ozman Posted January 23, 2013 #76 Share Posted January 23, 2013 That won't stop anyone with enough money from secretly doing it on some island out there like in Jurassic park. Btw, wasn't it in the news that some people out there in the world already have neanderthal genes due to neanderthals mixing with humans way back in the past? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Ad hoc Posted January 23, 2013 #77 Share Posted January 23, 2013 That won't stop anyone with enough money from secretly doing it on some island out there like in Jurassic park. Btw, wasn't it in the news that some people out there in the world already have neanderthal genes due to neanderthals mixing with humans way back in the past? yep. although it's debated now. 1-4% on average for europeans & asians (although asians might be a teeny bit higher if I remember right). which is about the same as having a great great great grandparent that is a neanderthal if it stands. and yeah, what goes on behind closed high-echelon doors is another matter again. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
3.0 Posted January 24, 2013 #78 Share Posted January 24, 2013 Trying to resurrect past humans; seems to be playing God to me. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Myles Posted January 24, 2013 #79 Share Posted January 24, 2013 Trying to resurrect past humans; seems to be playing God to me. Where do you draw the line? Bringing back an animal? Bringing back a plant? Helping someone stay alive when they are dieing of natural causes? Helping a beached whale? Just saying that "playing God" already happens. 2 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Taun Posted January 24, 2013 #80 Share Posted January 24, 2013 (edited) Where do you draw the line? Bringing back an animal? Bringing back a plant? Helping someone stay alive when they are dieing of natural causes? Helping a beached whale? Just saying that "playing God" already happens. While I agree with the gist of what you posted... there are other considerations... Bringing back a dinosaur - for example - fills a niche for researching what they were really like... they can be studied, examined, even disected when dead to learn more - they can be kept in a 'zoo' or preserve like in the movies... but a humanoid? can we justify bringing one back to be kept in a cage to be studied? At least a person kept in jail is (theoretically at least) there as a result of their misdeeds... A reborn neanderthal (or earlier species of homo-) would be imprisoned for life for the crime of being born... Or are they going to bring them back and just turn them loose?... I don't think so... Bringing a Neanderthal back fills no niche for research... we would not learn anything about their societies, their beliefs, customs, habits, etc... only their biology and that would be suspect because of the human surrogates that carried them, sharing genetic material... Edited January 24, 2013 by Taun 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Ad hoc Posted January 24, 2013 #81 Share Posted January 24, 2013 Where do you draw the line? Bringing back an animal? Bringing back a plant? Helping someone stay alive when they are dieing of natural causes? Helping a beached whale? Just saying that "playing God" already happens. indeed, I can't stand that phrase, because it gets thrown around a lot whilst meaning almost nothing. Better not let an ambulance crew bring you back with a defibrilator- harnessing the primal electrical force of nature and sending it through the heart of a body that's just 'died' to get it beating again and bring the person back to life is as much playing god as anything. On the other side of it- how can you even 'play' god? if you can really wield special powers reserved for god, then you must be (a) god. or else you're just working with tools you've been given- either BY god if there is one, or by the nature of the universe if there isn't. Either way you're 'playing' human. 2 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Ad hoc Posted January 24, 2013 #82 Share Posted January 24, 2013 (edited) While I agree with the gist of what you posted... there are other considerations... Bringing back a dinosaur - for example - fills a niche for researching what they were really like... they can be studied, examined, even disected when dead to learn more - they can be kept in a 'zoo' or preserve like in the movies... but a humanoid? can we justify bringing one back to be kept in a cage to be studied? At least a person kept in jail is (theoretically at least) there as a result of their misdeeds... A reborn neanderthal (or earlier species of homo-) would be imprisoned for life for the crime of being born... Or are they going to bring them back and just turn them loose?... I don't think so... Bringing a Neanderthal back fills no niche for research... we would not learn anything about their societies, their beliefs, customs, habits, etc... only their biology and that would be suspect because of the human surrogates that carried them, sharing genetic material... that's just a position on whether it's moral, or a good idea, or not. I think myles was specifically reacting to the platitude 'playing god' Edited January 24, 2013 by ad hoc 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Myles Posted January 24, 2013 #83 Share Posted January 24, 2013 (edited) indeed, I can't stand that phrase, because it gets thrown around a lot whilst meaning almost nothing. Better not let an ambulance crew bring you back with a defibrilator- harnessing the primal electrical force of nature and sending it through the heart of a body that's just 'died' to get it beating again and bring the person back to life is as much playing god as anything. On the other side of it- how can you even 'play' god? if you can really wield special powers reserved for god, then you must be (a) god. or else you're just working with tools you've been given- either BY god if there is one, or by the nature of the universe if there isn't. Either way you're 'playing' human. That is an awesome take on the phrase "playing God". Edited January 24, 2013 by Myles Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
