Fluoridating our Drinking Water

[SHaYap]

600 Physicians, Dentists, Scientists and Environmentalists Call for an End to Fluoridation

August 28, 2007

...

A statement asking Congress to end water fluoridation in the United States has been released by the Fluoride Action Network (FAN). Over 600 professionals, including a Nobel Prize winner, officers in the Union that represents Environmental Protection Agency professionals, and members of the National Research Council panel on fluoride‘s toxicology, have signed the statement.

The report urges Congressional members to “recognize that fluoridation is outdated, has serious risks that far outweigh any minor benefits, violates sound medical ethics, and denies freedom of choice.”

It cites eight recent events that call for an urgent end to water fluoridation. Among them:

• A 500-page review of fluoride’s toxicology by the National Research Council of the National Academies, published in 2006.
  
• Evidence from the U.S. Centers for Disease Control and Prevention (CDC) that found 32 percent of U.S. children have dental fluorosis, which is caused by fluoride.
  
• The American Dental Association’s 2006 policy change, which recommends not giving fluoridated water to infants for the first 12 months of life.
  
• A Harvard University study that found a five- to seven-fold increased risk of osteosarcoma (bone cancer) among young men who were exposed to fluoride between the ages of 6 and 8.
  
• The CDC’s recognition that fluoride is beneficial in reducing tooth decay when it’s applied topically, not taken systemically.
  

• Mercola link
  

Israel Has Officially Banned Fluoridation of Its Drinking Water

By Douglas Main 8/29/14 at 6:36 AM

On Tuesday of this week (Aug. 26), Israel officially stopped adding fluoride to its water supplies. The decision has “been lauded by various rights groups, but criticized by many in the medical and dental communities as a serious mistake,” as the Times of Israel put it.

The tasteless, colorless chemical is put into water for the purpose of reducing cavities, but critics say that it amounts to mass medication, and forces people to consume the substance whether they want to or not.

By law, fluoride had been added to public drinking water supplies of large Israeli towns since the 1970s, and until this week about 70 percent of the country was fluoridated. (For comparison, 67 percent of Americans receive fluoridated tap water.)

• newsweek link
  

Wait ... what ?

introductory comments

Fluoride is a highly toxic substance. Consider, for example, the poison warning that the FDA now requires on all fluoride toothpastes sold in the U.S. or the tens of millions of people throughout China and India who now suffer serious crippling bone diseases from drinking water with elevated levels of fluoride.

In terms of acute toxicity (i.e., the dose that can cause immediate toxic consequences), fluoride is more toxic than lead, but slightly less toxic than arsenic. This is why fluoride has long been used in rodenticides and pesticides to kill pests like rats and insects. It is also why accidents involving over-ingestion of fluoridated dental products–including fluoride gels, fluoride supplements, and fluoridated water–can cause serious poisoning incidents, including death.

• Fluoride alert Org link
  

~

[Rlyeh]

You, and folks like yourself, are so laughably predictable. You cant ever just talk about a subject without personally attacking those you disagree with. Its really pathetic when you think about it.

You mean like accusing the researchers of poisoning people? When faced with research like clockwork you utter something idiotic.

[Likely Guy]

Your post was interesting and his name was well researched. Most know the anti depression drug prozac contains fluoride/rat poison. That pineal gland "calcifying" article echoes many other articles against fluoride in H2O. More and more people these days are into alternative meds and very interested in the unknown long term health effects of consuming "unlabled" GMO foods, or drinking fluoride in their tap water. It's all about choice and many have no other alternative but to take "their" meds meant for insects and strong teeth?

Most new billion dollar super pills lack good results against many drug resistant viruses. The $$$ pill industry is loosing their battle with super bugs, etc. It seems like they're running out of bullets these days.

*snip*

(My bolding, my edit for brevity)

Where are the peer reviewed studies regarding the unknown long term side effects of alternative meds?

