Did man and dinosaur co-exist?

[Arbitran]

With my way of thinking whoever runs this dropped dinosaur manifestations like cryptic animals in my opinion. Mokele-mbembe anyone? It's a cryptic dinosaur spotted in Africa. At least nowadays. There's your dinosaur figurines from our ancient past. I'm still postulating ideas. It's sabotage.

Both Mokele-Mbembe and the alleged "figurines" (I think I know which ones you're talking about; however, you have been quite vague so far) have been quite thoroughly debunked.

[Arbitran]

My point was there was no new gene that had '"evolved".I have no beef with variation and natural selection,but these processes leading to class transitions is something i can't digest.

You yourself possess at least sixty genes totally unique to you, which you did not inherit from your parents. Your proposal that new genes cannot arise is categorically untenable. And your inability to "digest" a fact of nature does not affect its reality in the slightest.

[Dontlisten2me]

Both Mokele-Mbembe and the alleged "figurines" (I think I know which ones you're talking about; however, you have been quite vague so far) have been quite thoroughly debunked.

The figurines mentioned on Ancient Aliens.

How was Mokele-Mbembe debunked? Nobody believed in the African guy? They searched the entire Jungle? Can we toss the rest of cryptic animals in the trash since Mokele-Mbembe has been debunked? Let me be perfectly clear on this point. Dinosaurs lived 65 million years ago. What's left of them is fossilized in stone and the actual scientist spend years to undercover. What John Hammond and InGen created in Jurassic Park are genetically engineered theme park monsters. Nothing more, nothing less.

I don't think they put together fossils they found to be able to create such figurines and I don't think a guy popped in a VHS tape of National Geographic one day after flying down in a UFO. But how can I know if that didn't happen?

Edited December 16, 2012 by kampz

[Arbitran]

The figurines mentioned on Ancient Aliens.

Given I do not watch the programme with any sort of regularity (I have occasionally seen it, though nearly every word spoken is either utterly unsubstantiated or grasping at desperately distant straws), I don't know which you mean. But it sounds as though they were making another of their bizarre, sourceless claims. If you can actually give me a bit more to go on, then we could talk.

How was Mokele-Mbembe debunked? Nobody believed in the African guy? They searched the entire Jungle? Can we toss the rest of cryptic animals in the trash since Mokele-Mbembe has been debunked?

The African tribes which have been regarded as the originators of the Mokele-Mbembe legend have all stated, quite unambiguously, that the Mokele-Mbembe is a folkloric spirit, not an animal like a rhinoceros or elephant. Not a tangible, real-life animal. It's a legend. That is all.

No, we cannot dismiss all cryptids simply because one has been discredited; what we do need to do however is to refrain from speculation in the absence of evidence.

Let me be perfectly clear on this point. Dinosaurs lived 65 million years ago. What's left of them is fossilized in stone and the actual scientist spend years to undercover. What John Hammond and InGen created in Jurassic Park are genetically engineered theme park monsters. Nothing more, nothing less.

Um... what does Jurassic Park have to do with anything?

I don't think they put together fossils they found to be able to create such figurines and I don't think a guy popped in a VHS tape of National Geographic one day after flying down in a UFO. But how can I know if that didn't happen?

You haven't even given me any reason to think that there are any "figurines" in the first place. And your latter two sentences are... I regret... unintelligible to me... What is their relevance?

[Dontlisten2me]

"The African tribes which have been regarded as the originators of the Mokele-Mbembe legend have all stated, quite unambiguously, that the Mokele-Mbembe is a folkloric spirit, not an animal like a rhinoceros or elephant. Not a tangible, real-life animal. It's a legend. That is all."

Oh really?

http://arcturi.com/A...ofigurines.html

http://www.stupiddin...ving-that-isn-t

You can use a search engine to guide you.

Giant birds or thunder birds are being reported. People claim animals resembling pterodactyls and plesiosaurs. What's the difference between lake monsters or Bigfoot compared to dinosaurs?

It could be there imagination too. Mostly. (Dinosaur Figurines)

Edited December 17, 2012 by kampz

[Likely Guy]

"The African tribes which have been regarded as the originators of the Mokele-Mbembe legend have all stated, quite unambiguously, that the Mokele-Mbembe is a folkloric spirit, not an animal like a rhinoceros or elephant. Not a tangible, real-life animal. It's a legend. That is all."

