Knowing the mind of God

[Mr Walker]

Circular reasoning. I wonder if God communicates better than you can.

The problem may be in your understanding, in which case, No. You wouldnt comprehend either of us.

I answered your question logically and without 'circular reasoning" but you cant see or "get" it.

" God" is a name like "dog" It is just a sound we attach to an entity (real or imagined) which has certain defined parameters. When i meet an entity which matches the parameter of a dog I call it a dog. When i meet an entity which matches the parameters of a god, I call it (in my commuications with others) a god. There is nothing circular about that.

People recognise any entity via the common parameters, which we as a race attribute to that entity and describe in a variety of linguistic forms. There are a variety of god forms, just as there is a variety of dog forms, but they all fall within a set of universal parameters which we have attributed to them and catalogued them under..

[MistyW]

If there was an almighty, all knowing creator of the universe I doubt any single one human being could comprehend all the complexities and knowledge that must be in the creator's mind.

[Rlyeh]

The problem may be in your understanding, in which case, No. You wouldnt comprehend either of us.

I answered your question logically and without 'circular reasoning" but you cant see or "get" it.

You babbled a list of things god says without any form of support.

It doesn't take god to tell you baseless assertions are not logical.

People recognise any entity via the common parameters, which we as a race attribute to that entity and describe in a variety of linguistic forms. There are a variety of god forms, just as there is a variety of dog forms, but they all fall within a set of universal parameters which we have attributed to them and catalogued them under..

Hearing voices in your head is mental illness. If you want to call that god, go ahead.

[Mr Walker]

You babbled a list of things god says without any form of support.

It doesn't take god to tell you baseless assertions are not logical.

Hearing voices in your head is mental illness. If you want to call that god, go ahead.

Oh you dont believe me? Thats a different problem altogether and it is your problem not mine. My logic and reasoning is impeccable . You chose not to accept it, because you cant accept the existence of god. Thats a belief and you are entitled to it, but to argue that, based on your lack of belief, my own contact with god is logically impossible is poor reasoning.

I can assure you that hearing voices in your head (or in the real environment ) having visions, experiencing physical manifestaions we call miracles, seeing the future, reading other peoples minds, knowing things and even obeing or clair voyancing, are not symptoms of mental illness in them selves. No modern psychiatrist would catagorise them as such, in themselve,s because they are all normal natural and widespread parts of the human condition.. They can be natural adjuncts to more accepted mainstream human abilities. It depends on the nature and content of the information imparted in such experiences and the abilty to verify their contextual reality and integration into the natural environment around you.

For example a voice which says, "Kill your baby brother because he's possessed by the devil" is a different thing to a voice which says, very accurately as it turns out, " Stop the car now. A large red bus is about to come through the red light ahead of you and will kill you if you continue through the intersection." or tells you where to find someones lost wallet/purse etc Or talks to you about how to adapt to a new or difficult situation in your life. Or tells you it is about to cure you of an addiction or illness and then does do. Or tells you where to find a carpark or a fifty dollar when needed, and so on.

[Rlyeh]

Oh you dont believe me? Thats a different problem altogether and it is your problem not mine. My logic and reasoning is impeccable . You chose not to accept it, because you cant accept the existence of god. Thats a belief and you are entitled to it, but to argue that, based on your lack of belief, my own contact with god is logically impossible is poor reasoning.

Wouldn't be the first time you've abused logic to come to an illogical conclusion.

For example a voice which says, "Kill your baby brother because he's possessed by the devil" is a different thing to a voice which says, very accurately as it turns out, " Stop the car now. A large red bus is about to come through the red light ahead of you and will kill you if you continue through the intersection." or tells you where to find someones lost wallet/purse etc Or talks to you about how to adapt to a new or difficult situation in your life. Or tells you it is about to cure you of an addiction or illness and then does do. Or tells you where to find a carpark or a fifty dollar when needed, and so on.

For a teacher your comprehension skills are pitiful. The internal monologue is not what is implied when speaking of "hearing voices".

I've got to wonder why you bother replying in these instances, are you trying to be profound or daft?

[Ligia Cabus]

I think that "This mystery" - "called" God is the origin of all things and the mind of this Creator, in my opinion, is the source of all things. Then, I concluded that all things are the thought of this Creator.

Things that arose from the first Verb or Word, that I don't believe was pronounced in loud voice, but manifested only in a silent thought and this thought gave origin this multiverse, or be - the many which born from one. In this case, the knowledge of God mind or of his thoughts is the knowledge of the multiverse, its beings, its laws.

