The Only Way to Escape Hell

[libstaK]

Psalm 111:10

The fear of the LORD is the beginning of wisdom.

Only God Lozaleibou - only God and no other would I consider fearing and even then it is not that my actions should cause me to fear him but rather that the great unknown entity that he is comprised of should give any tiny creature such as a mere human pause and cause for reflection.

[Arbitran]

2 Corinthians 6:14-17

Do not be unequally yoked together with unbelievers. For what fellowship has righteousness with lawlessness? And what communion has light with darkness? And what accord has Christ with Belial? Or what part has a believer with an unbeliever? And what agreement has the temple of God with idols? For you are the temple of the living God. As God has said:

“I will dwell in them

And walk among them.

I will be their God,

And they shall be My people.”

Therefore

“Come out from among them

And be separate, says the Lord.

So other false gods cannot "coexist" with the One True God! So let me ask you again: What god are you are believer in, because it certainly is not the God of the Bible?

What is your substantiation for claiming the biblical storm god as the "One True God"? I could just as easily claim that Thor or Apollo is the "One True God"...

[lozaleibou]

Only God Lozaleibou - only God and no other would I consider fearing and even then it is not that my actions should cause me to fear him but rather that the great unknown entity that he is comprised of should give any tiny creature such as a mere human pause and cause for reflection.

So you are saying that you don't fear being wrong in the sight of God? This is why He gave us the Bible, His Word, so we can know what He thinks, and what He wants .us to be agreeing with and disagreeing with.

[libstaK]

2 Corinthians 6:14-17

Do not be unequally yoked together with unbelievers. For what fellowship has righteousness with lawlessness? And what communion has light with darkness? And what accord has Christ with Belial? Or what part has a believer with an unbeliever? And what agreement has the temple of God with idols? For you are the temple of the living God. As God has said:

“I will dwell in them

And walk among them.

I will be their God,

And they shall be My people.”

Therefore

“Come out from among them

And be separate, says the Lord.

So other false gods cannot "coexist" with the One True God! So let me ask you again: What god are you are believer in, because it certainly is not the God of the Bible?

I never mentioned any "other false Gods" I stated clearly there is only one. The Gods man makes in his own image are the false Gods, I make no God in my own image. As for Paul and his teachings make of it what you will but I disregard them. I regard what Jesus had to say and what he did and I see none of Jesus in these teachings. The best is to love and "love one another" is above all other laws - do you deny this?

[lozaleibou]

Only God Lozaleibou - only God and no other would I consider fearing and even then it is not that my actions should cause me to fear him but rather that the great unknown entity that he is comprised of should give any tiny creature such as a mere human pause and cause for reflection.

Let me ask you libstaK, do you really want to "coexist" with a religion that worships the moon, and says that its perfectly lawful to kill anyone who disagrees with them? That its ok to murder any person of a different race or color? That its ok to rape and kill another man's wife, as long as they are not a believer in their religion? Or that its ok to rape children? How could you possibly support something like that?

Edited September 9, 2012 by lozaleibou

[lozaleibou]

I never mentioned any "other false Gods" I stated clearly there is only one. The Gods man makes in his own image are the false Gods, I make no God in my own image. As for Paul and his teachings make of it what you will but I disregard them. I regard what Jesus had to say and what he did and I see none of Jesus in these teachings. The best is to love and "love one another" is above all other laws - do you deny this?

We are not suppose to judge whether anyone goes to heaven or hell, but we are told to judge other believers by their fruit. If you do not accept the WHOLE word of God, then you accept none of it! There will be those who Jesus will leave behind, and when they say, "Didnt we preach and do works in your name?" He will say, "I never knew you! Away from me you evildoers!"

I don't know about you, but I don't want to be one of those that He says, "I never knew you," to. Do you????

[libstaK]

So you are saying that you don't fear being wrong in the sight of God? This is why He gave us the Bible, His Word, so we can know what He thinks, and what He wants .us to be agreeing with and disagreeing with.

He gave us free will and the capacity to seek the truth.

Our free will - each and EVERY man's free will is an absolute sacred right.

