Coffey Posted May 26, 2013 #376 Share Posted May 26, 2013 You do realise that 'causing corruption in the earth' is justification against a liberal society in the eyes of Islamic conservative fundamentalists? Only a nut job would take it that way though, hence only nut jobs doing stuff like this and not Muslims in general. 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Yamato Posted May 26, 2013 #377 Share Posted May 26, 2013 This was an act of terror, Grade A. Nothing happened here even remotely justifiable. My point of debate is that terrorists tell us over and over again why they're attacking us, and western society chooses to ignore that and make up our own stories to repeat a thousand times over TV, internet and water cooler instead. I think it's a tragic disservice to our freedom and security when we're not being told the truth by way of withholding information seemingly every time another attack occurs. It doesn't really matter whether it's Iraq or Afghanistan or the broader "war on terror". It's not the chorus line's propaganda over Islam that it's understandable most people will get caught up in, it's anger over foreign policy which can be summed up in three components: Occupying their countries, killing people, supporting Israel and other oppressive regimes. People who want to drag religion into this are buying the soap they're selling ya. They don't need religion to kill us, and neither do we to kill them. Keep focused on that, and you keep stirring the pot 'o trouble whether you know it or not. 2 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Professor Buzzkill Posted May 26, 2013 #378 Share Posted May 26, 2013 (edited) Obviously they hate our freedoms. Its what the government says so it must be true. The only way to stop terrorists is to give up your freedoms so they have nothing to hate Edited May 26, 2013 by Professor Buzzkill 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
TSS Posted May 26, 2013 #379 Share Posted May 26, 2013 I did have to laugh at the hypocrisy of one of those half-wits responsible....his brother-in-law was moaning in an interview with ITV that when he was caught trying to cross from Kenya into Somalia to join the conflict that the British government didn't do enough when he claimed he was tortured. Slayed a British soldier for the conflicts we're involved in (according to him)...yet threw his toys out the pram when we didn't help after getting caught for the conflict he wanted to join. You couldn't make it up.... 5 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Yamato Posted May 26, 2013 #380 Share Posted May 26, 2013 I did have to laugh at the hypocrisy of one of those half-wits responsible....his brother-in-law was moaning in an interview with ITV that when he was caught trying to cross from Kenya into Somalia to join the conflict that the British government didn't do enough when he claimed he was tortured. Slayed a British soldier for the conflicts we're involved in (according to him)...yet threw his toys out the pram when we didn't help after getting caught for the conflict he wanted to join. You couldn't make it up.... Having expectations that aren't met is hardly hypocritical. They shouldn't have the expectation of help in the first place. Your soldiers should be the farthest thing from their minds over there, but they're not. And that includes before they cut someone's head off or if they never cut anyone's head off. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Yamato Posted May 26, 2013 #381 Share Posted May 26, 2013 The only way to stop terrorists is to give up your freedoms so they have nothing to hate Yeah Switzerland is the prime target in Europe; thankfully it's lined with anti-Islamic rough terrain. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
TSS Posted May 26, 2013 #382 Share Posted May 26, 2013 Having expectations that aren't met is hardly hypocritical. They shouldn't have the expectation of help in the first place. Your soldiers should be the farthest thing from their minds over there, but they're not. And that includes before they cut someone's head off or if they never cut anyone's head off. It's hardly hypocritical? Hmm, I guess he just doesn't think anything through then. Afterall, he's gone to fight for an organisation that is trying to over throw a government the British are trying to help stabilize, then once caught wants the British government to bail him out. Not the sharpest tool in the box that one is he. 3 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
SHaYap Posted May 26, 2013 #383 Share Posted May 26, 2013 Are we at U-M or 4chan? why ? are you confused ? here you go // 2 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Yamato Posted May 27, 2013 #384 Share Posted May 27, 2013 It's hardly hypocritical? Hmm, I guess he just doesn't think anything through then. Afterall, he's gone to fight for an organisation that is trying to over throw a government the British are trying to help stabilize, then once caught wants the British government to bail him out. Not the sharpest tool in the box that one is he. Maybe he's just dumb, right. Or maybe the results didn't match the expectations. When people don't appreciate the "help", stop helping. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