My biggest doubt is, admiting this hypothesis, that everything is the result of an matrix of creative thinking, what I wonder to myself is whether we-all that exists, it becomes real when the Creator is awake and active (in Maha-avatara) or if everything is a dream of the creator when he rests, sleeps, (in Pralaya). Or, will be that we are a dream or a nightmare of God?

[SpiritWriter]

To me, being "god blind" is like being physically blind. You can't sense feel or see, what is right there in front of you.

I dont really know what it is like to be separated from god because i have been connected to this source from my earliest memories, even when i had no conception that it was god, and simply thought that all humans shared this connection to the universal consciousness. Even as an atheist /secular humanist, i had the connection without understanding what it represented. As a teenager, and a reader of all marvel comics, I thought it was a sort of "spidey power" and never gave god a thought.

When I was young I used to talk to my favorite stuffed animal and think he was real (he was my best friend btw). Even when I went to school and we were apart I would think about him and communicate with him. I was raised in an athiest house so I no-one ever taught me about God. Now that I look back I know I was communicating to God the whole time and he used my little stuffed animal to have a relationship with me. I think its sweet. I however do know what it feels like to be a part from God, even after becoming a Christian I had periods where, for some reason I had no connection to God at all. I think God showed me that, took away his strong presence, so that I would know what it is like for other people that cannot feel him. So I could understand the reasons why it is possible for someone not to believe in him, and I am grateful for that. We have a very multi-dimensional God. Non-belief can serve its purpose in my opinion. And one of (not the only) the purposes is so that when the presence of God is strong and the mind of god is accessible, the believer will be even more grateful, understanding that it was Gods grace that came over them and nothing they have done on their own. I praise god right now for knowing him, I am in love with him!

[SpiritWriter]

And god has no gender because god is not human or anything like human; but again I use "he" for convenience and because the correct term, "it" carries less respect in the english language.

I am the same way. Well I don't say god has NO gender. I say God has both genders. Both male and female qualities, like we have. But I still say "he" for the most part. He is my lover, and She is my mother...

[freetoroam]

Mr Walker sir,

you say "God says many things. "....have you actually heard him yourself or is this all hearsay? What would the "Modern professional psychiatrists" say about this exactly?

[Mr Walker]

Wouldn't be the first time you've abused logic to come to an illogical conclusion.

For a teacher your comprehension skills are pitiful. The internal monologue is not what is implied when speaking of "hearing voices".

I've got to wonder why you bother replying in these instances, are you trying to be profound or daft?

Because you dont have my experiences you can't understand the nature of them (which may understandably frustrate you) The voice of god is not a part of my internal dialogues between parts of my intellect which i have known utilised and repsected since about the age of three, but a separate voice of power and knowledge manifesting from beyond myslef.

It is not even alawys an internal voice but a physical one, materialising from a material source and heard by others.

I understand your disbelief, but that is based on a lack of personal experience, and thus false.

Ps I am always entirely logical, but logic can logically lead to different conclusions, depending on the starting point and the evidences available. It is a system/tool, of thought and application, not a path to one truth.

[Mr Walker]

Mr Walker sir,

you say "God says many things. "....have you actually heard him yourself or is this all hearsay? What would the "Modern professional psychiatrists" say about this exactly?

Yes; god and I have an ongoing relationship which includes many forms of communication to and fro. And modern psychiatry finds me "perfectly normal, well adjusted and highly functional."

Professional people that I have encountered are not judgemental and several of them told me that, from their professional encounters, such experiences, including the manifestations of "miracles" are quite common. In the words of one, "such things seem to be quite real, but inexplicable at the present time".

And of course some of the top medical professionals, in many fields, in Australia are also men and women of faith.

[freetoroam]

Yes; god and I have an ongoing relationship which includes many forms of communication to and fro. And modern psychiatry finds me "perfectly normal, well adjusted and highly functional."

i am pleased they find you normal, but why do they test you in the first place?

[ZaraKitty]

The person that finds that mind of god will probably share the same ideals as him... that's how it usually happens, isn't it?

