Jump to content
Join the Unexplained Mysteries community today! It's free and setting up an account only takes a moment.
- Sign In or Create Account -

Homosexuality, sin, choice or biology?


Jor-el

Recommended Posts

If Homosexuality is not a choice , why are woman turning to it in droves after there marriages break up, unable to find a man who can understand them they then find this path.

Where exactly are women turning lesbian 'in droves'?

That saidd, some gay people in the past did repress theselves and get married, thining it would 'cure' them. In recent years they decidedbeing honest with themselves is better than not.

and what of free will Free Will? yes FREE WILL....to say your not given this blessing and claim you dont have this is the counter from those who practice Homosexuality as a lifestyle.

In terms of free will and sexual orientation, there's not much free will involved. But the there isn't in terms of sexual attraction anyway.

You're straight, that much is obvious. Are you attracted to every member of the opposite sex? No. Could you make yourself attracted to someone of the opposite sex you aren't attracted to? No. So as you can see, while you have free will, that doesn't mean you can chose who you are attracted to.

for all the proof that the homosexuals claim that they are born that way there is no verifiable and repeatable proof, in that we can not know a lifeforms chosen path before its walked, DNA can not show this... .likewise theres no proof in DNA murderes are born that way, there is no proof in DNA rightous are likewise born that way. people take free will out of the debate.

There's nothing confirmed yet because the research in the aea is still pretty new. There's many theories, but proving them takes time, time that there hasn't been yet.

To denie you have been given free will is a major cause for concern.

As said above, free will has nothing to do with sexual attraction or sexual orientation.

Does not the mind control the flesh? but the Homosexuals claim the flesh controls the mind, the true principal (as shown by Saint Paul: the law in my members is at war ...wretched man i am) is that we all have to rise above our physical desires,

Why should a gay person force themselves to be straight? Why should a gay person deny themselves love and companionship? Would you expect the same of straight people?

Edited by shadowhive
Link to comment
Share on other sites

OK sex is not just about reproduction in the natural world. Higher ordered mammals engage in sex (homosexual and heterosexual) not only for reproduction, they also do it for fun, comfort, if they're bored..you name it. So to say that it isn't a biological natural state is a fallacy made by those who are uncomfortable themselves with homosexual sex. Do like the bonobos do, if you don't like it, don't do it. Other than I don't see where the OP is attempting to address a question so much as have people agree with the supposition that it doesn't hold a biological need. That has been proven false, shown to be false and that the reason homosexuality is frowned upon at all is cultural bias.

  • Like 1
Link to comment
Share on other sites

Oh my, what has happened here?

If Homosexuality is not a choice , why are woman turning to it in droves after there marriages break up, unable to find a man who can understand them they then find this path.

Perhaps they were bisexual or pansexual beforehand? Also "in droves" is a drastic overstatement.

and what of free will Free Will? yes FREE WILL....to say your not given this blessing and claim you dont have this is the counter from those who practice Homosexuality as a lifestyle.

You're* This is one thing that really upsets me. When people call someone's sexuality a 'lifestyle'. I do not think the way I live my life is any different from a straight mans. I wake up in the morning, go to the restroom, wash my hands, eat (usually leftovers or cereal), go to work(or if I am out of work, look for a job), come home, play video games or get online, shower and then sleep. I just happen to find men, women and sometimes a mix of the two (transgender, genderqueer, etc.) attractive.

for all the proof that the homosexuals claim that they are born that way there is no verifiable and repeatable proof, in that we can not know a lifeforms chosen path before its walked, DNA can not show this... .likewise theres no proof in DNA murderes are born that way, there is no proof in DNA rightous are likewise born that way. people take free will out of the debate.

Born this way, baby! I wouldn't have chosen to be picked on in school and sometimes still today. Also, not everything is known about human biology. There very well may be a "gay gene". Why should it matter outside of a religious context that often denies science anyway?

To denie you have been given free will is a major cause for concern.

Does not the mind control the flesh? but the Homosexuals claim the flesh controls the mind, the true principal (as shown by Saint Paul: the law in my members is at war ...wretched man i am) is that we all have to rise above our physical desires,

We have to rise above our desires that would harm another. Me being with another man in no way hurts anyone.

