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Magicjax

You think you understand Atheist. But…

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Magicjax

This post was inspired by the biker poem "But you didn't see me"

http://www.cycletrailerrental.com/editorial0031.html

Like many social differences there are often misconceptions. We all know that people judge others in unfair ways at times. People have misconceptionst about others based on many things like race, sexuality, social groups and of course religion just to name a few. And as someone who use to be Christian and now an atheist. I know there are many misconceptions about atheist.

So, as inspired by the biker poem. I just started writing little tidbits on these misconceptions of atheism. Below are a few of them. What would you add? I'm basically keeping it in the format of "You think…" and "But…". The first part is from a person who has a misconception about atheism and the second part is the non-theists correction of their misconception.

You think your god and your religion is the only true god and religion. 

But if you where raised in another society you'd feel the same way about a different religion or god. 

You think it's normal to believe in Santa Claus, the Easter bunny and the tooth fairy when your a child. But as an adult you're not suppose to believe they're real. 

But why is it so easy to stop believe in those make believe things? Because they don't threaten you with eternal hell for not believing they're real. 

You think if a person doesn't believe in god then they must fallow satan. 

But since god creates Satan and we don't believe there is a god. We can't believe there's a Satan either. 

You think evolution is a theory. It is!

But there is more then one meaning to the word "theory" and you're using the wrong definition. The "theory of evolution" is as predictable as an apple falling down instead of up. 

Edited by Magicjax

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Cassea

Who is this "you?" I am so tired of Ex Christians lumping all Christians into their bad experiences. I've seen stories on this site that are not just bad. But very scary. That might be what happened to you. Not what happened to me. Not what happens to all the Christians I know. The ones I know are compassionate and flawed. Our goal is always forgiveness. We spend money building wells. We help the homeless. We are meager in our living. We don't waste money on television sets and new computers. When we know a family is in need. We help the family. We work hard in life. We suffer and are grateful for our joys. We reach out with love. We don't judge others. We avoid religious ritual. We practice peace. So please stop attacking Christians. Just because of the people who you used to associate with.

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Magicjax

My OP clearly states that the "You" is a person with a misconception.

The first part is from a person who has a misconception about atheism and the second part is the non-theists correction of their misconception.

For the record. Nothing "happened" to me. I was raised to believe in god. When I got older I realized I don't believe in god. There was no event. Nothing scary happened. I admit it took a while to admit I don't believe out loud because the society I was raised it teach you that you're suppose to believe. But I never really believed. It was always there in the back of my mind that something is "fishy" here.

Long story short I just stopped fighting the fact that even though society says this is something I'm suppose to never question. I did anyway. Scared is the complete opposite emotion I felt. It was a releif to be honest.

And where in my post did I mention either side? This question is about misconceptions. I never said this was a question for believers or non believers. I never said either side is better or worse.

Edited by Magicjax

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Cassea

Most Christians I know. Don't believe in Santa Claus. They are aware of the difference. Most of us do believe in Evolution. So again who is the "you"

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HerNibs

Most Christians I know. Don't believe in Santa Claus. They are aware of the difference. Most of us do believe in Evolution. So again who is the "you"

"you" is referring to the people with the misconceptions.

It's a generalized statement referring to a group of people, not a single person.

Nibs

ETA - Please correct me if I am wrong Magicjax.

Edited by HerNibs

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Magicjax

You're right. As I said in plain English in both my last posts. :)

I'll break down the obvious.

One person thinks something that all atheists have in common. If this person is wrong in their assumption that their statement is true then this is called a misconception. They assumed something but their assumption is incorrect.

In this case. Anyone (theist or non-theist) believes something to be true about atheism. But they are incorrect. This is what the "You" would be.

I can't believe I had to explain that 3 times in one day on UM LOL

Edited by Magicjax

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Magicjax

Most Christians I know. Don't believe in Santa Claus. They are aware of the difference. Most of us do believe in Evolution. So again who is the "you"

You're completely missing the point. Quit defending your religion and read the question. I said we all know there's no Santa. But we use to and it wasn't all that hard to stop believing. Because there's no consequence for not doing so. I never said Christians believe in Santa or that none of them understand evolution. But some have those "misconception"

It would be wise to save your deffences for a time when you're actually under attack. That's not the case in this discussion.