[Beany]

I think it's a critical thinking flaw to believe that only one's own or shared experiences are valid. The fact that we haven't had a particular experiences does not invalidate the experiences of other. Nor does it mean that those who experiences are different must provide proof of the validity of their experiences, indeed some of us have no interest in obtaining the validation of strangers, we have friends & family we turn to, we study, we gather information, we research. For many of us, the experience itself a part of the validation, but just one part of it. I always consider the source/claimant. Adult? Of sound mind? Reasonably intelligent? Has at least a high school education or is and autodidact? Is able to employ critical thinking skills? Has some knowledge of the topic or subject? Resorting to name-calling or insults is not an argument or a rationale, it's a judgment, and when we begin to judge we lose our objectivity. When that happens, we are no longer in communication, and no helpful exchanges of information take place.

Edited November 26, 2012 by Beany

[Mr Walker]

i am pleased they find you normal, but why do they test you in the first place?

When i had symtoms of a heart problem I went to the top heart surgeons in Australia When i was visited by an angel who removed my teenage addiction to nicotine and then entered an ongoing relationship with a real and powerful god of course i first went to get my mental health assessed by the top experts in the field. Turns out i am one of the few certifiably sane members of UM LOL. Basically they accpeted that what i expereinced were real paranormal events. They said these were quite common in their experience as professionals, and that all the test results showed that i was "highly functioning and well integrated." (They dont define people as crazy insane etc these days but they do tell you if you have a clean mental bill of health which I did. I also had the best scans etc done to check my neurological health, and continue these every 5 years or so. That, also, is excellent.

I really already knew i was fine, because of the nature and "contextual integration" of my experiences A logical and educated person can apply a number of reality and logic checkers to every event in their life to establish their independent reality and objective existence, or lack thereof.

Beany puts it very well in his post above. I judge my own and others accounts by a number of criteria Eg was the subject wide awake? Were they completely sober and drug free? Are they mentally well and have no background of hallucinations etc?

Then one must examine the contextual evidences. Eg if one sees a very bright light appear at night does one also see all the surrounding landscape lit by that light, and can that be verified in the morning. It is significant if there are indpendent witnesses to the external aspects of such events. Internal aspects can be verified by their own "truth" eg if a voice tells you it will cure you of cancer and in the next week you go in for tests and find an advanced cancer completely disappeared you can know the voice had some validity, whatever its source. If it accurately predicts a future event ditto If a force and voice acts to alter the physical reality of the world around you and that can be independently verified, then the force is real and physical. And so on.

tthere is alos the number and times events occur. If you are told a hundred times where to find a car park in a busy city, and there is ALWAYS one there, then you can know something unusual is happening. If you often read minds are told where lost objects are or are given knowledge of events to come, then again the number and accuracy of the events counts as validation just as a repeated scientific experiment does. If twenty, thirty, or fifty times, you are told where to find money to meet your needs, and it is always there, again this is a physical demonstraion of a real force.

Edited November 26, 2012 by Mr Walker

[Grandpa Greenman]

I guess the line between insanity and hearing a God, is what it is saying. If a god tells you to cause harm or kill, then you're insane. If what it says is a benefit, then you are sane in the eyes of society. Then again may a solder has gone off to war with a call from a god.

[freetoroam]

Mr Walker, you have said this on another thread:

^{"i base my way of life on evidences about how is best for people to live.}

^{Thus i do not smoke, drink, take drugs, eat much meat, and don't consume resources unnecessarily (i never fly by plane)}"

and on here you say this "When i had symtoms of a heart problem I went to the top heart surgeons in Australia When i was visited by an angel who removed my teenage addiction to nicotine"

So what age was it you gave up smoking?

[Marcion Meets E. Sibyl]

When i had symtoms of a heart problem I went to the top heart surgeons in Australia When i was visited by an angel who removed my teenage addiction to nicotine and then entered an ongoing relationship with a real and powerful god of course

i first went to get my mental health assessed by the top experts in the field. Turns out i am one of the few certifiably sane members of UM LOL.

Hi Mr Walker,

Speaking of heart problem, amazing that you would say that because when a dear friend's aorta burst in the ER of a hospital and was immediately taken into surgery, an enigmatic being/entity (angel came to my mind instantly) approached and comforted me, and through telepathy, it said to me that everything will turn out all right. I was the one who drove and took my friend to the ER that late night, speaking of perfect timing, for my friend survived (miraculously) -- to cut a long story short. Just sharing.

While reading this thread, it looks like you're defending your god again, sir.

Peace.

