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Yamato

Who are Palestinians?

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Q24

Things won't end well for the Israelis living on arab land.

Ah, careful not to swing too far the other way… it is no more ‘Arab land’ than it is ‘Jewish land’.

The last time we saw peace it was a multi-cultural region without this severe religious land divide.

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TSS

Things won't end well for the Israelis living on arab land.

I look forward to the day when it's no ones land. Won't happen of course, boarders, colours of cloths, cultures, histories, and 'rights' to continue in the same vain...as a species we're just a bit to backward to drop the childish charade. We'll even give the most important thing we have for these things (our lives), it would be laughable if the consequences were not so tragic.

It won't end well for either side, by virtue of the fact there are 'sides' to begin with.

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and then

Leaving aside your feelings about the holocaust and for the sake of discussion agreeing with every point you make about Israel and the land...how is it that you expect Israel to simply cease to exist? THEY feel that a horrendous wrong was done to them and THEY have a couple hundred nukes to defend what they think of as their home. This is the point that is amazing to me in the discussion about Israel. The whole world seems to think Israel will just pick up their marbles and go back to "where they came from". Rest assured that if things "end badly" for the Jewish people it will be after things have also ended very badly for the usurpers. Why is that concept so difficult to understand?

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President-Elect Acidhead

Ah, careful not to swing too far the other way… it is no more ‘Arab land’ than it is ‘Jewish land’.

The last time we saw peace it was a multi-cultural region without this severe religious land divide.

note: I said Israeli.... not 'jewish'.

I'm not a collectivist. As an individual, if I was born there yesterday I'd want out asap.

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Yamato

Ah, careful not to swing too far the other way… it is no more ‘Arab land’ than it is ‘Jewish land’.

The last time we saw peace it was a multi-cultural region without this severe religious land divide.

You're absolutely right, however the life of every Israeli is put into jeopardy so I think acidhead is also correct, looking at their policy and how they treat people. Genuine concern for Israel is a great reason not to support the status quo over there. Caring about people doesn't require picking one group and caring about it to the exclusion of another. I focused here on the Palestinians as they're the ones whose civil liberties are being trashed, and so I think the focus should be on the Palestinians in many other circles of discussion as well.

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hetrodoxly

This single statement completely and utterly destroys the credibility of any of those who have latched on to the Golda Meir quote.

No it doesn't, Golda Meir didn't say anything about suicide bombers, but how prophetic her words have become.

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ExpandMyMind

No it doesn't, Golda Meir didn't say anything about suicide bombers, but how prophetic her words have become.

Actually, it does. Unless, of course, you can (as has been asked of you already in this thread) point to something that supports her claim, from the time she made it? Even today it doesn't hold up.

Do you honestly think that he majority of Arabs hate Israel more than they love their children? Do you believe that they are all willing to send their children to death, as long as it harms Israel? Do you actually believe this complete and utter garbage? Of course you do, as you are just as discriminative as Golda.

Not even a substantial minority can be said to hate Israel more than they love their own children.

That statement is no different from claiming all Jews are tight with their money, or all blacks are criminals, or all Australians are racist. It's ****ing racist to the core.

Edited by expandmymind

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Yamato

The policy isn't human rights deprivation, its a series of policies that in effect may or may not have the impact of depriving Palestinians of their human rights amongst achieving other things, of which can be legally done under certain circumstances.

There is no "may not". They deprive human rights. They strangle millions of people in state sanctioned terrorism. But now you're implying that it's incidental. Another poster has already provided some rhetoric showing that this is a stated policy and there is plenty of evidence out there to back that up proving you wrong.

Rockets is obviously a blanket term, I'm talking about acts with the intention of perpetrating violence against Israels civilian population. Be it rockets, suicide bombers, gunmen etc

So now Palestinians can't even have actions with the intent of violence without their human rights being denied? This doesn't sit with your previous statement that you didn't think the Palestinians weren't allowed to use violence. Make up your mind. But back to the rockets, which Israeli bureaucrats love to use as the excuse for their policies, so now in this reply according to you, Palestinians aren't allowed to have rockets?

