Japan will never stop whaling, minister says

[Pop It and Shove It 742]

That is a fail....

Whales are endangered, or close to it.

Pigs, chickens, cows, etc. are no where near that. If the numbers of Cows, chickens, and pigs drop to a alarming level ( actually well before that ) we would stop killing them.

If whales had the numbers as cows, chickens, and pigs. Hell, Salmon, Cod, Shrimp...( Salmon numbers are dropping though ) I would not be complaining, and I doubt as many would be.

Stupid comparison in my opinion.

Perhaps you should read between the lines of what I said. It's only okay to slaughter animals if there's plenty around? Well by that logic, you wouldn't have cared on 9/11, only a few thousand people died, right? Or, is your next comment going to be that, that is yet again a stupid comparison because human life is more important, right? I think so, you don't seem the compassionate kind to me.

Just my opinion

[Sakari 9,740]

Perhaps you should read between the lines of what I said. It's only okay to slaughter animals if there's plenty around? Well by that logic, you wouldn't have cared on 9/11, only a few thousand people died, right? Or, is your next comment going to be that, that is yet again a stupid comparison because human life is more important, right? I think so, you don't seem the compassionate kind to me.

Just my opinion

That, by far, is the stupidist thing, and most selfish, and heartless statement I have ever seen, on any site....Anywhere, period.

You crossed the line there.......I would love for you to say that anywhere near my presence, or the brothers that feel the same.....You are sick, trully sick.

I have done a ton of charity work for 9/11, in the form of Tributes. ( motorcycle)

Iron Nation in Reno....

The Iron Nation Motorcycle Club’s annual Iron Nation 911 Run raised $20,000 in 2011 to support the Nevada Military Support Alliance. Since its debut in September of 2001, the Iron Nation 911 run has contributed a total of over $120,000 to the Nevada Military Support Alliance.

The Iron Nation Motorcycle Club organized as a nonprofit in 2004, and prides itself on its charitable events set up to raise money for those who are in need or are less fortunate. The club has been contributing event proceeds from the Iron Nation 911 run to the Nevada Military Support Alliance for the past 7 years.

The Nevada Military Support Alliance is a nonprofit organization dedicated to providing support to all Nevadans who have served or are presently serving in the United States military, as well as military families.

“The Nevada Military Support Alliance is very thankful for the continued support of the Iron Nation Motorcycle Club, and humbled by their generous contributions through the annual Iron Nation 911 run,” said Perry DiLoreto, President of the Nevada Military Support Alliance.

[Artaxerxes 134]

Whales, Dolphins, Elephants, Porpoises, Gorillas, Chimpanzees, Bonobos, Parrots, and possibly quite a few other species are sentient, and/or "conscious", and hunting and killing them is very similar to hunting and killing humans as far as I'm concerned.

They should be given "personhood" status; not that it would stop the Japanese and other cultures from killing and eating them. They hunt and kill and eat gorillas and chimpanzees in Africa which makes me sad.

Art

[Pop It and Shove It 742]

Yes, "heartless" for giving a sht about the poor wildlife on this planet that is slaughtered each and every day just so you can have yourself a chicken burger at McDonalds

I care about 9/11 go ahead on your tirade to now demonise me further than you've already tried. You give a sht about those who died on 9/11 but don't give a damn for the innocent animals who die every day, unless they're endangered? Am I following this right? YOUR logic is it's okay to kill if there is a lot of population, not mine. I'm anti killing, period Take a look in the mirror my friend

Edited March 20, 2013 by The Skater Boy

[Yamato 13,197]

Are you also against deer hunting? Turkey? Fishing?

If populations of turkey or deer were counted in the tens of thousands instead of the tens of millions, you better believe that, like whales, I'd be against hunting those species.

Fishing is the most ecologically destructive industry on the face of the earth. The exception would be farm-raised fish, and the determining factor is whether or not a species can be farmed so we're not unwitting dupes participating in the economics of extinction. Some kinds of fish can be, like salmon. Other kinds cannot, like tuna. The oceans affect the entire planet, they require the planet's attention. We're absolutely raping our oceans so yeah I'm against "fishing" when we're fishing out the oceans and destroying entire ecosystems for little to no good reason. .

