Gromdor Posted April 8, 2014 #2426 Share Posted April 8, 2014 Times must have changed since I was in the military. When I was in the MP's had guns, base security had guns, people who got pulled for guard duty had guns, and the munitions troops had guns. If you ever wanted to go shooting then you could go to the base range and sign out a sidearm or rifle and shoot there. Of course if you weren't one of these people you weren't allowed to have guns and they definitely weren't allowed in the barracks (but beer most definitely was.) I guess the logic was that it was easier for the enemy to seize a vital part of the base if they were able to just walk around with weapons in plain view. Only had one instance that I could remember of an airman holding his superior at gun point. That was a munitions guy and he was eventually talked down by the MP's. I can also see how it might be a bad idea to give a 19yr old kid returning from TDY in Iraq to find his wife/girlfriend with his neighbor a sidearm. Soldiers returning from the field definitely do need a readjustment period. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
+DieChecker Posted April 8, 2014 #2427 Share Posted April 8, 2014 if everyone on base would be armed, sergants and officers would be shot quite often, they usually treat enlisted like garbage. from what few of my frieds that went thru army, and deployment told me, most of the time soldiers hate their COs more than enemy. That is rubbish. People hate their in-laws, but you don't see people shooting their in-laws en-mass. There is about zero chance of a soldier shooting at an officer, unless he is suicidal already. 50 years in Leavensworth just isn't worth it. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
+DieChecker Posted April 8, 2014 #2428 Share Posted April 8, 2014 Another example of how guns save lives. http://en.m.wikipedi...t_Hood_shooting How will this one be spun? I think it will be spun as a soldier with mental health issue having a breakdown. I've not read this guys whole story, but I am 100% sure it will be harsh and long. A (normal) guy doesn't get to the point of killing people without a lot of motivation. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
+DieChecker Posted April 8, 2014 #2429 Share Posted April 8, 2014 No. That is probably the worst idea I have ever heard in my life. You think I would want my wife grocery shopping with my children surrounded by guys in their 20's who just got back from Afghanistan carrying guns? On post, my friend. With the expectation of such. Would you rather not have Police being armed? Do you believe that police officers don't get just as burnt out, or have just as bad of Traumatic Stress Disorder as a soldier could? Yet they go armed all the time. Or would you rather only the gang members and career criminals have guns with them at all times? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
aztek Posted April 8, 2014 #2430 Share Posted April 8, 2014 (edited) That is rubbish. People hate their in-laws, but you don't see people shooting their in-laws en-mass. There is about zero chance of a soldier shooting at an officer, unless he is suicidal already. 50 years in Leavensworth just isn't worth it. but people do shoot their inlaws, very much so. when people snap they do not think about prison time, civil or military. i,m pretty sure more shoot their inlaws than soldiers shoot officers. Edited April 8, 2014 by aztek Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Agent0range Posted April 8, 2014 #2431 Share Posted April 8, 2014 On post, my friend. With the expectation of such. Would you rather not have Police being armed? Do you believe that police officers don't get just as burnt out, or have just as bad of Traumatic Stress Disorder as a soldier could? Yet they go armed all the time. Or would you rather only the gang members and career criminals have guns with them at all times? We are talking about tens of thousands of Soldier's per post, and you are comparing it with the amount of officers in a police station? Apples and oranges. Allowing every Soldier on post to carry a weapon at all times WOULD NOT make the base safer. What happened? A couple mass shootings on a post? Far less than the civilian population has..and your knee jerk reaction is to arm the 40,000 Soldiers on Fort Hood and possibly their family members? I'm going to go out on a limb and guess that you are not in charge of making any kind of important decisions at all. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
+DieChecker Posted April 8, 2014 #2432 Share Posted April 8, 2014 (edited) We are talking about tens of thousands of Soldier's per post, and you are comparing it with the amount of officers in a police station? Apples and oranges. Allowing every Soldier on post to carry a weapon at all times WOULD NOT make the base safer. What happened? A couple mass shootings on a post? Far less than the civilian population has..and your knee jerk reaction is to arm the 40,000 Soldiers on Fort Hood and possibly their family members? I'm going to go out on a limb and guess that you are not in charge of making any kind of important decisions at all. The arguement is that if soldiers are armed they could defend themselves. The numbers of such is irrelevant to the discussion. This soldiers rampage was stopped by a MP with a gun that returned fire. Do you agree that if the first couple soldiers that this guy shot at had their own guns that lives would have been saved? Perhaps rather the arming the soldiers, we simply assign many of the "On Post" soldiers to temporary PM status? So we have trained (Rather already trained) and authorized police rather then the "violent idiiot gun happy kids" that you seem to think populates our military. So perhaps one in 4 soldiers is armed.... You can post personnal attacks if you like, I don't care about your babbling, only the relevent points you are making.... Edited April 8, 2014 by DieChecker Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Gromdor Posted April 9, 2014 #2433 Share Posted April 9, 2014 To be brutally honest, military bases have things that are much more important than soldiers. Having base security or MPs show up and shooting everyone that has a weapon in an unauthorized area is a lot easier and safer than trying to pick the "bad guys" out of a large group of confused armed soldiers. 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Sweetpumper Posted April 10, 2014 #2434 Share Posted April 10, 2014 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Rafterman Posted May 22, 2014 #2435 Share Posted May 22, 2014 Good for her. She probably saved both her and her boyfriend's lives. http://www.13abc.com/story/25559271/toledo-woman-with-gun-stops-mugger-with-bat A man was shot in South Toledo while attempting to attack a couple with a bat. It happened Monday afternoon in the 900 block of Vinton Street. Our media partner The Toledo Blade reports the suspect approached the woman and her boyfriend with a bat. He hit the male victim in the arm, but that’s when the woman pulled out a gun and fired twice. The suspect showed up at the University of Toledo Medical Center a short while later seeking treatment for a gunshot wound to the leg. There is no word at this time on whether he will face any charges. 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