This is starting to get dizzy. So they're allowed to use violence but they're not allowed to have rockets. I want to make sure exactly what the one-sided standard is that you're trying to impose solely on the Palestinians this time.

except that it does...the blockade is an attempt to do at least two things, enforce sanctions against the government in GAZA and limit the supply of weaponry into the region. Note, TWO THINGS (there are probably more reasons why too). The West did the same thing to Iraq and there are a bunch of countries today that face sanctions to varying degrees. For examples, see link

You're contradicting yourself again. First they're not disallowed the use of violence and now they're disallowed having weaponry! Really??? Yet another double standard for the hypocrisy. Where did THIS double standard come from that Israelis are allowed weapons and Palestinians are not? I know you can't answer these questions but who signed the Palestinians up for Pacifism without notifying me first? Sanctions are an act of war. And Israel isn't just stopping weapons even when or if I accepted your double standard for a moment. Again, you're not considering the list of banned items that aren't allowed into Gaza which have nothing to do with weapons. If you were telling the truth, humanitarian aid that has nothing to do with weapons wouldn't be banned. It's clear you don't know what the facts are.

well no. This is an absurd statement. Israel (and Egypt) are able to conduct the 'siege' and blockade upon Gaza due to geography and military power. There would be no way for Israel to enforce meaningful economic sanctions against Lebanon for example (due to rockets fired from southern lebanon), so why would they bother? Why would consistency come into it at all?

My statement is no manner of absurd. Rockets fell on Israel from the West Bank too. Again, not knowing the facts will lead you to believe that facts are absurd, but they're not. Israel would enforce meaningful sanctions which are acts of war against Lebanon the exact same way it enforces meaningful sanctions on Gaza, which would at least validate Israel's absurd excuse for besieging Gaza in the first place and forbidding Gazans' their civil liberties for all these years.

I don't quite get your point...are you saying its ok for Israel and the Palestinians to have rifles and shoot at each other? That's a single standard?

What an odd statement. The purpose of said sanctions isn't to deny the Palestinians access to rockets for the sake of them not having access to rockets...its about denying them access to rockets so they stop lobbing them into Israel (and so you don't get confused, we are talking specifically about the rockets here, and I'm not saying thats the sole purpose of the blockade/siege)

It's okay for anyone and everyone to have rifles and defend themselves. Of course that's a single standard because I don't have groups that I apply different standards for like you do. "What an odd statement"? You can't handle fairness like mine. You can't handle a single standard. You think it's odd and absurd. Nothing odd about banning cement? School supplies? Food? Are they going to make rockets, bombs and bullets or whatever else you hypocritically claim they're not allowed to have out of paper, pens, and concrete? Don't propagate these lies that hope to defend Israeli policy when you have no chance of getting them to stick.

actually they do under certain circumstances

anyways when you have a war or conflict, human rights are deprived to a degree and it is quite acceptable to a degree within a certain context.

So you are at least wise enough to retreat from your previous error claiming that they were "perfectly legal". A little bit of honest research would easily prove otherwise, and so I accept your apology. I would be happy however to engage in a full blown protracted discussion dealing specifically with how Israeli policy is illegal if you get the Zionist urge to retrace yourself from your retreat once again, and play this dishonesty that Israeli policy in its own circumstance is "perfectly legal".

The Beatles and the White album do not justify Israeli policy.

Very good. You can answer questions after they're asked repeatedly. Does anything relevant to the conflict not justify the policy?

Yes the actions of non-Palestinian actors that have an influence within the conflict between the Palestinians and the Israelis in part justify Israeli policy. Why? Because by being involved in the conflict their actions shape how both the Palestinians and Israelis act.

You're talking about motivation not justification. But applying my correction to your statement and understanding that it motivates Israeli policy, your short answer to my question is "Yes, Syria influences Israeli policy directed at Palestinians." I would love to hear you explain how you blame Syria for this. How does Syria's actions (what actions?) shape how the Israelis and Palestinians act (what actions?)? So to be clear, now you're claiming that Israel's policy is determined by Syria? That's one I haven't heard. Unless that's just your personal opinion, I will need a source, please.

meaningless statement, try again.

A narco-insurgency creating violence on the border between the US and Mexico with both the US and Mexicans attempting to solve the problem is different to attacks being perpetrated by the state against another state across borders.

