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Obama: Pass my jobs bill or explain yourself

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ninjadude

If 0bama really wanted to get people here jobs, hed stop supporting asian slavery and get out of unfair trade agreements. Make this country manufactor friendly again.

And yet the Repubs screamed bloody murder when the Stimulus act funded green energy industries......

Personally, I think they should stop H1B visas and give a major tax credit to companies that somehow either do not outsource or bring jobs back.

And yeah, the trade agreements don't seem to help anyone except to export jobs from the US.

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preacherman76

And yet the Repubs screamed bloody murder when the Stimulus act funded green energy industries......

I cant speak for republicans man, but from my POV, government shouldnt be in the buisness of supporting companies with tax payer dollars. This is a fine example, cause the company he supported went belly up, and all that money was wasted.

Personally, I think they should stop H1B visas and give a major tax credit to companies that somehow either do not outsource or bring jobs back.

And yeah, the trade agreements don't seem to help anyone except to export jobs from the US.

I'll be damned ninja, we found common ground. :tu:

Edited by preacherman76

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WoIverine

Call me crazy, but is it just me, or does a large portion of the voting public not remember the bailout fiasco under the current administration? What about the jobs all that money could've created? Where were those phantom jobs when CEO's and their cohorts took the money and ran? That's a massive, massive fail. Couldn't a large portion of the deficit have been paid off instead? This admin, and the previous one have made some of the worst financial blunders in the history of the nation. We absolutely cannot let this continue, it has to end now. "Pass my jobs bill or explain yourself", you have got to be kidding me. Explain yourself Barry, what about all those jobs YOU could've created with all the money you've p***ed away?

Edited by Spid3rCyd3

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Damrod

because you won't read the results. They are positive.wrong. Economically, in a down economy, we need MORE government.will not work. For a lot of reasons.going back to the unregulated times of 100 years ago will not help. You do realize those regulations exist for a reason?while it is technically possible to be a candidate without a party, it is just not feasible.

Though you are more radical than I am, we generally agree on a lot of different things. I am more of a Libertarian but with an understanding of the need for social programs and an awareness of the success of the "Nordic examples" of political structures. I didn't mean what Obama has done was not positive, but a tremendous amount of money was spent with lukewarm or less results on the jobs creation...those "shovel ready projects" only seemed to "shovel" money into the pockets of private contractors. I think for the idea to work it has to be done like back in the 40's and 50's where the Gov financed, designed (aka corp of engineers), managed, and hired workers directly...spending money "outsourcing" just injects a 25 to 35% profit into the company getting the contracts...and that moeny could be going directly into the economy as wages.

Call me crazy, but is it just me, or does a large portion of the voting public not remember the bailout fiasco under the current administration? What about the jobs all that money could've created? Where were those phantom jobs when CEO's and their cohorts took the money and ran? That's a massive, massive fail. Couldn't a large portion of the deficit have been paid off instead? This admin, and the previous one have made some of the worst financial blunders in the history of the nation. We absolutely cannot let this continue, it has to end now. "Pass my jobs bill or explain yourself", you have got to be kidding me. Explain yourself Barry, what about all those jobs YOU could've created with all the money you've p***ed away?

The bailout wasn't actually a total fail as much as we might like to think it was...it left a bad taste in everyone's mouth and left their backside a little sore...but it did save the auto makers, their workers jobs and all the associated trades and businesses (part stores, service centers, etc) from a collapse...so it was not a failure...it was just more expensive than I think it needed to be...but I am not an expert here...that is an uneducated guess.

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ninjadude

Call me crazy, but is it just me, or does a large portion of the voting public not remember the bailout fiasco under the current administration?

You're crazy. What bailout fiasco? The TARP act occured under the Bush administration. Maybe you've forgotten that Bush is not president any longer.

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ninjadude

.those "shovel ready projects" only seemed to "shovel" money into the pockets of private contractors.\\\\

well of course. who do you think it was going to? federal contractors? The whole idea was to pump up those businesses that were doing green energy. Kind of a no brainer.

I think for the idea to work it has to be done like back in the 40's and 50's where the Gov financed, designed (aka corp of engineers), managed, and hired workers directly...spending money "outsourcing" just injects a 25 to 35% profit into the company getting the contracts...and that moeny could be going directly into the economy as wages.

The Stimulus did inject money into the economy as wages. And don't say that Gov Financed thing too loud. The repubs will cry that you are are a Socialist!!:rolleyes:

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WoIverine

You're crazy. What bailout fiasco? The TARP act occured under the Bush administration. Maybe you've forgotten that Bush is not president any longer.

You shutup Raphael.