[Sakari 9,740]

Yes, "heartless" for giving a sht about the poor wildlife on this planet that is slaughtered each and every day just so you can have yourself a chicken burger at McDonalds

I care about 9/11 go ahead on your tirade to now demonise me further than you've already tried. You give a sht about those who died on 9/11 but don't give a damn for the innocent animals who die every day, unless they're endangered? Am I following this right? YOUR logic is it's okay to kill if there is a lot of population, not mine. I'm anti killing, period Take a look in the mirror my friend

I bow hunted for over 20 years. I bird hunted also. I know a lot about sustaining populations of wildlife. I have not hunted in over 10 years, do not care to anymore. I love my steak though.

I do not care if you do not eat meat, if you do not wear clothes, if you love God, or if you are gay or heterosexual. What you do is your business, what I do is mine..

I do hate the fact that people are killing Whales and Dolphins. ( Japanese )

No one should ever us 9/11 victims as a example when it comes to animals. That is just sick. And there is no excuse for that.

[Pop It and Shove It 742]

So you're saying human life is more important than animal life, that's fine - like I said, people have differing belief systems nothing "sick" about begging to differ. Life is life to me and nothing is more important than anything else.

[Sakari 9,740]

So you're saying human life is more important than animal life, that's fine - like I said, people have differing belief systems nothing "sick" about begging to differ. Life is life to me and nothing is more important than anything else.

As I said in the PM.....9/11 is very personal to me, and many others. If you had said humans, that would have been different. My sister feels the same as you.

I also feel Dogs are better then humans by far. Unconditional love, something we do not have. ( very rare )

Chickens cows and pigs, yes, we will have to disagree.

[Pop It and Shove It 742]

I apologise, as I did in the PM, if it was a little unsensitive of me. I do value animal life and human with the same weight, so we will indeed have to agree to disagree.

Again, sorry if my comment was hurtful.

[CrimsonKing 18,479]

One odd coincidence i have noticed from this and a few other threads

Most Americans who are for gun rights are against hunting certain species.

Most Europeans who are anti-gun are all for hunting all species equally.

Then we have the odd few like coffey (no offense meant btw) who are against guns and against hunting certain species.

Just a observation back to topic for any discussing haha

[FLOMBIE 3,287]

I don't think there is any connection, though. Two completely different topics.

[CrimsonKing 18,479]

I don't think there is any connection, though. Two completely different topics.

Didnt mean it in a bad way,just how our cultures differ has a few common factors that are shared.Might be a way of seeing some reasoning between our debates sometimes.

[FLOMBIE 3,287]

Most people you'd ask in Germany would tell you they are strictly against whaling. My position is the minority. And I am also not really pro whaling, as I am not really anti gun. I'm somewhere in the middle.

That said I think minke whaling might be alright, if set limits won't be exceeded and the population is kept under observation but blue whales, for example, should not be hunted.

[Myles 9,850]

If populations of turkey or deer were counted in the tens of thousands instead of the tens of millions, you better believe that, like whales, I'd be against hunting those species.

Fishing is the most ecologically destructive industry on the face of the earth. The exception would be farm-raised fish, and the determining factor is whether or not a species can be farmed so we're not unwitting dupes participating in the economics of extinction. Some kinds of fish can be, like salmon. Other kinds cannot, like tuna. The oceans affect the entire planet, they require the planet's attention. We're absolutely raping our oceans so yeah I'm against "fishing" when we're fishing out the oceans and destroying entire ecosystems for little to no good reason. .

Fair enough. So for you it's not about the cruelty, it is about preserving the animals with lower populations.

[Frank Merton 17,401]

Animals that show evidence of advanced intelligence should not be killed if at all possible. That just makes sense.

The question then is where do we draw the line. Are human beings the only ones protected by that rule? I would rather err on the side of caution and not kill primates or cetacians.

[third_eye 24,119]

How about ...

"animals that shows evidence of great stupidity should be killed when possible .... Makes better sense to me ... no ?"

but then some will try to smart up and claim that humans are not 'animals'

I suggest we shoot them first .... seems the only animal capable of stupidity is humans

Edited March 20, 2013 by third_eye

[Sakari 9,740]

How about ...

"animals that shows evidence of great stupidity should be killed when possible .... Makes better sense to me ... no ?"

but then some will try to smart up and claim that humans are not 'animals'

I suggest we shoot them first .... seems the only animal capable of stupidity is humans

We are the ones destroying the Earth with our greed, and ignorance.

That is why I all ways say ....