Having a single standard is meaningless to you, not to me. First of all you're baking a lot of claims into your rhetoric that you haven't substantiated. I don't see where the West Bank is attacking Israel just like I don't see where the US is colonizing settlements on Mexican territory and requiring them to be populated with "non-Mexicans". If Mexicans had a policy of stated aggression in response to that illegal nonsense, I would easily understand why. This kind of nonsense that you can't stop defending is wrong under any circumstance and that's my point. That's the single standard that you are completely unable to handle. If anyone deprives a people of their human rights, it's despicable, it's evil, it's immoral, it's illegal, and to me, it's unacceptable. It should be stricken down immediately wherever it rears its dirty head. Palestine is a fantastic place to start.

Let's see if I can uncover yet another double standard. So when the US "perpetrates violence against another state across its borders" does that mean that violence against the US is justified? Should people be attacking the US right now because of what we've done to Afghanistan, Iraq, Yemen, Somalia, Libya, Iran, Pakistan, etc? Even giving you the benefit of the doubt that there is finally the first single standard in anything you've said yet, I'd like to see you hold this one together.

Obviously Israel isn't going to allow violence by the Palestinians to be perpetrated against it.

Well then maybe the Palestinians shouldn't allow Israel to perpetrate violence against them. And that goal must obviously be accomplished by means that don't require main battle tanks, heavy artillery, helicopter gunships, jet bombers, and white phosphorous. But apparently only rockets or whatever other weaponry the Palestinians use is viewed as a problem to you because there is a double standard waiting around every corner.

But at the same time there is little it can do about (other than to respond) to violence against its troops when they were in Gaza for example.

LOL so Israeli troops invade Palestinian territory and the "response" only begins when they're attacked? You're stirring the Zionist kool aid you heard in the media once again. It's so convenient for you and the media to step into this 60+ year conflict and tell me what the next origin of it will happen to be. Israelis killed by Palestinians are almost entirely killed within Palestinian territory. Palestinians killed by Israelis are almost entirely killed within Palestinian territory. So the justification repeatedly made by Israeli bureaucrats that you can't stop applying double standards in the defense of (the "Hamas rockets"), represents a miniscule part of the violence in this conflict. You have to once again stoop to the irreconcilable position that some violence isn't allowed and some violence is.

nope I made it pretty clear. Violence is dumb for the Palestinians as it has gotten them absolutely nowhere. Unless you are really going to make the claim that the violent resistance movement in Palestinian has managed to achieve anything over the last what? 70 years?

So Israeli violence is "smarter" than Palestinian violence then? And that's your next justification for Israeli policy? To look at the results? The results are barbaric! Where's Israel's violence against Palestinians gotten it? Please flesh out how you compare the two violences now that you've chopped even violence up into two groups to apply yet another double standard.

If HAMAS and Fatah come to the conclusion, and actually act upon, of course Israel would have no justification for its current policies...I also think the Israelis often engage in 'dumb' violence too

Didn't you just tell me that they came to that conclusion? Give me some examples of "actually acting" upon it and for your own benefit, please be creative enough to think of brand new examples that haven't been tried yet, as examples from the past did not result in Israel changing its policy, which I should now point out would render Israel's policies unjustified by your latest admission. But please try to think of some examples that don't require yet another double standard regarding how human beings are treated. Humanity is universal.

give up attacks upon Israeli settlements/civilians

drop the existential threat bull (river to the sea)

engage with Israel

engage with the broader world community

achieve some kind of internal political stability

Been there, already done that, and the settlements continue to be constructed, the land continues to be stolen, the civil liberties of Palestinians continue to be trashed.

obviously Israel also needs to make concessions etc but much of Israels policy is hinged on the security threat posed by the Palestinians, remove that threat and suddenly the dynamic changes a great deal.

What concessions does Israel "need to make"? Please list them. Thanks.

Israel is committing acts of war against the Palestinians every hour of every day. It's unprecedented unrealistic nonsense to try to impose your double standard and continue to claim that acts of war are not allowed in response to war. If we honestly want an end to a war we must insist on the cessation of the acts of that war. And we don't start with examples that haven't happened in years that serve to keep you on one side of the conflict, we start with the examples that are happening right now. And that will continue to happen tomorrow. If Israel has a security threat from the Palestinians it has the sovereign right to defend its own borders which will take care of the security excuse. It doesn't have the right to impose collective punishment or control borders it has no sovereignty over, nor attack other nations in international waters. I know that every time Israel attacks Americans, they "couldn't see", but I also don't apply a double standard for Israel that somehow lets Israeli bureaucrats get away with killing Americans. They might be blind in the heart but they're not blind in the eye.