[Mr Walker]

Mr Walker, you have said this on another thread:

^{"i base my way of life on evidences about how is best for people to live.}

^{Thus i do not smoke, drink, take drugs, eat much meat, and don't consume resources unnecessarily (i never fly by plane)}"

and on here you say this "When i had symtoms of a heart problem I went to the top heart surgeons in Australia When i was visited by an angel who removed my teenage addiction to nicotine"

So what age was it you gave up smoking?

22.

53 when i had a triple by pass.

Sorry if i confused you by omitting a full stop. My first full blown manifestion by god/an angel was at the age of 22. Until then i was an ethical, if hedonistic, secular humanist/atheist. After that i was compelled to come to an accomodation with a real, powerful and interventonist entity i call god. That relationship continues to this day. God warned me of my heart problem, and sent a physical angel who was observed by many others, to comfort me while i was awaiting surgery.

Edited November 26, 2012 by Mr Walker

[Mr Walker]

Hi Mr Walker,

Speaking of heart problem, amazing that you would say that because when a dear friend's aorta burst in the ER of a hospital and was immediately taken into surgery, an enigmatic being/entity (angel came to my mind instantly) approached and comforted me, and through telepathy, it said to me that everything will turn out all right. I was the one who drove and took my friend to the ER that late night, speaking of perfect timing, for my friend survived (miraculously) -- to cut a long story short. Just sharing.

While reading this thread, it looks like you're defending your god again, sir.

Peace.

Thanks for sharing. This story is reasonably common and a number of people who underwent the same surgery in the same hospital have encountered similar angels as i did, when there. (As i sort of suggested, psychiatrists hear similar stories quite often) Again, when god saved the lives of my wife and myself in a major bushfire, I was interested to read, independently, of other peoples' similar encounters with god or angels, and how he also helped them survive.

God doesnt need any defence or justification. What I attempt to do is explain to others, as factually and rationally as I can, my encounters with god. Of course many people find this impossible, so i end up "defending' my self, but i dont see it that way. You dont have to defend a truth. It just is, and therefore is its own best defence.

[Cassea]

Angels are very common to those who are injured. I used to think a nurse was in the room with me. And there wasn't.

[Dan671]

Knowing the mind of God, begins with knowing yourself. I like this passage from the Gospel of Thomas. If those who lead you say to you: See the kingdom is in heaven, then the birds of heaven will precede you. If they say to you: It is in the sea, then the fish will precede you. But the kingdom is within you and it is with out you. When you know yourselves, then you will be known and you will know that you are sons of the living Father. But if you do not know yourselves, then you are in poverty and you are poverty.

[Mr Walker]

Knowing the mind of God, begins with knowing yourself. I like this passage from the Gospel of Thomas. If those who lead you say to you: See the kingdom is in heaven, then the birds of heaven will precede you. If they say to you: It is in the sea, then the fish will precede you. But the kingdom is within you and it is with out you. When you know yourselves, then you will be known and you will know that you are sons of the living Father. But if you do not know yourselves, then you are in poverty and you are poverty.

This is, for me, perhaps the greatest single and most self evident truth in the bible. It is Literally true, and it is perhaps the most important truth. heaven and hell after death are belief based concepts but every hman being can experience the reality of heaven and hell in their daily life on earth, and each can choose which state they want to enter into, in their life.

[White Crane Feather]

Knowing the mind of God, begins with knowing yourself. I like this passage from the Gospel of Thomas. If those who lead you say to you: See the kingdom is in heaven, then the birds of heaven will precede you. If they say to you: It is in the sea, then the fish will precede you. But the kingdom is within you and it is with out you. When you know yourselves, then you will be known and you will know that you are sons of the living Father. But if you do not know yourselves, then you are in poverty and you are poverty.

So very very true.

Edited November 27, 2012 by Seeker79

[freetoroam]

22.

53 when i had a triple by pass.

Sorry if i confused you by omitting a full stop. My first full blown manifestion by god/an angel was at the age of 22. Until then i was an ethical, if hedonistic, secular humanist/atheist. After that i was compelled to come to an accomodation with a real, powerful and interventonist entity i call god. That relationship continues to this day. God warned me of my heart problem, and sent a physical angel who was observed by many others, to comfort me while i was awaiting surgery.

I respect the way you "feel'. But I personally would give much more credit to the doctors and nurses who saved your life.

If god had existed he would not have put you in that position in the first place....and then he sends his angels in to save you?? This sounds like a typical story of someone trying to take the credit for being the saviour when in fact he was originally the instigator.