The machinations of Nicea have given me cause to question the lucidity of many parts of the Bible and their purpose - Corinthians and Acts have failed to earn my respect amongst others, the Gospels and Jesus' own path I am inspired by. I don't see much of the path that Jesus taught in Paul what I see is the decay of time that brings rules and regulations born of the will of man to tell others what to do - a complete subjugation of our right to FREE will.

The path of Christ was to live as a true Son of God, he taught to forgive, he taught to love and he taught to turn the other cheek. Through this he showed us the power of that path. He sacrificing his very life rather than bow to or even condemn those that nailed him - some of his last words on that cross were "Father, forgive them for they know not what they do" . He told us not to judge, to remove the log from our own eye first. And then ... Corinthians comes along after he is long gone, seriously?

Why would I, not worthy to be a piece of dirt at the end of his toe (if I should be so lucky) think higher of myself than any other human being on this earth and imagine myself saved while others condemned? - I am one of those who he pleaded for, I cannot claim to believe sincerely but then think myself greater than what God has put before me aka: everyone else, his creation in all it's diversified glory in fact.

[libstaK]

Let me ask you libstaK, do you really want to "coexist" with a religion that worships the moon, and says that its perfectly lawful to kill anyone who disagrees with them? That its ok to murder any person of a different race or color? That its ok to rape and kill another man's wife, as long as they are not a believer in their religion? Or that its ok to rape children? How could you possibly support something like that?

I don't know anyone like that. I know alot of muslims, some pagans and atheists and I know no one like that. I hear about them in the news though and I am sorry they are in such suffering and despair that they can imagine harming another would ever bring them closer to God. It's truly horrible how lost man can become in their own ego and pursuit of their lusts, the idolisation of pride above humility and anger and hatred above love and tolerance. I feel sorrow for such things, like most people.

[libstaK]

We are not suppose to judge whether anyone goes to heaven or hell, but we are told to judge other believers by their fruit. If you do not accept the WHOLE word of God, then you accept none of it! There will be those who Jesus will leave behind, and when they say, "Didnt we preach and do works in your name?" He will say, "I never knew you! Away from me you evildoers!"

I don't know about you, but I don't want to be one of those that He says, "I never knew you," to. Do you????

I don't want to be the one who claims to know who he will know when the times, I'm just gonna do the best I can with what I know, when i know better I will do better - no parent can ask more of their child and no parent wants their child bullying others or getting into playground fights because of pride and believing they are right - we should play nice in the sandpit, it's just good manners.

[lozaleibou]

I don't want to be the one who claims to know who he will know when the times, I'm just gonna do the best I can with what I know, when i know better I will do better - no parent can ask more of their child and no parent wants their child bullying others or getting into playground fights because of pride and believing they are right - we should play nice in the sandpit, it's just good manners.

The person with the best manners is still going to suffer an everlasting judgment of torment, if they do not know Jesus. It seems that the only verse of the Bible that seems to be quoted rampantly when true Scripture comes around is the "judging" verse. Let me show you something LibstaK.

Ezekiel 33:1-7

Again the word of the Lord came to me, saying, “Son of man, speak to the children of your people, and say to them: ‘When I bring the sword upon a land, and the people of the land take a man from their territory and make him their watchman, when he sees the sword coming upon the land, if he blows the trumpet and warns the people, then whoever hears the sound of the trumpet and does not take warning, if the sword comes and takes him away, his blood shall be on his own head. He heard the sound of the trumpet, but did not take warning; his blood shall be upon himself. But he who takes warning will save his life. But if the watchman sees the sword coming and does not blow the trumpet, and the people are not warned, and the sword comes and takes any person from among them, he is taken away in his iniquity; but his blood I will require at the watchman’s hand.’

So, if a believer is not warning others, then their blood in on HIS hands! I am warning everyone who will listen, that time is short. Jesus Christ is going to return, and if you have not accepted His free gift of salvation, and believe that He is the way, the truth and the life, and that no man comes to the Father but thru Him, then there is only one other alternative!

You cannot pick and choose certain parts when it comes to God's Word! The Bible says:

If anyone adds to these things, God will add to him the plagues that are written in this book; and if anyone takes away from the words of the book of this prophecy, God shall take away his part from the Book of Life.

If you put your faith in Jesus Christ, then you would know that there can be no other! No "coesisting" no other gods, no idols! Just Jesus!