"I disagree with your claim that there is ethnic cleansing. I don't deny the other two though I suppose we'd probably disagree n the extent or degree to which it has occured."

Good, so for the record, you agree that Israeli policy is both illegal and collective punishment. But refusing to also agree that Israeli policy is ethnic cleansing requires that you disagree with the very bureaucrats imposing the very policies that you sit here defending. That is some hardcore confusion and I'm going to help you out with that.

What a fantasy world we would all live in where we can only punish the intent for a crime (as spoken or written by bureaucrats) and not also the crime itself (as perpetually executed by bureaucrats) but lo and behold, here I am, performing surgery on exactly that.

"your brave nation that firebombed Tokyo, nuked Nagasaki and Hiroshima, imposed crippling sanctions upon Iraq etc right? I was simply making the point that 'human rights' aren't applicable all the time even when we like to claim they are. eg Its perfectly acceptable to violate an individuals liberty under certain circumstances (if they break the law and the legal punishment is to lock them up), context is everything."

That was very brave, and what's your problem with any of that? We firebombed Dresden too. Was that more acceptable than Tokyo? We dropped more bombs on Vietnam, Cambodia, and Laos than all the bombs dropped in World War II combined. And none of those three countries attacked us that I recall, unlike your relatively weak jabs about Germany and Japan.

Human rights go out the window when wars begin, which is the reason why starting stupid wars for "the security of Israel" and imposing stupid sanctions on Israel's behalf is wrong on its face. You won't find a more active critic against US foreign policy anywhere on this message board than me so singing to the choir isn't saying much. But, if the Palestinians are at war with Israel, and there's no greater proof of war than acts of war, then stop applying all these ridiculous double standards for how the Palestinians fight it.

"I wasn't referring to the Holocaust."

Really? Very good. So then we agree, that the Holocaust does NOT justify Israeli policy? I will consider that progress.

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ExpandMyMind

"I disagree with your claim that there is ethnic cleansing"

Just to address this. There has been, in the past (during the infancy of Israel), much ethnic cleansing of the Palestinians by Israel. This had to happen for Israel to have a state with a Jewish majority (and indeed it will need to happen again in about 5 decades, when Arabs once again outnumber Jews in the Promised Land). You can read about this here: http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/The_Ethnic_Cleansing_of_Palestine

(Though it is Wikipedia, and Israel's employees have been, for a long time now, editing and re-editing it to favour Israel, so you're probably best picking up a book. I recommend Benny Morris, a leading - if not the THE leading - Israeli historian).

Now, as for more modern day claims of ethnic cleansing (seeing as bathory does not seem to be aware that his still goes on), you can have a look here:

Thousands [140,000] lost residency under former policy, Israeli adviser says [with just 1 policy]

http://edition.cnn.com/2011/WORLD/meast/05/11/israel.residency.policy/index.html

10 Oct. '11: Civil Administration plans to expel tens of thousands of Bedouins from Area C

http://www.btselem.org/settlements/20111010_forced_eviction_of_bedouins

Only two examples of many.

I would have thought it plainly obvious to anyone who knows even next to nothing about this situation that there is a clear and indeed blatant policy of ethnic cleansing. What do people think knocking down Jerusalem homes and making way for Israeli settlers is? By definition this is ethnic cleansing.

Edited by expandmymind

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hetrodoxly

Actually, it does. Unless, of course, you can (as has been asked of you already in this thread) point to something that supports her claim, from the time she made it? Even today it doesn't hold up.

Do you honestly think that he majority of Arabs hate Israel more than they love their children? Do you believe that they are all willing to send their children to death, as long as it harms Israel? Do you actually believe this complete and utter garbage? Of course you do, as you are just as discriminative as Golda.

Not even a substantial minority can be said to hate Israel more than they love their own children.

That statement is no different from claiming all Jews are tight with their money, or all blacks are criminals, or all Australians are racist. It's ****ing racist to the core.