" we need a plague "

I apologise, as I did in the PM, if it was a little unsensitive of me. I do value animal life and human with the same weight, so we will indeed have to agree to disagree.

Again, sorry if my comment was hurtful.

Accepted....

[psyche101 23,079]

Nobody ever sat down with the Japanese and asked them to stop killing whales like grown ups, and you think that's the problem? If only the world wasn't so immature, your mature question asking Japan to stop would work? You've got to be kidding!

Yes it is the problem, and the 1986 moratorium is outright proof of it. Not one Whale taken by the Japanese in 1987. What year has the Sea Shepherd enjoyed such success in it's 36 years of terrorist actions?

If you know so much better than pirates and politicians, why don't you do something? It's not enough to snip at others when we don't agree with what they're doing. If you're so right, why don't you go say something mature and effective to the Japanese and change their minds? What are you waiting for? Do you need some email addresses and other contact information to help you out? Or are you going to come back with more excuses for inaction and more complaints about action that are surely just signs of maturity and knowing what you're doing?

Because I am not in parliament, so I will not be taken into account. That's the rules. and we all have to play by them. I am doing something, I am voting against those idiots who do not even know where the fence is in their backyard. If you have some email addresses then present them, I would be more than happy to ask the Japanese to sepal out on this issue. They probably have the same misconceptions we in Australia do, in the we think every Japanese person is strongly pro whaling, and we are not all stupid enough to not know our own recognised borders or support the Sea Shepherd.

A little maturity would go a long way, it's a page from a book you might want to take note of. Your ranting is not going to convert anyone who has a working brain in their head.

Conservationists don't complain that the river is dirty. Conservationists clean up the river. DO something besides complain about people while acting like you have a monopoly on maturity and common sense the rest of the world lacks. Your pattern is just dumping blame at everyone doing something to fight back and forgetting to dump the blame on the Japanese government where it belongs. Japan should be asked out of Australian waters that Australia recognizes via warship, and your ill-formed opinion that can't even recognize your own country's sovereign waters isn't going to affect the debate, much less end Japan's goons from doing their barbaric business.

Yes, conservations DO something, they do not get a TV show happening and capitalise upon the situation. As the Sea Shepherd does. How much money from Whale Wars goes to support programs to help injured whales back into the water?

I keep telling you that you cannot make up boundaries and expect people to live by your rules, Australia's waters are not breached, that sovereignty is not recognised. This is the sort of BS that Paul Watson spouts that people, even some pollies it would seem believe Show me a map where Whaling has occurred in Australian Waters please. The made up claim that stretches to the Antarctica is in globally recognised. Norway has a claim on the Antarctic, do you think all water between Norway and the Antarctic are Norway's Sovereign waters?

[psyche101 23,079]

You don't even respect your own country's position. The best country in the world for affecting this issue and you want to sit in the corner and cower. You don't understand boundaries at all, nor can you understand facts like Australia (not a few "idiot" politicians) officially recognizes its own sovereign territory.

I know my countries position, I bet your not even an Aussie, ands you are paying terrorists to invade out waters!! Keep your good intentions to yourself please, they are not wanted down under. The only person benefiting form your contributions in the Southern Hemisphere is Paul Watson and the TV show who capitalises on this grim situation. And I'd be more than happy to publicly debate that so and so Watson any day. But he is still on the run from warrants, so I doubt I

You do not even understand politics. Thos morons probably know they do not have a leg to stand on with regards to sovereign waters, but it gets them not only in the papers, but in the middle of a big debate, and they are portrayed as benevolent, and you feel for it. You cannot buy publicity like that, so they get people like the Sea Shepherd and capitalise on that publicity. If anything, you are giving the worst Government this country has ever had a leg up in the next election. As you do not have to put up with these idiots in power who bought the election through facebook, and then stabbed their way to the top, but you are helping their public profile, so your contribution hurts Australia in two ways. That's enough reason to get rid of the Sea Shepherd alone.

I wish you do gooders would actually do some good.

Here is a map of Australian Territorial Waters, as requested before, please place marks on it where you believe Japan has whaled in our waters. Because they have not, you just making that up based on the uninformed opinion of a politician.

As an Aussie, I'd like to say that it'd be nice if you stopped trying to help.

Even if that does mean your favourite show is cancelled.