[xYlvax]

The only way I want fluoride around me is when cleaning my teeth, then I make sure I rinse repeatedly. I won't drink water that I know has that in it, due to certain spiritual beliefs I have where that crap calcifies your 'third eye'. Ever since I stop drinking that filth up, I've been more aware and attune to everything.

[Yamato]

Even salts that are nutrients like Sodium, Magnesium, Calcium are bad for health in excess. We eat too much table salt in the US, one thing many of us could stand to cut back on. There's plenty of salt in foods already without adding more. But we have a taste for salty things. I love vegetables but I think that's actually because I pour salt on them.

I think it was that play that we did on tooth decay in grade school why I'm still not getting it yet.

Rinsing repeatedly after brushing is a great tip SpiritWalker. I usually take a few mouthfuls of water and spit it out after brushing too. If we can still taste toothpaste in our mouth, there's fluoride in it.

[preacherman76]

You mean like accusing the researchers of poisoning people? When faced with research like clockwork you utter something idiotic.

What does that have to do with you insisting on insulting people cause you don't agree with them? There is nothing in the rules that says I cant criticize a source. There is rules saying you cant personally attack other members. See the difference?

Guess not, cause you are still doing it.

[Peter B]

Bad teeth is due more to the current / modern dietary habits than flouride or no in the water ~

Are you sure? Research suggests otherwise: http://www.ada.org.au/app_cmslib/media/lib/1303/m537918_v1_nsaoh%20fluoridation%20paper.pdf

...> 75% of lifetime exposure to fluoridation relative to < 25% of lifetime exposure was associated with 11% and 10% fewer DMF-Teeth [decayed, missing and filed teeth] in the pre-1960 (p< .0001) and 1960–1990 cohorts (p= .018), respectively. Corresponding reductions in DF-Surfaces were 30% (p< .001) and 21% (p< .001). Findings for intermediate fluoridation exposure suggested a dose-response relationship.

[Peter B]

I was told that fluoride was originally an industrial waste product and a known toxin that some genius or geniuses found a way to get rid of AND make a tidy profit: convincing government that it was good for our teeth to the point that it they could dispose of it by putting it in our drinking water supply! Pure genius! Turn a toxic waste product that is expensive to deal with into a commodity and sell it to the whole nation as a necessity! Evil, but genius! And they have largely gotten away with it until fairly recently when this backlash started growing.

The idea that people might be able to find a use for a waste product is usually something to celebrate, not criticise. That most iconic Aussie food, Vegemite, is made from a waste product of beer production.

And while fluoride can be toxic, the amount required to experience that toxicity is way beyond what you could consume through drinking tap water.

In any case, why would the evil industrialists or the politicians want to poison the water they themselves drink?

[Peter B]

Water here in Australia has been fluoridated for years.

According to the Australian Dental Association, only about 90% of Australians have access to fluoridated tap water.

[SHaYap]

Are you sure? Research suggests otherwise: http://www.ada.org.a...ation paper.pdf

I could quote you sources of opinons from ages past but then I doubt you will accept them ... an impasse if you will ~

~

[Beefers]

I live in the USA, we drink our tap water here all the time, at least in my city we do. So if you come to Seattle, drink up. Although our water is fluoridated. if you want it without, you'll have to go to Portland Oregon. While you're there, ask people how often they see their dentist for fillings. It's a lot.

I used to drink it, but my now ex was like, whaaaaat?, quit that stuff, it's bad, blah, blah

[danielost]

iodine chlorine and fluoride are all in the same class of poisons. iodine the weakest requires a medical license in order to use it. chlorine the middle poison requires a license in order to use it. fluoride the strongest poison is in everyone's tooth paste and now most tap water. so those of you who have fluoridated water are poisoning your pets and lawns.

[danielost]

The idea that people might be able to find a use for a waste product is usually something to celebrate, not criticise. That most iconic Aussie food, Vegemite, is made from a waste product of beer production.

And while fluoride can be toxic, the amount required to experience that toxicity is way beyond what you could consume through drinking tap water.

