Arm the Teachers?

[Space Commander Travis]

If he thinks something is untouchable he should really look up the word Amendment.

And that's the definition of the word, and not what I asked for. What fits the definition? He's using the word, he should provide an example. Sacrosanct like what? He thinks I think that the 2nd Amendment is "sacrosanct" but I don't. He's just agitating from his hidden home in who-knows-what-country.

I wasn't talking about you, i was talking about our friend, the one who recently hollered "YOU WON'T TAKE AWAY OUR GUNS!!!". The whole argument that has been going on regarding Gun control is that the 2nd Amendment says that people are entitled to bear Arms, does it not? And that that is a sacred and unalterable principle. It's what makes Americans Americans, in fact.

[AsteroidX]

I actually I just think you shouldnt because you bring nothing helpful or positive.

[aztek]

Ah, right, no one else has a right to question how the U of S behaves, then. You might have an argument if it was, say, El Salvador or Fiji, but the U.S. likes to think of itself as being a moral beacon for the world, and that other countries should follow the same principles of Democracy and all the rest of it as it enjoys, by force if necessary. Arguments like this, and the incident that provoked it, do not do very much to convince the rest of the world that the U.S. has much of a leg to stand on morally, I am afraid.

oh they can question all they want, we just don't care. same way americans should not tell what russia should do about its corrupted dps, and illegal tadjik workers.... etc. i mean we can say, but you have every right to tell us mind your own damn buissness, and you would be right.

[Space Commander Travis]

I actually I just think you shouldnt because you bring nothing helpful or positive.

So, "YOU WON'T TAKE AWAY OUR GUNS!!!!" is helpful & postivie, then.

Edited December 20, 2012 by 747400

[Yamato]

I wasn't talking about you, i was talking about our friend, the one who recently hollered "YOU WON'T TAKE AWAY OUR GUNS!!!". The whole argument that has been going on regarding Gun control is that the 2nd Amendment says that people are entitled to bear Arms, does it not? And that that is a sacred and unalterable principle. It's what makes Americans Americans, in fact.

Then why were you asking me? And you never answered my questions to you from #270.

As if gun violence is the only violence we care about for some reason. As if gun murder is the only murder we care about.

http://www.nationmas...ders-per-capita

What does the lack of the United States Constitution's 2nd Amendment matter to the murdered souls in those nations?

What country are you from, incidentally? The "Leningrad region"? Really?

[Space Commander Travis]

There are few things angrier than an offended Patriot, aren't there. I suppose it says something that people seem to associate national identity with the freedom to possess weapons. i expect a psychologist would find something interesting in that.

Ah well, have a nice day, and merry festive seasonal greetings to you all.

[Professor Buzzkill]

In the US they have an additional right to own guns. Why are so many people upset that US citizens have that right?

I, for one, don't like the rights of the common people being taken away, whatever that right is.

[Space Commander Travis]

Then why were you asking me? And you never answered my questions to you from #270.

i wasn't actually asking you, it did say quite clearly that I was replying

I';m sorry? This from someone who insists that legislation from 1791 is sacrosanct?!

to the post quoted. It wasn't actually directed at you in the first place.

ok, now I hope we've got that clarified, I continue to wish you to have a good day.

[Essan]

I think all Americans SHOULD be allowed to BEAR ARMS.

After all the rest of us have arms (and hands and legs and feet) so why not the Americans.

Where in the US constitution though does it say Americans have the right to carry weapons of mass murder?

And if we ignore my little joke and accept that bearing arms means owning weapons, the same still applies - the Constitution was written when a gun could fire a bullet at a rate of up to 1 bullet every minute .......

In that context it's as outdated as Leviticus.

Was it ever intended that Americans could bear enough weapons to take over a small African country? No. You don't actually need sub machines guns to go shopping. Really. Well, except in America ........

edit: btw here in Britain we also have the right to bear arms. Any of us can own a gun. Although we have to demonstrate that we have due reason and above all a degree of responsibilty before we're allowed to. We don't let 12 year olds or drug addicts have them.