As for free will... Really, if it was a matter of willing yourself to change your sexuality, don't you think people would? Let me tell you it's not fun to get a tooth knocked out because someone doesn't approve of who you are.

  • Like 2
Link to comment
Share on other sites

none of these arguments posed by them have any merit, you either have free will or you dont, if you dont think you do i advise going to the hospital right now as you lost control of your senses and getting yourself diagnosed...it would better if somebody can take you for your own safty also!. no thats silly i know, , but thats your argument!

i cant control my body....Born this way..Its Natural.

just one thing lacks in your debate...EVIDENCE. show me the DNA that differs thiose born gay to those Born straight? if this is the case then your a seperate species..a race apart, that there is not 2 types of humans ,there is four types then ,at least 4 types. ( this is your argument , if your born gay then you are born different biologicaly to straight humans..)

BTW, i simply repeating and clarifying your words back to you. theres no judgement here.

do you claim to be born biologicaly diffrent to straight humans ? since you have no free will ? These are the things you claim..

Edited by Irrelevant
Link to comment
Share on other sites

There's no point arguing with someone who can't understand the simple truth that free will has nothing to do with who you love, your sexual orientation or who you are attracted to.

  • Like 1
Link to comment
Share on other sites

I agree and that is not the point is it, because again this is a social argument.

Let us make distinction here, my argument has got nothing to do with accepting or rejecting homosexuality. It is purely based one thing alone. Biology.

That's really good. Because biology has little to say about sociology. You should distinguish the two. You happen to be talking with a person with a degree in a social science and a healthy understanding of biological sciences including lab work at a university. I have continued relentlessly to show you that biology does not hold that sexuality is purely about reproduction beyond endorphins gained from eating burgers with sugar coated ketchup. I hope you are not in the habit of ignoring certain facts.

  • Like 1
Link to comment
Share on other sites

show me the DNA that differs thiose born gay to those Born straight? if this is the case then your a seperate species..a race apart, that there is not 2 types of humans ,there is four types then ,at least 4 types. ( this is your argument , if your born gay then you are born different biologicaly to straight humans..)

You do realise that many of our genes differ from person to person, don't you? Does that make us all different species? I'm really struggling to understand your thought processes here.

  • Like 4
Link to comment
Share on other sites

Do you guys realize this thread is going no-where?

Link to comment
Share on other sites

Yes I know, before I started this thread I did some studying on the issue and I was at that wiki page myself. The point is that there is something that is not mentioned anywhere..

Prevalence.

If the norm is heterosexuality and not merely one of many different sexual orientations then it can equally be classified as a deviance from the norm, which suggests a genetic or hormonal imbalance or mutation, which could then be curable by genetic therapy, which will be soon available to many with a wider selection of possible alterations we can will on our offspring. from eye colour to sexual orientation.

Small minds see the world in blacks and whites, no surprise here.

Sexuality isn't strictly "homo" or "hetero". Human sexuality exists on a spectrum. There is no "norm" so to say.

  • Like 1
Link to comment
Share on other sites

none of these arguments posed by them have any merit, you either have free will or you dont, if you dont think you do i advise going to the hospital right now as you lost control of your senses and getting yourself diagnosed...it would better if somebody can take you for your own safty also!. no thats silly i know, , but thats your argument!

i cant control my body....Born this way..Its Natural.

just one thing lacks in your debate...EVIDENCE. show me the DNA that differs thiose born gay to those Born straight? if this is the case then your a seperate species..a race apart, that there is not 2 types of humans ,there is four types then ,at least 4 types. ( this is your argument , if your born gay then you are born different biologicaly to straight humans..)

BTW, i simply repeating and clarifying your words back to you. theres no judgement here.

do you claim to be born biologicaly diffrent to straight humans ? since you have no free will ? These are the things you claim..

A separate species? Jesus christ, did you pay attention in high school biology? Ignorance....its what's for dinner I guess.

I mean no really, are you a poe?

Edited by Copasetic
  • Like 1
Link to comment
Share on other sites

none of these arguments posed by them have any merit, you either have free will or you dont, if you dont think you do i advise going to the hospital right now as you lost control of your senses and getting yourself diagnosed...it would better if somebody can take you for your own safty also!. no thats silly i know, , but thats your argument!

i cant control my body....Born this way..Its Natural.

