Mr.United_Nations Posted July 8, 2012 #126 Share Posted July 8, 2012 So what did they "really see" there in 1608? By its very nature, that question is impossible to answer since we will never know. Nobody was there taking pictures of it. All we can say is that they saw what they perceived to be evil omens, visions and apparitions in the sea and sky, which terrified them and caused them to repent of their sins. We can never know what they actually saw, but only try to understand it in terms of their culture, religion and mental world, which is a very different world from ours. In that sense, we are not likely to have any UFO sightings before the 18th and 19th Centuries, at least not as we would understand that term. There was a few reports before that, during the years of Alexander the great Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
quillius Posted July 9, 2012 #127 Share Posted July 9, 2012 There was a few reports before that, during the years of Alexander the great Hello Nixon, do you have any links to learn more about these claimed sightings? thanks Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Mr.United_Nations Posted July 9, 2012 #128 Share Posted July 9, 2012 Here the oldest starts from the top http://www.ufoevidence.org/Cases/CaseView.asp?section=sortoldest Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
TheMacGuffin Posted July 9, 2012 #129 Share Posted July 9, 2012 Here the oldest starts from the top http://www.ufoeviden...tion=sortoldest I had heard of Edmund Halley's UFO sightings, some very unusual and intriguing reports from one of those rare people with real scientific knowledge in the 17th Century. "Edmund Halley, the astronomer who discovered Halley's comet, could recall two accounts involving unidentified crafts. His first experience was in March of 1676, when he saw a, as he said, "Vast body apparently bigger than the moon." He estimated it at 40 mi. above him. He also stated that it made a noise, "Like the rattling of a great cart over stones." After estimating the distance it traveled in a matter of minutes, he came to the conclusion that it moved at a speed greater than 9,600 m.p.h. " http://www.ufoevidence.org/cases/case492.htm Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Hazzard Posted July 10, 2012 Author #130 Share Posted July 10, 2012 (edited) Many believe that the god or gods of tradition were actually alien visitors advance the idea that the "star" could have been a UFO - a spaceship - that led the Magi to Bethlehem. As ludicrous as this idea is, it's the only one that explains how the object could have suddenly appeared, moved, and stopped for the apparent purpose of pinpointing Jesus' birthplace. http://paranormal.ab.../aa120703_2.htm Swampgas,... Or maybe it really was Venus this time. A Planetary Conjunction. http://paranormal.ab.../aa120703_3.htm Edited July 10, 2012 by Hazzard Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
quillius Posted July 10, 2012 #131 Share Posted July 10, 2012 Here the oldest starts from the top http://www.ufoeviden...tion=sortoldest thank you for that Swampgas,... Or maybe it really was Venus this time. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
bee Posted July 10, 2012 #132 Share Posted July 10, 2012 Many believe that the god or gods of tradition were actually alien visitors advance the idea that the "star" could have been a UFO - a spaceship - that led the Magi to Bethlehem. As ludicrous as this idea is, it's the only one that explains how the object could have suddenly appeared, moved, and stopped for the apparent purpose of pinpointing Jesus' birthplace. http://paranormal.ab.../aa120703_2.htm Swampgas,... Or maybe it really was Venus this time. A Planetary Conjunction. http://paranormal.ab.../aa120703_3.htm http://en.wikipedia....therius_Society quote... The Aetherius Society is a UFO religion[2][3][4][5] founded by George King in 1954[6] (or 1955)[7], combining UFO claims, yoga, and ideas from various world religions[6][7], notably Buddhism, Christianity, and Theosophy.[8] The religion's stated goal is to prevent the annihilation of the Earth by improving cooperation between humanity and various alien species,[6] and by improving the spiritual lives of the world.[5] The society has claimed that various disasters may be prevented by prayer, often aided by "Spiritual Energy Batteries" meant to store healing psychic energy[5] The society also believes that it is to make the way for the "Next Master," a messianic figure who will descend upon Earth in a flying saucer, possessing magic more powerful than all the world's armies.[9] The society is named after Aetherius, a being King claims to have telepathically contacted and channeled. Aetherius is believed to a "Cosmic Master" from Venus, along with Buddha and Jesus.[ . Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Hazzard Posted July 10, 2012 Author #133 Share Posted July 10, 2012 Religion and UFOlogy,... Two beliefs that has VERY little to do with science. A mix of the two, is as close to hogwash we can possibly get. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
TheMacGuffin Posted July 10, 2012 #134 Share Posted July 10, 2012 Swampgas,... Or maybe it really was Venus this time. A Planetary Conjunction. http://paranormal.ab.../aa120703_3.htm Since we don't know where Jesus was really born or in what year, it's really a mute point. There are some people, usually religious believers, who swear that they know exactly when and where he was born and the exact hour that he died, but I have grave doubts about that. I suspect that he was born and grew up in Nazareth, for example, and that the story of Bethlehem was added later to make him seem more like the Messiah. In any event, none of this has much to do with UFOs. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
TheMacGuffin Posted July 10, 2012 #135 Share Posted July 10, 2012 (edited) Religion and UFOlogy,... Two beliefs that has VERY little to do with science. A mix of the two, is as close to hogwash we can possibly get. Perhaps for people like George Adamski and his followers it is a substitute religion, but not for me and many others. You are painting us all with a very broad brush, but that's not unusual for you. You do the ridicule thing very well, I'll say that much for you, and for some reason frequently emphasize the goofiest side of the UFO field in order to better diminish all of it. Phil Klass is the model here, along with the 1953 Robertson Committee. Edited July 10, 2012 by TheMacGuffin Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
