Seraphina Posted August 24, 2004 #51 Share Posted August 24, 2004 I don't pretend to know anything about military training....but I do think there has to be an element of some gun-ho ideal that leads to a lot of friendly fire accidents....the UK tank column that was blasted by US troops... They do realise that Saddam didn't have any tanks, right? While I accept that accidents can and do happen, the US military does have quite a reputation over here for being ready to attack just about anything that isn't flying American colours. There does seem to have been an element of this in the Iraq war....a horrifying number of friendly fire instances occured in a very short space of time towards the start of the war. While I can't really be bothered reading back over the thread to see what this has been attributed to by everyone else, I do think there was way way way too much lack of care in the planning of this war...far too many people seemed to be under the impression that, somehow, taking out Saddam took revenge for 9/11 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Michelle Posted August 24, 2004 #52 Share Posted August 24, 2004 Proved my point for me Sera. Press over there! What your press is telling may not always be the truth anymore than ours. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
alis Posted August 24, 2004 #53 Share Posted August 24, 2004 It seems that you are just aiming to be disagrable in this thread, it that what is going on? Are looking for an argument or would you like to have a better idea of why so many friendly fire accidents happen? fluffy with all due respect if you attack Iran, tehran which is the capital will be the most affected, my family are there and i will carry on disagreeing that Iran has weapons of mass distruction, though i needn't continue emphasing what i have already said about the subject at hand. and sera, you put it perfectly! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Fluffybunny Posted August 24, 2004 #54 Share Posted August 24, 2004 fluffy with all due respect if you attack Iran, tehran which is the capital will be the most affected, my family are there and i will carry on disagreeing that Iran has weapons of mass distruction, though i needn't continue emphasing what i have already said about the subject at hand. and sera, you put it perfectly! I can assure you I have no intentions of attacking Iran. I am fairly certain that Michelle has no intentions of invading Iran either. I can understand why you would be upset about that type of situation occuring, having family in an area that has could be attacked is horrible, and you have my sympathies for having to be in that situation. You really do. I have been in war, and would not care to see another regardless of where it may be. I would hope that you understand that the frustration that you feel towards the US government in this difficult time seems to be coming out in agression towards everyone in the US that has posted on this thread. If you were to look at the posts of Michelle and Myself, I think you would find us the best allies that you could have on supporting your point of view in regards to Iran. Neither of us are gung ho invade first and ask questions later kind of folks... We are not the US government, and we are not attempting to invade anyone. The hostility that I sense here comes across like regardless of what is said, it is going to be wrong. In my opinion the idea of these threads is to have an exchange and to learn from each other. Getting bashed for every post one makes kind of slows that entire process down. Do you just want to have someone act as a figurehead of the US to be able to get you frustrations out against? It would be understandable if that were the case, and I will volunteer to take whatever you feel the US has coming to it. In the same light I would hope that we could move past that frustration to maybe learning something about each others point of view and being able to do something about it. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
JAZ76US Posted August 24, 2004 #55 Share Posted August 24, 2004 I admire u very much Fluffybunny, Mr. Bunny for President Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Michelle Posted August 24, 2004 #56 Share Posted August 24, 2004 Oh no, that's so funny Jaz. I started to say write Master Fluff in at election time but I've already riled some people up about my love of him. I can't help it I've always been attracted to a man with intelligence. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
wunarmdscissor Posted August 25, 2004 #57 Share Posted August 25, 2004 michelle what youve got to understand is that our media is always reorting incidents of friendly fire involving americans. The thing is it never seems to be polish on american troops or indonesian on britsih troops its always American troops on another nation. I have yet to hear a story of british troops involved in a freindly fire incident with americans where americans suffered.(if you can provide any info that would be great). I mean in this gulf war and the last there have been countless incidents. I dont know if its a lack of training or if the americans are trigger happy but it happens FAR too often. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Michelle Posted August 25, 2004 #58 Share Posted August 25, 2004 wun that's my point exactly. That's what YOUR media is telling you. MY media isn't reporting much of that here that I hear anyway. Is my media hiding it from me or is your media blowing it all out of proportion? Maybe in Poland THEIR media is telling them they're being killed left and right by US. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