So, me finding other men attractive is equivalent to a sudden onset of a debilitating illness? How quaint. Do you or do you not have a "type"? It's the same darn thing. You are blowing things way out of proportion.

just one thing lacks in your debate...EVIDENCE. show me the DNA that differs thiose born gay to those Born straight? if this is the case then your a seperate species..a race apart, that there is not 2 types of humans ,there is four types then ,at least 4 types. ( this is your argument , if your born gay then you are born different biologicaly to straight humans..)

I have blonde hair. My sister has brown hair. My genetic makeup differs from hers in that way. If every little difference were to make up a new category, there would be so many types... I am biologically different from my sister. Doesn't make me any less human than she.

Ya know, certain groups of people once thought black people and Native Americans were different species. Good thing we got that cleared up or I'd be a human/native hybrid instead of full blown human!

BTW, i simply repeating and clarifying your words back to you. theres no judgement here.

Because I totally didn't take offense to being called another species... Then again, it might be nice to be a species apart from hateful humans. Perhaps the humans will put me on a reserve with all the hardboiled eggs and coffee I could ever want...

do you claim to be born biologicaly diffrent to straight humans ? since you have no free will ? These are the things you claim..

I am different on a chemical level in the same way as I am not a clone, rather a haphazard mash up of genes that survived through the generations to make me. I love me. Most of the time.

I obviously have the will to argue with you.

  • Like 1
Link to comment
Share on other sites

Does scientific consensus explain why then there is a preponderance of heterosexuality in nature (which includes mankind) and not of homosexuality?

Given that these conditions are said to be genetic and influence by environment, why then do we not see nature, in certain geographical areas, take an opposite tack to heterosexuality, merely statistically that would seem likely.

Because no two individuals of any species carry the exact same genetic outlines. Not even identical twins have identical genes. They may be similar, but there are variations. As such, heterosexuality is the primary "default" position because without the drive for heterosexual sex, then there is no procreation (unless the species is asexual, but most are not). If any geographical area did for some outlandish reason discover itself to be primarily homosexual, within two generations the species would die out in that area.
  • Like 1
Link to comment
Share on other sites

none of these arguments posed by them have any merit, you either have free will or you dont, if you dont think you do i advise going to the hospital right now as you lost control of your senses and getting yourself diagnosed...it would better if somebody can take you for your own safty also!. no thats silly i know, , but thats your argument!

i cant control my body....Born this way..Its Natural.

just one thing lacks in your debate...EVIDENCE. show me the DNA that differs thiose born gay to those Born straight? if this is the case then your a seperate species..a race apart, that there is not 2 types of humans ,there is four types then ,at least 4 types. ( this is your argument , if your born gay then you are born different biologicaly to straight humans..)

BTW, i simply repeating and clarifying your words back to you. theres no judgement here.

do you claim to be born biologicaly diffrent to straight humans ? since you have no free will ? These are the things you claim..

So why are you straight?

Link to comment
Share on other sites

Ignorance for dinner..i like that.

Dont brandish qualifications if you cant show what they amount to. I have honorary doctorates too.

I will point out to you halfpipe that shadow thinks parents should be allowed to have sex with there children, the one HE wants the state to give him, since He and His lover cant concieve, and why is that? Oh thats right, because the only place his Boyfriend could hope to concieve from is where the the origins of his debate comes from.

Backwards thought? I like that one too, buttocks thought would more appropriate from you however.

You got no evidence yet want laws overturned, but theres one law you can never overturn and thats the law of nature. A law established by my Father. As for why i desire woman ( and my wife and 3 children have passed, and i live chaste i might add BY CHOICE) is because this was what my father, community wrote into me. Gay is enviromental, no biology about it.( i couldnt care less about your Qual, mine are not given by man!) Theres no judgement here, except one, thats you shadow,but im praying foryou , and for those children you desire to harm that they be protected from you and those like you.

Edited by Irrelevant
Link to comment
Share on other sites

Go on Shadow, tell us again in your own words about how incesst is right...enlighten the UM community about what you hold true in this regard..

