aztek Posted July 31, 2012 #26 Share Posted July 31, 2012 Again, only in your fantasy world will capital punishment prevent someone from being killed. capital punishment doesn't stop. (was never my point, read posts more carefully) but a well placed bullet in progress will, in my real world at leats. 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
aztek Posted July 31, 2012 #27 Share Posted July 31, 2012 That you can defend against a rapist with a gun? i know it is hard to belive, but yes a gun in a female hands will stop rapist. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
aztek Posted July 31, 2012 #28 Share Posted July 31, 2012 as they said in an old movie, there is nothing wrong with shootings as long as right ppl get shot 2 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
msmike1 Posted July 31, 2012 #29 Share Posted July 31, 2012 The most ridiculous aspect of any crime where a gun is used is to blame the gun. It is an inanimate object. It doesn't have a brain, it can't move by itself, nor can it pull its own trigger. To immediately blame an inanimate object for a crime is in itself not very smart. I don't have the actual figures but it is somewhere around 270 million guns in teh U.S. and approximately 10 or 11 thousand gun related homicides in the U.S. That is not very many in relation to the amount of "evil" guns out there. I own many, many firearms of different shapes, sizes, and calibers. I am a law abiding citizen and hope I never have to use any weapon to kill another human being. This puts me in the majority of gun owners. So, because our legal system sucks, I have to be punished for the acts of a few bat chit crazy people out there? I don't think so. If guns kill people then pencils write on their own, spoons should be outlawed for making people fat, and every person that drives a car should be punished for the few drunks that go out and kill someone in a wreck. Mike 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Almighty Krogan Posted July 31, 2012 #30 Share Posted July 31, 2012 If guns don't kill people, people do Then do toasters not toast toast, toast toasts toast. 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ZaraKitty Posted July 31, 2012 #31 Share Posted July 31, 2012 How I see it. Everyone who owns a gun is a potential criminal. But also in saying that I think if everyone had a gun in plain site (as they do in texas, to my knowledge) crime would be a lot lower because shooting is a huge sport down there, nearly everyone can kill you in a heartbeat if they see you aim your gun at someone. So it's either no guns with very low crime rate or heaps of guns everywhere and a high suicide and accident rate. 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
+OverSword Posted July 31, 2012 #32 Share Posted July 31, 2012 How I see it. Everyone who owns a gun is a potential criminal. But also in saying that I think if everyone had a gun in plain site (as they do in texas, to my knowledge) crime would be a lot lower because shooting is a huge sport down there, nearly everyone can kill you in a heartbeat if they see you aim your gun at someone. So it's either no guns with very low crime rate or heaps of guns everywhere and a high suicide and accident rate. Zarra, you crack me up. You really have a whacky view of what it's like in the USA (too many movies possibly) I was raised in a home that had fire arms. My father had at least one rifle at any given time. That rifle was stashed in a the attic until he took it down to do a little target shooting miles and miles outside of any populated area. That was when I was a kid. I'm now in my mid 40's and my fathers gun hobby has expanded greatly. I don't own any guns but I would guess my father has more than 30 guns. They are kept in a huge metal safe bolted to the floor. Nobody could break into it without TNT. They are not loaded and the ammunition is kept elsewhere. I don't know anyone that carries a gun on them casually like a friggin cowboy, despite the fact that I know people who do have licenses to do so. I work with an Australian girl who was just as freaked out by the thought that there may be a gun nearby as you seem to be. However some coworkers talked her into going out target shooting with a few of us one weekend and now she loves it. If you can imagine that the skill of shooting a bow and arrow at a target is fun just multiply that fun by about 10 and you can picture that shooting a gun is a blast (pun intended). But even in Texas you would be hard put to locate someone carrying a gun on thier hip. 3 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
jugoso Posted July 31, 2012 Author #33 Share Posted July 31, 2012 If guns don't kill people, people do Then do toasters not toast toast, toast toasts toast. Actually....toasters toast bread 2 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Bavarian Raven Posted July 31, 2012 #34 Share Posted July 31, 2012 it's funny in these arguments, people never mention that tens of thousands of women alone every year are able to prevent themselves from being raped/murdered/robed/etc by simply either having a gun on their person, or owning a gun, or (sadly) having to use one. (not to mention other demographics). sure, innocent people are dying because of firearms. but if we outlaw them, even more innocent people will be hurt/killed. 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
