Gay marriage 'to be illegal'

[Mr Right Wing]

They fought against marriage changing, even when it was civil marriage own. Civil marriage and definition is decided solely by the government, not by the church. The church was, thusly, butting in where it didn't belong from the start.

'Haven't had as much issue' isn't the same as no issue, They always had issues with civil partnerships too. They didn't want them because they were 'too close to marriage' again, even though they were done by the government.

Gay people have always wanted same sex marriages, not civil unions, not civil partnerships, but marriage. Those other things are lesser and still considered as being inferior. they're always the result of compromises to appease religions and you know what I'm sick of religions I'm not part of trying to dicate if I can and cannot get married. Why should i have to settle for something seperate to appease the church's whims? Why should anyone?

We have equality laws in this country and, before this all started, the church already had entitlements not to follow it to the letter. Look at the claims they'd be forced. They claim that the equality law that they don't have to follow anyway, would be used against them, even though it can't be now.

I'm not making things up, nor am I attacking you personally. But hey, you always seem to have problems with what I say.

You do not -

1. Dictate to religion its values, its traditions and who it accepts as followers.

2. Own church marriage.

3. Have the right to demand religion is rewritten to accomodate you.

4. Have the right to force churches to perform their ceremonies on you and your gay partner.

Furthermore you do not own the equalities act. Although it covers gay rights it also covers ethnic minority rights and religious rights. The reason why is religious groups need their rights protecting from groups who would force their own values onto them, namely you. You are behaving as an anti-religious bigot and the sad thing is you dont even believe in God so whats it got to do with you?

[Cassea]

Point to where I said I wanted to force it to chang.. You are purposely misrepresenting me, ignoring what I say and twisting my words.

The discussion ends here, because, quite frankly, I've had enough of you doing it and you don't seem to stop.

All what you care about is the word of god. That''s all that matters. I hope selling your humanity out is worth it.

I pity that you can't see further than what the bible says, that you can't think for yourself for five minutes.

I didn't say that. You misread it. I said. You don't have the power to force it to change. It's a silly statement to keep insisting. That you are not trying to force it. You can't force it. You are just a person. How could you actually force it. You can't. So to keep insisting that you aren't trying to force it. Is very very silly. No one is saying you are trying to force the church to change. What you are doing is forcing your views. Down our throats. Instead of just conceding. That we have different opinions.

[Mr Right Wing]

No. I have no right to FORCE it to change.

I have every right to try and change it, to encourage change especially since that change is for the greater good for all.

Big difference. You and Casea should really learn that.

Then you're in violation of the equalities act.

Religions, religous groups and their followers have the right to practice their faith unhindered by others.

Edited December 14, 2012 by Mr Right Wing

[JGirl]

I have not. That's completely a lie. I have stated my opinion on this several times. I have no issue with homosexuality. If someone is gay it is between them and God. Not me.

exactly...

oh it's not me saying these things, it's the bible!!

bull crap

it's your rendtition of the bible.

to be a christian is to follow the teachings of jesus. quite simply that. the rest of it is pure interpretation and has no real bearing on being worthy of calling oneself a christian. therefore it stands that a homosexual person who believes in jesus and his teachings is indeed a christian in very good standing.

jesus said nothing about gay people in any way- and most definitely didn't say anything that would promote or justify the disgust and fear that many christians seem to have for homosexuality.

[shadowhive]

You do not -

1. Dictate to religion its values, its traditions and who it accepts as followers.

2. Own church marriage.

3. Have the right to demand religion is rewritten to accomodate you.

4. Have the right to force churches to perform their ceremonies on you and your gay partner.

Furthermore you do not own the equalities act. Although it covers gay rights it also covers ethnic minority rights and religious rights. The reason why is religious groups need their rights protecting from groups who would force their own values onto them, namely you. You are behaving as an anti-religious bigot and the sad thing is you dont even believe in God so whats it got to do with you?

1-4 have been covered. Try and keep up. I want religion to change. I don't want to FORCE them to change. What do I have to do to get that across to you?

Personally (and this is just my personal opinion) religous rights should have a seperate act. Ethnic, women's rights and gay rights are based on one thing: defending characteristics that are inborn. Religion is a choice. It should not be lumped in with things that are not.

What's it got to do with me? Again, explained. Look back a few pages.

[shadowhive]

Then you're in violation of the equalities act.

Religions, religous groups and their followers have the right to practice their faith unhindered by others.

As always, to an extent.

As I've mentioned, the bible says thaat gay people should be executed. Try and do that and guess what? The act does not protect you.