Oh really?

http://arcturi.com/A...ofigurines.html

http://www.stupiddin...ving-that-isn-t

You can use a search engine to guide you.

Giant birds or thunder birds are being reported. People claim animals resembling pterodactyls and plesiosaurs. What's the difference between lake monsters or Bigfoot compared to dinosaurs?

It could be there imagination too. Mostly. (Dinosaur Figurines)

Your first link favours your argument, the second argues against it. Or maybe I'm confused.

Edit: No, I don't think that you've thought your way through this yet.

Edited December 17, 2012 by Likely Guy

[Arbitran]

"The African tribes which have been regarded as the originators of the Mokele-Mbembe legend have all stated, quite unambiguously, that the Mokele-Mbembe is a folkloric spirit, not an animal like a rhinoceros or elephant. Not a tangible, real-life animal. It's a legend. That is all."

Oh really?

http://arcturi.com/A...ofigurines.html

http://www.stupiddin...ving-that-isn-t

You can use a search engine to guide you.

Giant birds or thunder birds are being reported. People claim animals resembling pterodactyls and plesiosaurs. What's the difference between lake monsters or Bigfoot compared to dinosaurs?

It could be there imagination too. Mostly. (Dinosaur Figurines)

Here's what five minutes' worth of research found on the Acámbaro figurines (yes, I had heard of them; just wasn't sure what you were talking about before):

http://detecting.org.uk/html/Acambaro_Figures_Famous_Fakes_and_Frauds.html

http://www.badarchaeology.com/?page_id=348

Yes, large birds have always been reported; first consider: do you realize just how hard it is to just the size of an aerial object, such as a bird? I get average crows around my house every single day that look like eagles or vultures from some angles when they're in flight. Reports of giant birds don't interest me in any great way.

And yes, there have been reports too of pterosaur- and plesiosaur-like animals; I find it suspicious that these reports only seem to appear after the discovery of pterosaurs and plesiosaurs. (Dragons and sea serpents don't count, sorry; pterosaurs aren't even slightly similar to the rather vivid descriptions given of dragons, and plesiosaurs would, without doubt, have been found by now if they persisted to modern day.)

[Abramelin]

I haven't read this before so this is what I think:

Let's assume some dinosaurs and pterosaurs did indeed live alongside humans, does that necessarily mean humans existed 65 millions or more years ago?

It could also mean only some dino species survived and lived till prehistoric times (I don't believe it, but just for the sake of the argument).

Yellyfish are truely ancient, and people have depicted them in art. Does that mean humans are billions of years old? No.

.

Edited December 17, 2012 by Abramelin

[AsteroidX]

We live along alligators and turtles still today so the answer is yes.

[Abramelin]

We live along alligators and turtles still today so the answer is yes.

They are not and never were dinosaurs.

[Dontlisten2me]

Here's what five minutes' worth of research found on the Acámbaro figurines (yes, I had heard of them; just wasn't sure what you were talking about before):

http://detecting.org...and_Frauds.html

http://www.badarchae...om/?page_id=348

Yes, large birds have always been reported; first consider: do you realize just how hard it is to just the size of an aerial object, such as a bird? I get average crows around my house every single day that look like eagles or vultures from some angles when they're in flight. Reports of giant birds don't interest me in any great way.

And yes, there have been reports too of pterosaur- and plesiosaur-like animals; I find it suspicious that these reports only seem to appear after the discovery of pterosaurs and plesiosaurs. (Dragons and sea serpents don't count, sorry; pterosaurs aren't even slightly similar to the rather vivid descriptions given of dragons, and plesiosaurs would, without doubt, have been found by now if they persisted to modern day.)

In 5 minutes you would see that there's a lot more to it.

You should understand you're not those people. I've seen many different sizes of airplanes in the sky at different heights. I can estimate well enough. It's not wise to judge/assume and I've never seen a "thunderbird". Birds slightly interest me.

Well do you think humans existed before pterosaurs and plesiosaurs? You assume that reports came after the discovery of those animals.

Edited December 17, 2012 by kampz

[AsteroidX]

I can marry my cousin. Well 2nd cousin so Im gona with yes we do live with dinosaurs.

http://dinosaurs.abo...rocodilians.htm

[Abramelin]

I can marry my cousin. Well 2nd cousin so Im gona with yes we do live with dinosaurs.

http://dinosaurs.abo...rocodilians.htm

Those who promote the idea that humans lived alongside dinosaurs most always mean sauropods and raptors (think "Jurassic Park").

