Jump to content
Join the Unexplained Mysteries community today! It's free and setting up an account only takes a moment.
- Sign In or Create Account -
F3SS

Guns save lives thread

2,946 posts in this topic

Recommended Posts

Michelle

Kill an enemy, designed for war intended to kill a person - little doubt about it.

Br Cornelius

*sigh* I've gone against my own advice in feeding the troll. Yes, every weapon since the beginning of time was designed to kill other humans and not for food. Thank you China and Europe for sending your cultural advances to a new world...the US. We are, after all, your descendants.

  • Like 2

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
Shiloh17

Let's take all the guns away from the law abiding citizens. Then, only the non-law abiding citizens will own guns.

This is the reason I own guns, to protect myself from those who shouldn't have guns.

  • Like 5

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
ciriuslea

The genie is well and truly out of the bottle, people like to kill each other and every other species on the planet.

Fact is if we didn't have guns we would have other weapons, guns are just one link in the long chain of weapons, they're the most effective means of killing a person which is why they're so popular. even used for defence the issue is to disable quick and effectively..you need guns in society because you have guns in society, the irony in that is incredible

  • Like 4

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
Bavarian Raven

Another thing to point out and question is, we often here X many people are shot every year in the US of A. Well that's true and all, but how many of those X people who were shot were committing a crime at the time of their shooting? IE, how many of those "victims" were robbers/muggers/attempted murders, etc.

From looking at the US stats (2009 ), there were 31,347 deaths. The #1 cause of firearm related deaths is suicides (~60%). So those don't count in the sense of gun control arguments... chances are a good many of those people would have killed themselves one way or another. The #2 cause were Homicides at roughly 36% or 11,493. The third leading cause was accidental deaths, at 554 or 2%. The fourth cause was self defence - 333 deaths or roughly 1.5%. The fifth cause was a column of undetermined deaths at 232 or roughly 1%.

So of the 31,347 people killed, 65% or 20,375 deaths are not the result of violent crime/murder/homicide, while 35% were. You are right in a manner or speaking, that is a decently large number - just under 11,000 people killed every year or 30 people a day. 0.00001% of the US population a day.

Now all this being said - what the stats don't take into account are all the lives saved/crimes prevented via the usage of firearms or the simple presence of one (ie, doesn't take into account criminals scared away/shot and survived). Now this number varies widely, depending on the source of the stats, etc, but it is anywhere from as low as a hundred thousand to 2.5 million. That's a lot of crimes prevented and lives/property potentially saved. One number that is commonly used is that roughly 100,000 to 200,000 rapes/sexual assaults/attempted abductions against females are prevented every year in the USA alone via the usage or simply carrying a firearm. Again, the stats for BOTH sides of the arguments are lacking, so when one side says "but the STATS say..." they really don't.

Again, what it really comes down to is liberty/freedom. Do we err on the side of liberty/freedom and allow people to own firearms, knowing there will be some deaths due to this, or do we restrict access to firearms for their own safety? That seems to be the biggest question in this whole debate. Cheers.

Edited by Bavarian Raven
  • Like 4

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
trancelikestate

Fair enough! I may have some Liberal leanings, but mostly I'm middle of the road. I certainly don't have a problem with our 2nd Amendment. I think we could have some Gun Control, but I'm all for people being able to defend themselves. I grew up with guns and have a great deal of respect for them.

You should drink more often! It's probably my only chance of winning an argument with you!! LOL

I too tend to lean more toward the left on my opinions but I don't have a problem with guns. Personally I think fully automatic weapons are pushing it abit, but I do believe people should have a right to carry weapons and defend themselves. Criminals are going to get ahold of guns regardless whether or not they are banned. They're criminals, breaking the law is what they do. At least ordinary people should be allowed to stop them.(I'm also all for vigilantism as well)

And man, you guys think you have it rough in the states, try living up in Canada. Our laws state if we are carrying a knife, nevermind a gun, which is within legal specifications even, and we are asked by police "what is it for" and we reply "for defending ourself" we can get arrested and charged. Basically any weapon whose purpose is to bring harm to another human being, for whatever reason, is illegal.

Edited by trancelikestate
  • Like 2

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
F3SS

*sigh* I've gone against my own advice in feeding the troll. Yes, every weapon since the beginning of time was designed to kill other humans and not for food. Thank you China and Europe for sending your cultural advances to a new world...the US. We are, after all, your descendants.