Mier Golda made that statement when Jews were being attacked and expelled by most Arabic & Muslim countries it was close to a million refugees, i'll say it again palestinian and Muslim Children are being taught to hate the pigs & dogs

and it's not isolated cases but main stream tv, public parades, in school etc, to deny this is not only foolish but counter productive, the largest group of fascist in the world today reside in Palestine you're an hardened supporter who's in capable of seeing both sides of the conflict you're an antisemitic left-wing fascist if anyone's a racist i'd say you fit the bill.

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ExpandMyMind

Mier Golda made that statement when Jews were being attacked and expelled by most Arabic & Muslim countries it was close to a million refugees, i'll say it again palestinian and Muslim Children are being taught to hate the pigs & dogs

and it's not isolated cases but main stream tv, public parades, in school etc, to deny this is not only foolish but counter productive, the largest group of fascist in the world today reside in Palestine you're an hardened supporter who's in capable of seeing both sides of the conflict you're an antisemitic left-wing fascist if anyone's a racist i'd say you fit the bill.

None of this supports Golda's statement in the slightest. Not. a. single. word.

And, in case you are not aware, the expulsion of Jews from Arabic countries, while an awful act, was a direct response to the expulsion of Arabs in today's Israel. And also, in case you are not aware, many Arab leaders in the early 70s offered to take the Jewish refugees that were expelled back if Israel properly address the Right of Return.

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Q24

But refusing to also agree that Israeli policy is ethnic cleansing requires that you disagree with the very bureaucrats imposing the very policies that you sit here defending.

I would have thought it plainly obvious to anyone who knows even next to nothing about this situation that there is a clear and indeed blatant policy of ethnic cleansing.

Yes, straight from Netanyahu: -

“If there is a demographic problem, and there is, it is with the Israeli Arabs who will remain Israeli citizens,” he said. The Declaration of Independence said Israel should be a Jewish and democratic state, but to ensure the Jewish character was not engulfed by demography, it was necessary to ensure a Jewish majority, he said.

If Israel’s Arabs become well integrated and reach 35-40 percent of the population, there will no longer be a Jewish state but a bi-national one, he said. If Arabs remain at 20 percent but relations are tense and violent, this will also harm the state's democratic fabric. “Therefore a policy is needed that will balance the two.”

So in the words of the Israeli Prime Minister and even the Israeli Declaration of Independence, Israeli Arabs are a “problem” that a policy is needed to deal with.

Of course the whole concept of a ‘Jewish state’ on this land is a statement of ethnic cleansing at its core.

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Yamato

Mier Golda made that statement when Jews were being attacked and expelled by most Arabic & Muslim countries it was close to a million refugees, i'll say it again palestinian and Muslim Children are being taught to hate the pigs & dogs

and it's not isolated cases but main stream tv, public parades, in school etc, to deny this is not only foolish but counter productive, the largest group of fascist in the world today reside in Palestine you're an hardened supporter who's in capable of seeing both sides of the conflict you're an antisemitic left-wing fascist if anyone's a racist i'd say you fit the bill.

I've asked who Golda Meir is talking about and I didn't get an answer. Is she talking about Jews or Israelis? You're suggesting she's talking about Jews. If she's talking about Jews then antisemitism was imported to the Middle East from Europe starting in the 20th century. If she's talking about Israel then it started less than a decade before she made that comment. If you're declaring a "Jewish Homeland" and expelling those who aren't Jewish, who were the Palestinian refugees supposed to hate? Themselves for living in their own homes? If the expulsion is Golda's evidence for the hate, and if expelling Jews is a justification for collective punishment of the people who are expelling them, then the Palestinians aren't who to punish. They were already being expelled themselves. Golda Meir should have felt nothing but sympathy for them for what they were going through, so using this quote to justify Israeli policy against Palestinians is bizarre. The connection there is their ethnicity. They're "the Arabs". I know what I call that, but I don't know how anyone else can come here and defend it.

I haven't seen anything expandmymind has said that's indicated he's in favor of the politics or politicians in the Palestinian territories, whether antisemitic or left-wing or fascist or otherwise. You're suggesting that there needs to be a lack of hatred amongst Palestinians for the oppression to stop? Is that what justifies Israeli policy? I'm pretty sure you'd have to think so in order to even be able to claim that Golda Meir is right.

