Oera Linda Book and the Great Flood [Part 2]

[Abramelin]

bù-del

bð-del

1, afries., st. M. (a): nhd. Beutel (M.) (1), Tasche; ne. bag (N.), purse (N.);

Hw.: vgl. as. bðdil, ahd. bðtil; Q.: W; E.: germ. *bðdila-, *bðdilaz, st. M. (a),

Beutel (M.) (1); s. idg. *beu- (2), *bu-, *b

heÈ-, *bhÈ-, V., blasen, schwellen,

Pokorny 98; W.: saterl. bul; L.: Hh 13a, Rh 673a

http://www.koeblerge...ch/afries-B.pdf

Yes, I know you think that the -DEL part is a suffix in itself, but the Dutch etymology site is more detailed, and says the suffix is -IL/EL. The BEU is the PGm stem, and got 'dentilized' into BUD.

Btw, you can look up BUD on the Etymology Online site.

[Abramelin]

beu for swelling I've seen. (I'll go back on bow because I first thought it was bue) Fir Bolg possibly also has this root in bolg/bulge and so does bull.

del might be valley then down, descent or under/low. Delta = low (lands) (Again, not opening as I first said)

beu-del

the word beu-del as bù-del and buda really should have something to do with these root words..

Sounds like a descriptive for where Buda might have been situated.

It also sounds very much like and describes a bottle.

A low swelling. Here's a pretty bottle that shows it:

Purses and bags would have been the same shape, a swollen bag drawn in at the top.

Greek βοῦττις (bouttis), "vessel"

bottle (n.)

mid-14c., originally of leather, from Old French boteille (12c., Modern French bouteille), from Vulgar Latin butticula, diminutive of Late Latin buttis "a cask," which is perhaps from Greek.

http://www.etymonline.com/index.php?term=bottle&allowed_in_frame=0

http://www.etymologiebank.nl/trefwoord/bottelen

Funny, one should be able to see a clear connection between BUDEL or BUIDEL and BOTTLE, but none of the linked sites gives that connection.

A 'container' (sack, bag, purse, bottle).

[Abramelin]

Either way, I do not think Fryans had Goddesses, so the above is Celtic influenced, you'd have to look under the layers more.

.

The Old Frisians had, as has been posted, but the 'Fryans' had not...

[Abramelin]

This Bitberg.

The city’s name derives from its Celtic toponym, Beda.

Toponym should just mean that is was known as this, it doesn't mean the Celts named it this but could mean it was known as this from the Celts at the time it became heard of.

It's 2000 years old at least.

I know of Bitburg's original name Beda, and I also said that Büdesheim is part of Bitburg.

Büdesheim, Does that mean Büde's Heim?

[Abramelin]

Maybe it's an interesting find, which fits in with your theory that Hautes Fagnes was Hâga Fênna.

But why name a burgh from a purse or a sack?

And to which grieteni did the area in which Apollânja travelled belong - the Rhine, all the way to the Bodensee?

Was it a new grieteni, established after the grietmen wrote down their list - with Ny.Fryasburch as its administration center?

Something else I have been thinking of all this time we talked about these burghs:

The OLB says so and so was grevetman over this or that area, and that burghs X and Y and Z were under his care.

Does that necessarily mean these cities must be located in these areas they were grevetman of?

And why name a burgh after a purse of sack? Why not? The OLB Jes-us was socalled nicknamed Buda because his mind was like a bag/purse full of wisdom.

Maybe the suggestion is that the OLB Buda burgh was like a 'bag of....' whatever. Gold, money?

Settlements are named after sillier things than a bag, sack (or maybe bottle).

And did you know that in the Dutch province of Drenthe there is a tiny village called "Amerika"? And it's name is older than that of the continent America... I always liked to see someone explain that name.

.

Edited March 14, 2013 by Abramelin

[Abramelin]

Yes Gestur, nice one. Language is fun.

Made me think of ‘Kraai’ en ‘Graai’.

De graai-cultuur, as we know in Dutch.

Wasn’t the Earl (Jarl) the head of the robbers? -> G-raaf in Dutch :-)

Van Gorp and Gestur, you should visit that Dutch etymology site, and enter 'raaf'.