FLOMBIE Posted July 31, 2012 #35 Share Posted July 31, 2012 You don't need a gun to protect yourself. Guns are distance weapons and not very efficient in close range. They are also heavy, need to be taken care of regularly, and need time to be made ready to fire. While they are able to be used as a defensive weapon in certain situations, they are actually designed as assault weapons. It is actually much easier and safer for everyone to use pepper spray or stun guns. They do their job very well. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Gunn Posted July 31, 2012 #36 Share Posted July 31, 2012 (edited) I don't see how anybody, especially Michael Moore (although I'm sure he's got everyone's best interest at heart), is going to convince most of the population in the U.S.A. to give up their gun ownership rights. I said this in another thread, so I'll say it in this thread; Anti-gun proponents have got over 230 years of U.S. history and culture, which a lot of it concerns guns, in this country to convince otherwise. You've got that far back of gun ownership, which is ingrained in just about every American since his or her birth to start with; even if there is a minority who don't like or own guns. One major culture aspect with guns is hunting, especially in the south, those hunters are not ever going to give up their guns. They'll die with those guns in their hands, before anyone trys to take their guns away from them. That includes future generations of hunters, so don't think you'll convince their great grandchildren to give up their guns either. Because they believe and are taught that it's their livelyhood to fall back on in hard times. So I don't care what anti-gun proponents say or do, their not going to convince hunters otherwise of that mentality. Then there is the other major aspect with guns, that sticks in the minds of most Americans, which is the possibility of oppresion from a future Government once the guns are taking away and not being able to fight back on equal terms. That's a hard, hard thought or fear to try and convince most Americans otherwise, because a number of reasons looking back on our American History tells us to be cautious when giving up our rights to gun ownership. Most of us would rather not take chances in case some unseen poltical reason comes along at some point and puts a damn dictator in pernament power instead of our historical Presidency, after the guns are taken away. Yeah, Americans are going to give up their guns when that possibilty looms and crosses a few minds of government politicians who want to change our whole political system and put them in pernament power. Most of the U.S. citizens are gonna say, "screw that, pal...I like my freedom!" Anyway, what it boils down to is anti-gun proponents have got their work of convincing most Americans of not having guns cut out for them, that's going to be a crap load as well as many, many, many years of convincing to do. So it will probably take them another 230 years and then some to turn around gun ownership into non-gun ownership in the United States. It's more of a daydream than a possible reality sometime in the future, because little with gun control has changed in the past so far. Good luck, because I personally think anti-gun proponents are wasting their time. Edit: (spelling) Edited August 1, 2012 by Purifier Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
lightly Posted July 31, 2012 #37 Share Posted July 31, 2012 Actually....toasters toast bread * .. and although no one was ever killed by a piece of toast , hardly anyone has ever been killed by a gun either. The cause of death is nearly always the BULLET. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Bavarian Raven Posted August 1, 2012 #38 Share Posted August 1, 2012 (edited) You don't need a gun to protect yourself. Guns are distance weapons and not very efficient in close range true, very true, and they require a decent amount of training, but, pepper spray doesn't have the same "fear factor" in detering a criminal/rapists, etc, etc Edited August 1, 2012 by Bavarian Raven Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ChewiesArmy Posted August 1, 2012 #39 Share Posted August 1, 2012 An eye for an eye makes us both one-eyed, not blind. And if it did make us blind...that's even better. Ever see two blind people duel? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
aztek Posted August 1, 2012 #40 Share Posted August 1, 2012 You don't need a gun to protect yourself. Guns are distance weapons and not very efficient in close range. They are also heavy, need to be taken care of regularly, and need time to be made ready to fire. While they are able to be used as a defensive weapon in certain situations, they are actually designed as assault weapons. It is actually much easier and safer for everyone to use pepper spray or stun guns. They do their job very well. wow, but no. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
F3SS Posted August 1, 2012 #41 Share Posted August 1, 2012 * .. and although no one was ever killed by a piece of toast , hardly anyone has ever been killed by a gun either. The cause of death is nearly always the BULLET. I would gaurantee and place a hefty bet that someone somewhere has chocked to death on a piece of toast. Likely more than one occurrence. It's time to have a long overdue conversation in this country about chared breads. That means bagels and English muffins too people. Theres no room fr exceptions here. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Junior Chubb Posted August 1, 2012 #42 Share Posted August 1, 2012 Actually....toasters toast bread Some Toasters toast people... Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
jugoso Posted August 1, 2012 Author #43 Share Posted August 1, 2012 Some Toasters toast people... Some people get toasted 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Michelle Posted August 1, 2012 #44 Share Posted August 1, 2012 You don't need a gun to protect yourself. Guns are distance weapons and not very efficient in close range. They are also heavy, need to be taken care of regularly, and need time to be made ready to fire. While they are able to be used as a defensive weapon in certain situations, they are actually designed as assault weapons. It is actually much easier and safer for everyone to use pepper spray or stun guns. They do their job very well. Huh? You aren't familiar with firearms at all are you? From my personal experience, I don't want to have to get close enough to a someone, that intends to do me bodily harm, to use pepper spray or a stun gun. You may as well be telling me a knife is sufficient in response to a man that has fifty pounds on me. I don't care what is "easier or safer" for the assailant when my life is in danger. One of us is going down and I am going to do my best to make sure it isn't me. 3 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
