Nick Clegg withdraws 'bigots' email

[Mr Right Wing]

1. First, imigration. The basic reason why imigration isn't put to a vote is actually quite simple: some people want to go too far with it and would vote without actually thinking of the consequences. Would it be enough for some people tostop imigration all together? No it wouldn't, they'd want the ones already here out (which would create holes ininfrastructure that would take awhile to fill) and second that people would want anyone that's not white out, which is a road we must never go down.

2. The EU is a similar problem. People seem to want to be out of it without thinking.

3. I'm patriotic. I love my country and it's people. But, unlike Mr Right Wing and others, I don't add a little note after that saying except x, y,z, I hate those people. People that want same sex marriage, they're British too. They love this country and it's people, but to people like Mr Right Wing and others, that doesn't seem to matter does it?

1. Is this a Democracy?

2. Is this a Democracy?

3. Is this a Democracy?

You have no right to prevent people having their Democracy. You state your case, everyone else does too, then we vote. If the majority vote to deport immigrants, to leave the EU or to ban gay marriage then thats what happens. We dont subvert the Democratic rights of the majority to keep a minorty happy and if we do then we've begun on the slippery slope towards Dictatorship.

[shadowhive]

1. Is this a Democracy?

2. Is this a Democracy?

3. Is this a Democracy?

You have no right to prevent people having their Democracy. You state your case, everyone else does too, then we vote. If the majority vote to deport immigrants, to leave the EU or to ban gay marriage then thats what happens. We dont subvert the Democratic rights of the majority to keep a minorty happy and if we do then we've begun on the slippery slope towards Dictatorship.

A key part of having a democracy is having common sense. We gotten rid of rascist ideas from the legal system quite some time ago and introducing them (even 'democratically') isn't the way to go. Sometimes there are things that we don't get to vote on and for good reason.

We don't subvert the rights of the minority just on the whims of the majority either. There are doens of groups that are minorities but to take away their rights just because there's fewer of them is considered wrong. Again, there is a very good reason for that.

If it was up to Mr Right Wing the only people that would participate in a democracy would be white people that fulfil the long list you listed in the other post which sounds much more like a dictatoriship.

[Mr Right Wing]

A key part of having a democracy is having common sense. We gotten rid of rascist ideas from the legal system quite some time ago and introducing them (even 'democratically') isn't the way to go. Sometimes there are things that we don't get to vote on and for good reason.

We don't subvert the rights of the minority just on the whims of the majority either. There are doens of groups that are minorities but to take away their rights just because there's fewer of them is considered wrong. Again, there is a very good reason for that.

If it was up to Mr Right Wing the only people that would participate in a democracy would be white people that fulfil the long list you listed in the other post which sounds much more like a dictatoriship.

What right do you have to tell others what they can and cant vote on?

In our country we have a socialist workers party (far left) and the BNP (far right). You'll notice our Democracy isnt closed down for them as they are both allowed to compete in elections. That should indicate something to you.

You've lived under a Labour Government too long who spent its days trying to close down our Democracy and playing little games to prevent others getting into power. Whether it be choosing the board at the BBC, trying to push through its version of the Enabling Act after 9/11, trying to push through legislation giving it the right to close other parties websites, or using outside groups such as unions to get around the spending limits during elections, you think its normal and acceptable.

No one, not me, you, or Joe Bloggs has the right to close down our Democracy.

Edited September 20, 2012 by Mr Right Wing

[shadowhive]

What right do you have to tell others what they can and cant vote on?

Some things shouldn't be voted on. What right to you have to try and take away the rights of others just because they're a minority?

In our country we have a socialist workers party (far left) and the BNP (far right). You'll notice our Democracy isnt closed down for them as they are both allowed to compete in elections. That should indicate something to you.

I've never said a thing about democracy 'closing down'. The trouble is far right parties need to have a lot of people on their side to get their radical policies through and that simply won't happen.

You've lived under a Labour Government too long who spent its days trying to close down our Democracy and playing little games to prevent others getting into power. Whether it be choosing the board at the BBC, trying to push through its version of the Enabling Act after 9/11, trying to push through legislation giving it the right to close other parties websites, or using outside groups such as unions to get around the spending limits during elections, you think its normal and acceptable.

No one, not me, you, or Joe Bloggs has the right to close down our Democracy.

I may have lived under a labour government but that doesn't mean i supported the things you claim. For much of the time I was under the government I was too youg to be able to vote of get involved (or understand the processes involved).

By point hasn't been to 'close down' democracy. My point has been that some things shouldn't be voted on because it would be detrimental to society.