At least one of you will drop from their chairs reading the results, but I am not going to post it.

[Knul]

Something else I have been thinking of all this time we talked about these burghs:

The OLB says so and so was grevetman over this or that area, and that burghs X and Y and Z were under his care.

Does that necessarily mean these cities must be located in these areas they were grevetman of?

And why name a burgh after a purse of sack? Why not? The OLB Jes-us was socalled nicknamed Buda because his mind was like a bag/purse full of wisdom.

Maybe the suggestion is that the OLB Buda burgh was like a 'bag of....' whatever. Gold, money?

Settlements are named after sillier things than a bag, sack (or maybe bottle).

And did you know that in the Dutch province of Drenthe there is a tiny village called "Amerika"? And it's name is older than that of the continent America... I always liked to see someone explain that name.

.

1. If in Astflyland castles are mentioned in that area and if in Westflyland castles are mentioned in that area, it is reasonable to suppose that in Southflyland happened the same.

2. If in Astflyland, Westflyland and Southflyland castles are mentioned in those areas, it is reasonable to suppose that the same happened in the Haga Fenna and Walda.

3. In the Seven Islands there was only one castle (in Domburg on Wallhalagara, Walcheren). Middel in Middekburg does not mean in the middle of an island, but the middlest of more castles.

Just a matter of logic.

Foreign territories did not belong to a particular grietenij, but to the Frisian State as a whole like our foreign colonies did not belong to Amsterdam or Hoorn or Enkhuizen, but to the State of the Netherlands.

Amerika s. http://nl.wikipedia.org/wiki/America_(Limburg)

Edited March 14, 2013 by Knul

[Abramelin]

1. If in Astflyland castles are mentioned in that area and if in Westflyland castles are mentioned in that area, it is reasonable to suppose that in Southflyland happened the same.

2. If in Astflyland, Westflyland and Southflyland castles are mentioned in those areas, it is reasonable to suppose that the same happened in the Haga Fenna and Walda.

3. In the Seven Islands there was only one castle (in Domburg on Wallhalagara, Walcheren). Middel in Middekburg does not mean in the middle of an island, but the middlest of more castles.

Just a matter of logic.

Foreign territories did not belong to a particular grietenij, but to the Frisian State as a whole like our foreign colonies did not belong to Amsterdam or Hoorn or Enkhuizen, but to the State of the Netherlands.

Amerika s. http://nl.wikipedia....merica_(Limburg)

No, this is what the OLB tells us:

These are the Grevetmen under whose direction this book is composed:—

Apol, Adela’s husband; three times a sea-king; Grevetman of Eastflyland ON THE OTHER SIDE OF ("ovir-a") the Lindaoords. The towns Liudgarda, Lindahem, and Stavia are under his care.

The Saxman Storo, Sytia’s husband; Grevetman over the High Fenns and Woods. Nine times he was chosen as duke or heerman. The towns Buda and Manna-garda-forda are under his care.

Abêlo, Jaltia’s husband; Grevetman over the South Flylands. He was three times heerman. The towns Aken, Liudburg, and Katsburg are under his care.

Enoch, Dywcke’s husband; Grevetman over Westflyland and Texel. He was chosen nine times for sea-king. Waraburg, Medeasblik, Forana, and Fryasburg are under his care.

Foppe, Dunros' husband; Grevetman over the Seven islands. He was five times sea-king. The town Walhallagara is under his care.

It never says in that area.

Yes, I am not crazy, I know that is how one should maybe interpret it, but that is not what it has to mean.

And look at how I translated the part of Apol, Adela's husband; I wonder how you would translate "ovir-a".

.

Edited March 14, 2013 by Abramelin

[Ott]

you should visit that Dutch etymology site, and enter 'raaf'

Yes, I saw it.

On http://gtb.inl.nl not only "Opperrabbijn" (chief Rabbi), but also "Geestelijke, predikant. Deze toepassing zal wel mede gegrond zijn op de zwarte ambtskleeding van de geestelijken en dus ontstaan zijn door associatie van raaf (III) met raaf (I)."

