Long lost pages of 'Book of the Dead' found

[Still Waters]

The last missing pages from a supposedly 'magical' Book of the Dead from an Egyptian priest, Amenhotep, have been found after a century-long search - in a museum in Queensland.

British Museum Egyptologist Dr John Taylor said he was 'floored' by the discovery of the 100 fragments.

It's the end of a worldwide search by archaeologists for the papyrus scroll - which supposedly contains spells to guide spirits into the afterlife.

Read more...

[The Puzzler]

Yeah, I read that on ninemsn, how bizarre - "gee, sorry, we didn't realise we had the missing pages of The Book of the Dead in the storeroom..."

[questionmark]

Yeah, I read that on ninemsn, how bizarre - "gee, sorry, we didn't realise we had the missing pages of The Book of the Dead in the storeroom..."

If you knew how many solution to mysteries are in storerooms of museums you would start a campaign to have them cleaned out.

[ShadowSot]

If you knew how many solution to mysteries are in storerooms of museums you would start a campaign to have them cleaned out.

I always figured the warehouse the Ark was stored in Indiana Jones was the storage of the Smithsonian.

[questionmark]

I always figured the warehouse the Ark was stored in Indiana Jones was the storage of the Smithsonian.

I was more referring to *real* mysteries, not created ones.

[ShadowSot]

I was more referring to *real* mysteries, not created ones.

I was being facetious Questionmark. My cousin works for the Smithsonian and has told me just how crowded their storage is.

[questionmark]

I was being facetious Questionmark. My cousin works for the Smithsonian and has told me just how crowded their storage is.

I know.... but could not resist... call it a preemtivestrike against the fringe telling us *what else is to be found*.

[Abramelin]

I was being facetious Questionmark. My cousin works for the Smithsonian and has told me just how crowded their storage is.

I guess you will know that now many people will haunt you with their questions.

It's like saying you have a sis working in the Vatican Library no one gets easily access to.

[ShadowSot]

I guess you will know that now many people will haunt you with their questions.

It's like saying you have a sis working in the Vatican Library no one gets easily access to.

I've been begging here to let me into the storage since I was six.

(She's a much older cousin, obviously.)

I do wish we lived in the same state so I could pester her more often....

Edited April 23, 2012 by ShadowSot

[Sir Wearer of Hats]

Does the phrase "liberated by Australian forces while deployed to Egypt" factor into this at any stage? because, bless their cotton socks, Australian forces, especially in WW1, were notorious for taking everything that wasn't nailed down.

[questionmark]

Does the phrase "liberated by Australian forces while deployed to Egypt" factor into this at any stage? because, bless their cotton socks, Australian forces, especially in WW1, were notorious for taking everything that wasn't nailed down.

Could be, could not be... the most likely variation is that you have to find an Aussie archeologist who participated in the dig and got part of the scroll as his booty. All proud he took it to the museum and the curator (by political appointment) did not know what to do with it. As it did not look like Nofretete or Tut-Anch-Amun nor anything like that it got put in a box and was forgotten until the day the intern was ordered to take the boxes from one end of the magazine to the other....

[kmt_sesh]

Could be, could not be... the most likely variation is that you have to find an Aussie archeologist who participated in the dig and got part of the scroll as his booty. All proud he took it to the museum and the curator (by political appointment) did not know what to do with it. As it did not look like Nofretete or Tut-Anch-Amun nor anything like that it got put in a box and was forgotten until the day the intern was ordered to take the boxes from one end of the magazine to the other....

In regards to the bolded portion, should we contact Daniel Collins or Hans-Dieter von Senff? They're both world-renowned archaeologists with Ph.D.s coming out their hoo-hoos, as is proved by the discussions with which they blessed us right here at UM.

Oh, my. I shouldn't say such things.

In all seriousness, it's not uncommon for a single papyrus text to have left Egypt in more than one piece. A lot of this stuff was sold to foreigners in the old days, and papyri with writing was especially popular to wealthy tourists in the late nineteenth century. An antiquarian in business for himself or even a savvy Egyptian villager could sell such stuff to the antiquities dealers who prowled Egypt, who in turn sold it to markets for auctions in the big cities (especially Luxor, Cairo, and Alexandria). This is how many museums with Egyptian exhibits fleshed out considerable portions of their collections.

The Book of the Dead is one of my favorite topics for research so naturally this discussion caught my eye. John Taylor is one of the leading Egyptologists of the British Museum. Oddly, however, I am not familiar with this particular Book of the Dead.

[questionmark]

The Book of the Dead is one of my favorite topics for research so naturally this discussion caught my eye. John Taylor is one of the leading Egyptologists of the British Museum. Oddly, however, I am not familiar with this particular Book of the Dead.