F3SS Posted May 22, 2014 Author #2436 Share Posted May 22, 2014 Nice to see that guns are still saving lives. Over a month without a post and I was starting to believe it was a myth. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
andy4 Posted May 22, 2014 #2437 Share Posted May 22, 2014 Nice to see that guns are still saving lives. Over a month without a post and I was starting to believe it was a myth. I'll agree with the above story that it could have, repeat, could have been much worse, but this is one I'll agree with as potentially saving a life. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Silver Surfer Posted May 25, 2014 #2438 Share Posted May 25, 2014 http://edition.cnn.com/video/data/2.0/video/us/2014/05/24/nr-california-shooting-victims-father-press-conference.cnn.html Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
aztek Posted May 25, 2014 #2439 Share Posted May 25, 2014 (edited) of course , first thing he blames, nra, his son was a nut case, i blame the father for ignoring his mental condition. and again, like in most shootings like this, cops could not do a thing to stop him. Edited May 25, 2014 by aztek 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Silver Surfer Posted May 25, 2014 #2440 Share Posted May 25, 2014 (edited) of course , first thing he blames, nra, his son was a nut case, i blame the father for ignoring his mental condition. and again, like in most shootings like this, cops could not do a thing to stop him. That wasn't his father. That was the father of one of the victims... Your correct in one thing though.. he was a nutcase. A nutcase with very easy access to guns. Edited May 25, 2014 by Silver Surfer Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
aztek Posted May 25, 2014 #2441 Share Posted May 25, 2014 [/size] That wasn't his father. That was the father of one of the victims... Your correct in one thing though.. he was a nutcase. A nutcase with very easy access to guns. we'll see where he got his gun from. he also used knife as well, killed 3 by stabbing. 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest Posted May 25, 2014 #2442 Share Posted May 25, 2014 Crazy people can always use other weapons - its just Guns make it easier to be lethal to more people. The result is generally more people end up dead. Even in this case the ratio was 1:2 people killed by knife and gun. Br Cornelius Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
aztek Posted May 25, 2014 #2443 Share Posted May 25, 2014 (edited) wow your math is that bad?? 7 killed 3 of them by knife, how is it 1:2 ratio? btw 7 including a gun man Edited May 25, 2014 by aztek Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest Posted May 25, 2014 #2444 Share Posted May 25, 2014 I apologise, I had heard he killed six subsequent to the knife attacks. However the point is still valid. Br Cornelius Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
aztek Posted May 25, 2014 #2445 Share Posted May 25, 2014 (edited) However the point is still valid. Br Cornelius which is??? guns are easy to get in CA? lol, actually there, they are not easy to get, legaly. in the state of Vermont they are easy to get, how many shootings you heard happened there??? Edited May 25, 2014 by aztek Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Rafterman Posted May 25, 2014 #2446 Share Posted May 25, 2014 [/size] That wasn't his father. That was the father of one of the victims... Your correct in one thing though.. he was a nutcase. A nutcase with very easy access to guns. He killed 3 with firearms, 3 with knives, and hurt quite a few with his car. But yet this is a "gun issue". Three people were also shot to death in a museum in Belgium yesterday. Is anyone blaming the NRA for that one. As to having "easy access" to guns, here is the FAQ on obtaining firearms in the State of California: http://oag.ca.gov/firearms/pubfaqs Does that seem like "easy access" to you - background checks, waiting periods, and safety courses. Unfortunately, no matter how strong the system is, bad people will be able to get firearms because the system is based on past actions. No different than any other licensing and approval process. 4 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest Posted May 25, 2014 #2447 Share Posted May 25, 2014 which is??? guns are easy to get in CA? lol, actually there, they are not easy to get, legaly. in the state of Vermont they are easy to get, how many shootings you heard happened there??? The point I made was guns make it easy to kill, I said nothing about been easy to get. But in a country awash with guns - yes they are easy to get. And Rafterman, how many mass shootings do we have in Europe compared to America. Yes there were three peopled killed by gun in Belgium this week - but how many mass killings did we have this year, last year, last decade. Your point is not very strong. Br Cornelius Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
aztek Posted May 25, 2014 #2448 Share Posted May 25, 2014 Sweden. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest Posted May 25, 2014 #2449 Share Posted May 25, 2014 Sweden. How many mass killings has Sweden had in the last decade ? Just to make it fair, you can even quote it on a per capita basis to account for population differences. Europe as a whole has a higher population than the USA and it has nowhere near the same level of mass shootings that the US has over the last 50years. Guns are not the norm in Europe and free access to guns is highly restricted throughout Europe. Br Cornelius Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
spartan max2 Posted May 25, 2014 #2450 Share Posted May 25, 2014 The majority of our deaths are coming from the inner big cities. Which also have the most gun control. 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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