Couldn't be more true. China invented explosives and Europe exported every trait good and bad to the USA.

  • Like 1

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
Odds

It's funny, here in Australia we have gun deaths around the 200 mark, each year, yet in the US it's around 30 000. And still people justify wanting guns. Perhaps maybe put that thinking cap on....

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
Beckys_Mom

Here, I'd like to start a thread where stories of guns saving lives and properties can be posted instead of making a new thread for every story that must be told. The blaze does an excellent job of posting these stories almost daily. While we are inundated with mind numbing reasonings on restrcition from the likes of Dianne Feinstein and carelessly shoot your shotgun through your front door if you're spooked Joe Biden it seems that we need a one stop area filled with daily tales on the upside of responsible gun ownership. All the stories like that get spread too thin and overlooked. Here, we can have a consolidation of reasoning that can't be ignored. Only time will tell if fellow UMers like this idea. But I'll start. Here goes...

Good job, great story.. Well, the part where he saves her from being kicked to death... I was surprised the cops were pretty decent about the outcome too

I feel that If I lived over there, then I would be armed to protect myself, it would be the logical thing to do...I support the rights of US citizens to carry arms, for there are many times when they do in fact come in very handy...

I have read a few good stories where so many Americans have in fact saved lives with their gun...Some people tend to think that only bad people will do harm with guns, yes this is true, but they forget about the good guys who can save not just themselves but many other helpless victims...

  • Like 3

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
Beckys_Mom

To those of you who are against Americans having guns.. What I feel that tends to be over looked is, if people grow up in a certain way of life, and are used to seeing things and living it a certain way, it's all they know.. In this case it's guns.. Many are raised with guns, like going on hunting trips, heading off to shooting ranges, ( can become the hobby ) and so on..They also have a right to bare arms ( it's in their constitution ) they love it, and many can't imagine being without it, plus they feel more protected with it..... If those rights are taken away, it would be like removing a limb from the body..We know that NO ONE likes having their rights being taken from them..

It is very ( and I mean VERY ) easy to sit here and say things like - "Well, we over here don't have guns and our death toll is much smaller than the US.. I don't like guns, too many die etc etc".. That is so easy to say, because you are used to living in a society that makes it very hard to have a gun, and maybe even ban them, so it's all you know.. You most likely cannot imagine what it would be like if all of a sudden your own country / city started allowing guns...

I have also noticed that some liberals do not like to hear of foreign countries having rights taken away by others, but will gladly vote to have the rights of their own people taken away quick and fast...

I hate the thoughts of having my own freedom and rights taken away, so I feel no one else should face the same...

EDIT - I will most likely get shot down for my statement but hey, It's how I see it...Pun not intended !!!

Edited by Beckys_Mom
  • Like 3

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
Beckys_Mom

I don't get it; this is a thread about guns. Are you trying to censor a poster?

It seems he is.......... A few months ago I was busy working away but took a short break to read some quick stories on here... I read something REALLY stupid from someone (can't recall who and it doesn't matter ) on on a topic similar to this about guns.... He was angry at someone from the UK who was not in favour of guns ...And he replies with - GO HOME ...I read it ( huge font and all ) and thought - Holy crap on a cracker, this dude is thick as a short plank...Does he think that the guy from the UK suddenly went over to the states to post on UM?..What's with the GO HOME chant? Someone should tell him that we are all at home, and it's called posting on the world wide web you numpty lol

Edited by Beckys_Mom
  • Like 1

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
trancelikestate

It's funny, here in Australia we have gun deaths around the 200 mark, each year, yet in the US it's around 30 000. And still people justify wanting guns. Perhaps maybe put that thinking cap on....

the US also has a population of 313 million (15% of which lives below the poverty line where most gun violence occurs). Australias is at about 22 million.

  • Like 1

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
Odds

'We over here' had mass shootings and we passed legislation that that stopped it. I worked on a farm, i fired my first gun at 8, had my own when i was 10. So yes i i was raised with guns. You don't hear me crying that they were taken away. I'm a grown man, i let things like that slide by whille i grew up.

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
Odds

the US also has a population of 313 million (15% of which lives below the poverty line where most gun violence occurs). Australias is at about 22 million.