pallidin Posted May 27, 2013 #385 Share Posted May 27, 2013 Maybe he's just dumb, right. Or maybe the results didn't match the expectations. When people don't appreciate the "help", stop helping. It's the non-combatant citizens that surely appreciate any help from the "West" It's the radical extremists that don't. Kind-of messes with their extremists plans to corrupt the government and instill harsh Sharia law. Say, Yamato, are you a proponent of Sharia law? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Clarakore Posted May 27, 2013 #386 Share Posted May 27, 2013 It's the non-combatant citizens that surely appreciate any help from the "West" It's the radical extremists that don't. Kind-of messes with their extremists plans to corrupt the government and instill harsh Sharia law. Say, Yamato, are you a proponent of Sharia law? Doubtful when the non-combatant citizens see the women and children die from our bombs and drones and then dismissed as collateral damage. Intervention also disrupts utilities such as water and energy and destroys homes and general infrastructure such as roads. Guess they will have to wait for reconstruction after the war... 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Yamato Posted May 27, 2013 #387 Share Posted May 27, 2013 Doubtful when the non-combatant citizens see the women and children die from our bombs and drones and then dismissed as collateral damage. Intervention also disrupts utilities such as water and energy and destroys homes and general infrastructure such as roads. Guess they will have to wait for reconstruction after the war... We're so sheltered from such disruption and collateral damage ourselves, our capacity not to empathize seems boundless. When that shoe's on our foot we'll all smarten up real quick,and for most, not a moment earlier. 2 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
acidhead Posted May 27, 2013 #388 Share Posted May 27, 2013 We're so sheltered from such disruption and collateral damage ourselves, our capacity not to empathize seems boundless. When that shoe's on our foot we'll all smarten up real quick,and for most, not a moment earlier. Like in Boston.... for a while everybody is angry.. and then they go back to sleep... ignoring what is happening in their name over seas. 4 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Yamato Posted May 27, 2013 #389 Share Posted May 27, 2013 It's the non-combatant citizens that surely appreciate any help from the "West" It's the radical extremists that don't. Kind-of messes with their extremists plans to corrupt the government and instill harsh Sharia law. Say, Yamato, are you a proponent of Sharia law? Based on what? What did you read to start thinking there's a correlation between appreciation of aid and righteousness? What did you read to even think anything you're saying is true? I see no evidence to support a word you're saying. Stop asking me like a broken record whether I'm a proponent of Sharia law. How many times do you have to get the same stupid question answered before you stop asking it? Dumbkabob politicians in the US, UK and France are busy handing out the help to extremists across the world. And based on the fact that we're the targets, as long as our idiotic governments and their simple-minded followers keep these asinine policies in place, these terrorist attacks are going to continue. Our governments aren't these benevolent forces saving the forces of good from the forces of evil. Stop buying that PC soap; it only leaves you more dirty than you started, with a grimy film that just doesn't seem to wash off. They're self interested bureaucracies with the same interests as every other government - their own power. Internet crusaders fighting altruistic fantasies against a foreign religion are part of the reason we're never going to stop this madness. Turning the herd's mentality will take a lifetime the rate we're going. 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Clarakore Posted May 27, 2013 #390 Share Posted May 27, 2013 (edited) We're so sheltered from such disruption and collateral damage ourselves, our capacity not to empathize seems boundless. When that shoe's on our foot we'll all smarten up real quick,and for most, not a moment earlier. "There is a difference between the West and the rest." “[Accounting for civilian casualties] is not mission essential.” “If we’re going to worship at the altar of collateral damage and civilian casualties,then we have to ask whether we should be in all of these wars.” “If we thought that every bomb dropped would cause casualties,and prayed that it doesn’t, then we’d all feel more comfortable with ourselves.” "If there is a geometry of civilian deaths, we don’t do a very good job of understanding it.” "The information battlefield needs to be better prepared." “In reality there are three wars: the war the military actually fights, the war the human rights groups would like it to fight, and the war that politicians claim is being fought.” Understanding Collateral Damage : Project on the Means of Intervention (2002) Edited May 27, 2013 by Leave Britney alone! 2 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Yamato Posted May 27, 2013 #391 Share Posted May 27, 2013 Like in Boston.... for a while everybody is angry.. and then they go back to sleep... ignoring what is happening in their name over seas. They ignore it because they think the policy being executed in their name is the answer to the problem. How many more years, decades and generations is it going to take before these people get a hint that the policy is what's causing it? Again and again, we're told point blank this is the case, and like mindless drones they excuse it away with more and more baseless feel-good political drivel every year. The government nor society at large cares what pack of lies people pick up on to support the policy, they only care that they pick up one of them to keep this racket going. 2 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Clarakore Posted May 27, 2013 #392 Share Posted May 27, 2013 The brutes who are rah rah for war should not be surprised when the dome of ignorance and veneer of safety is pierced by the minimal collateral damage we suffer in return. It is odd how we label it terrorism when it happens to us but call it collateral damage when it occurs to them. Some claim it is because the terrorists hide behind civilians. Well if a criminal runs into your house no one expects the cops to go in shooting everyone or drop a bomb on it killing all inside. 3 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Yamato Posted May 27, 2013 #393 Share Posted May 27, 2013 "What??? You're not a supporter of US/UK foreign policy? You must be a proponent of Sharia law then!" Really? Meanwhile I'm the loudest voice of opposition of foreign aid to these disgusting Sharia countries on the forum, but my goodness, don't let that fool you. If I don't bend over and take whatever the government is pumpin out with the peoples' money, somethin must be wrong with me. 4 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