Edited by Spid3rCyd3

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F3SS

Damrod,

You and I have already had it out before about our views on socialist societies. You like em, I don't. But besides that point, I have always thought that it works out better for Sweded, Finland, Norway and Denmark, your big four, because of the size of the population. Regardless of what I like, those policies can not sustain a multi-cultured nation of 300+ million. The total population for those four Nordic countries is only 25 million and I can't speak much of their local cultures but I doubt it's as diverse as here. Well whatever, I may be off topic but I felt like saying that socialism could only work with small populations where it's easier to get everyone with more similar upbringings on board.

Edited by Is it for real

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DieChecker

Personally, I think they should stop H1B visas and give a major tax credit to companies that somehow either do not outsource or bring jobs back.

Recent news articles say that most industries are hiring but the applicants don't meet minimum standards.

Where I work at Intel, we have lots of foreign nationals. Know why? Because they work like 50% more, for 25% less Salary, and are actually eager to be at work and inventive and usually very well educated.

There has been articles that the US colleges produce only like 66% of the number of people needed to fill new scientific/engineering positions. Americans are more interested in being Business Majors, or Social Sciences majors, or Ancient Greek Underwater Basket Weaving majors, then in all the science, math and engineering required for technical degrees. I'm not saying a Business Degree is easy, just that people in the US are aiming in general away from math and science in their university choices.

Thus the hiring of talented outside university graduates is very necessary to the US economy. Or, maybe we should fill that Doctorate of Physics position with a blind hermaphrodite with a Oil Painting degree?

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DieChecker

well of course. who do you think it was going to? federal contractors? The whole idea was to pump up those businesses that were doing green energy. Kind of a no brainer.

Funny.

http://www.humanevents.com/article.php?id=47025

Sad.

http://www.gazette.net/article/20111007/NEWS/710079694/1124/1124/federal-report-blasts-green-jobs-program&template=gazette

Scary...

http://dailycaller.com/2010/05/03/the-truth-behind-green-jobs/

Obama says in 2010 State of the Union. "Jobs need to be Number One" So.... Where are these jobs? Obviously 2 years later and he did not make unemployment #1.

Edited by DieChecker

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Damrod

Damrod,

You and I have already had it out before about our views on socialist societies. You like em, I don't. But besides that point, I have always thought that it works out better for Sweded, Finland, Norway and Denmark, your big four, because of the size of the population. Regardless of what I like, those policies can not sustain a multi-cultured nation of 300+ million. The total population for those four Nordic countries is only 25 million and I can't speak much of their local cultures but I doubt it's as diverse as here. Well whatever, I may be off topic but I felt like saying that socialism could only work with small populations where it's easier to get everyone with more similar upbringings on board.

That is a very good point. They are smaller and geographically/atmospherically different...Perhaps because my "big 4" are all northern countries...aka "come from the lands of ice and snow" maybe they are accustomed to having to work together and be more close knit and united to survive the harshness of their environment....just a guess. Where we have such a large land mass and diversified environment and atmosphere that we don't quite have to deal with things the way they do....but...also...bear in mind that per capita....even though they may be small in numbers overall...the wages are higher and there are more wealthy millionaires and billionaires than here...by percentages I mean...

My point when I refer to them is not to use them as a blueprint model and try to be "just like them"...I am trying to point out their successes and say "Maybe...just maybe....we can learn something from this that we can use"...just a thought...

I have said it before...in my heart, I am a socialist Libertarian...I want freedom, but I want programs (yes, tax based) to take care of humanitarian/social things and infrastructure (electricity, water management, highways, etc)...aside from that...I want the Gov out of my life...no...really...

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BlindMessiah

Recent news articles say that most industries are hiring but the applicants don't meet minimum standards.

Where I work at Intel, we have lots of foreign nationals. Know why? Because they work like 50% more, for 25% less Salary, and are actually eager to be at work and inventive and usually very well educated.

There has been articles that the US colleges produce only like 66% of the number of people needed to fill new scientific/engineering positions. Americans are more interested in being Business Majors, or Social Sciences majors, or Ancient Greek Underwater Basket Weaving majors, then in all the science, math and engineering required for technical degrees. I'm not saying a Business Degree is easy, just that people in the US are aiming in general away from math and science in their university choices.

Thus the hiring of talented outside university graduates is very necessary to the US economy. Or, maybe we should fill that Doctorate of Physics position with a blind hermaphrodite with a Oil Painting degree?

Not that I completely disagree, but business and social science degrees can be very math intensive. I'm majoring in economics which is pretty much a blend of the two and I'm taking several calculus courses. It's not as math intensive as engineering to be sure, but it's by no means lacking in technical math skills.

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Damrod

Recent news articles say that most industries are hiring but the applicants don't meet minimum standards.

Where I work at Intel, we have lots of foreign nationals. Know why? Because they work like 50% more, for 25% less Salary, and are actually eager to be at work and inventive and usually very well educated.

