Demon names during exorcism

[gambino78]

Why during exorcism the priest ask the demons to tell their names?

Some say the demons can be exorcised only if they will tell their names. It's also said that during exorcism the hardest part is to make the demons to tell their real names. I donno what to say. I mean i can't throw out someone from my house if i don't know his name?

What do you think?

[dazdillinjah]

Ive no idea ..Im a Christian but Im sure the Catholic's will know

[Disembodied Voice]

Never really thought about that. Kind of reminds me of Hellboy when he has to say his true name. lol. But I guess that's how they got the idea for that. Maybe by saying their name you can hold some kind of power over them or something and that's why they don't want to tell you their name....

[libstaK]

Why during exorcism the priest ask the demons to tell their names?

Some say the demons can be exorcised only if they will tell their names. It's also said that during exorcism the hardest part is to make the demons to tell their real names. I donno what to say. I mean i can't throw out someone from my house if i don't know his name?

What do you think?

Don't know for sure but taking a punt on what I have noted in my life thus far - When God created Adam he allowed him to name everything and he gave him dominion over all things. So, by extension, knowing the name of the demon would give a descendant of Adam dominion over it by law and the power to command it, or "conjur". To conjur you would have to be very specific in your commands, therefore the extensive ritualism of exorcisms in the catholic tradition.

I was raised a catholic by the way but have diverted to a more gnostic interpretation of the christian faith.

[gambino78]

Maybe by saying their name you can hold some kind of power over them or something and that's why they don't want to tell you their name....

Interesting point of view. Thanks!

[gambino78]

Don't know for sure but taking a punt on what I have noted in my life thus far - When God created Adam he allowed him to name everything and he gave him dominion over all things. So, by extension, knowing the name of the demon would give a descendant of Adam dominion over it by law and the power to command it, or "conjur". To conjur you would have to be very specific in your commands, therefore the extensive ritualism of exorcisms in the catholic tradition.

I was raised a catholic by the way but have diverted to a more gnostic interpretation of the christian faith.

Indeed. As Disembodied Voice said above, it may be the power of the word.

Speaking of old writings, they confuse people more and more. On this subject, let's take The Bible statements. Jesus exorcised a demon but only after the demon told his name. When Jesus ask him to tell his name, the demon said "My name is Legion cuz we are many". So, in my opinion, the devil DID NOT said his real name cuz it was something like you ask a soldier to tell his name and he answers "My name is Army cuz we are many". Right?

[Regency]

Online it says that, by it giving you it's name when you demand it to reveal it's identity, it gives you power over it. Doesn't explain why a demon would want to give it's power away though.

[eight bits]

Deliverance-exorcism is a lot older than Roman Catholicism or Eastern Orthodoxy. Christian forms are not much different from others. There are many "techniques," of which one is to elicit the name of the demon.

Exorcism is a "contest of wills" of sorts, so exorcism rituals often include things that are socially useful for establishing authority and status on the exorcist's part. As to name-knowing, there is a general human feeling of social unease when somebody knows a lot about you and you don't know anything about them (imagine somebody you've never met calls you up and asks personal questions...). Exchanging names "levels the playing field," psychologically.

Even in modern society, don't you feel a difference between somebody who introduces themselves using both first and last name, as opposed to first name only? Just because there are practical reasons for that doesn't change the emotional character of the transaction.

Presumably, anything Jesus did is fair game for any Christian, and Jesus used the technique in the Legion incident (Mark 5: 6 ff, Luke 8: 26 ff.).

It is interesting that Jesus asks for Legion's name only after Legion has announced Jesus' name, origin, and title. So there's a little bit of drama there. Jesus plays catch-up, but mistakenly (?)addresses the demon as if it is one entity, then comes the demons', plural, response - ha ha, we outnumber you. But, of course, outnumbering Jesus is unavailing, and hapless Legion is-or-are evicted into some pigs, and from there into water, a traditional demonic holding pen.

The incident is also unusual for Jesus in that it has a "proof" of exorcism success apart from the healing of the afflicted man, that strange self-destructive behavior of the swine herd. That sort of visible sign of the exit of the demon is another element of ancient exorcism technique.

