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Belgium UFO


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maybe your analogy is better than you give it credit for MC.

I agree. I thought it was a good analogy actually.

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Why, thank you gentlemen! :blush:

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This was a classic case of hoaxers taking advantage of a real UFO flap, which has been happening since 1947. There was a famous memo by J. Edgar Hoover that year in which he said that he wasn't going to send his agents out chasing reports of flying hubcaps, garbage can lids and toilet seat covers while the military kept the really good cases to itself.

The La (Louisiana) case he referred to in his memo was an obvious fake, but the Air Force wouldn't let his own agents even look at it and Hoover never liked to be shut out:

"A 16 inch aluminum disc equipped with two radio condensers, a fluorescent light switch and copper tubing found by F.G. Harston near the Shreveport, Louisiana, business district was declared by police to be "obviously the work of a prankster." Police believed the prankster hurled it over a sign board and watched it land at Harston's feet. It was turned over to officials at Barksdale army air field."

http://www.project1947.com/roswell/ufo47.htm

From the very start, the US military had a policy of discouraging and damping down public enthusiasm for UFO reports, because they knew that in these waves the number of misidentified objects, fakes and crazies would go up greatly. They preferred to concentrate on a smaller number of really good cases that were genuine unknowns, preferably reported by pilots and military personnel--and those could also be kept secret.

fake_ufo_answer_5_xlarge.jpeg

Edited by TheMcGuffin
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Seriously?

So people like you think the aliens are here, and they can have a good laugh at your expense, why else?

I've read a few of your posts recently and to be honest, you seem to be trying to cause trouble with your attitude. There is a lot of skeptics on here who are nice people and manage not to insult others like you keep doing.

Also I have seen a triangle above my head..... Do I beleive it's ET... No. So why brand everyone who believes it is an unidentified aircraft etc as being "ET believers". I beleive there is ET life out there, I'm 50/50 on whether they have visited Earth, but I know damn fine I've seen things that are unexplainable. You are coming across as someone far worse than any believer, skeptic or in between.. you are coming across as an arrogant Ass.

Edited by Coffey
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I always refer people to my sig quote. It's my position on the ETH. I think it's very possible that ET could be here. I can't find any corroborating evidence that makes me lean one way or the other though. Lack of evidence, isn't evidence as we know.

I hear people say this a lot, usually as a debunking tactic, that 'No Evidence Exists'.

I don't think you are using it as a debunking tactic here, so please allow me to share some of the evidence with you.

You seem to have an open mind, and have seen things with your own eyes, so this evidence might not freak you out as much as it does some...

I totally get the axiom: "Absence of Evidence is not Evidence of Absence", and you are correct.

However folks like you should know about the good evidence.

And when you hear folks attempting to 'debunk' the entire UFO mystery based upon a 'lack of evidence' please remind them not only of your axiom, but also that evidence does exist.

Here is the most evidence I could accumulate on a single case, it contains over 40 newspaper articles, several books, news radio broadcasts, and video footage. It contains radar returns certified by US Army Regional Command. It contains documentation on deaths resulting from the event. It contains physical damage done to a major US City, and it all happened before 'Roswell'.

MC, please take some time to review The Smoking Anti-Aircraft Guns of Los Angeles, 1942... here:

http://www.abovetopsecret.com/forum/thread329188/pg1

And thank you for your open mind!

-Brand of Amber

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Gravitation is the mutaul attraction of two objects that dis-similar in mass and energy, creating a differential potential energy. When particles work together through electromechanical binding as with atoms and molecules and planets etc., they have a combined gravity. Gravitation between bound groups and unbound particles is then increased because the differential potiential increases.

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Gravitation is the mutaul attraction of two objects that dis-similar in mass and energy, creating a differential potential energy. When particles work together through electromechanical binding as with atoms and molecules and planets etc., they have a combined gravity. Gravitation between bound groups and unbound particles is then increased because the differential potiential increases.