I was interested for quite a while in it, even had some reproductions hanging in my office but I got tired of it after a while. Lie to the gods to get into heaven? Nah!

Edited April 23, 2012 by questionmark

[kmt_sesh]

I was interested for quite a while in it, even had some reproductions hanging in my office but I got tired of it after a while. Lie to the gods to get into heaven? Nah!

Aw, come on, you have to admit...it's an easier route than the Roman Catholic way.

[Simbi Laveau]

I was more referring to *real* mysteries, not created ones.

Not necissarily fabricated.

I know for a fact,that the Museum of natural history in nyc,has store room that go for blocks,under the city.

It has stuff that's never seen the light of day.

They done testing there,that should be out in public domain,but its not.Museums have wealths of knowledge and artifacts ,they just don't make the public privy to.Why that is,is anyone's guess.

Stands to reason,that most institutions of this nature ,have them.

The Smithsonian,being in the capitol ,probably has some classified stuff the Govt likes to keep close to the vest.

It doesn't mean it looks like that last scene in Indiana Jones,but I have always thought a warehouse like that,exists somewhere in the USA.

[Simbi Laveau]

I wonder if this will change how some of the existing spells were supposed to be done.

[ShadowSot]

Mostof the reason they don't get displayed comes down to funding and space, not enough of either to get everything up. Plus the keep receiving new material that comes in while already backlogged on work that needs to be carefully examined and presented, with new stuff that gets pushed ahead of the line for one reason or another.

[kmt_sesh]

Not necissarily fabricated.

I know for a fact,that the Museum of natural history in nyc,has store room that go for blocks,under the city.

It has stuff that's never seen the light of day.

They done testing there,that should be out in public domain,but its not.Museums have wealths of knowledge and artifacts ,they just don't make the public privy to.Why that is,is anyone's guess.

Stands to reason,that most institutions of this nature ,have them.

The Smithsonian,being in the capitol ,probably has some classified stuff the Govt likes to keep close to the vest.

It doesn't mean it looks like that last scene in Indiana Jones,but I have always thought a warehouse like that,exists somewhere in the USA.

I'm a docent with the Field Museum of Natural History in Chicago. I'm familiar with its collections. In purpose and function the American Museum of Natural History (the one in New York you're talking about) is very similar to the one in Chicago. These are huge institutions of science encompassing everything from zoology to anthropology to geology to genetics. They have only so much physical space in the public galleries. I'm not well acquainted with the American Museum of Natural History and have never been there, but I can speak for the Field Museum. It displays less than one percent of its total collections despite being one of the largest natural history museums in the world. What the public doesn't generally see are the massive spaces above the upper public level and in three subbasements below the ground level, sprawling with storage spaces and labs of all sorts.

The overstorage is not being "hidden" from the public in these museums. That's rather silly to suggest in the first place. These are centers of science and learning. The large percentages of collections not on public display are kept in overstorage for good reasons. Usually it's because they're too frail or damaged to be displayed, or because they're held in reserve for visiting scientists to examine and study.

Once a year we host our Members Night where Field members can come and explore the overstorage and labs. It's a blast—one of my favorite nights of the year. We're undergoing a change in leadership with a new president soon to come aboard, and there's been a call to open these spaces to the general public maybe as often as one day a month. I'm in favor of the idea but can see why it probably won't work, due largely to staffing and expense. Still, things are not being hidden. It's true that the average person can't just go exploring labs and overstorage whenever he or she wishes, but that's perfectly sensible. Who in the hell would allow that? Museums like the Field and American Museum spend a fortune every year to store and conserve their collections, and to pay a large staff to study them. You can bet they're going to protect their collections.

My apologies for coming across harshly. It's not my intent to unload on you. If you're curious about the collections of the American Museum of Natural History, look into its publications. No doubt you can find mountains of literature on the research of its collections, including plenty of stuff not displayed in its public galleries. I know I've been able to do this with the collections of the Field Museum, especially pertaining to its Egyptian collection.

I wonder if this will change how some of the existing spells were supposed to be done.

As I stated earlier I'm not familiar with this particular papyrus, but the sum total of its parts are unlikely to have any dramatic effect on our understanding of the Book of the Dead. This text changed noticeably from period to period, so at most it might render a better understanding of how the Book of the Dead was envisioned and composed during the time period during which its owner, the priest Amunhotep, lived and died. Mostly it's exciting only because the missing portions of his text have now been found.