[lozaleibou]

I don't know anyone like that. I know alot of muslims, some pagans and atheists and I know no one like that. I hear about them in the news though and I am sorry they are in such suffering and despair that they can imagine harming another would ever bring them closer to God. It's truly horrible how lost man can become in their own ego and pursuit of their lusts, the idolisation of pride above humility and anger and hatred above love and tolerance. I feel sorrow for such things, like most people.

Then you should research what it is that they truly believe, and maybe read the book that they follow.

[lozaleibou]

He gave us free will and the capacity to seek the truth.

Our free will - each and EVERY man's free will is an absolute sacred right.

The machinations of Nicea have given me cause to question the lucidity of many parts of the Bible and their purpose - Corinthians and Acts have failed to earn my respect amongst others, the Gospels and Jesus' own path I am inspired by. I don't see much of the path that Jesus taught in Paul what I see is the decay of time that brings rules and regulations born of the will of man to tell others what to do - a complete subjugation of our right to FREE will.

The path of Christ was to live as a true Son of God, he taught to forgive, he taught to love and he taught to turn the other cheek. Through this he showed us the power of that path. He sacrificing his very life rather than bow to or even condemn those that nailed him - some of his last words on that cross were "Father, forgive them for they know not what they do" . He told us not to judge, to remove the log from our own eye first. And then ... Corinthians comes along after he is long gone, seriously?

Why would I, not worthy to be a piece of dirt at the end of his toe (if I should be so lucky) think higher of myself than any other human being on this earth and imagine myself saved while others condemned? - I am one of those who he pleaded for, I cannot claim to believe sincerely but then think myself greater than what God has put before me aka: everyone else, his creation in all it's diversified glory in fact.

I never said that we all don't have a right to choose, but like any choice we make, we will suffer the consequences for those choices! Jesus gave His life freely! No one took it from Him! The Bible also says that Jesus is going to return to the earth in a robe dipped in blood, prepared for battle! He will return with His church that will have already been raptured!

[libstaK]

The person with the best manners is still going to suffer an everlasting judgment of torment, if they do not know Jesus. It seems that the only verse of the Bible that seems to be quoted rampantly when true Scripture comes around is the "judging" verse. Let me show you something LibstaK.

Ezekiel 33:1-7

Again the word of the Lord came to me, saying, “Son of man, speak to the children of your people, and say to them: ‘When I bring the sword upon a land, and the people of the land take a man from their territory and make him their watchman, when he sees the sword coming upon the land, if he blows the trumpet and warns the people, then whoever hears the sound of the trumpet and does not take warning, if the sword comes and takes him away, his blood shall be on his own head. He heard the sound of the trumpet, but did not take warning; his blood shall be upon himself. But he who takes warning will save his life. But if the watchman sees the sword coming and does not blow the trumpet, and the people are not warned, and the sword comes and takes any person from among them, he is taken away in his iniquity; but his blood I will require at the watchman’s hand.’

So, if a believer is not warning others, then their blood in on HIS hands! I am warning everyone who will listen, that time is short. Jesus Christ is going to return, and if you have not accepted His free gift of salvation, and believe that He is the way, the truth and the life, and that no man comes to the Father but thru Him, then there is only one other alternative!

You cannot pick and choose certain parts when it comes to God's Word! The Bible says:

If anyone adds to these things, God will add to him the plagues that are written in this book; and if anyone takes away from the words of the book of this prophecy, God shall take away his part from the Book of Life.

If you put your faith in Jesus Christ, then you would know that there can be no other! No "coesisting" no other gods, no idols! Just Jesus!

I'll leave you to your assumptions. You said it yourself - just Jesus, so why bring the old testament into it when the the new testament was about a new covenant? As to "co-existing" with others, I won't apologise for understanding the concepts of cause and effect enough to "do unto others as I would have them do unto me".

[libstaK]

I never said that we all don't have a right to choose, but like any choice we make, we will suffer the consequences for those choices! Jesus gave His life freely! No one took it from Him! The Bible also says that Jesus is going to return to the earth in a robe dipped in blood, prepared for battle! He will return with His church that will have already been raptured!

Oh - the rapture, sorry I have nothing to say to anybody who preaches that.