In any case, why would the evil industrialists or the politicians want to poison the water they themselves drink?

they probable drink bottled water or use a filter.

[Iron_Lotus]

so many babies *drinks cup of tap water* grow a pair.

[preacherman76]

The idea that people might be able to find a use for a waste product is usually something to celebrate, not criticise. That most iconic Aussie food, Vegemite, is made from a waste product of beer production.

And while fluoride can be toxic, the amount required to experience that toxicity is way beyond what you could consume through drinking tap water.

In any case, why would the evil industrialists or the politicians want to poison the water they themselves drink?

Id hardly call dumping toxic industrial waste into our drinking water, so they can not only avoid the millions it would cost then to properly dispose of, but actually make a profit, something to celebrate. Especially considering they have now proven links to this practice and all kinds of health problems.

NTM there are studies showing there is little to no dental benefits compared with area's with no water fluoridation anyway.

[Lilly]

Ok, time to leave one another alone and focus on the subject matter

[Yamato]

According to the Australian Dental Association, only about 90% of Australians have access to fluoridated tap water.

Sir was only 90% correct? He's been slipping lately. I wonder how much of that F water Malcolm Young's been drinking

they probable drink bottled water or use a filter.

Hard to filter it with filtration on the market today. Maybe I should start drinking more bottled water. But if they're going to add salts for taste or pH balance, at least get the salts in proportion. Calcium, Magnesium and Potassium would do better in a 1:1:1 ratio than all of one and none of the others. It sounds ridiculous that bottled water could make someone constipated for example, but it all goes back to what crap they're putting in it.

so many babies *drinks cup of tap water* grow a pair.

So says the guy whose selfies are always dragging on cigarettes. Maybe you are more courageous.

[Iron_Lotus]

psst that's not me there are no pictures of me on this forum and you don't know my smoking habits if i have any at all and frankly it's not your business, now like i said go grow a pair.

[Yamato]

Hey I_L at least I remembered your old avatar. And seriously bro you're acting like one of Riyeh's toadies here, chill out. I'm not going to have a balls-contest with you and I'd appreciate it if you wouldn't keep trying to sign me up for it.

It's plain that Riyeh came here and started punching people in the face for no reason other than stating their own opinions. Why doesn't any mod pay the slightest bit of attention to that? Since it's my thread, the whole damn thing will get shut down over trolls who seem to run this place. The discussion pays the price for the behavior and that's not fair. Although it's 300% more likely when it's my discussion for some reason.

Let's act civil and discuss this topic, or go find something else to discuss please.

[SHaYap]

the natural non F water resources are reserved for the major industrial bottled, packaged and canned beverages, drinks or wine and beer manufacturers ~ those top brands can't have F in it and keep to taste ~ without 'approved' additives and allowed flavoring in the 'cheap' stuff anyways ~

As most Australians love a beer I thought I’d create an article for open discussion on 'natural' beer and wine.

What do you know about the Australian beer and wine industry with regards to Fluoride/Toxins, raw ingredient, organics/gm , and the ownership of these companies?

• flouride Australia link
  

and

50 Reasons to Oppose Fluoridation

By Paul Connett, PhD (updated in September 2012)

In Europe, only Ireland (73%), Poland (1%), Serbia (3%), Spain (11%), and the U.K. (11%) fluoridate any of their water. Most developed countries, including Japan and 97% of the western European population, do not consume fluoridated water.

In the U.S., about 70% of public water supplies are fluoridated. This equates to approximately 185 million people, which is over half the number of people drinking artificially fluoridated water worldwide. Some countries have areas with high natural fluoride levels in the water. These include India, China and parts of Africa. In these countries measures are being taken to remove the fluoride because of the health problems that fluoride can cause.

• F A N link
  

that's 49 more than enough for me ~

In Malaysia where we love our food more than anything else ~ we know how food tastes sideways with food prepared with F water , and we've known it for years ~

~

[Harte]

Salt is a word do describe many chemical compounds. Some of which are toxic or industrial waste, some of which are necessary to sustain life. Salt can be a natural mineral or otherwise organic that is not industrial waste at all.