TheMacGuffin Posted July 10, 2012 #136 Share Posted July 10, 2012 I'll repeat what I said previously in several posts, that in a pre-scientific, pre-industrial age, any UFO reports were likely to be interpreted in religious or supernatural terms. That's was how they viewed the entire world and could do nothing else. That's a far cry from saying that UFOs and aliens should be some kind of religion, which is something I've never said in my life. As I pointed out, Edmund Halley is unusual in the 17th Century for actually being able to make a scientific observation of something that would probably later have been called a UFO, and he may have been one of the first to do so. He reported other anomalies and phenomena during his long career, in 1708, 1715, 1716 and 1735 http://www.scribd.com/doc/16805639/A-List-of-UFO-Sightings-by-Astronomers Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Hazzard Posted July 10, 2012 Author #137 Share Posted July 10, 2012 I'll repeat what I said previously in several posts, that in a pre-scientific, pre-industrial age, any UFO reports were likely to be interpreted in religious or supernatural terms. And Ill repeat what I posted in response to that. Maybe they really where/are signs from God, angels or demons (?)... like some people still believe to this day. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Hazzard Posted July 10, 2012 Author #138 Share Posted July 10, 2012 (edited) Perhaps for people like George Adamski and his followers it is a substitute religion, but not for me and many others. You are painting us all with a very broad brush, but that's not unusual for you. You do the ridicule thing very well, I'll say that much for you, and for some reason frequently emphasize the goofiest side of the UFO field in order to better diminish all of it. Phil Klass is the model here, along with the 1953 Robertson Committee. Why you take this so personal I have no idea. But just so you dont get disapointed. Here is The Last Will and Testament of Philip J. Klass,... "To ufologists who publicly criticize me or who even think unkind thoughts about me in private, I do hereby leave and bequeath THE UFO CURSE. No matter how long you live, you will never know any more about UFOs than you know today.... As you lie on your own death-bed you will be as mystified about UFOs as you are today. And you will remember this curse." Edited July 10, 2012 by Hazzard Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
TheMacGuffin Posted July 10, 2012 #139 Share Posted July 10, 2012 "To ufologists who publicly criticize me or who even think unkind thoughts about me in private, I do hereby leave and bequeath THE UFO CURSE. No matter how long you live, you will never know any more about UFOs than you know today.... As you lie on your own death-bed you will be as mystified about UFOs as you are today. And you will remember this curse." No, I won't, Uncle Phil. I was luckier than many others in that respect. 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
TheMacGuffin Posted July 10, 2012 #140 Share Posted July 10, 2012 And Ill repeat what I posted in response to that. Maybe they really where/are signs from God, angels or demons (?)... like some people still believe to this day. Do you believe in God, angels and demons? That's a whole other discussion, of course. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Sweetpumper Posted July 10, 2012 #141 Share Posted July 10, 2012 No, I won't, Uncle Phil. I was luckier than many others in that respect. Too bad so few of us have had experiences. 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
quillius Posted July 10, 2012 #142 Share Posted July 10, 2012 Too bad so few of us have had experiences. you never know who has and who hasnt Sweetpumper........may not be as few as you think 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Sweetpumper Posted July 10, 2012 #143 Share Posted July 10, 2012 you never know who has and who hasnt Sweetpumper........may not be as few as you think Yeah, I'm amazed at what will come up in casual conversation with people I've known for years. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
bee Posted July 10, 2012 #144 Share Posted July 10, 2012 But just so you dont get disapointed. Here is The Last Will and Testament of Philip J. Klass,... "To ufologists who publicly criticize me or who even think unkind thoughts about me in private, I do hereby leave and bequeath THE UFO CURSE. No matter how long you live, you will never know any more about UFOs than you know today.... As you lie on your own death-bed you will be as mystified about UFOs as you are today. And you will remember this curse." did he have delusions of being some kind of wizzard or witch-doctor...? All that's missing is the creepy music and...mmmmwwwwhahahahahahahahahahahahahah . 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
quillius Posted July 10, 2012 #145 Share Posted July 10, 2012 Yeah, I'm amazed at what will come up in casual conversation with people I've known for years. yep, just like the Roswell story you came across when out with friends I feel its one of the best I have read here for some reason....I think it was the casual nature in which it came about Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
quillius Posted July 10, 2012 #146 Share Posted July 10, 2012 did he have delusions of being some kind of wizzard or witch-doctor...? All that's missing is the creepy music and...mmmmwwwwhahahahahahahahahahahahahah . na... he was the only one with keys to that vault Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Sweetpumper Posted July 10, 2012 #147 Share Posted July 10, 2012 yep, just like the Roswell story you came across when out with friends I feel its one of the best I have read here for some reason....I think it was the casual nature in which it came about ' They just bought some land in the San Luis Valley . Said there was some UFO watchtower in the area that I'll check out when we go out there, if I can work up the nerve. There's nothing more unsettling than witnessing something that shouldn't be. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
bee Posted July 10, 2012 #148 Share Posted July 10, 2012 na... he was the only one with keys to that vault lol the curse was a bit over the top....or a weird joke...wonder what a psychologist would make of it...... ps.... psyche is probably in bed now...he'll have to come to Phil's rescue tomorrow.... . 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Hazzard Posted July 10, 2012 Author #149 Share Posted July 10, 2012 (edited) Back on topic, anyone,... http://www.ufocasebo...fopictures.html Edited July 10, 2012 by Hazzard Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
DONTEATUS Posted July 10, 2012 #150 Share Posted July 10, 2012 HAzzard ! what photo do you like the best ? I`ll just tell you mine are the ones that are all locked up ! Cant wait to show everyone ! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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