There has been articles that the US colleges produce only like 66% of the number of people needed to fill new scientific/engineering positions. Americans are more interested in being Business Majors, or Social Sciences majors, or Ancient Greek Underwater Basket Weaving majors, then in all the science, math and engineering required for technical degrees. I'm not saying a Business Degree is easy, just that people in the US are aiming in general away from math and science in their university choices.

Thus the hiring of talented outside university graduates is very necessary to the US economy. Or, maybe we should fill that Doctorate of Physics position with a blind hermaphrodite with a Oil Painting degree?

I understand your political and economical view...but life is meant to be more than that...

Life should not be based on how many hours of your life you are willing to sell to maintain shelter, food and the necessities of life...that is...basically....slavery in one form or another. There are certain things that should be a given. If you choose to be an artist and work to create a new masterpiece...or...if you choose to be a engineer that designs the structures that holds up the buildings of high finance...there are certain things you should never have to worry about and yes...the capability and means are well within our means.

The grain grower is poisoned...he is poisoned to think that to be important and valued, he needs a Mercedes or a BMW...he thinks to be recognized, he needs a 5 bedroom 4 bath mcMansion....and he works to attain these things by adjusting the prices on the necessities of life...which in turn effects the prices of EVERYTHING ELSE...if you look at how prices have rose as "cost of living" it is because people are lustful and envious...they want "MORE" and they shove a dagger in the back of anyone else to get it...so they increase their prices...and the next guy...affected by that....raises his prices...and this is a society programmed way of thinking. It does not have to be this way....but...I only have philosophy... don't know how to practically make it work...I only know that ...philosophically...and eventually...and realistically...the whole shooting match....will fail...you cant charge $17.00 for a burger because gas prices went up...there has to be limits and standards and this is where I see gov stepping in...

BUT...if you like working harder for less...by all means...continue spewing support for how things are now...it is going to continue this path...getting harder and harder...until it all falls apart...*see other threads....you do not have to suffer...you are not a lesser person because you do this job or that...they are all necessary...do not sell yourself short...just because "one of them" said you were not valuable...we are all valuable and there is a place for each and every one of us...though the rich don't want to yield to that cause...that's an increase in direct costs and a decrease in yields and profits....oh pooh...

Edited by Damrod

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Dredimus

You're crazy. What bailout fiasco? The TARP act occured under the Bush administration. Maybe you've forgotten that Bush is not president any longer.

**Laughing Histerically* The Left And Libs have been screaming "BUSH'S FAULT" over and over for the last 3 years instead of blaming Barry for what he has caused... Just... tickled my funny bone thats all..

Oh, and I believe the person you were responding to was referring to the first stimulus package that was tossed out by Barry... you know... the one that cost the country nearly a trillion dollars.

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ninjadude

Recent news articles say that most industries are hiring but the applicants don't meet minimum standards.

because standards are ridiculous. Companies want someone cookie cutter exactly for the job. I just read an article today about it. They want people to effect the bottom line immediately. No more training, bringing up to speed, OJT. So jobs are going unfilled because no one meets the exact HR specs.

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F3SS

That is a very good point. They are smaller and geographically/atmospherically different...Perhaps because my "big 4" are all northern countries...aka "come from the lands of ice and snow" maybe they are accustomed to having to work together and be more close knit and united to survive the harshness of their environment....just a guess. Where we have such a large land mass and diversified environment and atmosphere that we don't quite have to deal with things the way they do....but...also...bear in mind that per capita....even though they may be small in numbers overall...the wages are higher and there are more wealthy millionaires and billionaires than here...by percentages I mean...

My point when I refer to them is not to use them as a blueprint model and try to be "just like them"...I am trying to point out their successes and say "Maybe...just maybe....we can learn something from this that we can use"...just a thought...

I have said it before...in my heart, I am a socialist Libertarian...I want freedom, but I want programs (yes, tax based) to take care of humanitarian/social things and infrastructure (electricity, water management, highways, etc)...aside from that...I want the Gov out of my life...no...really...

Holy crap. We weren't nearly as civil the first time around about this. I see better now that we aren't complete polar opposites, which is cool. About the bolded part...All that stuff is good and we should be able to do these things with moderation and reason. But untill the feds learn how to properly use our tax dollars with moderation and reason, I must continue to gripe about how the existing humantitarian/social programs are hideously mismanaged and abused. And yes, they need to get out of our way and the people will show they know better than them.

**Laughing Histerically* The Left And Libs have been screaming "BUSH'S FAULT" over and over for the last 3 years instead of blaming Barry for what he has caused... Just... tickled my funny bone thats all..

LOL, I thought that was the pot calling the kettle black too. Perhaps the funniest far left statement I have ever seen.