Edited December 20, 2012 by Essan

[freetoroam]

In the US they have an additional right to own guns. Why are so many people upset that US citizens have that right?

I, for one, don't like the rights of the common people being taken away, whatever that right is.

But its never just in America though when they send this sort of image around the world:

[Wickian]

In the US they have an additional right to own guns. Why are so many people upset that US citizens have that right?

I, for one, don't like the rights of the common people being taken away, whatever that right is.

The reason a lot of people get upset, and me to a lesser degree, over gun control is all of these events that spark the debate wouldn't have been prevented if said laws were implemented anyway. The guns are often stolen, and if not then it's already illegal to murder people and that doesn't seem to stop people from doing it anyway. A legal pistol will kill someone just as easily as an illegal automatic rifle.

I have no idea what real solution could be used to prevent mass murders, but control doesn't do a thing to try and fix the cause of them.

[FLOMBIE]

I think all Americans SHOULD be allowed to BEAR ARMS.

(...)

[aztek]

I think all Americans SHOULD be allowed to BEAR ARMS.

After all the rest of us have arms (and hands and legs and feet) so why not the Americans.

Where in the US constitution though does it say Americans have the right to carry weapons of mass murder?

And if we ignore my little joke and accept that bearing arms means owning weapons, the same still applies - the Constitution was written when a gun could fire a bullet at a rate of up to 1 bullet every minute .......

In that context it's as outdated as Leviticus.

Was it ever intended that Americans could bear enough weapons to take over a small African country? No. You don't actually need sub machines guns to go shopping. Really. Well, except in America ........

not again. i tought everyone knew by now of 2008 ussc desision on 2nd. it clearly states who has a right, where, when, and what weapons. true, it does not metion assult weapons specificly, it just says rifles and handguns, for hunting arget shooting and defence.

[Corp]

In the US they have an additional right to own guns. Why are so many people upset that US citizens have that right?

I, for one, don't like the rights of the common people being taken away, whatever that right is.

I don't think it so much that we're upset but that we see it as a cultural difference. I mean we have plenty of guns around but it's not a right to have one, nor is there any desire to make it a right. If you want a gun you can get one, provided you follow the law. Now of course we do have heated gun debates up here but it has none of the intensity of the debates that take place in the US. So when there's talk of gun reform that is still lighter than the gun laws we have and some people react as if the government is going to enslave them or something, we wonder what the hell is in water you're all drinking. Culturally we don't see owning a gun anywhere near the same level as issues such as free speech. So that many Americans seem to completely reject any kind of gun reform, no matter how minor and no matter how much gun crime happens, strikes us as very odd.

Edited December 20, 2012 by Corp

[Michelle]

I don't think it so much that we're upset but that we see it as a cultural difference. I mean we have plenty of guns around but it's not a right to have one, nor is there any desire to make it a right. If you want a gun you can get one, provided you follow the law. Now of course we do have heated gun debates up here but it has none of the intensity of the debates that take place in the US. So when there's talk of gun reform that is still lighter than the gun laws we have and people react as if the government is going to enslave them or something, we wonder what the hell is in water you're all drinking. Culturally we don't see owning a gun anywhere near the same level as issues such as free speech. So that many Americans seem to completely reject any kind of gun reform, no matter how minor and no matter how much gun crime happens, strikes us as very odd.

I wish people wouldn't lump us all together like that.

[Yamato]

i wasn't actually asking you, it did say quite clearly that I was replying

to the post quoted. It wasn't actually directed at you in the first place.

ok, now I hope we've got that clarified, I continue to wish you to have a good day.

We were already past that. You replied to me and you cited gun homicide statistics comparing the US and UK.

When I respond with the highest per-capita murder-rates enjoyed by many countries in Europe, you forgot what we were talking about, stopped answering my questions, and told me to have a nice day. I'd call that a rout, but no, a socialist-leaning poster from Russia ("Leningrad"?) agitating Americans about their rule of law isn't going to serve you here. Russia's murder rates are atrocious. Russia's been described as a "Mafia State" in Wikileaks. I like Russia for a lot of reasons, family being one. But if you think that America's gun laws have left us less safe than you, you are dreadfully mistaken.