Link to comment
Share on other sites

I don't think the comparisons are equivalent. Do you think a person with green hair is the norm, or about someone with yellow eyes?

We are not talking of variation here, but of biological traits that are caused genetically due to mutation. It may not even be a gene that is the cause of homosexuality but other biological factors, in any other case where equivalent situations occur, we call them genetic disorders, why should we be calling homosexuality anything else?

Yellow eyes are actually a bad example as I have yellow eyes, well amber but it’s the same thing, which just goes to show that you don’t really understand what normal is or the amount of variation there can be.

Edited by Odin11
Link to comment
Share on other sites

cover your eyes!!! lol but its nature...

your points have been blown to smithers..*SNIP*

I fight for the rights of children ( who are inocent) as they have no law written into them but the laws we as society write, so i pray let society write the right laws, that society becomes a true society that raises children who to themselves be true according to there created purpose..

your done..goodbye.

Edited by Paranoid Android
Removed veiled insult
Link to comment
Share on other sites

none of these arguments posed by them have any merit, you either have free will or you dont, if you dont think you do i advise going to the hospital right now as you lost control of your senses and getting yourself diagnosed...it would better if somebody can take you for your own safty also!. no thats silly i know, , but thats your argument!

i cant control my body....Born this way..Its Natural.

Nor can you, however it is clear you should already be in a mental hospital.
Link to comment
Share on other sites

That religion is merely the patsy for a much wider human feeling against homosexuality. When religion is removed as in the case of Nazis and Communism, the homosexual community was still treated badly or even worse than badly.

Nazi Germany and Communist Russia were influenced by the negative teachings of their Christian past against homosexuals. Take that into account. If oldschool Christianity didn't have an issue with it, Germany and Russia wouldn't have thought about killing their gay brothers and sisters. The Nazi party was formed at a gay bar, S&M gay bar. Ironic isn't it.
  • Like 1
Link to comment
Share on other sites

Ignorance for dinner..i like that.

Hope you aren't talkin' 'bout me an' Shadowhive, cuz, between the two of us, you'll go hungry.

Dont brandish qualifications if you cant show what they amount to. I have honorary doctorates too.

Obviously not ones in spelling or grammar. I mean, I honestly can not tell who you are talking to sometimes.

I will point out to you halfpipe that shadow thinks parents should be allowed to have sex with there children, the one HE wants the state to give him, since He and His lover cant concieve, and why is that? Oh thats right, because the only place his Boyfriend could hope to concieve from is where the the origins of his debate comes from.

Their* Why shouldn't a homosexual couple be able to raise a child? I mean, having two dads is a whole heck of a lot better than being put through the foster care system. Jesus had two dads.

And HOLY COW! Shadowhive is gay? Dude! I wish I'd known sooner. I hope he looks like his avi. Grell is scrumptious. Yet... You seem to think he'd prefer Ciel.

Backwards thought? I like that one too, buttocks thought would more appropriate from you however.

Who is this one directed at? I think I missed someone's post. Sorry, whoever you are.

You got no evidence yet want laws overturned, but theres one law you can never overturn and thats the law of nature.

*sing-song voice* Seperation of church and sta~ate!

A law established by my Father. As for why i desire woman ( and my wife and 3 children have passed, and i live chaste i might add BY CHOICE) is because this was what my father, community wrote into me.

Oh man, seeing your kids go before you must be painful. If I read that right, I'm sorry to hear that you're all alone now.

Gay is enviromental, no biology about it.( i couldnt care less about your Qual, mine are not given by man!)

Seriously, where is your proof?! I didn't just wake up one day and go "duhhr, I LIKE BOTH BECAUSE I WANNA!" It's who I am. I've known for a very long time. Since I was about five. Not that I was sexually attracted to both, of course not. But I could play house with a boy or a girl and have fun imagining my life with them. My parents took me to church every Sunday since I was two months old. I may not be a Christian now, but I was always told that god is loving. God forgives. So, if that is the case, it really doesn't matter, now does it? Why are you wasting your time here? You have nothing to gain by telling us off. I, however, feel threatened. Of course I'm going to lash out when you are calling a group that I am part of all sorts of things.