Would love to have a full debate about this at some point in a relevant thread.

As this isn't the place for a debate about Gravity, suffice to say I disagree ;)

1) Gravity is not a result of Electromagnetism

2) attraction does not exist in physics, it is an illusion of perception by the human brain, an effect of repulsion. (In simpler terms, you cannot pull something, pulling forces are the result of pushing forces, even in Magnets and Storm systems...) - See Centrifugal Force Myth, or Centrifugal vs. Centripetal for more info on this:

http://answers.yahoo.com/question/index?qid=20090612212124AAMFvpH

-Brand

Edited to add - MC's analogy was perfect :)

Edited by BrandOfAmber
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And there are many websites that describe how to fake UFO pictures and videos, but I won't provide and links because I don't like to encourage that type of thing.

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I hear people say this a lot, usually as a debunking tactic, that 'No Evidence Exists'.

I don't think you are using it as a debunking tactic here, so please allow me to share some of the evidence with you.

You seem to have an open mind, and have seen things with your own eyes, so this evidence might not freak you out as much as it does some...

I totally get the axiom: "Absence of Evidence is not Evidence of Absence", and you are correct.

However folks like you should know about the good evidence.

And when you hear folks attempting to 'debunk' the entire UFO mystery based upon a 'lack of evidence' please remind them not only of your axiom, but also that evidence does exist.

Here is the most evidence I could accumulate on a single case, it contains over 40 newspaper articles, several books, news radio broadcasts, and video footage. It contains radar returns certified by US Army Regional Command. It contains documentation on deaths resulting from the event. It contains physical damage done to a major US City, and it all happened before 'Roswell'.

MC, please take some time to review The Smoking Anti-Aircraft Guns of Los Angeles, 1942... here:

http://www.abovetopsecret.com/forum/thread329188/pg1

And thank you for your open mind!

-Brand of Amber

Nice post!

I agree that the Battle Of LA is one of the more compelling cases! To me, anything that was originally in the media and then changed, is a red flag (i.e. Roswell). I'll have to check out your link a bit later, lots of reading! Thanks for the link and for your POV.

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Gravitation is the mutaul attraction of two objects that dis-similar in mass and energy, creating a differential potential energy. When particles work together through electromechanical binding as with atoms and molecules and planets etc., they have a combined gravity. Gravitation between bound groups and unbound particles is then increased because the differential potiential increases.

Brand of Amber already pointed out the inaccuracies in your post. I think everything you said, is wrong. Gravity has little to no effect on the quantum world.

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Debates are ways of learning new things, just remember my brain is broken. According to DOD psyciatrists, they can't find a shrink that can outthink me so my brain is actually beyond ecconomical repair. Just because I've held clearences above top secret and can make planes dissapear from RADAR and visability to the human eye doesn't mean I'm always right in my assesments. However, light is a perception of the mind based on repetative changes in field effects. Since light does not exist, any assesment based on the speed of light is skewed. But you can think I'm a nutcase if you want. I sure hope we are not the most intelegent life n the universe because we can't even find a way to stop killing each other.

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Debates are ways of learning new things, just remember my brain is broken. According to DOD psyciatrists, they can't find a shrink that can outthink me so my brain is actually beyond ecconomical repair. Just because I've held clearences above top secret and can make planes dissapear from RADAR and visability to the human eye doesn't mean I'm always right in my assesments. However, light is a perception of the mind based on repetative changes in field effects. Since light does not exist, any assesment based on the speed of light is skewed. But you can think I'm a nutcase if you want. I sure hope we are not the most intelegent life n the universe because we can't even find a way to stop killing each other.

There's nothing wrong with being uninformed. When it's spout as truth, people tend to get aggravated.