But if you consider crocodiles and turtles to be these dinosaurs because they are related or have a common origin, then you could also mention birds.

[AsteroidX]

touche and you are correct birds.

You could even add small species of mammals into that as well but I am very not up to my info that bit.

Did we as Lucy type humans live alongside dinosaurs as we see in the old Black and White movies. I dont belive that.

[CRIPTIC CHAMELEON]

I'm not sure but does camping at loch ness count after all nessie is supposed to be a plesiosaur.

[Arbitran]

In 5 minutes you would see that there's a lot more to it.

You should understand you're not those people. I've seen many different sizes of airplanes in the sky at different heights. I can estimate well enough. It's not wise to judge/assume and I've never seen a "thunderbird". Birds slightly interest me.

Well do you think humans existed before pterosaurs and plesiosaurs? You assume that reports came after the discovery of those animals.

I may not be those people, but as a biologist, I've seen my fair share of birds, from all over the world. It's difficult to judge size at a distance, and especially so in the sky, if one is not trained to know what one is looking at.

And no, of course humans did not exist before pterosaurs and plesiosaurs; that's asinine. I don't assume that the reports come after the discovery of those fossils; I've studied this to a significant extent, and have found no compelling accounts of pterosaur- or plesiosaur-like creatures which did not occur after the discovery of pterosaur and plesiosaur fossils.

[Arbitran]

But if you consider crocodiles and turtles to be these dinosaurs because they are related or have a common origin, then you could also mention birds.

Well, if we're calling every organism with a common origin to the clade Dinosauria a 'dinosaur', then every organism on Earth is a 'dinosaur'. Except... that isn't the case. Crurotarsians such as crocodylians and their relatives, while related closely to dinosaurs, simply do not qualify. They are archosaurs, yes, but not dinosaurs. Birds, on the other hand, are, indeed, full-fledged dinosaurs in their own right.

[Arbitran]

touche and you are correct birds.

You could even add small species of mammals into that as well but I am very not up to my info that bit.

Did we as Lucy type humans live alongside dinosaurs as we see in the old Black and White movies. I dont belive that.

No, australopithecines never saw any non-avian dinosaurs; given they evolved roughly 60 million years after the non-avian dinosaurs... you know, 'went the way of the dinosaur'...

[Arbitran]

I'm not sure but does camping at loch ness count after all nessie is supposed to be a plesiosaur.

Plesiosaurs were not dinosaurs, as a note. And as another note, the Loch Ness Monster mythos has evolved significantly over the years; originally it was a mythic kelpie (a ghost horse that lived in the loch and carried anyone who tried to ride it to their watery death), then it was a sea serpent-like creature, like a giant snake or worm, and then after the discovery of plesiosaurs and other prehistoric aquatic animals, then we find that the mythos describes it as such...

[FurthurBB]

My point was there was no new gene that had '"evolved".I have no beef with variation and natural selection,but these processes leading to class transitions is something i can't digest.

Well new genes do evolve or sometimes just old genes evolve new roles, but the only thing that leads from one 'class' to the next is a whole lot of allelic frequency changes and natural selection over a long period of time.

[spikeman25]

Umm you do realize that if man coexisted with dinosaurs we would be extinct too. Herp derp

[Quaentum]

Umm you do realize that if man coexisted with dinosaurs we would be extinct too. Herp derp

Oh heavens no. Just go to the creation museum and you can see that they were pets to us and we rode them like horses.

[spikeman25]

Lol @ creationism

[silicasecrets]

I think another species of habitants were here w dinos.And they were a creation of someones for some purpose.

The problem w findind the truth is that its always hidden from us.For one reason or the other.

Evolution is a good theory,but thats all it really is >theory.How can you prove that evolution WASNT purposly manipulation from some intelligence?

.

Oxygen has had to have been here if there was plant life and trees

Time travel will soon be recording history properly ,maybe itll go mainstream in our lifetimes i hope.

[Arbitran]

I think another species of habitants were here w dinos.And they were a creation of someones for some purpose.

The problem w findind the truth is that its always hidden from us.For one reason or the other.

Evolution is a good theory,but thats all it really is >theory.How can you prove that evolution WASNT purposly manipulation from some intelligence?

.

Oxygen has had to have been here if there was plant life and trees

Time travel will soon be recording history properly ,maybe itll go mainstream in our lifetimes i hope.

Um... NONSENSE ALERT.