There are so many churches who claim rights to being the church of this "rapture" - you can't all be right so just forget it, I've heard it all before I don't even want you starting on preaching from the bible about such a thing with me, it is the most "holier than thou" divisive concept I have come across - you think it right to believe that others are condemned to hell? You seal your own fate don't try to make me a part of that.

[lozaleibou]

Oh - the rapture, sorry I have nothing to say to anybody who preaches that.

There are so many churches who claim rights to being the church of this "rapture" - you can't all be right so just forget it, I've heard it all before I don't even want you starting on preaching from the bible about such a thing with me, it is the most "holier than thou" divisive concept I have come across - you think it right to believe that others are condemned to hell? You seal your own fate don't try to make me a part of that.

I won't make you be a part of anything! If you reject the Bible, then you reject God!

John 1:1-5

In the beginning was the Word, and the Word was with God, and the Word was God. He was in the beginning with God. All things were made through Him, and without Him nothing was made that was made. In Him was life, and the life was the light of men. And the light shines in the darkness, and the darkness did not comprehend it.

He is the Word! If you reject His Word, you reject Him!

Its clear that you are not a true Christian believer because you're own words betray you. I will be praying for you though, and for the pseudo-sage, that you both wake up to the truth before its too late!! Jesus loves you and wants to give you His free gift of eternal life. Don't put your trust in your own understanding, but rather in the One who has the power to save both body and soul!

Edited September 9, 2012 by lozaleibou

[libstaK]

I won't make you be a part of anything! If you reject the Bible, then you reject God!

John 1:1-5

In the beginning was the Word, and the Word was with God, and the Word was God. He was in the beginning with God. All things were made through Him, and without Him nothing was made that was made. In Him was life, and the life was the light of men. And the light shines in the darkness, and the darkness did not comprehend it.

He is the Word! If you reject His Word, you reject Him!

Its clear that you are not a true Christian believer because you're own words betray you. I will be praying for you though, and for the pseudo-sage, that you both wake up to the truth before its too late!! Jesus loves you and wants to give you His free gift of eternal life. Don't put your trust in your own understanding, but rather in the One who has the power to save both body and soul!

Thanks for the prayers, nice segue but you dont' get to decide who is a true christian, sorry I know it must wound your pride and I don't mean to. Spouting scripture is easy try living it to the core and see if you are so quick to judge.

[Beckys_Mom]

He is the Word! If you reject His Word, you reject Him!

I just reject the words written about him and I chose to follow him in my own way..it works for me and believe it or not works well for millions like me....Now that I think of it, I think it worked well for those who followed God before there ever was a bible...seriously ...I think it has something to do with being able to think for one self and how we all differ.. crazy init ? lol

Its clear that you are not a true Christian believer because you're own words betray you. I will be praying for you though, and for the pseudo-sage, that you both wake up to the truth before its too late!! Jesus loves you and wants to give you His free gift of eternal life. Don't put your trust in your own understanding, but rather in the One who has the power to save both body and soul!

Oh absolutely... I dunno who libstak thinks she is, going around here with her intelligent mind, her free choice ( showing it off lol ) and using logic...I mean who does that? Who? It,s unnatural that's what it is.. She should sit and narrow her mind down to a point where none of her own understanding is relevant...it does not belong..All this trusting in yourself and your understanding is just nonsense isn't it?

I say well dare she claim to be a true Christian.. I think if you are so perfect and you never sin ( and I mean never ) and if you are just exactly like Jesus, ( you could fill in for him any time as his substitute ) then you can judge people like her and also judge those other pesky Christians who like to think that using their own minds and their true intelligence is right.. I think not.. They should all take a leaf out of your book, listen to your judging and only hope you will be just as condesending to them like you were to libstak and you pray for them too............Yes like you said - before it is too late !!.. ..They are not as perfect and they are certainly no messiah material that's for sure lol .... I agree they are not doing it right.. They all should sit and take notes from you........ So you keep on judging and praying for those lost puppies..

I so kid on all of that lol

Just as in anything, we are free to make the choice to do what is right or what is wrong, but we are not free of the consequences of those choices.