Edited March 21, 2013 by psyche101

[psyche101 23,079]

If populations of turkey or deer were counted in the tens of thousands instead of the tens of millions, you better believe that, like whales, I'd be against hunting those species.

Fishing is the most ecologically destructive industry on the face of the earth. The exception would be farm-raised fish, and the determining factor is whether or not a species can be farmed so we're not unwitting dupes participating in the economics of extinction. Some kinds of fish can be, like salmon. Other kinds cannot, like tuna. The oceans affect the entire planet, they require the planet's attention. We're absolutely raping our oceans so yeah I'm against "fishing" when we're fishing out the oceans and destroying entire ecosystems for little to no good reason. .

Leatherback Sea Turtles are critically endangered, removal of Shark Nets and Drift nets (line caught Tuna ONLY would also be a help here) would be a major first step toward helping them. Does the Sea Shepherd know they exist, or ask Australia's politicians to remove the nets, and replace them with more effective acoustic devices? Would they make such a request from politicians who are making up territorial boundaries and spilling this misconception to the media ad who also offer safe harbour to the Sea Shepherd? It would have NOTHING to do with the HUGE amount of free publicity, would it now?

That is what a conservationist would do is it not? Help ALL marine life in ALL countries? Why does Australia get such a free ride when our cetacean management is in the toilet? LINK - Removing Walls of Death.

Edited March 21, 2013 by psyche101

[Yamato 13,197]

Fair enough. So for you it's not about the cruelty, it is about preserving the animals with lower populations.

It's about preserving natural habitats, ecosystems and species foremost.

Why shouldn't it also be about cruelty? Tell me, what is the crueler? Nearly beheading a cow at a slaughterhouse and killing it almost immediately, or shooting a whale in the back of the head with a harpoon and watching it suffer, panic and struggle until it drowns on its own blood more than 20 minutes later? If cruelty is the reason to further agree with me, I will accept that application also.

[Yamato 13,197]

Leatherback Sea Turtles are critically endangered, removal of Shark Nets and Drift nets (line caught Tuna ONLY would also be a help here) would be a major first step toward helping them. Does the Sea Shepherd know they exist, or ask Australia's politicians to remove the nets, and replace them with more effective acoustic devices? Would they make such a request from politicians who are making up territorial boundaries and spilling this misconception to the media ad who also offer safe harbour to the Sea Shepherd? It would have NOTHING to do with the HUGE amount of free publicity, would it now?

That is what a conservationist would do is it not? Help ALL marine life in ALL countries? Why does Australia get such a free ride when our cetacean management is in the toilet? LINK - Removing Walls of Death.

What is your problem with Sea Shepherd getting publicity? They need all the publicity they can get, and a lot more than they currently do.

What is your problem with Australia and who's giving it a free ride? If you're an Aussie like you say you are, stand up and DO something. Again, you're consummately at odds with your own country. If you don't like the best country in the world for its position on whaling, you're hardly credible when claiming you want whaling to end. We don't need perfection or the Lord Jesus Christ to find allies in our battle with illegal Japanese whale poachers. What we need is some courage to stand up and do something about it, not sit around and complain about the people who are.

If Sea Shepherd waited for any country to live up to its own standards, it would never do anything. Sea Shepherd has operations all over the world, sharks and Bluefin to mention a few more, and that's remarkable granted the annual budget that they operate with. I doubt you can appreciate anything that the organization that's actually doing something, is doing. But I appreciate your questions, because it's an opportunity to answer.

http://www.seashephe...longlining.html

[media=]

[/media] Edited March 21, 2013 by Yamato

[WoIverine 1,784]

"The second angel poured out his bowl into the sea, and it became blood like that of a dead man; and every living thing in the sea died." That'll curtail the whaling problem just a little bit.

[CrimsonKing 18,479]

Our oceans are already dieing at an incredible rate due to pollution and disasters such as the oil spill and fukushima.The dead zones are growing more every year,i just think we should take care of what we have before it is all gone.

[psyche101 23,079]

What is your problem with Sea Shepherd getting publicity? They need all the publicity they can get, and a lot more than they currently do.

That is ALL the Sea Shepherd does. Garner publicity. You have convinced yourself that they do more than that, but you are wrong. The token gestures for the TV shows only ensure the TV show will have another season of Whale Wars.