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Cassea

Please find me one single Christian that really believes in Santa Claus. (Who isn't six)

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Beckys_Mom

Please find me one single Christian that really believes in Santa Claus. (Who isn't six)

A seven year old Christian? lol

Well I know a good few that do and so many that did

Edited by Beckys_Mom

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GoldenWolf

Please find me one single Christian that really believes in Santa Claus. (Who isn't six)

Don't you believe in god? I think that is what the religious think of him, as santa claus. Have you been naughty or nice?

Edited by HavocWing

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HerNibs

You think it's normal to believe in Santa Claus, the Easter bunny and the tooth fairy when your a child. But as an adult you're not suppose to believe they're real.

But why is it so easy to stop believe in those make believe things? Because they don't threaten you with eternal hell for not believing they're real.

Please find me one single Christian that really believes in Santa Claus. (Who isn't six)

I don't think you are understanding Magicjax's post. The idea is that Santa Claus, Easter Bunny, etc. are all mythological creatures that society is ok with a person "growing out of them and no longer believing" but failure to believe in a god/s is something "you" believes is an out an out "evil" act that will cause you to suffer for all eternity.

Each thing (SC, EB, god/s) all have the same amount of evidence but only the failure to believe in god/s is wrong.

Nibs

ETA: Again, MagicJax, please correct me if I am wrong. :)

Edited by HerNibs

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Andami

I really hope you're not serious. He clearly stated that most people don't believe in Santa. He was using that as a comparison with God. You know, both things that you're raised to believe in even though you can see neither? He also stated that one of the reason children stop believing Santa is because there is no consequence in doing so. You can stop believing and still get the presents. In Christianity, and many other religions, not believing in that religion's deity is a one-way ticket to its equivalent of hell. It's not all that hard to understand if you read his posts...

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Habitat

I don't see why rejecting whatever was being fed to you as 'religion' would oblige you to become an atheist. That's a bit like saying because you hated the tripe they served up to you for dinner every night,you turned into a vegetarian. One does not follow from the other as a matter of necessity, at all.

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Beckys_Mom

That's a bit like saying because you hated the tripe they served up to you for dinner every night,you turned into a vegetarian.

Ha ha good one.... I wonder if my cooking has turned the odd one to a vegetarian over night? unsure.gif

Edited by Beckys_Mom

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Cassea

I really hope you're not serious. He clearly stated that most people don't believe in Santa. He was using that as a comparison with God. You know, both things that you're raised to believe in even though you can see neither? He also stated that one of the reason children stop believing Santa is because there is no consequence in doing so. You can stop believing and still get the presents. In Christianity, and many other religions, not believing in that religion's deity is a one-way ticket to its equivalent of hell. It's not all that hard to understand if you read his posts...

I know he's using it as an example. I'm pointing out that it's not true. Comparing belief in God is not the same as a belief in Santa. And btw I started off asking "Who is you" Who is the you in the story?

I don't see why rejecting whatever was being fed to you as 'religion' would oblige you to become an atheist. That's a bit like saying because you hated the tripe they served up to you for dinner every night,you turned into a vegetarian. One does not follow from the other as a matter of necessity, at all.

Thank you. I am asking again Who is the "you" in the story? Just because a few people understand. Your point. Doesn't mean you actually are making one. Oversimplistic ideas. Are often praised. By unsophisticated thinkers. (I give you the Chia pet) It doesn't mean your point is stupid. I'm asking you a question. You take us through. A series of steps in reason. Or spiritual awareness. I'm asking who is the you? This is because. You wrote this

The first part is from a person who has a misconception about atheism and the second part is the non-theists correction of their misconception.

If the first part is from a person. Who has a misconception of atheism. That means the person speaking is the Christian with the misconception. Of Atheism. But the person says "You" and then speaks to a person about their belief in God. So really the "You think" is directed to a Christian. And the second part is the non theists correction. So the "you" is the Christian.

Yet the ideas you say to the Christian. Are really. Misconceptions atheists have about Christians. Not misconceptions. Christians have about non believers. Then the ideas are wrong to begin with.

You think your god and your religion is the only true god and religion.

