Where do souls of evil people go after death?

[Habitat]

10 minutes ago, GreenmansGod said:

I got what he meant through the typos and I go weary of the phase, it insults my Dad.

Your old man wouldn't, or shouldn't, have given a bugger what someone blurted out on an anonymous forum, this is getting into special snowflake territory.

[Grandpa Greenman]

I care....  I don't like his memory maligned. 

[Alan McDougall]

7 hours ago, back to earth said:

I wouldnt believe  that guy if he swore on a bible ... besides, couldnt even get the quote right 

"No atheists no the foxholes"  what the hell is that supposed to mean ? 

 

 

It comes from the first World War with the opposing armies pinned down in trenches or otherwise called foxholes as a means of avoiding cannon or gunfire. However, when they saw the other side rushing at them with fixed bayonets and loaded  guns  and knew that the might die in the next few moments, that abandoned their atheist beliefs and called out to almighty God in terror to save them from death.

This really happened! 

[Grandpa Greenman]

4 hours ago, Alan McDougall said:

It comes from the first World War with the opposing armies pinned down in trenches or otherwise called foxholes as a means of avoiding cannon or gunfire. However, when they saw the other side rushing at them with fixed bayonets and loaded  guns  and knew that the might die in the next few moments, that abandoned their atheist beliefs and called out to almighty God in terror to save them from death.

This really happened! 

It is an assumption, made by those who wish to use the dead for their own means. It is used to proselytize. The dead can't speak for themselves. I can only say what my father told me about his experience in combat.  

[XenoFish]

4 hours ago, Alan McDougall said:

that abandoned their atheist beliefs and called out to almighty God in terror to save them from death.

This really happened! 

So you were there with them? If I'm remembering correctly my grandfather describe the foxhole as either you're doing something, or something you didn't want to have to do. 

[+Noteverythingisaconspiracy]

5 hours ago, Alan McDougall said:

It comes from the first World War with the opposing armies pinned down in trenches or otherwise called foxholes as a means of avoiding cannon or gunfire. However, when they saw the other side rushing at them with fixed bayonets and loaded  guns  and knew that the might die in the next few moments, that abandoned their atheist beliefs and called out to almighty God in terror to save them from death.

This really happened! 

First I don't think that the existence of God is first on the mind of people in a war situation. Secondly I would think that many people in that situation would have very serious doubts as to the existence of God. Afterall how would a loving God allow something as bad as WW1 in the first place ?

[Alan McDougall]

59 minutes ago, Noteverythingisaconspiracy said:

First I don't think that the existence of God is first on the mind of people in a war situation. Secondly I would think that many people in that situation would have very serious doubts as to the existence of God. Afterall how would a loving God allow something as bad as WW1 in the first place ?

 

What makes you think the only attribute of God is love?  In scripture, it also says for instance "It is a terrible thing to fall into the hands of the Living God" or, "vengeance is mine says the Lod God", "God is a consuming fire."  The devil  knows Gid exists and her trembles in terror

"The beginning of wisdom is the fear of God"

What makes you think God loves a paedophile and abuser of little children or that God loves those that hate him"

God's Love is not Infinite it is conditional.

[Alan McDougall]

Wikepedia

 

Reverend William T. Cummings, who served at Bataan, is famous for declaring "There are no atheists in foxholes."^[1] In addition, Lieutenant Colonel Warren J. Clear, who also served at Bataan, used the expression in an interview printed in U.S. newspapers in the middle of April.^[1]

Chaplain F.W. Lawson of the 302d Machine Gun Battalion, who was wounded twice in wartime, declared "I doubt if there is such a thing as an atheist. At least there isn't in a front line trench."^[1] Hannah More wrote: "In agony or danger, no nature is atheist. The mind that knows not what to fly to, flies to God."^[2]

In recent years the organization Military Association of Atheists and Freethinkers has taken up use of the slogan "Atheists in Foxholes" as a list of those men and women who serve the country while lacking a belief in a god.^[3]

President Dwight D. Eisenhower declared in remarks broadcast from the White House as part of a February 7, 1954 American Legion Program:

“

As a former soldier, I am delighted that our veterans are sponsoring a movement to increase our awareness of God in our daily lives. In battle, they learned a great truth-that there are no atheists in the foxholes. They know that in time of test and trial, we instinctively turn to God for new courage…Whatever our individual church, whatever our personal creed, our common faith in God is a common bond among us.[4]

[XenoFish]

God was created by people which is why god has human qualities. It's just a cultural thoughtform, an egregore.

