Citizen Hearing on Disclosure

[mcrom901]

sounds like they wound him up good and proper...

he usually bs's regardless...

[media=]

[/media]

@ 2:28 - look, the evidence is overwhelming and has been since the 1950s, the phenomenon that's being seen all over the world by millions of people for six and half decades is non-human intelligent beings, almost certainly from other star systems with biospheres like our own, engaging the human race... that's just the way it is, it's the reality, THE EARTH IS FLAT, the earth goes around the sun and there are extraterrestrials engaging us, we need to get used to that

Edited May 6, 2013 by mcrom901

[bee]

the reason why some seem unhappy with that premise is that they have over-expectations as to what the phenomenon must represent... i'll stick with the data at hand and an open mind for anything of substance which might turn up in the future... no need for what ifs and soothsaying

whatever floats your boat....

he usually bs's regardless...

@ 2:28 - look, the evidence is overwhelming and has been since the 1950s, the phenomenon that's being seen all over the world by millions of people for six and half decades is non-human intelligent beings, almost certainly from other star systems with biospheres like our own, engaging the human race... that's just the way it is, it's the reality, THE EARTH IS FLAT, the earth goes around the sun and there are extraterrestrials engaging us, we need to get used to that

It's pretty obvious that he meant to say 'The Earth isn't flat'.....

.

[mcrom901]

It's pretty obvious that he meant to say 'The Earth isn't flat'.....

the rest of what is has to say is equally meaningless and is not based in reality either i'm afraid

eta...

don't assume the obvious, 'he said what he has said'.... given his track record, it's not really a bizarre statement... why don't you ask him about it prior being certain... who knows, maybe he does indeed believe in a flat earth, no?

Edited May 6, 2013 by mcrom901

[Troublehalf]

Not going to blow my mind. Seems a natural progression.

Why?

It might not blow YOUR mind, but it might blow other peoples. Imagine Fundamentalists of any Religion (bar maybe Buddism) being told that Humans are not the only creatures to exist in the Universe. Imagine then telling them the Aliens have advanced technology or have progressed further into understanding the Universe. Fundamentalists, especially Literal Fundamentalists, would be struck with such a powerful ambivilence, that they either go mad at what they see before them (Aliens, technology etc) or they throw down their Holy Text Book. The Vatican would be filled to the brim, the Swiss Guard would be called in to defend the Pope from the hordes of angry Chathloic Christians demanding answers. This is why at least one Pope (maybe 2) has said that if Alien species do exist, they are Christians and we should welcome them with open arms.

As for your question; In the vastnuss of space, the cosmos and the Universe (same thing I know) that the only creatures lucky enough to gain sentience either through an omnipotent deity (A God of Classical Theism) or through "Evolution"... Then the end result isn't great. Wars, crime, over-population, food wastage, killing billions of animals every week for food, thousands of plants and animals going extinct via logging and other constructions. We are the best the universe has to offer? We are the only living beings in the entire Universe that has managed to go into Space.... No, I don't think so. I swear I read somewhere a mention about the percentage chance of humanity reaching the stage we are, was.

My point being, we are not exactly the greatest sentient creatures in terms of everything. The idea of another life form with both sentience and advance technology and communication makes me feel better. I makes me hope that somewhere, out there, somebody is doing better than us.

[bee]

the rest of what is has to say is equally meaningless and is not based in reality either i'm afraid

'reality' is a tricky and deep subject...

congratulations if you believe YOU have 'reality' all worked out......

some of the greatest philosophers and thinkers in the history of human-kind would be envious...if they knew you had cracked it...

.

[Babe Ruth]

Exactly the same as with all these (particularly 9/11) Conspiracies. Has anyone ever heard of a Govt. that competent that they managed to plan all that and keep it secret ever since?

For you and Don, here is an example of a secret kept by the government, a lie told by the government in the Supreme Court, for 50 some odd years.