Oppression should be hated, and by extension those who oppress. And that emotional response is very much a function of everything I've been taught since I was a child. From my parents. From my schools. From my church. I despise it with every fiber of my being. I would only hope you do too. If I was trapped in a hopeless situation that might very likely outlive me, I would be sure to teach my children never to stand for it, never to submit to tyranny and never surrender their civil liberties to any terrorist or criminal state.

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Knight Of Shadows

Mier Golda made that statement when Jews were being attacked and expelled by most Arabic & Muslim countries it was close to a million refugees, i'll say it again palestinian and Muslim Children are being taught to hate the pigs & dogs

and it's not isolated cases but main stream tv, public parades, in school etc, to deny this is not only foolish but counter productive, the largest group of fascist in the world today reside in Palestine you're an hardened supporter who's in capable of seeing both sides of the conflict you're an antisemitic left-wing fascist if anyone's a racist i'd say you fit the bill.

this outta be used in comedy movies topic ! now who told you that ?! god damn you've exposed our biggest secret ...

actually we believe dogs might conqure the world some day in some arabic prophcies and we're trying to stop it it's true !

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hetrodoxly

this outta be used in comedy movies topic ! now who told you that ?! god damn you've exposed our biggest secret ...

actually we believe dogs might conqure the world some day in some arabic prophcies and we're trying to stop it it's true !

The only comedy is you ignorance on the subject, do a search and educate yourself look at this for a start and let me know what you think.

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Knight Of Shadows

wooow .. that was reallly shocking .. it even shocked me and am a muslim and an arab ! can you believe this !?

what's even more shocking is that you use videos posted by racists and try to prove a point using them

it says and listen carefully i hate to repeat my self but i'll humor your claims :

1- "the idea that the " Radical muslims " said and the nazis said is to demonize the jews you know they just turn them into demons"

now we have very different concept here .. now he says radical muslims in other words ... some type of extremists ?

now for you to take example out of that and display it as general islam is kind of offending to us all but never mind that

the other point here ... you see what this old man say in the video is simply not true .. how ?

well there was nothing in " Quran " that says to kill or hurt jews .. not even paint them in bad picture

and there's hadith for the prophet that says : he who hurt al zameen " arabic word for christians and jews " it's like he hurt me personally

now i don't know wanna make this religious debate but before you wave around racists videos you should at least try an accurate ones

wanna prove me wrong ... bring me proof from islam which is limited to " Quran and Hadith "

so that makes that person speaking about slaughtering the jews wrong .. by the laws of islam it self ... nice isn't ?

anyway after this there's couple of silly pictures which i don't know what to make of and there goes a woman says

2- " they are killing infedels just like the preacher told them to it's their duty to kill them "

we already established that killing person based on his/her religion is forbidden in islam and anyone who does this

does not do it in islam's name .. but only for personal desire or reason or what so ever ... so don't pin the blame on islam

3- next we hear a funny looking guy saying about crowd of people protesting screaming " till israel is wiped off from the face of the earth these cries will contiune ... again mixing up religion with politics aren't you ? israel is a invading force in palestine .. not a religion

so when some one shout death to israel or something .. doesn't mean he's saying death to jews .. now how is that related i don't know ?

now isn't that video in iran ? if so .. iran ruled by shaia muslim " not really muslims " they're punch of fanatics

4- a man commenting about eggs hatching up .. i don't know if it's worth this .. but he said one thing right though .. the world is reaping

yep israel is reaping .. a child with father killed by israel would surely gonna turn up with violence and does something back so i don't see how this shocks you .. next. .. this is getting boring what's that has to do with dogs already !

5- and what an aweful and annoying music and a little kid saying " we swore we will avenge from our invader for our killed and wounded "

and the subtitles in english added the line " vengful blood " to make sure their agenda reach people with weak personality as you .. sorry

6-then the lame guy with glasses talk bunch of things .. ohh the worst thing is to strip kids of their childhood and make them want to be suicidal bombers ... ummm and am sure that israel killing their parents infront of their eyes did not contirbute in making them feel that way ... ahh come already i thought this will involve dogs

7-next child scream in sometype of play about being " suicide bomber " now there's play on words here in translations

you see the word " Fedayean " means many things .. but suicidal bomber ain't one of them it could mean a commando

it could mean some one willing to give his life for what he believes in .. it means many thing but suicidal bomber .. no

i think that kid words been twisted .. they should apologize to him .. ain't nothing wrong with one willing to give his life for his country

aren't you willing to that if your country been invaded ? Next pffft

8-and then a man trying to act like smart guy .. who can't even spell " S " right .. ohhh reminds me of some one i know

he talk bunch of things then a kid wearing bomb belt accident .. which i don't buy if you asked me

coz .. why wear suicidal bomb belt .. and not use it ? bit off eh ?