You're not wrong, but most people who are are poor here try to provide for themselves, buy food, sustainable living,and not go buy a gun.

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
ciriuslea

It's funny, here in Australia we have gun deaths around the 200 mark, each year, yet in the US it's around 30 000. And still people justify wanting guns. Perhaps maybe put that thinking cap on....

Murders involving knifes shot up by as much as 40% according to some websites, so controlling guns has worked to lower gun related deaths, as a consequence people are now using knives.

  • Like 3

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
Kowalski

I thought this thread was about people who had guns that saved their lives, not about a gun debate...there are plenty of threads that have that, or feel free to start one. Nice to know, a perfectly good thread was hijacked....

  • Like 5

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
Odds

So it's now a knife issue? Every person who has a kithen has them.

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
Odds

I thought this thread was about people who had guns that saved their lives, not about a gun debate...there are plenty of threads that have that, or feel free to start one. Nice to know, a perfectly good thread was hijacked....

This is a forum, right? Where people state their opinions? I don't think my opinion was far off topic.

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
Bavarian Raven

It's off topic because a certain group of people came in crying "oh guns are bad. Bwah bwah bwah." Heaven forbid there was a thread showing the times guns have saved lives. Oh wait, that goes against their ingrained views.

Oh and Odds, you may find being disarmed nice, but I've seen too many times in history what happens when people willingly turn in their weapons "in the name of safety". It's never ended well before ;)

  • Like 4

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
Odds

Disarmed? The Governent Payed me because i didn't need it. I don't need it to hunt, i live in Sydney. The worst things we need to be aware of are spiders. If you need to be scared of people with guns, it's because there are guns. Believe it or not, we have your news over here too. Not once in nearly two decades have we seen a mass shooting.

  • Like 3

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
Frank Merton

I don't know that one can start a thread and control it by not permitting posts of people who want to provide evidence that supports the other side. If you want to show that guns save lives, then others posting that gun's don't save lives is fair. If you want to show that monkeys have a secret conspiracy to overthrow mankind, then others posting evidence to the contrary would be perfectly fair.

  • Like 4

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
F3SS

Yes but Frank this thread was doing soo good for soo long and it really was a one topic stop.

  • Like 2

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
Odds

I don't know that one can start a thread and control it by not permitting posts of people who want to provide evidence that supports the other side. If you want to show that guns save lives, then others posting that gun's don't save lives is fair. If you want to show that monkeys have a secret conspiracy to overthrow mankind, then others posting evidence to the contrary would be perfectly fair.

Well said.

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
Frank Merton

Mass shooting or other mass killings can happen anywhere. I think removing guns is a useful thing to do but not a complete solution.

Part of the problem is the glorification of violence in the media. The film industry in particular in the US has been successful and made a lot of money appealing to base instincts of sadism and adventurism, and in the process has cheapened life in the eyes of many, especially the already disturbed, by making such behavior seem common or at least tolerable.

Then there is the publicity such events get in the west. Rather than reporting the facts of the attack, the networks interrupt broadcasting and interview grief-stricken family and other devices to get watchers and readers. This only encourages more of this. Some guidelines restricting the press and so on would help.

Of course "freedom of the press," regardless of the harm such freedom often causes, is strongly defended by the same press, in its selfish interest, and they maintain steady propaganda about how important a free press supposedly is. A few guidelines and some government power here would help society without harming the public's right to know.

Much of the problem comes with mental illnesses; programs to identify those prone in their sickness to violence and committing them, when appropriate, are also needed. Here again the lawyer-bound US doesn't seem to be able to overcome its propaganda about freedom and restrict such people and force treatment, even though it is in their best interest.

  • Like 1

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
Odds

Yes but Frank this thread was doing soo good for soo long and it really was a one topic stop.

It takes two to tango. You can't have a thread, and expect everyone to agree.

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
ciriuslea

So it's now a knife issue? Every person who has a kithen has them.

yes but not everyone uses them to kill people, the point was it doesnt matter what the weapon is as you liked to make clear, gun deaths in Aus fell due to controls, it didn't stop people killing each other, they just found another weapon to use

  • Like 2

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
Guest
This topic is now closed to further replies.

  • Recently Browsing   0 members

    No registered users viewing this page.