U.S. v. Reynolds, 345US1 is the case number, and it was heard in 1953. The event that triggered the case happened in 1948. That was the first case in which the government invoked the "National Security" name. In that case, the Court accepted that invocation and ruled in favor of the government, and against the widows of men killed in a B-29 bombers. Their husbands were civilian engineers onboard the airplane that crashed, and they alleged negligence on the part of the government, and sued under Federal Tort Claims Act of 1946.

Because of the court's ruling, all the details were classified and kept secret.

Then along came a funny turn of events, and it's covered very well by the Washington Post and Timothy Lynch in the June 22, 2003 issue, under the title "An Injustice Wrapped in a Pretense."

In 2000, the daughter of one of the engineers discovered that, perhaps by accident, the report had been declassified and was available to the public. She ordered a copy, read it, and found out no military secrets at all had been involved, and that the government investigation into the accident found that there was government negligence, and that the crash was most likely caused by an engine fire, as the plaintiffs had alleged all those years ago.

In fact, the government attorneys lied to the Court in its arguments. The court was deceived, and anybody else involved in the case was deceived.

So any fantasies you might entertain suggesting that the government cannot keep secrets are, well, fantasies, not based upon empirical evidence.

[Babe Ruth]

UFO's does not equal Alien Spacecraft.

It's just that, something the police officer at the time couldn't work out.

Look at this way. The American Government couldn't keep the fact Clinton got a ******* from his Secretary secret. How are they supposed to keep things like, "Faked Moon Landing" or "9/11" or "Sandy Hook" or whatever.

Governments acknowledge that UFO's exist, however, they don't all assume UFO = Advanced Civilisation Spacecraft. In the end, the government will release it when ready.

The Pope(s) have already paved the way, saying any alien species we meet will have been created by God and are Christian. Little bits and bobs drip out, the films, the documentaries, the sightings.

To be told, fully and finally that Humanity is not alone in this Universe... It could blow peoples minds. They could riot, hysteria spreads and bad stuff happens.

I always think, if Humans and Humanity are the pinnacle of intelligence and civilisation.... then damn, that's depressing.

One might easily argue that the government HAS NOT SUCCEEDED in keep such secrets. People all around the globe understand that there are UFOs, aliens, Operation Northwoods, Operation Paperclip, the Gulf Of Tonkin, and 911. They understand that the government has suppressed information about these, destroyed evidence, falsified evidence, engineered magnificent coverups.

I think you're trying to make the point that government attempts to keep secrets, and sometimes it succeeds, but such success does not always last very long.

[bee]

.

you know...those ex Congressmen and women at the Citizen Hearing are not at all happy about the medical records

of Sgt Burroughs and Sgt Penniston being classified. They might just try and get them opened up. And that would be

interesting...because why would they be classified in the first place? Maybe because they would officially prove that something real

happened in Rendlesham Forrest, England back in 1980...? (and ET related?)

Burroughs and Penniston were the US servicemen who were sent to investigate the craft that was found in the forrest.

Penniston even touched it. And they had serious health problems after.

Here's Merrill Cook talking about it after Day 2

and here is the first part of an audio of Day 2 .....which includes the first hand testimony of Burroughs and Penniston.

[media=]http://www.youtube.com/watch?feature=player_embedded&v=Qa7_UGMxLMo

other parts are on youtube ....that I haven't had time to listen to myself yet...(but I have listened to the one above)

.

Edited May 6, 2013 by bee

[minera]

People all over the world who have witnessed such things are all 'imagineing' every thing. Only the government is right (in their own opinion) and sheeple should stick to working hard to give them their hard earned cash and leave the rest to those 'in the need to know' category. Boy this planet is really screwed up and if aliens are keeping tabs on us I am sure they would agree. I actually saw the news clip of the Rendlesham Forrest incident but only for a few seconds before the broke for a commercial. Not a word after nor was there any explanation. It was like it never happened. Trust the government? No way!

[Space Commander Travis]

If it's inter-dimensional or time travel that's going on....she would be right - it's not ET.