[Cassea]

exactly...

oh it's not me saying these things, it's the bible!!

bull crap

it's your rendtition of the bible.

to be a christian is to follow the teachings of jesus. quite simply that. the rest of it is pure interpretation and has no real bearing on being worthy of calling oneself a christian. therefore it stands that a homosexual person who believes in jesus and his teachings is indeed a christian in very good standing.

jesus said nothing about gay people in any way- and most definitely didn't say anything that would promote or justify the disgust and fear that many christians seem to have for homosexuality.

exactly...

oh it's not me saying these things, it's the bible!!

bull crap

it's your rendtition of the bible.

to be a christian is to follow the teachings of jesus. quite simply that. the rest of it is pure interpretation and has no real bearing on being worthy of calling oneself a christian. therefore it stands that a homosexual person who believes in jesus and his teachings is indeed a christian in very good standing.

jesus said nothing about gay people in any way- and most definitely didn't say anything that would promote or justify the disgust and fear that many christians seem to have for homosexuality.

That is a more liberal interpretation of Christianity. You don't get to dictate what it means to be Christian. It's not just what Jesus said. It is also what God said. I am probably more liberal. But I don't deny the right of those who are more conservative. To believe what they do. And to do otherwise is bigoted and disrespectful. No matter how much you try to hide behind. Self righteousness.

[Mr Right Wing]

1-4 have been covered. Try and keep up. I want religion to change. I don't want to FORCE them to change. What do I have to do to get that across to you?

Personally (and this is just my personal opinion) religous rights should have a seperate act. Ethnic, women's rights and gay rights are based on one thing: defending characteristics that are inborn. Religion is a choice. It should not be lumped in with things that are not.

What's it got to do with me? Again, explained. Look back a few pages.

I like the way you say you dont want to force change onto the church then say lets rewrite the law to give them less rights.

Bit of a contradiction.

[Cassea]

1-4 have been covered. Try and keep up. I want religion to change. I don't want to FORCE them to change. What do I have to do to get that across to you?

Personally (and this is just my personal opinion) religous rights should have a seperate act. Ethnic, women's rights and gay rights are based on one thing: defending characteristics that are inborn. Religion is a choice. It should not be lumped in with things that are not.

What's it got to do with me? Again, explained. Look back a few pages.

You can't force them to change. We know this. So it is silly to keep saying it. It is as if you are writing "I'm not going to force Obama to resign" Who are you? You have no power at all. You can't force them. So why do you keep saying this as if you are. Giving up some huge power and not forcing them. You instead are nasty to Christians and try to . Hide behind self righteousness. Insisting that people are doing things to you. That are not being done.

You reject God and don't believe in Him. You are hoping that others will stop believing in God. And then they can just agree with you. So this is what you are doing. You are hiding behind the ignorance of God. Expecting others to eventually agree. When we say we won't. You attack us.

Edited December 14, 2012 by Cassea

[shadowhive]

I like the way you say you dont want to force change onto the church then say lets rewrite the law to give them less rights.

Bit of a contradiction.

That's not what I mean at all.

By all means religion's should have rights, but those rights should not be under ann act which protects things that aren't a choice. I don''t want them to have less rights and that's just my opinion.

[shadowhive]

You can't force them to change. We know this. So it is silly to keep saying it. It is as if you are writing "I'm not going to force Obama to resign" Who are you? You have no power at all. You can't force them. So why do you keep saying this as if you are. Giving up some huge power and not forcing them. You instead are nasty to Christians and try to . Hide behind self righteousness. Insisting that people are doing things to you. That are not being done.

I have to keep saying it. Why? Because YOU keep making out like I want to force them to do things.

Things have been done to me by religious people.Try being kicked and punched, Try being name called. Try being spat on. Try being beaten. ...oh wait that doesn't count!

What about other countries, where people can be murdered for being gay? Or people that commit suicide due to religious pressure. Oh wait, those don't count either!

I don''t repect bullies. The church acts like a bully and tries to hide behind god, but it's still a bully. It just has protection to be one.

Edited December 14, 2012 by shadowhive

[JGirl]

That is a more liberal interpretation of Christianity. You don't get to dictate what it means to be Christian. It's not just what Jesus said. It is also what God said. I am probably more liberal. But I don't deny the right of those who are more conservative. To believe what they do. And to do otherwise is bigoted and disrespectful. No matter how much you try to hide behind. Self righteousness.

no it isn't.

it is the literal meaning of christianity.

[Cassea]

Gay people have insulted me. They have attacked my faith. Insulted my God and Jesus. Mocked and derided me. Threatened me with violence. Etc. I don't decide that all gay people act this way. I don't use this as a justification. To be bigoted towards gay people. You have taken your stories. And used them to justify your bigotry. You hide behind them as if they are true for every believer. And every church. Common sense says this isn't possible. You are hiding behind self righteousness. You are shoving your views at people who understand them But disagree with you. And for some reason this has enraged you. So you take it out on Christians.

[Mr Right Wing]

That's not what I mean at all.

By all means religion's should have rights, but those rights should not be under ann act which protects things that aren't a choice. I don''t want them to have less rights and that's just my opinion.

So you are saying that.