No I don't. I don't have a "religion" that I follow. I follow God and Jesus.

But if you where raised in another society you'd feel the same way about a different religion or god.

Not true. I was raised in another society. I converted to Christianity. So did my family.

You think it's normal to believe in Santa Claus, the Easter bunny and the tooth fairy when your a child. But as an adult you're not suppose to believe they're real.

I don't think it is normal. I think it is wrong to lie to children. I was not lied to. And I see more nonbelievers. Lying to their children.

But why is it so easy to stop believe in those make believe things? Because they don't threaten you with eternal hell for not believing they're real.

God doesn't threaten me with eternal hell.

You think if a person doesn't believe in god then they must fallow satan.

No I do not. Neither does anyone I know who is Christian. The only ones who follow Satan. Are satanists.

But since god creates Satan and we don't believe there is a god. We can't believe there's a Satan either.

Who said you did?

You think evolution is a theory. It is!

I think evolution is a fact. So do all the Christians I know.

But there is more then one meaning to the word "theory" and you're using the wrong definition. The "theory of evolution" is as predictable as an apple falling down instead of up.

No I am not. I'm not using the wrong definition.

Edited by Cassea

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HerNibs

I know he's using it as an example. I'm pointing out that it's not true. Comparing belief in God is not the same as a belief in Santa. And btw I started off asking "Who is you" Who is the you in the story?

Many of us see it as being true. I can't think of a religion that doesn't state that their "god/s" are the only "real" god/s and failure to believe in them will result in damnation and or destruction/punishment.

As far as I (and many other atheists feel) Santa/god(s) are all mythical beings. But if I don't believe in Santa I've just grown up. After all, who could believe in a magical being that visits everyone on earth in one night and rewards them. Makes more sense to believe in a magical being that is every where in the universe, knows all, creates all and controls your eternal destiny.

Nibs

ETA: "You" has been explained to you.

Edited by HerNibs

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Cassea

Many of us see it as being true. I can't think of a religion that doesn't state that their "god/s" are the only "real" god/s and failure to believe in them will result in damnation and or destruction/punishment.

As far as I (and many other atheists feel) Santa/god(s) are all mythical beings. But if I don't believe in Santa I've just grown up. After all, who could believe in a magical being that visits everyone on earth in one night and rewards them. Makes more sense to believe in a magical being that is every where in the universe, knows all, creates all and controls your eternal destiny.

Nibs

ETA: "You" has been explained to you.

Please see my edit. The OP reads as a list of misconceptions that Atheists have about Christians. And no the you is wrong. The 'you" is someone speaking to the Christian. Not the Christian speaking to the atheist.

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Magicjax

Since the Santa point has turned into the main discussion (which I did not intend. LOL). I myself was never told he wasn't real. The only thing that told me was the fact that I told my parents what I wanted. And quite often I got it (not always. :( ). So I finally put 2 and 2 together and realized my parents got that present and put santas name on it. They knew I knew when I said "thank you mom and dad".

The same basic way of logical thinking is what brought me to the conclusion that I don't believe in god. But because the society I live in is mostly in favor of believing in god. At first I kept the thought to myself. I didn't tell anyone. First I'd say "I do believe in god but I don't fallow any religion". Then, as I found out there are others that question that too. I became more open to say it out loud. Knowing that there are others that don't believe in god in the society I live in was equivalent to me saying "thank you mom and dad". I now know who is really responsible for my happiness. Those who I love and love me. I don't need an imaginary figure to receive that acceptance.

Edited by Magicjax

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Cassea

Please read my edit. You explained the OP wrong. You also posted many misconceptions. Atheists have about Christians. Not beliefs that Christians. Have about Atheists. I don't know anyone. Have never met anyone. Even in Catholicism. Who thinks atheists worship Satan. I have never heard this. Or encountered this. So I am asking once again. Who is the "you." What Christians do you know. That think this way?

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aquatus1

In all honesty, I found the presentation of the OP somewhat unclear, and while I sincerely doubt Magicjax was looking for a fight, I can sort of see how others might have not seen it like that.

Being that we are just on the second page, and the original points that needed clarifying have been clarified, perhaps you could actually discuss the Original Topic, which to my mind, will have a bit more meat to it.