I agree, Doctors and people alike can't explain everything. I've had diagnosis' that were ignored, unknown or falsely stated. It's the nature of the world we live in. Good and evil. Some doctors diagnose with preconceived notions. (I like how the show 'House' represents that sometimes.) Some doc's are really great at what they do, with an obvious passion about it. Shop around! It's ok to be wrong, but not ok to pretend you're right! :yes:

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Just for the record, the Roswell incident was the result of one classified military project(RADAR targeting development) shooting down another classified military project(tools for spying) and the information was released in 1996 by the military. The alien inigma was a cover story to try to contain exposure of classified information in this case. Truth really is stranger than fiction. Theories are just theories, until proven. It's the proving part that is difficult because funding generally only goes to developing the popular theories.

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Gravitation is the mutaul attraction of two objects that dis-similar in mass and energy, creating a differential potential energy. When particles work together through electromechanical binding as with atoms and molecules and planets etc., they have a combined gravity. Gravitation between bound groups and unbound particles is then increased because the differential potiential increases.

No.

There is no need for a difference in mass and energy between 2 objects to create gravitational attraction towards each other. It's entirely possible for 2 objects of the same mass to orbit a mutual center of gravity or crash into each other because of their gravitational attraction for each other.

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Wonder why ever UFO sighting is being debunked. Makes me wonder if there is pressure to bear by a government who doesn't the truth let out.

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Wonder why ever UFO sighting is being debunked. Makes me wonder if there is pressure to bear by a government who doesn't the truth let out.

Or maybe... they aren't quite as solid as UFOlogy would have you believe? Where's the fun in that though. Much more entertaining to imagine a big government cover-up conspiracy.

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http://www.telegraph.co.uk/news/newstopics/howaboutthat/ufo/6039834/UFO-files-Belgian-fighters-scrambled-to-investigate-UFOs.html

The article in OP does absolutely nothing to debunk the 'Belgian Wave' in the 90's. The only thing that article does is reinforce that the media is either clueless about the facts of this incident, or are purposely trying to confuse people.

A piece of foam doesn't get F16's airborne to intercept. C'mon people, open your eyes.

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I don't understand why people think that this was intended to debunk the whole wave in the first place. Clearly it is just about the photo. Relax just a tad eh?

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There are those who make decissions as to what information to pass on to the general public, some elected and some in more perminent positions. The choice of an individule does not by itself indicate a conspiracy, nor does his/her subondinates following directions. Some information is best kept secret because it endanger the lives of others.

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I don't understand why people think that this was intended to debunk the whole wave in the first place. Clearly it is just about the photo. Relax just a tad eh?

Point taken. I think you can admit that parties on both sides of this issue often jump to conclusions based on new findings.

And it is worth clarifying that the wave in the 90's was a very serious and unexplained event.

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Gravitation is only one part of a complex set of interactions, surface charge repulsions, axial aligmnent, motionn and electrothermal relationships are just the beginning of the factors. The Earth isn't flat, we've come along way in furthering underrstanding, but we still have along ways to go.

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Point taken. I think you can admit that parties on both sides of this issue often jump to conclusions based on new findings.

No doubt about that. :tu:

And it is worth clarifying that the wave in the 90's was a very serious and unexplained event.

Well, there are possible explanations for the individual components that the flap consisted of. Are they definitive and absolute? No, it still remains officially unexplained, and probably will stay that way indefinitely. But that doesn't mean that the plausible explanations which could fit the data aren't correct, simply that those explanations will most likely remain unproven and unprovable.

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No doubt about that. :tu:

Well, there are possible explanations for the individual components that the flap consisted of. Are they definitive and absolute? No, it still remains officially unexplained, and probably will stay that way indefinitely. But that doesn't mean that the plausible explanations which could fit the data aren't correct, simply that those explanations will most likely remain unproven and unprovable.

Yeah, the Belgian incident will most likely remain unsolved & unexplained. I think we can both agree that F16's don't get scrambled for non-events. It is very expensive and time consuming to launch an aerial mission. Something was up there, and eluded Belgium's fastest jets.

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