Well, it wouldn't be if they were Time travellers from Earth, but if they were from other Dimensions, would that be from Earth? I suppose it depends if they, like the Little People, do actually inhabit this plabnet alongside us but on a different wavelength, as it were, or whether their "home" is somewhere different entirely. These are interesting philosophical questions.

[Space Commander Travis]

For you and Don, here is an example of a secret kept by the government, a lie told by the government in the Supreme Court, for 50 some odd years.

U.S. v. Reynolds, 345US1 is the case number, and it was heard in 1953. The event that triggered the case happened in 1948. That was the first case in which the government invoked the "National Security" name. In that case, the Court accepted that invocation and ruled in favor of the government, and against the widows of men killed in a B-29 bombers. Their husbands were civilian engineers onboard the airplane that crashed, and they alleged negligence on the part of the government, and sued under Federal Tort Claims Act of 1946.

Because of the court's ruling, all the details were classified and kept secret.

Then along came a funny turn of events, and it's covered very well by the Washington Post and Timothy Lynch in the June 22, 2003 issue, under the title "An Injustice Wrapped in a Pretense."

In 2000, the daughter of one of the engineers discovered that, perhaps by accident, the report had been declassified and was available to the public. She ordered a copy, read it, and found out no military secrets at all had been involved, and that the government investigation into the accident found that there was government negligence, and that the crash was most likely caused by an engine fire, as the plaintiffs had alleged all those years ago.

In fact, the government attorneys lied to the Court in its arguments. The court was deceived, and anybody else involved in the case was deceived.

So any fantasies you might entertain suggesting that the government cannot keep secrets are, well, fantasies, not based upon empirical evidence.

But surely you must be able to appreciate that keeping the details of one plane crash secret, and a plot of the scale of 9/11 (or the truth about UFOs) is on a rather different scale. Rather more people would be involved in either of the latter, for a start, and the case you mention is actually a further argument against the efficiency of Governments, is it not? Of course Governements are instinctively secretive, but that's usually the case when there's some mistake that they want to cover up.

[shrooma]

strange really, how 900 coppers can see UFO's, but not one of them could find me on any CCTV camera when I got mugged outside hamilton sq. station in liverpool, even though i'd travelled on three trains, and been to four different stations, all of which have more cameras than a bus full of japanese tourists.

somehow, I thought being invisible would be cool.

apparently not.....

[Babe Ruth]

But surely you must be able to appreciate that keeping the details of one plane crash secret, and a plot of the scale of 9/11 (or the truth about UFOs) is on a rather different scale. Rather more people would be involved in either of the latter, for a start, and the case you mention is actually a further argument against the efficiency of Governments, is it not? Of course Governements are instinctively secretive, but that's usually the case when there's some mistake that they want to cover up.

I understand what you're saying, but does 'covering up negligence' justify perjury at the Supreme Court level? Does saving a few dollars going to widows justify perjury in the Court and elsewhere?

What this demonstrates is a behavioral profile of the government--deception for its own sake, or whatever sake might be created by some anonymous bureaucrat or Pentagon official. Simply put, it is the NATURE of the creature to deceive, and there is ample evidence of that.

I am not making any claims for the efficiency of government. On the contrary, government is and has been well known for its lack of efficiency. For its tremendous wastefulness.

My point Colonel, is that the claim advanced by you and others that government is UNABLE to cover things up is simply wrong. It is quite able to do so, though its machinations may take 50 years to be exposed. It deceives and covers up as a matter of routine, whether the subject matter is the crash of a B-29, the presence of alien life forms, or the events of 11 September.

[psyche101]

If it's inter-dimensional or time travel that's going on....she would be right - it's not ET.

Does something indicate such?