Take imigration. You see imigration has bad that they're 'coming over here and taking our jobs' or taking advntage of the system. And yes, some of them are doing just that. the key word there being some. Many of them are hard working and contributing. Many of them are doing jobs that otherwise wouldn't be done.

I see things like that from experience. My grandmother had Alzeimers. In her last years we couldn't take care of her, so she had to go in a nursing home. Many of the staff there were imigrants. Why? Because there simply weren't the 'white British' people that could do or wanted to do the job. Because of those imigrants, those vulnerable people got looked after and taken care of in their last years.

That's the reality that people like you tend to ignore, that there's plenty of situations just like that where imigrants are doing their bit, where they're providing services for people that British people don't want to or can't.

[Mr Right Wing]

1. Some things shouldn't be voted on.

2. What right to you have to try and take away the rights of others just because they're a minority?

3. I've never said a thing about democracy 'closing down'.

4. The trouble is far right parties need to have a lot of people on their side to get their radical policies through and that simply won't happen.

5. I may have lived under a labour government but that doesn't mean i supported the things you claim. For much of the time I was under the government I was too youg to be able to vote of get involved (or understand the processes involved).

6. My point hasn't been to 'close down' democracy. My point has been that some things shouldn't be voted on because it would be detrimental to society.

7. Take imigration. You see imigration as bad and that they're 'coming over here and taking our jobs' or taking advantage of the system.

8. I see things like that from experience. My grandmother had Alzeimers. In her last years we couldn't take care of her, so she had to go in a nursing home. Many of the staff there were imigrants. Why? Because there simply weren't the 'white British' people that could do or wanted to do the job. Because of those imigrants, those vulnerable people got looked after and taken care of in their last years.

9. That's the reality that people like you tend to ignore, that there's plenty of situations just like that where imigrants are doing their bit, where they're providing services for people that British people don't want to or can't.

1. I really am shocked at that comment.

2. Yet you are prepared to limit our Democracy and thus violate the Democratic rights of others.

3. You just did, twice.

4. Yes, so whats your problem? If 80% of people suddenly voted far-left or far-right you have no right to prevent it. The reason is this is a Democracy and its their right to vote for who they want.

5. Glad to see you'll be voting Conservative then.

6. That is closing down Democracy.

7. I oppose immigration because 95% have not fled countries where their lives were threatened but are economic migrants. I have nothing against helping people in geniune need.

8. I have nothing against foreign engineers, doctors, lawyers, scientists, etc. While I would make exceptions for these most immigrants dont belong to the professional class. Why do we want some other nations shelf-stackers, cleaners or production line workers? Their lives werent even under threat.

9. I believe that in my country my people come first. Our priorities are making sure everybody here has a job, that the elderly can live on their pensions, that the homeless are housed, that the young are looked after properly, that we have enough police on the streets, that we can defend ourselves properly. It isnt giving away £10 billion in foreign aid while letting another 150,000 immigrants come here through the EU while we are in the Middle of a Double Dip Recession. The priority is the British people.

[shadowhive]

1. I really am shocked at that comment.

Why? Sexism and rascism have no places in civilised societies. If the laws to give women equal rights, free slaves and make homosexuality legal were voted on we'd liked still have all three.

2. Yet you are prepared to limit our Democracy and thus violate the Democratic rights of others.

Everything has it's limits. The fact that you'd use democracy to steamroller over people's rights shows how much those limits are needed.

3. You just did, twice.

What a funny world you must live in. No. I didn't said democracy must be closed down. What I said was that some things shouldn't be voted on. The system is filled with things that aren't voted on yet no one has problems with that.

4. Yes, so whats your problem? If 80% of people suddenly voted far-left or far-right you have no right to prevent it. The reason is this is a Democracy and its their right to vote for who they want.

The far right won't win by that majority. Thankfully

5. Glad to see you'll be voting Conservative then.

I didn't last time and I won't this time.

6. That is closing down Democracy.

No, it's common sense, something you lack.

7. I oppose immigration because 95% have not fled countries where their lives were threatened but are economic migrants. I have nothing against helping people in geniune need.

Somehow I doubt that.

8. I have nothing against foreign engineers, doctors, lawyers, scientists, etc. While I would make exceptions for these most immigrants dont belong to the professional class. Why do we want some other nations shelf-stackers, cleaners or production line workers? Their lives werent even under threat.

So they should only come if a: you can benefit from their knowledge and skills or b: are under threat.

9. I believe that in my country my people come first. Our priorities are making sure everybody here has a job, that the elderly can live on their pensions, that the homeless are housed, that the young are looked after properly, that we have enough police on the streets, that we can defend ourselves properly. It isnt giving away £10 billion in foreign aid while letting another 150,000 immigrants come here through the EU while we are in the Middle of a Double Dip Recession. The priority is the British people.