freetoroam Posted January 24, 2013 #84 Share Posted January 24, 2013 (edited) It's all a lie by the press, they misunderstood what he said in an interview. Read this article that shows he is not pursuing this project at all. http://www.8newsnow....r-a-neanderthal As ozman has pointed out here, looks like the Neanderthal Frankenstein if off, or rather, was never on in the first place. maybe he saw this thread and decided against the idea. This thread was posted on the 19th, the article on the 22nd. But this does not mean there are not many other Frankensteins out there, making sure they do not do any interviews with Der Spiegel. Edited January 24, 2013 by freetoroam Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Myles Posted January 24, 2013 #85 Share Posted January 24, 2013 While I agree with the gist of what you posted... there are other considerations... Bringing back a dinosaur - for example - fills a niche for researching what they were really like... they can be studied, examined, even disected when dead to learn more - they can be kept in a 'zoo' or preserve like in the movies... but a humanoid? can we justify bringing one back to be kept in a cage to be studied? At least a person kept in jail is (theoretically at least) there as a result of their misdeeds... A reborn neanderthal (or earlier species of homo-) would be imprisoned for life for the crime of being born... Or are they going to bring them back and just turn them loose?... I don't think so... Bringing a Neanderthal back fills no niche for research... we would not learn anything about their societies, their beliefs, customs, habits, etc... only their biology and that would be suspect because of the human surrogates that carried them, sharing genetic material... I agree, but some would argue that it is nearly as bad to bring a dinosaur back to just keep it caged up. I'm not one of them. 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Taun Posted January 24, 2013 #86 Share Posted January 24, 2013 I agree, but some would argue that it is nearly as bad to bring a dinosaur back to just keep it caged up. I'm not one of them. The dinos wouldn't need to be 'caged'... we could put them all on some island, like... Japan maybe! let them roam free - the Japanese shouldn't mind, after all they've dealt with Godzilla for all those years - a few cute and cuddly T-Rex's and Raptors should be no problem at all! 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
freetoroam Posted January 24, 2013 #87 Share Posted January 24, 2013 The dinos wouldn't need to be 'caged'... we could put them all on some island, like... Japan maybe! let them roam free - the Japanese shouldn't mind, after all they've dealt with Godzilla for all those years - a few cute and cuddly T-Rex's and Raptors should be no problem at all! Not very fair though on the poor old dino, Japan are riddled with Earthquakes, best they go somewhere where they will not get harmed again, be it by humans or another natural disaster, say maybe........Mars? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Taun Posted January 24, 2013 #88 Share Posted January 24, 2013 Not very fair though on the poor old dino, Japan are riddled with Earthquakes, best they go somewhere where they will not get harmed again, be it by humans or another natural disaster, say maybe........Mars? Wow... think how fast a raptor would be at 38% gravity!!! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Space Commander Travis Posted January 24, 2013 #89 Share Posted January 24, 2013 Not very fair though on the poor old dino, Japan are riddled with Earthquakes, best they go somewhere where they will not get harmed again, be it by humans or another natural disaster, say maybe........Mars? it might help if they were able to breathe, though ... Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Myles Posted January 28, 2013 #90 Share Posted January 28, 2013 it might help if they were able to breathe, though ... Good thought. Since the oxygen levels were different for the dino's, wouldn't they need to be kept in a regulated containment? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
xxxch00bxxx Posted January 28, 2013 #91 Share Posted January 28, 2013 (edited) Where do you draw the line? Bringing back an animal? Bringing back a plant? Helping someone stay alive when they are dieing of natural causes? Helping a beached whale? Just saying that "playing God" already happens. You are a beautiful human being i agree that term has always annoyed me to great lengths. It only leads to a few scenarios: 1: We can do it because we are responsible enough to do it, and your God wants us to do it. 2: God just forgot to nerf our intelligence. 3: How are we able to do it, if only God can, The answer God does not exist. We had dire wolves, giant bears, smilodons, ground sloths, mammoths, cheetahs, giant flightless birds and lots of other mega fauna in the Americas and yet, I don't think it a good idea to bring any of those back either. Suppose science creates 2000 neanderthals. Where do they go? Who is going to govern them? How do you keep them on their Reservation? How are they going to get money? Suppose they can easily speak English, or German, or Korean... whatever... and it turns out they are intelligent and want to be part of the world, then what? Just let them mingle back into society? Perhaps... but then doesn't that counter the entire reason for the experiment at all? Suppose then they want to intermarry with the "Regular" humans? Will their be laws to forbid that? Will they have full Rights in the nation they live in? It is just a very big Can of Worms, with little to gain. Bring back a couple might be science worthy, but then so is any number of genetic experiments that are generally forbidden for many reasons. They are gone and it would be the more moral thing to do to leave them that way. I beg to differ there is unlimited potential to gain from studying a hominid who attributed its DNA to many humans that exist today, with regards to the animals you mentioned it would be best they stayed extinct, mainly for the environment they lived in will now not be able to sustain them at all. Edited January 28, 2013 by xxxch00bxxx 2 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
freetoroam Posted January 28, 2013 #92 Share Posted January 28, 2013 it might help if they were able to breathe, though ... I have wondered about the atmosphere in their days. It was fine for them, but is the reason man was not around then because of the atmosphere and climatic conditions were not suitable for us? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
freetoroam Posted January 28, 2013 #93 Share Posted January 28, 2013 with regards to the animals you mentioned it would be best they stayed extinct, mainly for the environment they lived in will now not be able to sustain them at all. Are you phychic? i was just asking this! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Erowin Posted February 1, 2013 #94 Share Posted February 1, 2013 Oh come on, when am I getting my mammoth! I better be paying for a mammal ride in the next few years, if they're so sure they can clone things! 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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