[+Noteverythingisaconspiracy]

27 minutes ago, Alan McDougall said:

What makes you think the only attribute of God is love?  In scripture, it also says for instance "It is a terrible thing to fall into the hands of the Living God" or, "vengeance is mine says the Lod God", "God is a consuming fire."  The devil  knows Gid exists and her trembles in terror

"The beginning of wisdom is the fear of God"

What makes you think God loves a paedophile and abuser of little children or that God loves those that hate him"

God's Love is not Infinite it is conditional.

Using scripture isn't going to get you anywhere with me, simply because I don't believe scripture is anything other than the words of very mortal men. As an atheist why should I care what scipture says ?

My question is simply this: Is it okay to worship a God that lets people get away with bad things and only punish them in the afterlife.

If someone you were close to was murdered, would you then think "It's okay if he gets away with it, because God will punish him in the afterlife", or would you want him to be punished right here in this life ? Please be honest !

 

 

[CelticBanshee]

On 12/16/2011 at 10:41 PM, gnostic-deity said:

i believe their spirit is "absorbed" back into the pure love that is god. because, they obviously needed it. and really, who are we to judge? and also, we dont know anything. neither you nor I.

The only person that seems to understand. 

[An Urban Leg3nd]

On 12/16/2011 at 1:01 PM, Alan McDougall said:

Hi,

Thinking about serial killers like Jeffry Dahma, Ted Bundy, and evil despots like Hitler, Stalin, Nero, these despicable, deprasved people who, have passed over into some dimension beyond mortal

Where do you think they have gone to in the afterlife?

Did they end up in hell?

Do you think they will have been punished?

Do you think God has just annihilated their souls/spirits?

Or??

Please add your thoughts!!

 

 

Actually, I can't account for where they went, or where they are. I don't have a clue. It would seem as if we as humans only ponder the happy ending side of things. We only wonder so strongly where the "good people" go and don't give much thought to where the evil men end up. Good questions you ask. While I don't believe in God because I think he is more evil than Satan, I do believe in an after-life of some sort for all kind of people. The universe, seen and unseen, is so astronomically large, we could end up anywhere. The possibilities are endless. Thats the great part. Think about this, where did all of the "good" people before the biblical era go after they died? Where did all the people who knew of no Christ go after they died? If no one could have taught these people about God or Christ, how can a god end up sending them to hell for their ignorance? Do you realize there would have to be literally "millions" of people who died before Jesus showed up and went to hell? If they did goto hell I think it's unjust. Only an omni-evil creator would do such a thing. There is a such a thing as "good unbelievers", people who dont believe in God or gods and lead a totally wholesome life like anyone else. Entirely. But people like Hitler or Stalin, I dunno...I do think that spiritually, people are held accountable for they're actions, but not by some supernatural governing agent or agency. I believe an after-life exist, but what determines where you go is the type of life you lived. I think if you were an evil man, outright just evil, you end up sending yourself somewhere out there for the miserable and like minded spirits.Likewise, if you were a good hearted person, I think you end up going to somewhere in the after-life which is good instead of evil. I think there are many places you could end up,...I dont believe there is just a heaven and a hell, but a lot out there and in-between. Hopefully, truly evil men pay for their crimes in some way, but..I equally hope that good people go somewhere out of the evil men's presence and that it's not a bad place wherever you end up.

 

I think if God did exist, at least the biblical one,...his methods of judging and sending people to heaven or hell are totally skewed and demented. His views and ways are so evil I don't see what could be worst than being around a vindictive being like him for all eternity. And actually, if you think about it, annihilation doesn't sound all that bad. You wouldn't feel a thing, or know where you are, or aren't ,...you simply wouldn't exist anymore. Not bad.

 

@The Silver Thong, you made a great point. What if Hitler who killed all of those millions of people, repented in his bunker and cried and realized the wrong he had done, don't think mass murderers think like this, but if he did possibly, ..and "God" forgave him and allowed him into heaven after his suicide, wouldn't that be totally ****** up? If God allows mass murderers into a place of eternal bliss just because they said "forgive me, Im sorry", ...yet sends millions of good people who don't believe in God to hell because of their "lack of faith", God is entirely evil. I repeat that statement throughout multiple post because it's true and the consequences and philosophical implications of the biblical God's actions are criminal. Anyone who believes in him has to be insane, or would enjoy worshipping Satan. Read the bible,...Jehova out does Satan in every way...deception, murder, animal and human sacrifice. All covered.