=>> preacher, probably in part because black clothes associate with raven.

[Abramelin]

OK, better someone from The Judes Land ("Thjudisland") posting that than someone from another country.

[Abramelin]

Amerika s. http://nl.wikipedia....merica_(Limburg)

Your link doesn't work (and that's because of the final bracket), but this one does:

http://nl.wikipedia....erica_(Limburg)

And it's a rather recent name for that village ("late negentiende eeuw" = late 19th century)

This is the Drenthe "Amerika":

Amerika is a hamlet in the Netherlands. It is part of the village of Een, in the Noordenveld municipality in Drenthe. Amerika has an elevation of 4 meters (13 feet).

Just north of the hamlet is the recreational ground Ronostrand, a swimming pool from an old sand mine.

The village name is older than the name of the continent of America.

http://en.wikipedia....merika,_Drenthe

.

Edited March 14, 2013 by Abramelin

[Knul]

Edited March 14, 2013 by Knul

[Ott]

OK, better someone from The Judes Land ("Thjudisland") posting that than someone from another country.

Why, is there anything controversial about my post?

[Abramelin]

That's Frisian territory in the early Middle Ages.

But we - you and me - should also take notice of Frisian legends and reports about Frisian colonies, the ones used by those who created the OLB.

And then we get Frisian colonies in Mainz and Switzerland, and even the Friesische Haft (Poland), and all the connections with Britain and Ireland I have posted about.

I have also posted about how much the Frisians influenced trade in medieval Europe, how much they influenced the later Vikings and how much they had an influence during the Crusades. I could go on for hours like this, but I am not willing to refresh your memory again and again and again.

If you want to create a hoax, you'll have to know your sources, and be very creative.

The ones who wrote the OLB were creative, but it is apparent you lack their creativity.

.

Edited March 14, 2013 by Abramelin

[Abramelin]

Why, is there anything controversial about my post?

Not at all, but if *I* quote that, Knul will start yelling again.

And he has no fkg clue where I come from.

I don't want to be banned again because someone doesn't understand what s/he reads.

[Ott]

Not at all, but if *I* quote that, Knul will start yelling again.

OK

Good wordplay btw.

The Judes Land ("Thjudisland")

And for those who don't get it:

THJUDISLAND would have been the OLB word for both Deutschland (Germany) and Dietsland (Netherlands + Flanders or Dutchland).

Edited March 14, 2013 by gestur

[Abramelin]

OK

Good wordplay btw.

And for those who don't get it:

THJUDISLAND would have been the OLB word for both Deutschland (Germany) and Dietsland (Netherlands + Flanders or Dutchland).

No, it's Twiskland in the OLB.

In Scandinavia it's still called Tyskland: http://no.wikipedia.org/wiki/Tyskland

[Knul]

That's Frisian territory in the early Middle Ages.

But we - you and me - should also take notice of Frisian legends and reports about Frisian colonies, the ones used by those who created the OLB.

And then we get Frisian colonies in Mainz and Switzerland, and even the Friesische Haft (Poland), and all the connections with Britain and Ireland I have posted about.

I have also posted about how much the Frisians influenced trade in medieval Europe, how much they influenced the later Vikings and how much they had an influence during the Crusades. I could go on for hours like this, but I am not willing to refresh your memory again and again and again.

If you want to create a hoax, you'll have to know your sources, and be very creative.

The ones who wrote the OLB were creative, but it is apparent you lack their creativity.

.

Apparently you did not understand, that the Frisian grietenijen should be in Frisia, not beyond the red line.

[Abramelin]

I do understand you don't know the next thing about creating a hoax,

[Apol]

Did you see the place Butjadingen on your map, Knul - at the mouth of Weser?

A budingun is said to be a 'thing'.

What about this as the site for the burgh of Bvda?

[Knul]

Did you see the place Butjadingen on your map, Knul - at the mouth of Weser?

A budingun is said to be a 'thing'.

What about this as the site for the burgh of Bvda?