Example ( Imagine me as God who commands all to follow or else ) .........If I have control over you and I can do anything to you...then if i tell you - Follow me or face your doom, then you are not free by a long shot.. you have one choice to stay safe... If not and you dared to chose freely to follow another, you face punishment....Not free...it is limiting you to one choice and only one

Edited September 9, 2012 by Beckys_Mom

[Arbitran]

Let me ask you libstaK, do you really want to "coexist" with a religion that worships the moon, and says that its perfectly lawful to kill anyone who disagrees with them? That its ok to murder any person of a different race or color? That its ok to rape and kill another man's wife, as long as they are not a believer in their religion? Or that its ok to rape children? How could you possibly support something like that?

Interesting, because those sorts of things are entirely consistent with the mitzvot... all except for the moon part.

[Arbitran]

We are not suppose to judge whether anyone goes to heaven or hell, but we are told to judge other believers by their fruit. If you do not accept the WHOLE word of God, then you accept none of it! There will be those who Jesus will leave behind, and when they say, "Didnt we preach and do works in your name?" He will say, "I never knew you! Away from me you evildoers!"

I don't know about you, but I don't want to be one of those that He says, "I never knew you," to. Do you????

Of course a two-thousand-year-old, dead Jewish carpenter from the Middle East doesn't know me! And he doesn't know you either. He hasn't known anyone for a very, very long time.

[Arbitran]

The person with the best manners is still going to suffer an everlasting judgment of torment, if they do not know Jesus. It seems that the only verse of the Bible that seems to be quoted rampantly when true Scripture comes around is the "judging" verse. Let me show you something LibstaK.

Ezekiel 33:1-7

Again the word of the Lord came to me, saying, “Son of man, speak to the children of your people, and say to them: ‘When I bring the sword upon a land, and the people of the land take a man from their territory and make him their watchman, when he sees the sword coming upon the land, if he blows the trumpet and warns the people, then whoever hears the sound of the trumpet and does not take warning, if the sword comes and takes him away, his blood shall be on his own head. He heard the sound of the trumpet, but did not take warning; his blood shall be upon himself. But he who takes warning will save his life. But if the watchman sees the sword coming and does not blow the trumpet, and the people are not warned, and the sword comes and takes any person from among them, he is taken away in his iniquity; but his blood I will require at the watchman’s hand.’

So, if a believer is not warning others, then their blood in on HIS hands! I am warning everyone who will listen, that time is short. Jesus Christ is going to return, and if you have not accepted His free gift of salvation, and believe that He is the way, the truth and the life, and that no man comes to the Father but thru Him, then there is only one other alternative!

You cannot pick and choose certain parts when it comes to God's Word! The Bible says:

If anyone adds to these things, God will add to him the plagues that are written in this book; and if anyone takes away from the words of the book of this prophecy, God shall take away his part from the Book of Life.

If you put your faith in Jesus Christ, then you would know that there can be no other! No "coesisting" no other gods, no idols! Just Jesus!

Why should it be "just Jesus"? What makes him so exceptional?

[Arbitran]

I never said that we all don't have a right to choose, but like any choice we make, we will suffer the consequences for those choices! Jesus gave His life freely! No one took it from Him! The Bible also says that Jesus is going to return to the earth in a robe dipped in blood, prepared for battle! He will return with His church that will have already been raptured!

Well, we all know that isn't going to happen any time soon. Another universe, perhaps?

[Arbitran]

I won't make you be a part of anything! If you reject the Bible, then you reject God!

John 1:1-5

In the beginning was the Word, and the Word was with God, and the Word was God. He was in the beginning with God. All things were made through Him, and without Him nothing was made that was made. In Him was life, and the life was the light of men. And the light shines in the darkness, and the darkness did not comprehend it.

He is the Word! If you reject His Word, you reject Him!

Its clear that you are not a true Christian believer because you're own words betray you. I will be praying for you though, and for the pseudo-sage, that you both wake up to the truth before its too late!! Jesus loves you and wants to give you His free gift of eternal life. Don't put your trust in your own understanding, but rather in the One who has the power to save both body and soul!

Give me a break. Please end all this "I'm praying for you" crap. We all know you really aren't.