aztek Posted August 1, 2012 #45 Share Posted August 1, 2012 lol, no he isn't familiar, every statement about firearms is dead wrong, that is clear, he is clueless about the subject. but what is wrong the most is first and last sentances. You don't need a gun to protect yourself. - no, it is you that don't need the gun, if you so decide, but weather i need it or not isn't your call. (not to mention, the reason is total nonsense) no, the pepper spray and stun guns aren't safer or easier. that is what someone that clueless about it, would say. spray also gets you as well, and every time you use it you have to make sure the wind ins't blowing your way, even few drops in your face, will make you even easier target, that is how it is in real world. again it is a clear sign, the author is clueless. stun guns kill too, you never know whose heart wont take it, it happened too many times. cops are a lot more trigger happy when they know they wont kill you (most likely), and tend to stun you, for almost no reason, it also happened multiple times. for no reason, it is all on the net. again author is clueless. 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Zirna Posted August 1, 2012 #46 Share Posted August 1, 2012 it's funny in these arguments, people never mention that tens of thousands of women alone every year are able to prevent themselves from being raped/murdered/robed/etc by simply either having a gun on their person, or owning a gun, or (sadly) having to use one. (not to mention other demographics). sure, innocent people are dying because of firearms. but if we outlaw them, even more innocent people will be hurt/killed. I own a gun myself as do most of the people I know, whether they are used for hunting or personal protection. For many its not about shooting or killing its about feeling safe because you know that you have some form of protection in case you need it. Besides guns arent the only weapons that have been used to kill people. 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
RavenHawk Posted August 1, 2012 #47 Share Posted August 1, 2012 If guns don't kill people, people do Then do toasters not toast toast, toast toasts toast. Toasters don't toast. It still takes a human to load in the bread and then engage the mechanism. Without intent, the toaster just lays there. 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
RavenHawk Posted August 1, 2012 #48 Share Posted August 1, 2012 How I see it. Then you need to get better glasses. Everyone who owns a gun is a potential criminal. Everyone who doesn't own a gun is a potential criminal. Including you! But also in saying that I think if everyone had a gun in plain site (as they do in texas, to my knowledge) You need to work on your knowledge. crime would be a lot lower because shooting is a huge sport down there, Sport and crime are mutually exclusive. nearly everyone can kill you in a heartbeat if they see you aim your gun at someone. Well, if you are going to be irresponsible then what would you expect?? So it's either no guns with very low crime rate or heaps of guns everywhere and a high suicide and accident rate. No guns would not lower the crime rate. Why do you think that? People will and do commit crime without guns. Do you think if someone wants to kill themselves and they don't have a gun that they aren't going to attempt to take their life? People have been killing ever since Cain. Why do you think it will change today? If you think more people are getting killed today, it's because there are more people. That's it. 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Paracelse Posted August 1, 2012 #49 Share Posted August 1, 2012 People don't just murder each other on their own. Somebody else made that happen. Not always! Name calling will not be tolerated. Learn to disagree with others with using insults. You mean without ??? :whistle: OK so while most of you know I live in France after living most of my adult life in the US. When I came to France, I had to leave my toys in the US, gave them to the Boy to keep, my vintage Winchester 22 long, my SKS, my 38 special, my Ruger 44. I was told in France there are very tougher gun laws and there were litteraly no crime! The first year, I was there I did find of several murders not implicating guns: one mother froze 6 babies she didn't want, (there was a similar case few years before) so does that mean we have to have a freezer permit now?? On separate occasions, two girls killed a friend of their, one for cheating with their own boyfriend, one for having bought the same clothes pounding them with their phone on the head then on sidewalks. Do we have to have a permit for phones and sidewalks? A boy who was bullied in school faced his nemesis with a hammer (and some brain matter in the school corridor). Beware carpenters some people will take away your right to bear a hammer! On a freeway, a group of angered motorists forced a vacationer on the side of the road and kill him using tire wrenches (OK their excuse was he didn't like gypsies roma).... So I demand that each driver's licence comes with a permit for tire irons. Last March; an insane al quada wannabee killed 3 French paratroopers, 3 Jewish kids and a rabbi in front of their school using a mod"el 1911 45 caliber and an Uzzi. Those guns are illegal in France In June, 4 people were killed and 6 wounded with a AK47 in Lilles In July one person was killed and three wounded in Amiens also by means of AK47; What I'm just trying to say was I owned guns, freezers, phones and hammers, I walked on sidewalks and never killed anyone! Does that ascertains that causes are more important than means? Just my two cents to pounder on! 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Thanato Posted August 1, 2012 #50 Share Posted August 1, 2012 Guns are tools to be used for a purpose. That purpose can be as simple as gathering food or as complex as fighting war. The fact is a gun is a gun. It can't kill anyone or do any harm by its self. It needs a user to do the job. The User picks which job that tool will be used for. I can kill someone just as effectivly with a baseball bat, as I can a gun. Just a gun is cleaner, and more effeciant. The gun does not have to be used as a weapon of death, it can be used to keep the peace. A firearm can act as a deturant against crime and war. It can also be used as a sport or recreational device. The fact of the matter is, it is not the firearm that is the problem it is the person operating the firearm. ~Thanato Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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