9- the old guy from the beginning speak a new pile of nonsense include " what the muslims do to their children is worse than germany did "

and what do we do to our children i asked ? if " muslims " and islam is the reason to what they're doing

then why it's only happening in palestine .. i'll tell you why ! coz of israel crimes against those people :P

why it happens always in country under invasion .. and invaders nag about the result of their brutal crimes .. got no idea

next

10-the woman goes again they tell arab children that jewish cook cookies made of blood

actually to point you right this is wasn't made up by muslims it was made up by the world during what's been called " the blood lables "

that happened in europe and every where .. why are ya blaming us for it ? ask your ancestors :D

and am not going to comment on that woman racists accusations on arab media " there is no shame in arab media "

i'll just say " well there is no shame in killing palestinians children infront of camera too " like muhammad dura ?

.... and no dogs ... i can't believe you made me go into discussions with you about muslim teach their children to " hate "

dogs and pigs .. and this " obvious " racists video does not mention dogs or pigs ... i can't believe i watched that on dialup

am so dissapointed and what bothers me the most is that ignorat B woman who keep making racists comments against islam ! the nerve

anyway .. so if you watch this stuff often am not sure where you got those twisted ideas about islam .. coz you keep feeding illusions

in your head by racists who spread such tapes and it's obvious to any one know 1% about islam it's free of all those claims

now to the dogs and pigs .. you didn't convince me ;)

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Yamato

This thread was never meant to be a place where people would lose ground by throwing mud.

It's effortless to find and dredge up ugly video clips of Zionists saying and doing the most heinous of things, and that too would achieve absolutely nothing.

What's so fantastic about the mindset of these Zionists is, if the status quo is so bad, that is a perfect reason to change the status quo, not defend the same policies that have resulted in all the dirty little cherry pickings they manage to dredge up.

They incriminate themselves, but they need mirrors.

I suppose I should thank them for making my case, but first I need to point out how stupid it is to complain about something while simultaneously insisting that we keep on paying for it. Hey look at those 800,000 children, let's use tyranny to cut them off from having a life with violent force control, because I know of a video.

We can throw mud at each other till the cows come home, but the bottom line is the status quo propping all of this hatred and madness up must change. If governments are going to remain deliberately impotent to affect that change, then it must occur by civil action. I've already provided examples of such action, here is yet another:

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Q24

I've already provided examples of such action, here is yet another:

Brave kids.

One day the whole world will walk out on Israel the same way… the potential outcome of that terrifies me. Israeli politicians need to wake up and start some serious bridge building with their neighbours now if the inevitable outcome of their current path is to be avoided. Unfortunately they show no sign of doing so and are dooming their people in the process. I feel bad for the future Jewish citizens of Israel, I really do – the conditions are once again formenting for a horrendous fall of their leadership’s own doing.

I wonder, is this fact perhaps why some Western politicians not only tolerate Israeli policy but continue to support it – the fear of what will happen to the Jewish people if they don’t? If so, it is understandable but then more effort is needed from our leaders to moderate on both sides of the conflict. Then again, I think they have tried and failed.

What will be will be unless Israel drastically changes its course.

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and then

Brave kids.

One day the whole world will walk out on Israel the same way… the potential outcome of that terrifies me. Israeli politicians need to wake up and start some serious bridge building with their neighbours now if the inevitable outcome of their current path is to be avoided. Unfortunately they show no sign of doing so and are dooming their people in the process. I feel bad for the future Jewish citizens of Israel, I really do – the conditions are once again formenting for a horrendous fall of their leadership’s own doing.

I wonder, is this fact perhaps why some Western politicians not only tolerate Israeli policy but continue to support it – the fear of what will happen to the Jewish people if they don’t? If so, it is understandable but then more effort is needed from our leaders to moderate on both sides of the conflict. Then again, I think they have tried and failed.