[orangepeaceful79]

I'm a docent with the Field Museum of Natural History in Chicago. I'm familiar with its collections. In purpose and function the American Museum of Natural History (the one in New York you're talking about) is very similar to the one in Chicago. These are huge institutions of science encompassing everything from zoology to anthropology to geology to genetics. They have only so much physical space in the public galleries. I'm not well acquainted with the American Museum of Natural History and have never been there, but I can speak for the Field Museum. It displays less than one percent of its total collections despite being one of the largest natural history museums in the world. What the public doesn't generally see are the massive spaces above the upper public level and in three subbasements below the ground level, sprawling with storage spaces and labs of all sorts.

The overstorage is not being "hidden" from the public in these museums. That's rather silly to suggest in the first place. These are centers of science and learning. The large percentages of collections not on public display are kept in overstorage for good reasons. Usually it's because they're too frail or damaged to be displayed, or because they're held in reserve for visiting scientists to examine and study.

Once a year we host our Members Night where Field members can come and explore the overstorage and labs. It's a blast—one of my favorite nights of the year. We're undergoing a change in leadership with a new president soon to come aboard, and there's been a call to open these spaces to the general public maybe as often as one day a month. I'm in favor of the idea but can see why it probably won't work, due largely to staffing and expense. Still, things are not being hidden. It's true that the average person can't just go exploring labs and overstorage whenever he or she wishes, but that's perfectly sensible. Who in the hell would allow that? Museums like the Field and American Museum spend a fortune every year to store and conserve their collections, and to pay a large staff to study them. You can bet they're going to protect their collections.

My apologies for coming across harshly. It's not my intent to unload on you. If you're curious about the collections of the American Museum of Natural History, look into its publications. No doubt you can find mountains of literature on the research of its collections, including plenty of stuff not displayed in its public galleries. I know I've been able to do this with the collections of the Field Museum, especially pertaining to its Egyptian collection.

As I stated earlier I'm not familiar with this particular papyrus, but the sum total of its parts are unlikely to have any dramatic effect on our understanding of the Book of the Dead. This text changed noticeably from period to period, so at most it might render a better understanding of how the Book of the Dead was envisioned and composed during the time period during which its owner, the priest Amunhotep, lived and died. Mostly it's exciting only because the missing portions of his text have now been found.

Thank you for this thoughtful and well-composed response to those people who assume that everything unknown is some vast conspiracy on the part of science to hide all the "good stuff" from the public.

Your museum sounds wonderful and if I am ever in Chicago, I will make it a stop on my itinerary.

[Simbi Laveau]

I'm a docent with the Field Museum of Natural History in Chicago. I'm familiar with its collections. In purpose and function the American Museum of Natural History (the one in New York you're talking about) is very similar to the one in Chicago. These are huge institutions of science encompassing everything from zoology to anthropology to geology to genetics. They have only so much physical space in the public galleries. I'm not well acquainted with the American Museum of Natural History and have never been there, but I can speak for the Field Museum. It displays less than one percent of its total collections despite being one of the largest natural history museums in the world. What the public doesn't generally see are the massive spaces above the upper public level and in three subbasements below the ground level, sprawling with storage spaces and labs of all sorts.

The overstorage is not being "hidden" from the public in these museums. That's rather silly to suggest in the first place. These are centers of science and learning. The large percentages of collections not on public display are kept in overstorage for good reasons. Usually it's because they're too frail or damaged to be displayed, or because they're held in reserve for visiting scientists to examine and study.

Once a year we host our Members Night where Field members can come and explore the overstorage and labs. It's a blastone of my favorite nights of the year. We're undergoing a change in leadership with a new president soon to come aboard, and there's been a call to open these spaces to the general public maybe as often as one day a month. I'm in favor of the idea but can see why it probably won't work, due largely to staffing and expense. Still, things are not being hidden. It's true that the average person can't just go exploring labs and overstorage whenever he or she wishes, but that's perfectly sensible. Who in the hell would allow that? Museums like the Field and American Museum spend a fortune every year to store and conserve their collections, and to pay a large staff to study them. You can bet they're going to protect their collections.

My apologies for coming across harshly. It's not my intent to unload on you. If you're curious about the collections of the American Museum of Natural History, look into its publications. No doubt you can find mountains of literature on the research of its collections, including plenty of stuff not displayed in its public galleries. I know I've been able to do this with the collections of the Field Museum, especially pertaining to its Egyptian collection.

As I stated earlier I'm not familiar with this particular papyrus, but the sum total of its parts are unlikely to have any dramatic effect on our understanding of the Book of the Dead. This text changed noticeably from period to period, so at most it might render a better understanding of how the Book of the Dead was envisioned and composed during the time period during which its owner, the priest Amunhotep, lived and died. Mostly it's exciting only because the missing portions of his text have now been found.