Theres no judgement here, except one, thats you shadow,but im praying foryou , and for those children you desire to harm that they be protected from you and those like you.

What- I don't even- I must be missing posts or something because I never saw one in which Shadowhive said it was cool to harm children.

Oh, and I hate to burst your bubble, but there is incest in the bible. But, hey, as long as they are two consenting adults, who am I to judge?

And you better believe I will fight until my last breath for my right to marry Niki.

  • Like 1
Link to comment
Share on other sites

None of the Christian Aplogists here are suggesting brutality or anything of the sort against homsexuals...None are seeking to have them suffer.. infact i support there wish to marry! let them, however the placement of children by the state into these homes i cant support, its a unatural outcome of such a union..therefore its against my lords wishes, against nature ..and heres why! and if nature discriminates then perhaps take that up with your creator.

before anybody says another word id enchourage you shadow ( who has never been short of a word) , for HIM to tell us again in HIS words about how children can have sex with there parents??... and i belong in a mental home rlyleh? sorry , i fight for those who cant fight for themselves, thats children first! if that puts me in a mental home then it would be the sanity ward...

Link to comment
Share on other sites

before anybody says another word id enchourage you shadow ( who has never been short of a word) , for HIM to tell us again in HIS words about how children can have sex with there parents??...

I've been following this thread and I've read many of Shadow's posts. He's never said what you claim. At best, you can't read properly. At worst, you're deliberately misrepresenting him with your spurious and revolting accusations.

I challenge you to produce the post where he said that.

Shameful.

Link to comment
Share on other sites

at best hes hiding...refusing to say what he said on the Athiests go to heaven thread , where he claimed to first be a girl, who was attacked by christians...then the holy spirit came and showed us all who he really was and his purpose...

Link to comment
Share on other sites

before anybody says another word id enchourage you shadow ( who has never been short of a word) , for HIM to tell us again in HIS words about how children can have sex with there parents??

If you go back to his comments, you'll note that his comment was referring to an adult child - in other words, two consenting adults, if they happen to be related that's between them. I don't agree with that sentiment either, but intimating that shadowhive is a paedophile is unwarranted, and I'm asking you now to stop the false allegations.

at best hes hiding...refusing to say what he said on the Athiests go to heaven thread , where he claimed to first be a girl, who was attacked by christians...then the holy spirit came and showed us all who he really was and his purpose...

It's fair to say that I've argued with shadowhive more often than probably any other person on UM. I think you'll find you were mistaken that he claimed to be a girl. In all the time I've debated with him he's only ever declared that he's a male. You'll have to pull up the specific post that says otherwise because I've never seen it. Edited by Paranoid Android
  • Like 3
Link to comment
Share on other sites

None of the Christian Aplogists here are suggesting brutality or anything of the sort against homsexuals...None are seeking to have them suffer.. infact i support there wish to marry! let them, however the placement of children by the state into these homes i cant support, its a unatural outcome of such a union..therefore its against my lords wishes, against nature ..and heres why! and if nature discriminates then perhaps take that up with your creator.

So you'd rather they suffer foster care and orphanages rather than have warm, loving homes? That doesn't really seem like you are looking out for them.

I have been hurt, physically, because of who I am. Those who hurt me claimed they did it because I was against god and to teach me a lesson. Just because you don't do it doesn't mean others don't.

before anybody says another word id enchourage you shadow ( who has never been short of a word) , for HIM to tell us again in HIS words about how children can have sex with there parents??...

Shadowhive may be asleep by now. It's almost three AM where I'm at.

and i belong in a mental home rlyleh? sorry , i fight for those who cant fight for themselves, thats children first! if that puts me in a mental home then it would be the sanity ward...

I can't say if I agree or disagree with Ryleh's statement, but you do come off as rather uppity and self-important. Sorry, its just my opinion. If I met you on the street you might be a nice guy, but here you kinda look like a jerk. The same can also be said for me from time to time.

Now if you will excuse me for a moment, I'm going to go review this thread you mentioned.

Link to comment
Share on other sites

Guest
This topic is now closed to further replies.
  • Recently Browsing   0 members

    • No registered users viewing this page.