can't help wondering what the ramifications of real faith must be, pretty powerful for it to be mentioned so often - but who is there who really knows how or why?

Please disregard any statements by me that might ever suggest I actually know

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In the end isn't that human nature? Curiousity, inquisiteness, a thist for knowledge.

God in this story knew in advance that Adam would eat from the tree, but he still put the tree there. If 'god' didn't want people eating from the tree, then he could easily have made it so right?

Hhmmm, so it's his fault or responsibility?

Also, the serpent that did the tempting was in the garden too, why let it be there, he must have known it's nature?

You might want to check out some readings on the demiurge on the web then, you might find them interesting.

Best to take responsibility for our decisions in the end though regardless of how they came about otherwise when would we start to resolve these things?

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Please disregard any statements by me that might ever suggest I actually know

It's pointless to debate any point with you since you demur preemptively.

What a convenient excuse.

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God's Hand? 44% of Americans See Natural Disasters as Sign of End Times

http://www.livescien...asters-god.html

Natural disasters have been going on from the word go...long before man could ever measure them.. and we are still here

They happen all the time, so why on earth would so many Americans think - the end is near? that is just stupidity !

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Yep, that's agnosticism.

Actually, agnostic theist.

Agnostic theism is the philosophical view that encompasses both theism and agnosticism. An agnostic theist believes the proposition at least one deity exists is true, but per agnosticism also believes that this proposition is unknown or inherently unknowable. The agnostic theist may also or alternatively be agnostic regarding the properties of the god(s) they believe in.[1]

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Agnostic_theism

The joys of being an eclectic Pagan. :ph34r:

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~TheBigK~ you must not be from america if you thought that was a lot more than what should be more americans than any other country believe in a god.

believe it or not we're a stupid country

Nope, I'm right next to you in Wisconsin. And I guess maybe I should know better because of that, but sometimes I make the mistake of assuming we're getting smarter.

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When I say poor it doesn't mean you are poor in terms of wealth and knowledge, what I mean poor in spirit these people whatever is there status in life rich, intelligent and really poor the ones who seek god and believes without god they are nothing are far more better. Civilizations? Why? What happen now to the Roman Empire? Where are they now?

There are nations here that are really poor, their place are desert no trees no flowers, the people are not really that intelligent but they pray 5 times a day and so they are blessed people from great nations come to serve them and they become rich because they always seek God. I am not saying this just because I am with them, no my religion is different. Someday rich nations will become poor, united will be divided and that I believe will happen if they will not cling to God.

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All of these are just natural disasters. Believe me, when God gets angry, you'll know it.

How so? We haven't seen anything out of the ordinary in the last 6-7,000 years.

Will there be cards? Notices?

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It's pointless to debate any point with you since you demur preemptively.

What a convenient excuse.

Sorry you feel that way, I just wanted to avoid a debate on God being flawed, convenient yes cos I could go for days on all the ways God is not flawed, I leave this one in play though. Man is very good at creating God in his own image. I just don't want to play in that Labyrinth.

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