[Karlis]

~~~ ... Let me show you something LibstaK.

Ezekiel 33:1-7

Again the word of the Lord came to me, saying, “Son of man, speak to the children of your people, and say to them: ‘When I bring the sword upon a land, and the people of the land take a man from their territory and make him their watchman, when he sees the sword coming upon the land, if he blows the trumpet and warns the people, then whoever hears the sound of the trumpet and does not take warning, if the sword comes and takes him away, his blood shall be on his own head. He heard the sound of the trumpet, but did not take warning; his blood shall be upon himself. But he who takes warning will save his life. But if the watchman sees the sword coming and does not blow the trumpet, and the people are not warned, and the sword comes and takes any person from among them, he is taken away in his iniquity; but his blood I will require at the watchman’s hand.’

So, if a believer is not warning others, then their blood in on HIS hands! I am warning everyone who will listen, that time is short. Jesus Christ is going to return, and if you have not accepted His free gift of salvation, and believe that He is the way, the truth and the life, and that no man comes to the Father but thru Him, then there is only one other alternative!

You cannot pick and choose certain parts when it comes to God's Word! The Bible says:

If anyone adds to these things, God will add to him the plagues that are written in this book; and if anyone takes away from the words of the book of this prophecy, God shall take away his part from the Book of Life.

If you put your faith in Jesus Christ, then you would know that there can be no other! No "coesisting" no other gods, no idols! Just Jesus!

lozaleibou -- when applying any set of Scriptures to all Christians, one has to be certain of the context of such Scriptures.

Eze 33:1 And the Word of Jehovah came to me, saying,

Eze 33:2 Son of man, speak to the sons of your people, and say to them:

Eze 33:7 And you, son of man, I have set you a watchman to the house of Israel. Therefore you shall hear the Word from My mouth, and warn them from Me.

In this particular instance, God had chosen the prophet Ezekiel to warn Israel at that particular time in their history.

Many denominations today apply Ezekiel's commission to Christians, to warn everyone in general -- but that is not what these Scriptures teach.

In these days of history, those who accept Jesus as their Saviour have not been commissioned to Ezekiel's role of "watchman" to non-believers.

[lightly]

It strikes me as odd that God would forgive only upon request.

I think that's sorta how it's done in Christianity ? .. another word for "request" might be prayer? There is advice in Bible verses as to how to make prayer effective.Faith probably being the most important element? .. apparently very helpful too when asking/requesting in Jesus' name (and therefore Authority) ... i guess God cain't hardly say NO when you do that.. it seems he gets confused as to who is really asking

[libstaK]

Oh absolutely... I dunno who libstak thinks she is, going around here with her intelligent mind, her free choice ( showing it off lol ) and using logic...I mean who does that? Who? It,s unnatural that's what it is.. She should sit and narrow her mind down to a point where none of her own understanding is relevant...it does not belong..All this trusting in yourself and your understanding is just nonsense isn't it?

I say well dare she claim to be a true Christian..

lol thanks for the compliment BM - interesting how the Kingdom of Heaven is within us, yet all these dogmas keeping being thrown in our faces to follow blindly what a book or another says.

Example ( Imagine me as God who commands all to follow or else ) .........If I have control over you and I can do anything to you...then if i tell you - Follow me or face your doom, then you are not free by a long shot.. you have one choice to stay safe... If not and you dared to chose freely to follow another, you face punishment....Not free...it is limiting you to one choice and only one

That sounds suspiciously what a charlatan would do to convince others to blindly follow them and never question or reason whether it is wise to do so - believing in this rapture and being "saved" while others burn is someone telling you that you are "special" and "loved" where others are not "loved", it's a fascination that blinds people from ever discerning truth - they don't need to, "they're already saved".

And how many cults of the "saved" have drunk the cool aid so far - literally? Or in another version of the same problem, with different names but the same message, how many have strapped bombs to themselves in search of "paradise" cos someone told them that's where it is?

It just keeps happening and will always happen while people are being told to distrust their own wisdom. "Cos all those thoughts come from the devil, just listen to me, I am the true messenger/apostle/messiah/teacher - I'll lead you, don't trust your own mind it can deceive you".

Well here's my good news - if the Kingdom of Heaven is inside me then looking there would be a pretty good idea don't you think?

Ok now I'm ranting, but I feel better, rant over.