What is your problem with Australia and who's giving it a free ride? If you're an Aussie like you say you are, stand up and DO something. Again, you're consummately at odds with your own country. If you don't like the best country in the world for its position on whaling, you're hardly credible when claiming you want whaling to end. We don't need perfection or the Lord Jesus Christ to find allies in our battle with illegal Japanese whale poachers. What we need is some courage to stand up and do something about it, not sit around and complain about the people who are.

What is my problem? I AM an Aussie, my taxpayer dollars assist, and clean up the messes these jerk offs leave behind. I am not happy that one brown cent that I work hard for goes to that terrorist organisation, and with their international pay TV "incentive" I will never get these filthy mongrels out of my pocket. I want REAL conservation, not an endless show pretending they care. If you are dim enough to give your money to these pirates, fine, but house them in your own backyard too. Not mine thanks. As an Aussie, I'd like to tell you and the Sea Shepherd to rack off. We do not want you or your so called BS help. Nor do we want your BS about Sovereign waters that nobody recognises. Go some other place and make your stupid show.

What does being the best country in the world have to do with anything?

Yeah, we do need courage not some jumped up upstart pirating his way across the seas we need someone with the fortitude to say "Hey Japan, we totally screwed up with the last moratorium, what would it take to get you to reconsider that position?"

Like in the year 19787 when Japan did not take even one whale. Thanks to negotiation.

Not some idiot throwing rancid butter at boats. What they hell do you think that is actually doing? Making them all stinky huh! That showed them Whalers!

What we need is for you do gooders to stay in your own country and shut the hell up. If you want the stupid TV show so bad, shoot it in your own backyard!

I feel exactly the same way about you. I do not think you give a rodents rectum about Whaling, just Whale Wars. You do not understand sovereign waters one little bit, and when I offered to ask Marine Biologists to come into the other thread and explain it in better than I have you insulted me in PM. You have issues Yam, anger issues. So does Watson, and that is your problem. You cannot even maintain yourself in a forum without having to resort to PM to insult!

If Sea Shepherd waited for any country to live up to its own standards, it would never do anything. Sea Shepherd has operations all over the world, sharks and Bluefin to mention a few more, and that's remarkable granted the annual budget that they operate with. I doubt you can appreciate anything that the organization that's actually doing something, is doing. But I appreciate your questions, because it's an opportunity to answer.

http://www.seashephe...longlining.html

And I am glad you did answer, I have asked you before to not bother with Youtube, as I do not hold it in very high regard as my signature says, but I did read the link, and it says exactly what I have been saying. There is collusion between the Sea Shepherd and some rotten mongrel in Australia's Labour/Green Government. Dirty politicians, who I would not mind betting get a cut from Whale Wars. From your link:

Commission for the Conservation of Southern Bluefin Tuna (CCSBT): Since 1992, Australia, Japan, and New Zealand have ordered seabird mitigation measures to be used in their Southern bluefin tuna longline fishery and made the use of bird-scaring lines mandatory in their fisheries. In 1996, Australia required all vessels fishing below 30 degrees south latitude to use bird-scaring lines.

Notice how the Sea Shepherd turns a blind eye to Australia's long lines because of some BS excuse? What the hell is bird scaring going to do 30 degrees below south latitude? Save half the birds is better than none is it? How many Australian Ships do they mention confiscating lines from? Are they trying to say no fishing vessels from Australia use long lines? Get real man! It's a free pass, and why? Because of the mongrels taking the payoff from those bloody pirates Gee, hope you do not mind the idea of you donation being used for graft and corruption! Might have been a nice bottle of red for some moron pollie even. Appropriate that would be.

You are a perfect example of TV conservation. You think you are doing the right thing, yet in the end, all you are keeping alive is a TV show that capitalises on that which you think you are assisting. The Sea Shepherd are terrorist crooks. Nothing more, and there are warrants to prove it.

Even the International Whaling Commission revokes their observers status, and calls them terrorists, these are the people who you are trying to actually help by not helping, yet even when the highest whaling authority on the planet, who know more about whales than Paul Watson does about TV, are asking them to rack off. What does it take to get the message across? The Sea Shepherd is not welcomed by thinking Aussies, nor is the Whale Wars show helpful in any way. Go away pirates. And keep your money Yam. Spend it in whatever country you live in. Stop Bloody Helping! It's not wanted!

Are you American by any chance Yam? Is that your problem? You know it was a decision from your country that created this situation that we have today, and you want to shift the blame is it?

Edited March 21, 2013 by psyche101