A good way to look at that problem, but if you take the lined area for Astflyland, then the Haga Fenna and Walda should be in the white (Saxon) area above the red line. That area is called Bornego. s. http://nl.wikipedia.org/wiki/Bornego

Apart from the holy wood Baduhenna I did not find anything similar to Buda. Badu-henna = Badu Fenna ? Buda has been identified as Buiten-post, but no one believed that. s.http://nl.wikipedia.org/wiki/Buitenpost .

A possibility, which comes close, is the origin of Bant, Bantega situated in the Kuinder wood. The new Bant is rebuilt in the Noordoostpolder, but got its name from the old Bant, Bantega in Lemsterland, which existed till 1700, when it was overflooded.. Bante-ga indicates a gouw=ga like Alder-ga = Oude Gouw. s. http://www.plaatsengids.nl/bant . Lemsterland is the area around Lemmer and is part of Stellingwerf. The area was Niedersaksisch, divided from Westergo by the Tjonger river as I have indicated earlier. Bant could have been one of the three castles at Kuinder.

Edited March 15, 2013 by Knul

[The Puzzler]

Its name is derived from Low German "buten" (=outside) and "Jade" and thus means the lands on the other side of the Jade river

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Butjadingen

bùta:

b-ðt-a

70, afries., Präp.: nhd. außer, außerhalb, ohne; ne. except (Präp.), but

(Präp.), without (Präp.); Q.: extrõ AB (82, 8), sine K 4, L 12 L 2, AB (84, 5);

Vw.: s. a-; Hw.: s. bot-a; vgl. ae. bðtan, as. biðtan, ahd. biðzan, mnl. buten; Q.: F,

E, S, B, H, R, W, AB (82, 8), AB (84, 5), K 4, L 12, L 2; E.: s. bi-, ðt-a; W.:

nfries. buwtte; W.: saterl. buta; L.: Hh 13b, Rh 676a

[Apol]

A good way to look at that problem, but if you take the lined area for Astflyland, then the Haga Fenna and Walda should be in the white (Saxon) area above the red line. That area is called Bornego. s. http://nl.wikipedia.org/wiki/Bornego

Apart from the holy wood Baduhenna I did not find anything similar to Buda. Badu-henna = Badu Fenna ? Buda has been identified as Buiten-post, but no one believed that. s.http://nl.wikipedia.org/wiki/Buitenpost .

A possibility, which comes close, is the origin of Bant, Bantega situated in the Kuinder wood. The new Bant is rebuilt in the Noordoostpolder, but got its name from the old Bant, Bantega in Lemsterland, which existed till 1700, when it was overflooded.. Bante-ga indicates a gouw=ga like Alder-ga = Oude Gouw. s. http://www.plaatsengids.nl/bant . Lemsterland is the area around Lemmer and is part of Stellingwerf. The area was Niedersaksisch, divided from Westergo by the Tjonger river as I have indicated earlier. Bant could have been one of the three castles at Kuinder.

I don't understand your red line logic.

Isn't Bant quite remote from Bvda linguistically? And where should the burgh of Lindahêm have been situated if Bvda was in Kuinre, or in that area?

I regard the Baduhennawood as not being a real name, but a name put to the wood by the Romans because they didnt know any name for it. They saw a depiction of the goddess Baduhenna there, and just called it "the Baduhennawood".

[The Puzzler]

In the OLB Buda the town is written as Bvda and Buda/Jessos is written as Bûda.

I'm wondering if these words are different and therefore might have different meanings - Bvda might not be purse just because Bûda means it. bûda is budel, purse, but maybe Bvda is not the same.

Maybe Bvda IS bûta (like Butjadingen - out) based, rather than purse based....

I have not checked the original text though, that was from the transliteration.

Edited March 15, 2013 by The Puzzler

[Ott]

No, it's Twiskland in the OLB.

In Scandinavia it's still called Tyskland

I know that Germany is called Tyskland in Scandinavia.

Otharus pointed that out in august 2011.

fryskednis.blogspot.com/twiskland-deutschland

In Finnish it is called Saksa, in English, Italian, Greek and Russia varieties of Germania, in French and Iberian varieties of Allemania.

But in German and Dutch it is Deutschland/ Duitsland, which is derived from THJUD = folk, people AND duiden/ deuten (explain, interpret).