A huge part of a problem when making an argument about salt is using the term salt. Salt can mean many things. From edible salts to toxic ones.

Within the argument of fluoridating water, even fluoride can be in many chemical combinations, of which sodium fluoride is one. And sodium fluoride is not the only fluoride salt.

Though it is true that anything can be toxic at some level. Water can be toxic. Oxygen can be toxic. Salt compounds that are necessary to function can be toxic. Fluoride, while not a necessity to life, can be beneficial in some perimeters, and toxic in others.

I thought of the other uses of the word salt after I posted that. A salt is the result when an acid and a base are combined, so obviously there are quite a few very nasty salts out there.

I was referring to table salt.

12 to 16 (estimated) tablespoons killed this woman: link

Obviously, that's a lot of salt and no adult in their right mind is in danger of salt poisoning. But it illustrates my (and your) point - everything is toxic - and it underscores the idea that there are safe levels of anything that's toxic (including fluoride.)

Also, regular table salt is an industrial waste. link Of course, not the salt sold in stores.

So characterizations of any chemical as "toxic industrial waste" is pretty much meaningless, since this characterization fits many chemicals that we don't ordinarily think of as either.

Harte

[TheDarkerSide]

Where I am the water is treated, but that is fine by me! I guess I would be pretty useless finding my own clean, sanitised bug free water, uncontaminated by animal and human waste. So I am happy to turn on the tap and drink. Happy knowing the water company has treated and decontaminated the water to a level that makes it as safe as possible. No health related problems and my family have drunk fluoride added water since it was introduced before my birth. I think a lot of this mis information is put out to obtain bigger sales for the bottled water industry.

[danielost]

where i live, i can't drink the city water. it has some kind of fungus in it. i am in a nursing home and on doctors orders i have to drink bottled water. my water only has water in it. when i was drinking the city water i was throwing up everyday. this went on for about four months. before they got the doctor's order for the bottled.

[danielost]

I thought of the other uses of the word salt after I posted that. A salt is the result when an acid and a base are combined, so obviously there are quite a few very nasty salts out there.

I was referring to table salt.

12 to 16 (estimated) tablespoons killed this woman: link

Obviously, that's a lot of salt and no adult in their right mind is in danger of salt poisoning. But it illustrates my (and your) point - everything is toxic - and it underscores the idea that there are safe levels of anything that's toxic (including fluoride.)

Also, regular table salt is an industrial waste. link Of course, not the salt sold in stores.

So characterizations of any chemical as "toxic industrial waste" is pretty much meaningless, since this characterization fits many chemicals that we don't ordinarily think of as either.

Harte

table salt is gotten from evaporation pools. rock salt is also from these pools.

[ChrLzs]

iodine chlorine and fluoride are all in the same class of poisons.

Good Grief.

Some folks need to take a chemistry class. Did you not realise that, as a VERY OBVIOUS example, chlorine and chlorides are COMPLETELY and utterly different???

If not, then how is it that we NEED salt, which is sodium chloride? Both Sodium and Chlorine are very, very nasty things... By Dan's ridiculous logic, salt is just as deadly as chlorine gas...

You know, H₂O is lethal under many circumstances, too, Daniel...... If I was you I'd stop drinking it.

We need some flouride as a trace element for healthy teeth - the only thing up for argument is whether, in a typical diet, you get enough that there is no need for it to be supplemented.

I'd happily offer much more scientific literature and studies and reports that show the benefits of fluoridation, but those of Daniel's ilk who gullibly swallow this rubbish wouldn't visit any site that had peer-reviewed science. Youtube and tinfoilsites rule as a reference for the Daniels..

Does anyone here have a credible reference that looks at the actual numbers of proven benefits to teeth, versus any ill-effects like the very rare and largely harmless dental fluorosis? And that shows that fluorosis (or whatever) was caused by fluoridation?