[psyche101]

It might not blow YOUR mind, but it might blow other peoples. Imagine Fundamentalists of any Religion (bar maybe Buddism) being told that Humans are not the only creatures to exist in the Universe. Imagine then telling them the Aliens have advanced technology or have progressed further into understanding the Universe. Fundamentalists, especially Literal Fundamentalists, would be struck with such a powerful ambivilence, that they either go mad at what they see before them (Aliens, technology etc) or they throw down their Holy Text Book. The Vatican would be filled to the brim, the Swiss Guard would be called in to defend the Pope from the hordes of angry Chathloic Christians demanding answers. This is why at least one Pope (maybe 2) has said that if Alien species do exist, they are Christians and we should welcome them with open arms.

But the Vatican has been saying for decades that ET exists, and that they accept evolution. It's all part of Gods master plan now. Some small fundie groups are not really worth of consideration are they? Wouldn't the majority just look at them carrying their placards and shake one's head?

The Pope might actually want to meet such visitors? Maybe he can send out some intergalactic missions! But seriously, from a theological point of view, for any alien that may have philosophy of some form in their culture would surely find the pope a fascinating man to speak to, and could spend months at the Vatican learning about the history of religion.

The woo woo sites overplay this nonsense and cite Orson Wells and the War of the Worlds, which I find a non comparison. It's a different world today. People are not in the grip of war, and we know what Mars looks like and do not fear invasions form Martians and Venusians these days. We have matured a bit as a species. If you woke up to a Mothership tomorrow morning, the banks would still want the mortgages paid. Teachers would still expect to see kids homework. It would change the world yes, but not stop it. Todays world spins too fast with our culture.

As for your question; In the vastnuss of space, the cosmos and the Universe (same thing I know) that the only creatures lucky enough to gain sentience either through an omnipotent deity (A God of Classical Theism) or through "Evolution"... Then the end result isn't great. Wars, crime, over-population, food wastage, killing billions of animals every week for food, thousands of plants and animals going extinct via logging and other constructions. We are the best the universe has to offer? We are the only living beings in the entire Universe that has managed to go into Space.... No, I don't think so. I swear I read somewhere a mention about the percentage chance of humanity reaching the stage we are, was.

Are we "creatures"? I read recently that we are sentient matter. The Universe has become aware, and is wondering about itself. We might be part of a much bigger picture than just making top predator. We save animals too, bring them back from the brink of extinction, even clone some long dead ones. It takes time for a species to mature, that you are unhappy with our current situation just seem to show impatience? Maybe other have gone into space, maybe not. We have had the ability to rocket to the stars since 1960. LINK Space is indeed vast, and lifetimes might be needed, even with time dilation and length contraction on our side. That is what one calls a Pioneer is it not?

We are getting better. We know how to look after the planet, and the people wo are polluting are also worried not they know what we have been doing for the last 70 or so years to the planet, and now we are trying to fix it. Alternate energies come out almost every month. Is this remorse and effort to repair not worthy of mention? I think the small steps forward are inspirational.

My point being, we are not exactly the greatest sentient creatures in terms of everything. The idea of another life form with both sentience and advance technology and communication makes me feel better. I makes me hope that somewhere, out there, somebody is doing better than us.

I hope you can see our species in a different way. Too many can only see faults, and if that is all we ever see, who is going to pat the good people on the back who are trying to make a change?

[psyche101]

For you and Don, here is an example of a secret kept by the government, a lie told by the government in the Supreme Court, for 50 some odd years.

U.S. v. Reynolds, 345US1 is the case number, and it was heard in 1953. The event that triggered the case happened in 1948. That was the first case in which the government invoked the "National Security" name. In that case, the Court accepted that invocation and ruled in favor of the government, and against the widows of men killed in a B-29 bombers. Their husbands were civilian engineers onboard the airplane that crashed, and they alleged negligence on the part of the government, and sued under Federal Tort Claims Act of 1946.

Because of the court's ruling, all the details were classified and kept secret.

Then along came a funny turn of events, and it's covered very well by the Washington Post and Timothy Lynch in the June 22, 2003 issue, under the title "An Injustice Wrapped in a Pretense."