[Corp]

Wasn't my intent, full aware that there's far more sane Americans than nutters. Edited it to make it clearer.

[Stellar]

The guns are often stolen, and if not then it's already illegal to murder people and that doesn't seem to stop people from doing it anyway.

If you truly believe this logic, then you should have no problem leaving your doors unlocked and never locking your car doors. Hell, just leave the windows open. A locked door isnt going to stop a criminal, they'll just break the window, right?

[Wickian]

If you truly believe this logic, then you should have no problem leaving your doors unlocked and never locking your car doors. Hell, just leave the windows open. A locked door isnt going to stop a criminal, they'll just break the window, right?

I'd much rather have a guard dog than a locked door. And yes, if someone really wants to break into your house(in the situation they're targeting you specifically), then a locked door will do nothing to stop them. You'd be better off ready to defend your property with a warning system(dog or alarm).

Locking a car door makes sense though.

[Stellar]

Locking a car door makes sense though.

Why? Because it prevents crimes of opportunity. Similarly, stricter gun control/removing guns from the system will prevent crimes of opportunity. This whole talk of the black market for guns is nonsense.

[glorybebe]

I saw a note from a former teacher on the CBC boards who basically said he would quit if someone tried to arm him. That he doesn't need that added stress. I would imagine that most teachers would take a similar view.

I would think so, too. I couldn't imagine the stress on their shoulders if they were expected to have guns.

[preacherman76]

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Why would I assume that? Because these kids that commit suicide after the shootings are clearly not afraid of dying or being shot. So what will the end result be? One kid trying to kill as many kids as possible, but this time from some sort of cover, while a fearful teacher pulls out his gun and tries to kill the kid on the rampage, probably missing him with most of the bullets because pistols are difficult to aim. Compound that by all the other people who fire back in fear, since you want "everyone to have a gun". There will be stray bullets everywhere and, coupled with overpenetration, it'll also result in much greater collateral damage.

Why do I think this will happen? Because thats american culture. Thats exactly why it'll happen.

Cry about how "uninformed" I am all you want, the stats say otherwise. Compare gun-related deaths in the US to any other western country with stricter gun control laws.

And you know what? I pretty much agree with you that guns arent a problem. Its the people. Its the culture. The culture, however, isnt going to be and cant be changed any time soon, so the only sensible option is to make it more difficult to obtain guns.

And undoubtedly you're going to come back and say that "criminals will always find ways of getting guns". Well sure, the career criminals definitely will, but you know who wont? All the criminals of opportunity, which by far outweigh the career criminals, will not be going to the "black market" and just "obtaining" a gun. 16yo Joe Bloggins who want's to kill his teacher for failing him on his algebra exam is going to go get his daddy's shotgun. He's not going to run off to the dark alleys asking every crack addict he sees for a gun dealer.

What the hell are you talking about?

[JGirl]

We were already past that. You replied to me and you cited gun homicide statistics comparing the US and UK.

When I respond with the highest per-capita murder-rates enjoyed by many countries in Europe, you forgot what we were talking about, stopped answering my questions, and told me to have a nice day. I'd call that a rout, but no, a socialist-leaning poster from Russia ("Leningrad"?) agitating Americans about their rule of law isn't going to serve you here. Russia's murder rates are atrocious. Russia's been described as a "Mafia State" in Wikileaks. I like Russia for a lot of reasons, family being one. But if you think that America's gun laws have left us less safe than you, you are dreadfully mistaken.

yeah, duck lips and hi powered weaponry. sexy

[Yamato]

yeah, duck lips and hi powered weaponry. sexy

A helluva lot sexier than hiding behind their skirts or running to the government to keep them "safe".

[JGirl]

A helluva lot sexier than hiding behind their skirts or running to the government to keep them "safe".

lol if you say so