That's the only point of yours I can (uncomfortably) agree on to an extent.

Your conservatives haven't done a very good job of ensuring any of those things though. In fact for many of those things, they've done the exact opposite.

[Guest]

Its a good job we live in a democracy since it ensure that the bigots on both the right and the left will never define the nature of the country we live in. The closest we got to that was old Maggie the witch, but democracy eventually saw her off and her extremist ideas.

the real problem for people like Mr Right Wing is they don't really want a democracy since they fully realize that there extremist position will never become national policy - that is why they frequently espouse their desire for a dictatorship.

Br Cornelius

[Mr Right Wing]

Its a good job we live in a democracy since it ensure that the bigots on both the right and the left will never define the nature of the country we live in. The closest we got to that was old Maggie the witch, but democracy eventually saw her off and her extremist ideas.

the real problem for people like Mr Right Wing is they don't really want a democracy since they fully realize that there extremist position will never become national policy - that is why they frequently espouse their desire for a dictatorship.

Br Cornelius

I believe in getting as near to true democracy as possible not a dictatorship.

That scares people as many want to stop others having their say.

[Guest]

I believe in getting as near to true democracy as possible not a dictatorship.

That scares people as many want to stop others having their say.

The problem is that Britain is an overwhelmingly moderate country - and your ideas will never amount to anything in the grand scheme of things.

Br Cornelius

[Mr Right Wing]

The problem is that Britain is an overwhelmingly moderate country - and your ideas will never amount to anything in the grand scheme of things.

Br Cornelius

If you think being anti-immigrantion, anti-gay marriage and anti-eu is extremism then I think you've got a surrpsie coming at some point.

[shadowhive]

If you think being anti-immigrantion, anti-gay marriage and anti-eu is extremism then I think you've got a surrpsie coming at some point.

You do realise those views are held by the far right and a view held by the far right is, by definition, extremist in nature.

[Mr Right Wing]

You do realise those views are held by the far right and a view held by the far right is, by definition, extremist in nature.

They are held by most British people.

[smurf0852]

They are held by most British people.

They aren't not even close to most

[Mr Right Wing]

They aren't not even close to most

I quite clearly rember a YouGov poll which asked people would you vote for these policies without telling them the party was the BNP. The vast majority of people said yes. But you've coloured your world red so its no wonder its all distorted (not that I hadnt noticed many times before lol).

Obviously the BNP contains Nazis in its ranks and has people that come out with controversial comments. However if UKIP got its act together and adopted all those policies it would clean up at the next election.

[None of the above]

I quite clearly rember a YouGov poll which asked people would you vote for these policies without telling them the party was the BNP. The vast majority of people said yes. But you've coloured your world red so its no wonder its all distorted (not that I hadnt noticed many times before lol).

Obviously the BNP contains Nazis in its ranks and has people that come out with controversial comments. However if UKIP got its act together and adopted all those policies it would clean up at the next election.

You can't vaguely reference memories of polls without specifics MRW.

THAT'S colouring a world view.

It's totally meaningless without context and figures.

The BNP are a toxic racist party full of Nazis and extremists.

As for UKIP.

The fact that people like to vote for them in Euro elections to flip a big fat middle finger to the political establishment has given them ideas above their station.

[Mr Right Wing]

You can't vaguely reference memories of polls without specifics MRW.

Not only biased but ignorant too lol.

Sadly for you the YouGov poll results were well publized around the country as everyone without a red bias remembers.

[None of the above]

Not only biased but ignorant too lol.

Sadly for you the YouGov poll results were well publized around the country as everyone without a red bias remembers.

So where are they then?

You do show your lack of 'substance' when you make claims but won't back them up with facts.

BTW, I'm a true blue EUROPEAN. Not some pale blue Tory forum troll.

[Mr Right Wing]

So where are they then?

You do show your lack of 'substance' when you make claims but won't back them up with facts.

BTW, I'm a true blue EUROPEAN. Not some pale blue Tory forum troll.

With a nice Russia symbol lol

[None of the above]

With a nice Russia symbol lol

Glad you like it!

[smurf0852]

With a nice Russia symbol lol

Lol I agree it is a very nice symbol of united workers strength against class driven oppression .

[Mr Right Wing]

Lol I agree it is a very nice symbol of united workers strength against class driven oppression .

Learn your place lol

[smurf0852]

Learn your place lol

Lol ok

[None of the above]

Learn your place lol

On your bike

[smurf0852]

Learn your place lol

i bet you have a laminated picture of maggie thatcher on the back of your toilet door .come on admit it

[Jackofalltrades]

Never voted Liberal and never ever will.

Never voted Liberal Full Stop, and never ever will.