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ninjadude

Except that article is complete BS. The DOE loan is specifically earmarked for spending inside the U.S. None of it will be spent in Finland

See here for the real story source

seems not everyone agrees. From your article:

The federal Employment and Training Administration “disagrees with [the inspector general’s] conclusion and expects performance to significantly increase following an initial lag during the standard start-up phase of the grants,” according to the report.

Maryland labor officials argue the report is incomplete and say the state should be proud of what the Maryland Energy Sector Partnership has achieved.

Scary...

http://dailycaller.c...ind-green-jobs/

Obama says in 2010 State of the Union. "Jobs need to be Number One" So.... Where are these jobs? Obviously 2 years later and he did not make unemployment #1.

and yet the republicans wont agree to pass any bill that adds one single job. Still waiting...

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ninjadude

blaming Barry for what he has caused.

you'll have to be more specific

Oh, and I believe the person you were responding to was referring to the first stimulus package that was tossed out by Barry... you know... the one that cost the country nearly a trillion dollars.

The Stimulus was provably successful. It was too small. The government has to spend money in a down economy.

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DieChecker

I understand your political and economical view...but life is meant to be more than that...

Working to Live, rather then living to Work? I agree. I toss off my job like a cleanroom smock when I leave at night. But if people were better trained, and trained for the jobs that are waiting, rather then trained for just whatever hobby they follow, then they could make more when they do work.

Life should not be based on how many hours of your life you are willing to sell to maintain shelter, food and the necessities of life...that is...basically....slavery in one form or another.

While that is true. Those who sell those hours dearly, because they have the experience or education, are buying their slavery at a higher price. My opinion is that (in general) people who go after a well paying job they don't like, rather then a job they do like that pays little or nothing directly, seem to be better off in their free time. I know I like having hundreds of extra dollars a month doing a thankless technical job, then if I had no extra cash and worked as a freelance artist or writer. I can do more with my family... go on vacations, buy a better computer, better camera, get plenty of clothes, fix the car... so on, when if I was a starving artist I would not have a house, and would be taking the bus, and have no vacations, little clothes, and still be using dial-up. This is also about selfishness and about responsibility. Do you please yourself, or do what needs doing?

The grain grower is poisoned...he is poisoned to think that to be important and valued, he needs a Mercedes or a BMW...he thinks to be recognized, he needs a 5 bedroom 4 bath mcMansion....and he works to attain these things by adjusting the prices on the necessities of life...which in turn effects the prices of EVERYTHING ELSE...if you look at how prices have rose as "cost of living" it is because people are lustful and envious...they want "MORE" and they shove a dagger in the back of anyone else to get it...so they increase their prices...and the next guy...affected by that....raises his prices...and this is a society programmed way of thinking. It does not have to be this way....but...I only have philosophy... don't know how to practically make it work...I only know that ...philosophically...and eventually...and realistically...the whole shooting match....will fail...you cant charge $17.00 for a burger because gas prices went up...there has to be limits and standards and this is where I see gov stepping in...

That is all true. But, isn't it happening anyway? How are 300+ million people going to turn 90 degrees and suddenly stop being materialistic? Not going with the system generally means you are just going to be left behind.

BUT...if you like working harder for less...by all means...continue spewing support for how things are now...it is going to continue this path...getting harder and harder...until it all falls apart...*see other threads....you do not have to suffer...you are not a lesser person because you do this job or that...they are all necessary...do not sell yourself short...just because "one of them" said you were not valuable...we are all valuable and there is a place for each and every one of us...though the rich don't want to yield to that cause...that's an increase in direct costs and a decrease in yields and profits....oh pooh...

So then how to turn 300 million people? What would convince the mass of people to stop? How to put the genie back into the bottle? How to close Pandora's box?

When you look up the hill and an Avalanche is coming, you can try to run from it and hope to get out of the path and survive a while, or just lay down and let it cover you and hope that it is not get too deep and a boulder does not smash you. But, I think what you cannot do is raise your hand and tell the Avalanche to stop or go somewhere else, because it is just going to mow you down. How do you propose to stop the avalanche?

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DieChecker

because standards are ridiculous. Companies want someone cookie cutter exactly for the job. I just read an article today about it. They want people to effect the bottom line immediately. No more training, bringing up to speed, OJT. So jobs are going unfilled because no one meets the exact HR specs.

That is what I read too. I've always found that policy to be weird.

Intel follows that policy now. Positions will sit idle for years when an applicant could have been hired, sent to college for a couple terms and been ready in a fraction of the time and lost potential. I've applied for many jobs that I only fulfilled like 80-90% of the requirements and never heard back from any of them, yet the jobs remain open.

The puzzle then is for Obama and the Jobs Bill to link these jobs and those employers together, not to just toss money into the air and see if any of it makes jobs.

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