TSS Posted May 27, 2013 #394 Share Posted May 27, 2013 Maybe he's just dumb, right. Or maybe the results didn't match the expectations. When people don't appreciate the "help", stop helping. Good point, at least it would be if he had been off to fight in country where we had bombed and killed civilians, but he wasn't, he was off to a country where he have offered (in partnership with other donars) to help them with things like getting their economy more stable etc. Strange he would be off to a country we are not fighting in, and a country that has nothing to do with him, to fight for Al-Shabaab (who are killing the civilian population in the efforts to over throw the government)...yet you say the people over there don't appreciate any help from us. Do you have any evidence for that? 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Clarakore Posted May 27, 2013 #395 Share Posted May 27, 2013 (edited) "What??? You're not a supporter of US/UK foreign policy? You must be a proponent of Sharia law then!" Really? Meanwhile I'm the loudest voice of opposition of foreign aid to these disgusting Sharia countries on the forum, but my goodness, don't let that fool you. If I don't bend over and take whatever the government is pumpin out with the peoples' money, somethin must be wrong with me. When a group holds on tight to a bundle of beliefs, to disagree with one in their eyes makes you disagree with all. The EDL do the same if you disagree with their extremism. Sit-down protest by We Are Waltham Forest blocks route of EDL march Good people will still disagree knowing that their disagreement is not support for Sharia, the deaths of our civilians, or anything else they accuse them of. Edited May 27, 2013 by Leave Britney alone! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
SHaYap Posted May 27, 2013 #396 Share Posted May 27, 2013 this or that there or here us or them then or now live or die its all the hypnotic mantra that dulls the minds of the flock .... on both sides , meanwhile ... 'we' have lives to live , they say .... . 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
itsnotoutthere Posted May 27, 2013 #397 Share Posted May 27, 2013 Like in Boston.... for a while everybody is angry.. and then they go back to sleep... ignoring what is happening in their name over seas. I think you're missing one important point in that statement. Since when have the people had any say in what their governments do. Foreign policy is carried out without any reference the people, in fact once you have put that tiny tick on the ballot paper I think you'll find all governments then do exactly what they want despite what the people want.The only reason our government are now starting to make noises about an EU referendum is because another party has come along that is going to give the people the opportunity to vote. 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
itsnotoutthere Posted May 27, 2013 #398 Share Posted May 27, 2013 (edited) When a group holds on tight to a bundle of beliefs, to disagree with one in their eyes makes you disagree with all. The EDL do the same if you disagree with their extremism. Sit-down protest by We Are Waltham Forest blocks route of EDL march Good people will still disagree knowing that their disagreement is not support for Sharia, the deaths of our civilians, or anything else they accuse them of. Hey, that slogan on the top of that banner would work well for the Labour party. Edited May 27, 2013 by itsnotoutthere Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
odas Posted May 27, 2013 #399 Share Posted May 27, 2013 A few words from the Bosnian Imam Mustafa Ceric. I hope that muslims as well as non muslims read this. It is not the first time that Mr. Ceric is comenting regarding Islam, Islamophobia and terrorism in this way. People like him make me proud to be both, Bosnian and muslim. Excerpt: "'' For years I have watched in Sarajevo human blood shed in front of my eyes. However, the blood on the hands of the executioner with a butcher knife in his hands I've ever seen on a London street shocked me more than ever.Not because it is the blood of one more valuable than the blood of another human being. Shocked me was the fact that it was the blood of the London street that was shed as the killer shouted "Allahu Akbar" and because "one of the attackers called to Islam with a desire for revenge for British foreign policy towards Muslims," said Ceric. He believes that'' the time that Muslims, particularly in Europe, not only in Europe, to take a serious and responsible steps to discover who is behind the misuse of the words "Allahu Akbar" and'' Who are those who spread fear and terror in the name of Islam in European streets'' http://translate.google.ca/translate?hl=en&sl=hr&u=http://www.vijesti.ba/&prev=/search%3Fq%3Dvijesti%26rlz%3D1R2SKPT_enCA453%26biw%3D1152%26bih%3D633 7 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
freetoroam Posted May 27, 2013 #400 Share Posted May 27, 2013 Cameron, the prime minister of England is still in Ibiza. Well done Cameron for being out of the country you allegedly run while tensions are up. 2 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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