You think that because people choose their faith they are entitled to less rights than you. In effect the religious would be made second class citizens whose views arent as important as yours.

[Cassea]

no it isn't.

it is the literal meaning of christianity.

That's a bit arrogant. Not all Christianity is regarded the way you have stated. You are wrong. I'm sure you know this. So this appears to be more silly.

[shadowhive]

So you are saying that.

You think that because people choose their faith they are entitled to less rights than you. In effect the religious would be made second class citizens whose views arent as important as yours.

No. Nice try though.

I think we should have two laws. The equality act protecting gay rights, women's rights, ethnic rights. All of those things are inborn traits.

A second law, let's call it the religious act, which gives the exact same rights religions have now. The only change would be to seperate religion, which is a choice, from things that aren't.

[Dash--]

That's a bit arrogant. Not all Christianity is regarded the way you have stated. You are wrong. I'm sure you know this. So this appears to be more silly.

Nor is it "all" the way you've stated.

[JGirl]

That's a bit arrogant. Not all Christianity is regarded the way you have stated. You are wrong. I'm sure you know this. So this appears to be more silly.

that isn't my definition of it. that is the definition of it.

i'm not surprised it appears 'silly' to you. it doesn't fit with your mindset.

[Cassea]

Nor is it "all" the way you've stated.

What way have I stated?

[shadowhive]

Gay people have insulted me. They have attacked my faith. Insulted my God and Jesus. Mocked and derided me. Threatened me with violence. Etc. I don't decide that all gay people act this way. I don't use this as a justification. To be bigoted towards gay people. You have taken your stories. And used them to justify your bigotry. You hide behind them as if they are true for every believer. And every church. Common sense says this isn't possible. You are hiding behind self righteousness. You are shoving your views at people who understand them But disagree with you. And for some reason this has enraged you. So you take it out on Christians.

I don't defend the actions of those people.

No, you simply use the bible to justify the bigotry of others. You use it to excuse them. You use it to give them justification. You use it to make out like they need protection.

You are the one that says 'the bible says this, therefore the church should follow it'. Yet in the next breath you say it's not the same for every church and every believer. So which is it? should every christian be playing by the same playsheet or do they have the choice to inteprete it as they wish?

It enrages me when they have the gall to treat people as inferior. Think for a second about your belief and what it says. Homosexuality is a sin. Always, een in a loving, comitted relationship. Hetrosexuality, on the other hand is not a sin, especially in marriage. Do you not see what the problem is there?

[Mr Right Wing]

No. Nice try though.

I think we should have two laws. The equality act protecting gay rights, women's rights, ethnic rights. All of those things are inborn traits.

A second law, let's call it the religious act, which gives the exact same rights religions have now. The only change would be to seperate religion, which is a choice, from things that aren't.

Thats a charming attitude.

[shadowhive]

Thats a charming attitude.

Why? Are you going to argue that religion is not a choice?

[Cassea]

I don't defend the actions of those people.

No, you simply use the bible to justify the bigotry of others. You use it to excuse them. You use it to give them justification. You use it to make out like they need protection.

You are the one that says 'the bible says this, therefore the church should follow it'. Yet in the next breath you say it's not the same for every church and every believer. So which is it? should every christian be playing by the same playsheet or do they have the choice to inteprete it as they wish?

It enrages me when they have the gall to treat people as inferior. Think for a second about your belief and what it says. Homosexuality is a sin. Always, een in a loving, comitted relationship. Hetrosexuality, on the other hand is not a sin, especially in marriage. Do you not see what the problem is there?

You should calm down. You are being melodramatic. I am smart enough to know. That whether I agree with it or not. The Church of England and the Catholic Church. Base their religious canon on the BIble. I didn't say they should follow it. I observed that they do follow it. They are much more conservative than I am. And no I don't believe that every Christian should be playing on the same playsheet. The same way I don't believe every Jew should. There is not one interpretation. Those suggesting there is are very silly in my opinion.

Edited December 14, 2012 by Cassea

[Beckys_Mom]

It hits you... You are one min reading a story about gays and marriage, who's forcing who to do what and so on.............Then you hear a much bigger and more shocking, sad news story ..and you stop and think why am I getting wrapped up in something that is minor compared to something that is more tragic ?

My views as of now are - I really do not care what happens with the gays and the churches, I have come to realize that my family are all that matters.. Having watched and listened to a more tragic story on Sky News at this present time, I really think these sort of issues are small and not worth it..

Edited December 14, 2012 by Beckys_Mom

[Mr Right Wing]

Why? Are you going to argue that religion is not a choice?

No I'm going to argue that gays, women, immigrants and the religious are all entitled to exactly the same rights under law.

Trying to isolate religion from the equalities act is not only a charming attitude it sets a dangerous precedent. One day its lets isolate them off the next day its our rights are more important than theirs.

Hitler would be proud of you right now.