Usually, though, Jesus just does the rebuke-and-command thing, and the only sign of success is the simple correction of the afflicted person. His apostolic successors (epsiodes are scattered throughout Acts) maybe add to the simple verbal approach that they are acting in the place of Jesus. Invocation of spiritual authority figures (for example, Solomon) was part of pre-Christian ritual, too. Conversely, some non-Christians apparently used Jesus' name, just as some non-Jews probably used Solomon's.

Jesus himself can be found acknowleding that he exorcises through the power of God when questionned about it by critics, but in his actual performances does not seem to use the "in the name of ..." method, typically just rebuke-and-command, maybe with some precuation about "... and don't come back."

So,

Some say the demons can be exorcised only if they will tell their names.

is not the position of any Christian exorcism lore that I know of. Unfortunately, the whole subject is a BS-magnet, so no doubt plenty of people will focus on that one possible element of technique as if it were essential.

[gambino78]

Online it says that, by it giving you it's name when you demand it to reveal it's identity, it gives you power over it. Doesn't explain why a demon would want to give it's power away though.

Yes, why a demon would want to reveal his real name? He already know that it will be the moment he will be throwed out of that body. So why?

It's also said that usually demons say false names to mask their real identitiy. I guess it depends of the power and faith of the priest to force him to tell his real name.

[gambino78]

Deliverance-exorcism is a lot older than Roman Catholicism or Eastern Orthodoxy. Christian forms are not much different from others. There are many "techniques," of which one is to elicit the name of the demon.

Exorcism is a "contest of wills" of sorts, so exorcism rituals often include things that are socially useful for establishing authority and status on the exorcist's part. As to name-knowing, there is a general human feeling of social unease when somebody knows a lot about you and you don't know anything about them (imagine somebody you've never met calls you up and asks personal questions...). Exchanging names "levels the playing field," psychologically.

Even in modern society, don't you feel a difference between somebody who introduces themselves using both first and last name, as opposed to first name only? Just because there are practical reasons for that doesn't change the emotional character of the transaction.

Presumably, anything Jesus did is fair game for any Christian, and Jesus used the technique in the Legion incident (Mark 5: 6 ff, Luke 8: 26 ff.).

It is interesting that Jesus asks for Legion's name only after Legion has announced Jesus' name, origin, and title. So there's a little bit of drama there. Jesus plays catch-up, but mistakenly (?)addresses the demon as if it is one entity, then comes the demons', plural, response - ha ha, we outnumber you. But, of course, outnumbering Jesus is unavailing, and hapless Legion is-or-are evicted into some pigs, and from there into water, a traditional demonic holding pen.

The incident is also unusual for Jesus in that it has a "proof" of exorcism success apart from the healing of the afflicted man, that strange self-destructive behavior of the swine herd. That sort of visible sign of the exit of the demon is another element of ancient exorcism technique.

Usually, though, Jesus just does the rebuke-and-command thing, and the only sign of success is the simple correction of the afflicted person. His apostolic successors (epsiodes are scattered throughout Acts) maybe add to the simple verbal approach that they are acting in the place of Jesus. Invocation of spiritual authority figures (for example, Solomon) was part of pre-Christian ritual, too. Conversely, some non-Christians apparently used Jesus' name, just as some non-Jews probably used Solomon's.

Jesus himself can be found acknowleding that he exorcises through the power of God when questionned about it by critics, but in his actual performances does not seem to use the "in the name of ..." method, typically just rebuke-and-command, maybe with some precuation about "... and don't come back."

So,

is not the position of any Christian exorcism lore that I know of. Unfortunately, the whole subject is a BS-magnet, so no doubt plenty of people will focus on that one possible element of technique as if it were essential.

Jesus didn't use the "in the name of God" cuz He WAS God. So no need for that line in His practice.

I did see a real exorcism and pls make the difference between mentally ill persons and real possessed ones. In fact more than 90% of so called possessed cases there are only mentally diseases. But real possession exists and i saw it with my very eyes, here at a monastery in Romania. There were 2 simple country girls, both possessed. I even stayed very close to them during exorcism and....we are in 2011 and trust me, nobody, no medic, scientist,etc can explain to me how a simple girl can SCREAM LOUDLY on 3-4 voices in the same time, with her mouth closed. Not to mention that she was speaking/shouting in romanian, latin and other 2-3 languages i don't know or i didn't understand because they were spoken in the same time. And at one point when the priest asked to tell the names, one voice answered and told very fast 9-10 names but there were common names like Dan, John, etc.