What will be will be unless Israel drastically changes its course.

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hetrodoxly

wooow .. that was reallly shocking .. it even shocked me and am a muslim and an arab

Of course it won't shock you as you say your an Arab and a Muslim.

Do you claim this video to be fake.

Cleric claiming Jews to be the cause of all the worlds troubles, you'll probably have the same Muslim ideology.

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and then

Israel possesses the land. Israel possesses nukes and one of the best armies in the world. The people who settled the country were in large part survivors of a holocaust and have struggled mightily to keep that memory fresh for their heirs. Ignoring or denying the holocaust doesn't make it untrue. Before a single settlement was built and after Israel accepted the deal for the '48 borders the Arabs attacked and LOST land. In the wars of attrition they lost. In the wars of '67 and '73 they lost land.

When Gaza was given up by Sharon and thousands of Israelis lost their homes the government of Israel assumed that a new beginning was at hand. Rocket fire from Gaza began almost immediately.

I believe that this conflict will usher in the last war. It is the ultimate insoluble human problem : unending hatred.

On the day when "the whole world walks out on Israel" and the hatred between Jew and Arab comes to it's fruition the whole world may well get burned. On that day it will no longer matter who was right or wrong.

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hetrodoxly

None of this supports Golda's statement in the slightest. Not. a. single. word.

Of course it does, she's saying stop teaching the ideology of hating Jews, stop the ideology of blaming Jews.

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Knight Of Shadows

Of course it won't shock you as you say your an Arab and a Muslim.

Do you claim this video to be fake.

Cleric claiming Jews to be the cause of all the worlds troubles, you'll probably have the same Muslim ideology.

great .. more love videos

dude i watched that first one on dialup connection took me forever and after that it was bunch of racists talking

why would i be interested in spending endless time in samiliar videos

don't get me wrong it's not that i don't wanna discuss things i really do but i rather discuss points you bring

like you say milk is white , black , purple .. we discuss it but i hate the watch and comment thing

simply ask and i answer but would you stop posting videos i can't watch that stuff with my current connection

you could tell me what those videos about .. and i'll answer then " hopefully about dogs and pigs "

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hetrodoxly

Israel possesses the land. Israel possesses nukes and one of the best armies in the world. The people who settled the country were in large part survivors of a holocaust and have struggled mightily to keep that memory fresh for their heirs. Ignoring or denying the holocaust doesn't make it untrue. Before a single settlement was built and after Israel accepted the deal for the '48 borders the Arabs attacked and LOST land. In the wars of attrition they lost. In the wars of '67 and '73 they lost land.

When Gaza was given up by Sharon and thousands of Israelis lost their homes the government of Israel assumed that a new beginning was at hand. Rocket fire from Gaza began almost immediately.

I believe that this conflict will usher in the last war. It is the ultimate insoluble human problem : unending hatred.

On the day when "the whole world walks out on Israel" and the hatred between Jew and Arab comes to it's fruition the whole world may well get burned. On that day it will no longer matter who was right or wrong.

Good post, i can't see how the conflict can ever be resolved, those who try to separate politics from religion haven't grasped the complexities of the situation on the Israeli side you have those who think they're only occupying a small part of the promised land given them by god, on the Palestinian side you have those who use the words of the Quran to an extent that it's created a cult of kill the Jew.

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hetrodoxly

great .. more love videos

dude i watched that first one on dialup connection took me forever and after that it was bunch of racists talking

why would i be interested in spending endless time in samiliar videos

don't get me wrong it's not that i don't wanna discuss things i really do but i rather discuss points you bring

like you say milk is white , black , purple .. we discuss it but i hate the watch and comment thing

simply ask and i answer but would you stop posting videos i can't watch that stuff with my current connection

you could tell me what those videos about .. and i'll answer then " hopefully about dogs and pigs "

Well i'll tell you the content, there's a three year old on tv talking about killing pigs and dogs ie Jews.

There's lots of videos calling Jews every derogatory word you can think of, the main ones being pigs, apes, monkeys and dogs.

You talk of racism, the type coming out of Palestine is the worse i've seen.

remember what we're debating "are Palestinian children being taught to hate Jews" you claim they're not, i've show you video of Palestinian tv showing this to be the case, there's lots of it.

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