See (mostly in Dutch): fryskednis.blogspot.com/neder-holland

OLB fragmenten

[002/20] Adela's Rede

THÉR HÉRDON HJA MITH LUSTUM NÉI THA VRDWÁLSKA FINNA SÁGUM.

THRVCHDAM HJA THJVD ÀND NÉI WÉRON.

SÁ SEND HJA VNT.FRYAST VNTHONKES THENE WALD HJARAR ALDRUM

[O+S p.7]

Daar hoorden zij met welgevallen [:lusten] naar de losbandige [:overdwaalse] sagen der Finnen,

omdat die slecht [? duidelijk, verklarend] en nieuw waren.

Zoo zijn zij ontfriesd ondanks de macht hunner ouders.

{N.B. indien THJVD hier slecht betekent - zoals in Nyfrysk -, hoort middelste regel bij laatste, niet bij eerste regel!}

There they learned with pleasure the loose ways of the Finns,

because they were bad [illustrative, explainable?] and new;

and thus they became denationalised in spite of the efforts of their parents.

{note: if THJVD has a negative meaning, like in newfrisian, the 2nd line belongs to the third}

[013/18] Tex Frya's

THÀN SKILUN J HJA HJRA DVMHÉD BITJVTHA

[O+S p.23]

dan zult gij haar hare dwaasheid beduiden

explain to her her folly

[039/20] Minno's Skrifta

THA FORSTA ÀND PRESTERA KÉMON BÁRJA THAT WI HJARA TJVTH OVER HÉRICH MAKAD HÉDE

ÀND THÀT FOLK KÉM TO VS VMBE HUL ÀND SKUL

[O+S p.57]

De vorsten en priesteren kwamen en gaven voor dat wij hunne onderdanen oproerig gemaakt hadden,

en het volk kwam tot ons om heul en schut te vragen.

The priests and the princes declared that we had excited their subjects to rebellion,

and the people appealed to us for aid and protection.

[097/10] Burchfám's Love

THA FÉRHÉMANDA HÉRA KÉMON HJARA THJUD ASKJA

[O+S p.135]

De uitheemsche heeren kwamen hunne lieden opeischen;

The foreign lords came to look after their people,

[101/27] Andere deel Formleer

THISSA SÉKA MOTON KLÁR ÀND BÁR MÁKAD WRDA BY ALLE WISA.

SÁ HÀT HJAT ANOTHERA BITHJUTA ÀND BIWISA MÜGE

[O+S p.141]

Deze zaken moeten klaar en openbaar gemaakt worden op alle wijzen,

zoodat zij het aan anderen mogen beduiden en bewijzen.

These things must be made clear and manifest in every way,

so that they can be made clear and comprehensible to all.

[104/32] Taal en antwoord

BIFVNDEN HÀVANDE HO SÉR THET DVATH VMB.ALLÉNA TO TOBBANDE

ALSA BITHJUDE HIU HIRA BERN HO AND HWÉRVMBE HJU ALSA HÉDE DÉN

[O+S p.145]

Bevonden hebbende hoe zeer het doet, om alleen te tobben,

zoo beduidde zij hare kinderen, hoe en waarom zij zoo gedaan had.

Having found how hard it is to toil alone,

she showed her children how and why she had done it.

[113/12] Apollánja's Fárt

WI NE SKILUN NÉN BIHOF LONGER NAVT NÀVE AN THÀT WLA THJUD

[O+S p.155]

wij zullen geen behoefte langer hebben aan dat vuile volk.

we shall have no occasion to deal with those nasty people.

BTW, we don't know if OLB's TWISKLAND exactly overlaps the nowaday (or 19th century) 'Tyskland'.

It will partly have been around there, but it may have stretched further eastwards.

.

Our demonstratives are derived from THJUD.

THJUS AGATH WRALDA.S GAST

Deze komt Wralda's geest toe.

That is for Wralda’s ghost only.

(Tex fryas, OLB page 12)

this, that --- english

deze, dit, die, dat --- dutch

dies, das --- german

=>> duidwoorden, Deutwörter (demonstratives)

Edited March 15, 2013 by gestur