[eight bits]

Jesus didn't use the "in the name of God" cuz He WAS God. So no need for that line in His practice.

Of course, people of different religious persuasions have different views about that. My intent was to be neutral, and I commented about Jesus only because you had mentioned a priest.

The Fourth Gospel, John, has no exorcisms, but does have the raising of Lazarus, which the others do not. Jesus invokes God then, and explains why he does so (at 11: 41-43):

So they took away the stone. And Jesus raised his eyes and said, "Father, I thank you for hearing me. I know that you always hear me; but because of the crowd here I have said this, that they may believe that you sent me."

And when he had said this, he cried out in a loud voice, "Lazarus, come out!"

It's interesting that in another context, what Jesus says could be an exorcism formula. But it does show, I think, that there would be nothing irreverent in thinking about Jesus using an appeal to the authority of God, spoken aloud, at least sometimes during his exorcism ministry.

I hope that the information was of some use to you. Thank you also for the report about those exorcisms you witnessed. The subject is a fascinating one.

La revedere.

[dazdillinjah]

Deliverance-exorcism is a lot older than Roman Catholicism or Eastern Orthodoxy. Christian forms are not much different from others. There are many "techniques," of which one is to elicit the name of the demon.

Exorcism is a "contest of wills" of sorts, so exorcism rituals often include things that are socially useful for establishing authority and status on the exorcist's part. As to name-knowing, there is a general human feeling of social unease when somebody knows a lot about you and you don't know anything about them (imagine somebody you've never met calls you up and asks personal questions...). Exchanging names "levels the playing field," psychologically.

Even in modern society, don't you feel a difference between somebody who introduces themselves using both first and last name, as opposed to first name only? Just because there are practical reasons for that doesn't change the emotional character of the transaction.

Presumably, anything Jesus did is fair game for any Christian, and Jesus used the technique in the Legion incident (Mark 5: 6 ff, Luke 8: 26 ff.).

It is interesting that Jesus asks for Legion's name only after Legion has announced Jesus' name, origin, and title. So there's a little bit of drama there. Jesus plays catch-up, but mistakenly (?)addresses the demon as if it is one entity, then comes the demons', plural, response - ha ha, we outnumber you. But, of course, outnumbering Jesus is unavailing, and hapless Legion is-or-are evicted into some pigs, and from there into water, a traditional demonic holding pen.

The incident is also unusual for Jesus in that it has a "proof" of exorcism success apart from the healing of the afflicted man, that strange self-destructive behavior of the swine herd. That sort of visible sign of the exit of the demon is another element of ancient exorcism technique.

Usually, though, Jesus just does the rebuke-and-command thing, and the only sign of success is the simple correction of the afflicted person. His apostolic successors (epsiodes are scattered throughout Acts) maybe add to the simple verbal approach that they are acting in the place of Jesus. Invocation of spiritual authority figures (for example, Solomon) was part of pre-Christian ritual, too. Conversely, some non-Christians apparently used Jesus' name, just as some non-Jews probably used Solomon's.

Jesus himself can be found acknowleding that he exorcises through the power of God when questionned about it by critics, but in his actual performances does not seem to use the "in the name of ..." method, typically just rebuke-and-command, maybe with some precuation about "... and don't come back."

So,

is not the position of any Christian exorcism lore that I know of. Unfortunately, the whole subject is a BS-magnet, so no doubt plenty of people will focus on that one possible element of technique as if it were essential.

The example youre using regarding 'Legion' was & still is known in the Bible as a 'Healing' definately not an 'Exorcism' ..when reading that episode (Mark 5:9) you also see Jesus may not have needed to even know the name Legion ..His command "Come out of this man, you evil spirit" had already been made

Then later in Mark 6:7 Jesus gave his disciples authority over evil spirits & his instructions are shown in Mark 6:8

These imo are healings ..the more elaborate ritualistic exorcisms must be based on these however so very good point

[libstaK]

Indeed. As Disembodied Voice said above, it may be the power of the word.

Speaking of old writings, they confuse people more and more. On this subject, let's take The Bible statements. Jesus exorcised a demon but only after the demon told his name. When Jesus ask him to tell his name, the demon said "My name is Legion cuz we are many". So, in my opinion, the devil DID NOT said his real name cuz it was something like you ask a soldier to tell his name and he answers "My name is Army cuz we are many". Right?