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Cassea

Who is this "you?" I am so tired of Ex Christians lumping all Christians into their bad experiences. I've seen stories on this site that are not just bad. But very scary. That might be what happened to you. Not what happened to me. Not what happens to all the Christians I know. The ones I know are compassionate and flawed. Our goal is always forgiveness. We spend money building wells. We help the homeless. We are meager in our living. We don't waste money on television sets and new computers. When we know a family is in need. We help the family. We work hard in life. We suffer and are grateful for our joys. We reach out with love. We don't judge others. We avoid religious ritual. We practice peace. So please stop attacking Christians. Just because of the people who you used to associate with.

This is my original reply. The beliefs attributed to "Christians." In the OP. Do not match any Christian I know. So I mean. I have seen quite a bit. That people may have. Come out of a town or family. Where a distorted view of Christianity. Was practiced. That doesn't mean. That all Christians think this way. I also personally think it is dishonest. For people who know this is happening. To push the idea. As true. When they know. Very well. That most Christians do not. For Example, Believe that atheists. Worship Satan. It is frustrating. Peace.

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Magicjax

Yea. Read the poem I linked to in the OP. it demonstrates the inspiration of my post and why I used the "you" anoligy. I read that poem and thought, "ok. Bikers get labeled with misconceptions. So do us atheist". So if you go to that link and read it you might better understand my intentions.

Here's one that I've personally experienced. To clarify. The "you think" is something someone said to me. Their exact words where "I don't believe you're an atheist because you're such a nice guy". So my tidbit goes like this:

-You think you don't believe in god but that can't be true because you're a nice person.

But you don't ask everyone you meet what their religious beliefs are. I'm sure you've meet many theist and non-theist that you like or dislike without knowing if they believe in god or not.

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Cassea

Please. One last time. Who do you know that thinks that atheists. Worship Satan? :unsure2:

In the spirit of the OP.

To the non believer. From the Christian.

You think it doesn't hurt when you treat us as a stereotype. It does.

You think that we all think the same way.

We don't. There are at least. Nine major denominations.

http://www.religionfacts.com/christianity/charts/denominations_beliefs.htm

You think you are getting even. With someone who was Christian. Who judged you in the past. By taking it out. On every Christian you meet in the future.

You're not. You're just being as abusive to us. As they were to you.

Edited by Cassea

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Magicjax

This is my original reply. The beliefs attributed to "Christians." In the OP. Do not match any Christian I know. So I mean. I have seen quite a bit. That people may have. Come out of a town or family. Where a distorted view of Christianity. Was practiced. That doesn't mean. That all Christians think this way. I also personally think it is dishonest. For people who know this is happening. To push the idea. As true. When they know. Very well. That most Christians do not. For Example, Believe that atheists. Worship Satan. It is frustrating. Peace.

I can understand that. But you've got to remember that it's possible that I have meet people that think these things. People don't understand what being atheist means. Some think it's a different religion when it's not. Some think you must believe in god to have morals and that's not true. Maybe you haven't meet such people because youre a believer in a society that accepts that. Many don't understand us atheist. And many get very vocal about it and say the kinds of things I've said in this discussion right to our faces. Most just walk away is discuss though. Just like many use to do (and still do unfortunately) to other minorities.

Yes, some Christians hate atheist on site. Some think the world is less then 10,000 old and evolution isn't true. Some still really think there's cheese on the moon. Not just kids. Yes, there are religious bigots out there. I'm not saying all or even most. But there are a good number of them and when you're an atheist you'll find them more often.

Edited by Magicjax

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HerNibs

Please. One last time. Who do you know that thinks that atheists. Worship Satan? :unsure2:

In the spirit of the OP.

To the non believer. From the Christian.

You think it doesn't hurt when you treat us as a stereotype. It does.

You think that we all think the same way.

We don't. There are at least. Nine major denominations.

http://www.religionfacts.com/christianity/charts/denominations_beliefs.htm

You think you are getting even. With someone who was Christian. Who judged you in the past. By taking it out. On every Christian you meet in the future.

You're not. You're just being as abusive to us. As they were to you.

Google Rapture Ready or the CARM forums, how about Jack Chick. Each one of these flat out state that if you are not christian you are following Satan.

Nibs

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