Edited July 12, 2016 by An Urban Leg3nd

[Badperson]

There's always reincarnation..

[An Urban Leg3nd]

12 minutes ago, Badperson said:

There's always reincarnation..

Yeah, but the thing is, if we were reincarnation we'd have no memory or knowledge of it.  We wouldn't even know. So why reincarnate at all?

[CelticBanshee]

22 hours ago, An Urban Leg3nd said:

Yeah, but the thing is, if we were reincarnation we'd have no memory or knowledge of it.  We wouldn't even know. So why reincarnate at all?

Been thinking about this a lot recently. Unlike some stubborn people I'm open minded. I believed in and argued for God and the afterlife and blah blah for so long and I kept telling myself that all of the natural/man made suffering is 1) pointless in the end for 'love is all there is' and 2) for something that's supposedly worth it in 'Gods eyes' maybe heaven here? But recently I've come to my own conclusion that if there actually is a creator then it's intentions are more sinister and childlike than anything 'loving' and 'wise'. One need not look further than the fact that the universe has infinitely more ways to kill us naturally than to help us or 'love' us naturally. All of the contradictions in the idea that no love is greater than the love of God, but all life must consume, and in most cases consume other life, the pain and the fear that must come with that makes me grateful i'm living in 2016 and not 2016 b.c. and then there's the way humans treat each other. There is no such thing as love or divinity etc... Only animal instincts in a rare window of time. 

[XenoFish]

I've always had an issue with the personal god concept. That for some reason you're so special that god would grant your wishes. Seems juvenile. 

15 minutes ago, CelticBanshee said:

Been thinking about this a lot recently. Unlike some stubborn people I'm open minded. I believed in and argued for God and the afterlife and blah blah for so long and I kept telling myself that all of the natural/man made suffering is 1) pointless in the end for 'love is all there is' and 2) for something that's supposedly worth it in 'Gods eyes' maybe heaven here? But recently I've come to my own conclusion that if there actually is a creator then it's intentions are more sinister and childlike than anything 'loving' and 'wise'. One need not look further than the fact that the universe has infinitely more ways to kill us naturally than to help us or 'love' us naturally. All of the contradictions in the idea that no love is greater than the love of God, but all life must consume, and in most cases consume other life, the pain and the fear that must come with that makes me grateful i'm living in 2016 and not 2016 b.c. and then there's the way humans treat each other. There is no such thing as love or divinity etc... Only animal instincts in a rare window of time. 

[universal skeptic]

Man created god(s) in his image. When we break on through to the other side we will know the truth, if there is any truth to be known.  

[GlitterRose]

On 7/8/2016 at 8:34 PM, Badperson said:

I think it's because he gives people the opportunity to repent... No matter how bad your situation is you can always change

I think you're missing the point of omniscience. If God exists and is omniscient, then he would already know who was going to do bad things and not repent. There's no "you can always change." 

Why not just have the unrepentant never be born in the first place? 

[GlitterRose]

On 7/14/2016 at 11:36 AM, An Urban Leg3nd said:

Yeah, but the thing is, if we were reincarnation we'd have no memory or knowledge of it.  We wouldn't even know. So why reincarnate at all?

It's like taking a test...not even being told whether you passed or failed or what mistakes you made...and then getting same test over and over again. What spiritual growth could you possibly be expected to muster if you don't even know what mistakes you made the last time around? 

[An Urban Leg3nd]

1 hour ago, ChaosRose said:

I think you're missing the point of omniscience. If God exists and is omniscient, then he would already know who was going to do bad things and not repent. There's no "you can always change." 

Why not just have the unrepentant never be born in the first place? 