I actually wasn't implying that the museum of natural history was hiding anything.

I know someone that worked there,and I've read Douglas Prestons book,as he also worked there,back in the 80s-90s I believe.

I do think,if the Smithsonian has unusual artifacts,they might well be hidden,having such a close connection to Washington .

That's what I meant.

And the museum in NYC,has storage UNDER the city,in sub basements.

City blocks are long !

I've heard that they might even connect to the old subterranean subway system .

The research I know of,that I think should be public,is specific to animal testing.

They have fish samples from the 1800s,that contain just as much mercury as fish today,which would be proof that fish just store mercury,or are born with it.

It has nothing to do with modern pollution ,which I find fascinating !

And I've been to the field museum ! I went JUST to see the 2 lions .I wanted to see them for years.

And of course Sue.

And,as an aside.I wandered down in the basement where the Egyptian stuff is.Mind you,I know they weren't even anyone hugely famous.

No idea if it's still there.I went in 2007.

I am very sensitive to odd energy.

I do not usually have to leave a room because of something in the room being "off".

Something in that Egyptian collection is not right.

I got dizzy,nauseous.I noticed it while looking at the baby mummies.I cannot remember if they had been babies or still borns....i just had to get out of there.

It subsided as soon as I got upstairs.

Very weird.

I love the lions though.The eyes,albeit glass,still give me shivers .They look evil .

And well ,people who use the book of the dead as their main magical tome,will have issue as to the spells,their order ,and if missing some of them ,all this time,was crucial to the actual work.

I have a basic skim the surface understanding of it.

I use some of the dieties,but not spells from the book directly.

I am not Rosicrucian though.

They are a bit fanatical about it all.

If you would like to check out Douglas Prestons book,its called Dinosaurs in the Attic I believe.

Its out of print I think ? I got it at the library

Edited April 24, 2012 by Simbi Laveau

[Sir Wearer of Hats]

How exactly are people using the Book of the Dead as a magic(k)al guide?

I always thought the Book of the Dead was about how to prepare your soul to go to the Egyptian afterlife, and what things need to be done to the body after the 'Ka' has departed to ensure there's some extra support for the soul in the journey.

[Simbi Laveau]

How exactly are people using the Book of the Dead as a magic(k)al guide?

I always thought the Book of the Dead was about how to prepare your soul to go to the Egyptian afterlife, and what things need to be done to the body after the 'Ka' has departed to ensure there's some extra support for the soul in the journey.

*coughs*

You can bring people back from the dead allegedly,but people use the spells all the time. I believe they are numbered ?

Id have to look,as its not something I use personally.

I use certain dieties in my personal practices,including their specific heiroglyphics.

My one close rosecrucian friend,is long dead.

He had a coven in NJ .

It's basically aliester crowley kind of stuff.Golden Dawn and OTO use the book of the dead,a lot.

It leaves a bad taste in my mouth .

Who wants to reanimate a body ?

They attempt it,just to say they did.

Many people use Isis and Osiris ,and the actual steps laid out.To what end,only they can know.

Edited April 24, 2012 by Simbi Laveau

[Abramelin]

You ever bring people back from the dead? No, eh?

My impression about you is that you live in fairy land.

And believe me - I do know a thing or two about Hoodoo (and Voodoo).

[Simbi Laveau]

You ever bring people back from the dead? No, eh?

My impression about you is that you live in fairy land.

And believe me - I do know a thing or two about Hoodoo (and Voodoo).

My high priestess is Lady Rhea from nyc .As I always say,feel free to Google her.Email her,and ask her if Missy lives in fairyland.Do let me know what she says.

I've known her since I'm 15 .I am also her Acupuncturist .Ask her if i lie about that,or if i was a paramedic.

It's alleged you can bring the dead back to life,with book of the dead spells. I know crowley at least attempted it.I am aware of parts of the ritual he used.

Crowley ,golden Dawn,and OTO,tend to be looked down upon in my circles.

I still think crowley was murdered,despite reports of his natural demise.

I personally,as i SAID in my post,in no way use any of it.I like certain Egyptian dieties.

If you know oh so much about all of this,you would know what I was implying,but you instead ,felt the need to knock me.

Not *my* problem.

And I'm so happy you know a bit about voodoo and hoodoo.Maybe you can teach me,since I am so uninformed ,here in fairyland .

Edited April 24, 2012 by Simbi Laveau

[Eldorado]

Maybe there's hope for someone, someday, finding a copy of the Cleopatra Swimsuit Edition of Sports Illustrated.