wunarmdscissor Posted August 25, 2004 #59 Share Posted August 25, 2004 gp then research friendly fire incidents. this isnt propoganda if britain had killed us troops something like that would be reported. i mean we're reporting when iraqis kill our troops. If we make mistakes our media would defo report it. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Subtemperate Posted August 25, 2004 #60 Share Posted August 25, 2004 Yes, here in australia we also heard of those friendly fire incidents..... Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
gollum Posted August 25, 2004 #61 Share Posted August 25, 2004 Alis, apology accepted. You where not to know the level of training required. As for Americans possibly being gun-ho....I do'nt believe so. One difference I do know between our troops and American troops is that if a British soldier fire even one shot in Iraq he must report it and fill out a shed load of paperwork, as does his immediate boss, and then his boss and so on and so on till it reaches his brigade commander. It has gotten(is that a word?) so bad that, and I know this for fact, soldiers are purchasing there own weapons on the black market. Not all soldiers mind, just the odd few. Every soldier has to sign for his weapon and ammunition. I do'nt know if that's the case with the rest of the coalition troops but British soldiers certainly do. Now you all may cry out "injustice" or "outrageous" but if you where going out on 2-3 patrols a day and coming under fire every time you went out and you returned fire with your own weapon, think of all that hassle and grief you would get when you went back in. In a word NIGHTMARE. You may say "they are under fire of course they can return fire with there own weapons". But it's not that simple. Infact war is not that simple and it really never will be. You can buy a brand new, still in the waxed paper, 9mm pistol and 3 mags with 100 rounds for around $60. An AK47 with ammo and mags will set you back around $100. You can also purchase hand grenades, RPG's, smoke grenades to name but a few. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Fluffybunny Posted August 25, 2004 #62 Share Posted August 25, 2004 I have yet to hear a story of british troops involved in a freindly fire incident with americans where americans suffered.(if you can provide any info that would be great). I mean in this gulf war and the last there have been countless incidents. I dont know if its a lack of training or if the americans are trigger happy but it happens FAR too often. Perhaps wun you could go look up the overwhelming numbers of American troops vs Brits? What percentage of the total troop count is American? British? What percentage of Combat Troops are American? How many American Troops have been Injured or Killed? How many Brit Troops have been Injured or Killed? What percentage is that? What is the overall F.F. death and injury rate for all wars in the last 70 years? Please look into the entire story before you run around offending people and making accusations to which you do not appear to understand the entire story. It is not right or fair for you to do so. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
wunarmdscissor Posted August 26, 2004 #63 Share Posted August 26, 2004 (edited) Perhaps wun you could go look up the overwhelming numbers of American troops vs Brits? What percentage of the total troop count is American? British? What percentage of Combat Troops are American? How many American Troops have been Injured or Killed? How many Brit Troops have been Injured or Killed? What percentage is that? What is the overall F.F. death and injury rate for all wars in the last 70 years? Please look into the entire story before you run around offending people and making accusations to which you do not appear to understand the entire story. It is not right or fair for you to do so. Yeah fluffy but if you look at whta i said i did say that i did not know the reassons for it. However in my defece i wasnt really being offensive to anyone also there was far more american troops in iraq howevere there was still around 20 000 british troops, obv im not a soldier . How many American Troops have been Injured or Killed however with 20 000 troops there must have been plenty of incidents where british troops were unsure if they were facing an american or not. Honestly , during the original Iraq war more british soldiers were killed by americans than iraqis. it isnt out of order to comment on this. anyway i dont want to offend anyone. so im sorry if i did . However i still stand by my original comment that there is something wrong somewhere. Edited August 26, 2004 by wunarmdscissor Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
alis Posted August 26, 2004 #64 Share Posted August 26, 2004 However i still stand by my original comment that there is something wrong somewhere. there sure is! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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