 

Do you not think it is cruel of God to create a man he knows from the beginning will not be saved and is destined for hell? Think about that. I know this man here is going to burn in hell, the most rotten horrible place you can even imagine, despite my efforts, he won't be saved, he belongs to the devil, I create him anyway and let his life take it's course then I see him burn in hell. How sadistic. Why create people who are bound for hell anyway? It's a question I often use to ask myself, God knows who gets in and who doesn't, why create the people who don't get in? Let's take it a step further, why create Lucifer, the first one who disobeyed God in the beginning? God knows Lucifer is a deceptive being filled with hate for God and humanity,...he knew this before he created him, ...lives could have been saved had God not created Lucifer at all. Unless, God wants there to be evil. Unless, God wants there to be people who turn from him and goto hell to be with the devil. Goto the root of the problem, Lucifer...get rid of him and no one else can be deceived. No, Lucifer is created anyway and goes around doing his own thing until Judgement Day. Another screwed up thing about God and his will,...on Judgment Day God is suppose to throw Satan, the false prophet, and unbelievers in hell for all eternity, well turns out after 1000s years pass God will allow Satan to be let out of hell to roam the Earth once again after New Jerusalem ensues. Satan gets to roam around and "test people" all over again for a short period of time to "see" who really is God's people again. After which, God throws him back into hell again. Why let Satan out to roam again? Hasn't he done enough damage? Im beginning to think God is just constructing this whole world and evil just for his own sick enjoyment. It's almost as if he doesn't take human suffering seriously,...he's just playing with his toys. (very sad) I will forever believe God is evil. I as a human can imagine a better way than him.

[GlitterRose]

Just now, An Urban Leg3nd said:

Do you not think it is cruel of God to create a man he knows from the beginning will not be saved and is destined for hell? Think about that. I know this man here is going to burn in hell, the most rotten horrible place you can even imagine, despite my efforts, he won't be saved, he belongs to the devil, I create him anyway and let his life take it's course then I see him burn in hell. How sadistic. Why create people who are bound for hell anyway? It's a question I often use to ask myself, God knows who gets in and who doesn't, why create the people who don't get in? Let's take it a step further, why create Lucifer, the first one who disobeyed God in the beginning? God knows Lucifer is a deceptive being filled with hate for God and humanity,...he knew this before he created him, ...lives could have been saved had God not created Lucifer at all. Unless, God wants there to be evil. Unless, God wants there to be people who turn from him and goto hell to be with the devil. Goto the root of the problem, Lucifer...get rid of him and no one else can be deceived. No, Lucifer is created anyway and goes around doing his own thing until Judgement Day. Another screwed up thing about God and his will,...on Judgment Day God is suppose to throw Satan, the false prophet, and unbelievers in hell for all eternity, well turns out after 1000s years pass God will allow Satan to be let out of hell to roam the Earth once again after New Jerusalem ensues. Satan gets to roam around and "test people" all over again for a short period of time to "see" who really is God's people again. After which, God throws him back into hell again. Why let Satan out to roam again? Hasn't he done enough damage? Im beginning to think God is just constructing this whole world and evil just for his own sick enjoyment. It's almost as if he doesn't take human suffering seriously,...he's just playing with his toys. (very sad) I will forever believe God is evil. I as a human can imagine a better way than him.

Urban...I'm agnostic. If there was some sort of creative force, I wouldn't propose to know if it's actually conscious, anthropomorphic, and/or has any concern for us.

Of course it would be cruel to bring something into being just so you could punish it for an eternity.

[coolguy]

Maybe they just go in to the void, if satan was the big bad wolf and all that, and u where a bad person why would he be punish souls for,this is the dumiest thing i ever hesrd if ur a bad guy u will go to hell when u die and the devil will punshih u really what a bunch of crap, 

Edited July 16, 2016 by coolguy

[+Hammerclaw]

Hamtramck.

[Alan McDougall]

On 7/10/2016 at 2:47 PM, XenoFish said:

So you were there with them? If I'm remembering correctly my grandfather describe the foxhole as either you're doing something, or something you didn't want to have to do. 

2

 

 

 

 

Satan Punishes no one the punishment comes from Almighty God at the great judgement seat

[XenoFish]

3 hours ago, Alan McDougall said:

Satan Punishes no one the punishment comes from Almighty God at the great judgement seat

This is called cause and effect. I see no god here. If god do exist it has no right to judge us, for we are just like god. For we a jealous, wrathful, and full of pride. To cast judgment up us would be to judge 'himself'. 

All it took was devouring all the souls in purgatory to turn one little angel into a god. Then again God often seems like a soul devour beast anyway. I think 'he' needs some prozac or zoloft.