Sure that's reasonable.

Let's suppose something else. What if Legion referred to the nature of the entity? Perhaps it was many faceted and diverse in it's many desires and therefore it's will when active in a man was causing him to err? It would be a Legion with a singular purpose - to bring man to sin and have him follow after all the worldly things and succumb to it's temptations and thereby increase his separation from God subtely, step by step with the power of it's "many" tools at it's disposal to ensure success. Let's suppose each time we succumbed it gained more power over us, blinded us more, made us more like itself. "If thine eye be single thy whole body shall be full of light" Therefore if thine eye be many, or Legion it would stand to reason that it would be filled with darkness.

[Acenaspheru]

well i know that egyptian gods don't use their real names because the secret name holds all their power so if someone learns it they themselves can use that power.

the story of isis for example. she found out and used the real name of the creator god, ra.

maybe it's the same principal? just that instead of useing that power they dispatch it?

[Corp]

Or they're just being polite

[Agent. Mulder]

Or they're just being polite

Probably just a formal greeting.

Preist: What be your name demon?

Demon: I am called Allbutt, good sir.

Preist: Ah. Why thank you gentle demon. Now, shall we get this exorcism under way?

Demon: Jolly good sir. Would you mind going for tea after?

I picture this as monty python sketch or something.

[scepticalbeliever]

Jesus' exercisms lasted a minute but a Rc exorcism have been known to take a lot longer. Wonder why that is.

[graciousgabby]

Jesus' exercisms lasted a minute but a Rc exorcism have been known to take a lot longer. Wonder why that is.

Because it's JESUS! Come on!

When he prayed to "God"...he had a direct line...it was his Daddy! The other people probably got a message stating..."Your exorcism will be addressed in the order received, you are the 20th exorcism requester in line."

[lightly]

Interesting subject and posts... i agree with those saying it's a power of the spoken word sort of thing... and power of speaking a name. Egyptians believed that to speak the name of the dead was to make them live again.

Jesus called LAZARUS! by name to raise him from the dead. (if your a believer , that is) \

let there be light!

[Alienated Being]

Demonic possession does not exist - however, psychologically delusional and the mentally sick do.

[StarChild 83]

Along with the gaining power over them by speaking their name I thought it was also to try and identify the type of demon they were which I guess in some way would increase the chances of a successful exorcism. But idk know for sure, just what I always figured.

[Donnie Darko]

Perhaps they have power over them, or more control by using their name? Of course Jesus is going to get a direct response, he is the son of God.

PRAISE JESUS!

[ColoradoParanormal]

Here's some food for thought on this.

Coming from a Christian background and a rather different one. My uncle, the pastor of the non-denominational church I grew up in, had a distinct calling on spiritual warfare. His mentor (All pastors have a Pastor or several pastors they answer too, get advice from etc etc) was an Ex High Priest in a Satanic Cult. With his calling it meant he dealt a lot with Demons, Demon Possessions, and even locations "haunted" by a demonic entity. Among a lot of other things. He preached a whole lot about this, and prepared his congregants to do spiritual warfare. One thing I know about the whole "Demonic Name" thing is, Demons have a pecking order just as angels, and of course humans do. According to my uncle, there are nameless Demons that just basically work and are nameless. They serve no purpose but to carry out what the Named Demons tell them to, and also just roam the earth to cause fear, panic, destruction, and open up doors for the more powerful Named Demons to do their "work."

So, therefore if you're dealing with a Named demon, you know two things A: You're dealing with a harder, more powerful entity (thus a different set of rules apply) and B: By knowing the name of this entity, you then have power over it. (This was already touched in this forum above).

[Avant]

Look at Rumpelstiltskin, all his power was in his name...maybe he was a demon?

Names have always had a power, for example how many people here would post there own (full) name here on the board? It's not advisable cause of the power you'd give to someone else trying to do naughty things.

[cpjason]

I am not sure if what you are talking about is true or not, but it may be a double edged sword.

I know when saying a demons real name, it often causes them to appear. It is common to do this during a demonic posession by mistake and call up other demons who have a portal into the person being possesed.

Don't ever talk about other demons by name when you are at a exorcism or they will compound the problem. Once one demon gets inside you, all the others can jump right in without trouble which isn't normal. I could tell you why it isn't normal but that is another topic all together.