In 2000, the daughter of one of the engineers discovered that, perhaps by accident, the report had been declassified and was available to the public. She ordered a copy, read it, and found out no military secrets at all had been involved, and that the government investigation into the accident found that there was government negligence, and that the crash was most likely caused by an engine fire, as the plaintiffs had alleged all those years ago.

In fact, the government attorneys lied to the Court in its arguments. The court was deceived, and anybody else involved in the case was deceived.

So any fantasies you might entertain suggesting that the government cannot keep secrets are, well, fantasies, not based upon empirical evidence.

They do not seem to have kept this secret? Some things take time, but with so many people involved, eventually it all gets out.

[psyche101]

People all over the world who have witnessed such things are all 'imagineing' every thing. Only the government is right (in their own opinion) and sheeple should stick to working hard to give them their hard earned cash and leave the rest to those 'in the need to know' category. Boy this planet is really screwed up and if aliens are keeping tabs on us I am sure they would agree. I actually saw the news clip of the Rendlesham Forrest incident but only for a few seconds before the broke for a commercial. Not a word after nor was there any explanation. It was like it never happened. Trust the government? No way!

I live in Australia, the US Government has no hold over me, and I have a decent telscope and if I saw an alien craft heading to the US I would tell the world.

The conspiracists are unable to accept that the US is not the entire world.

[psyche101]

I understand what you're saying, but does 'covering up negligence' justify perjury at the Supreme Court level? Does saving a few dollars going to widows justify perjury in the Court and elsewhere?

What this demonstrates is a behavioral profile of the government--deception for its own sake, or whatever sake might be created by some anonymous bureaucrat or Pentagon official. Simply put, it is the NATURE of the creature to deceive, and there is ample evidence of that.

I am not making any claims for the efficiency of government. On the contrary, government is and has been well known for its lack of efficiency. For its tremendous wastefulness.

My point Colonel, is that the claim advanced by you and others that government is UNABLE to cover things up is simply wrong. It is quite able to do so, though its machinations may take 50 years to be exposed. It deceives and covers up as a matter of routine, whether the subject matter is the crash of a B-29, the presence of alien life forms, or the events of 11 September.

But you did not prove that at all, all you did was show that the process can be laboured.

[archernyc]

Does something indicate such?

These are just possible alternatives to ET...it could be us...just from somewhere/some time else.

[psyche101]

These are just possible alternatives to ET...it could be us...just from somewhere/some time else.

Ahh, yes, indeed. In fact despite people pooh poohing time travel it would be easier than crossing space with warp, you just need a wormhole and a very fast spaceship.

"Just" he says LOL.

I find Jacques Vallee's thoughts interesting on this subject.

[DONTEATUS]

Does it count when I fly one of these around the solar system old mate

Watch out for me coming into Texas on the back of one of these!

The one I want

Lets Fire that Ride Up Mate ! THe Steaks will be on the Barbie !

[quillius]

The CDC has a plan for the zombie apocalypse so I suppose that is evidence that zombies are real and loom on the horizon as an impending doom?

I guess some insight into what and how they define zombie may be of interest and may even provide us with a new perspective that doesnt seem as instantly insane as it does at first glimpse.

[quillius]

They do not seem to have kept this secret? Some things take time, but with so many people involved, eventually it all gets out.

Gidday mate,

yes it all gets out eventually but the bigger the subject the more mud that gets out also...the truth can then be harder to discern even if out in the open......

[psyche101]

Gidday mate,

yes it all gets out eventually but the bigger the subject the more mud that gets out also...the truth can then be harder to discern even if out in the open......

I can think of cases where the truth comes out, and is ugly such as MKUltra, and then the details seem rather precise, "mud" seems to be more the basis for a CT?

[quillius]

I can think of cases where the truth comes out, and is ugly such as MKUltra, and then the details seem rather precise, "mud" seems to be more the basis for a CT?

gidday mate,

yes I agree, although a subject like UFOs will take a lifetime (if possible at all) to seperate the mud that has accumilated over the years. Granted the bulk has been from CT's but I also feel that they are not the only ones.