Frank Merton Posted June 19, 2013 #26 Share Posted June 19, 2013 Oh talk about difficult problems, especially for a foreigner trying to do business with women in the States. Off the top some assume you are sexist, and depending on the woman's politics, which you don't know, either is likely to give offense. I decided "what the hell," and went with Mz all the time unless I was told otherwise. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Clarakore Posted June 19, 2013 #27 Share Posted June 19, 2013 Right it is Ms. and not miss if spelled out and what I was trying to spell out, thx Taun. Ms. or miss, whichever one, both work here and are pronounced exactly the same here, with an 's' sound. If writing to any female would definitely spell it out as Ms. Never hear Mrs. or misses pronounced with a 'z' here either unless someone is trying to be humorous. When some old-timers talk about their wives here they will say "the missus" for Mrs. Maybe the official rules state otherwise. Collins dictionary allows for both the 'z' and 's' sound but that is not really an American dictionary. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Purplos Posted June 19, 2013 #28 Share Posted June 19, 2013 Yah, up here in the north women don't want to be called ma'am. They see it as a sign they're getting old. Being called darling, honey, dear or anything like that is too familiar and kinda creepy, unless the person doing it is an older southern woman. Interesting how cultures vary. That being said, people can still be polite and friendly. I say please and thank you all the time. I call elderly people sir or ma'am, such as "Excuse me please, ma'am" when they're blocking the entire grocery aisle. I'm 38 and wouldn't call people my own age by any title like that, and certainly wouldn't call younger people anything either. 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Beckys_Mom Posted June 19, 2013 #29 Share Posted June 19, 2013 (edited) To a large number of women here in the States, "Miss" is offensive, they prefer the abbreviation "Ms" which they pronounce "Mizz"... Always seemed a bit pointless and silly to me, but then I'm not a Ms... And "Thank you, Mizz" just doesn't sound right ... Over here many hate being called miss and love..they cannot stand it... Madam is more common over here, I think that's why I liked ma'am ( because it sounds like slang for madam ) we don't hear that over here and it is new to us The younger kids ( girls usually ) get - Young madam OR Young lady ..I tend to say young lady more.. It goes to show you how it can vary and change from one place to another.. some hate it, some don't mind, some love it.. Personally I don't complain, unless the person is being rude and it's how they say it... If they are not rude, then I am ok with it.. I cannot see why I would get upset and b**ch over it. I don't know why people would b**ch over it, if the other person is not being rude. When I am out, I am someone who likes to get things done and keep on the move..I cannot speak for others, but I am not one who likes to complain over small things... Edited June 19, 2013 by Beckys_Mom 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Taun Posted June 19, 2013 #30 Share Posted June 19, 2013 (edited) Over here many hate being called miss and love..they cannot stand it... Madam is more common over here, I think that's why I liked ma'am ( because it sounds like slang for madam ) we don't hear that over here and it is new to us The younger kids ( girls usually ) get - Young madam OR Young lady ..I tend to say young lady more.. It goes to show you how it can vary and change from one place to another.. some hate it, some don't mind, some love it.. I do not get why anyone feels the need to b**ch over it..I am not the kind of person who has a lot of time on my hands when I am out and about to correct people if they call me madam, lady, miss or even ma'am.. As long as they are polite.. Complaining is a waste of my time, I go out and do what I need to do, not yap over a certain greeting...If they are not rude, so what? That's my view...I cannot speak for others but I am not one that has to complain all the time about certain things.. I like to get one with it.. "Young Lady" is mostly used here as either descriptive ("She is a young lady") or when ever mom or dad is PO'd at a daughter (" Explain yourself Young Lady"!)... Madam is seldom used around here (so far as I know) and calling a woman "Madam" would probably indicate to her you thought she ran a house of prostitution... And I agree... I don't see why some people get upset over these things... in virtually every case you can tell the intent of the title used by the person's tone... Politeness should never be criticized, even if the usage is incorrect... Edited June 19, 2013 by Taun 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Beckys_Mom Posted June 19, 2013 #31 Share Posted June 19, 2013 "Young Lady" is mostly used here as either descriptive ("She is a young lady") or when ever mom or dad is PO'd at a daughter (" Explain yourself Young Lady"!)... Madam is seldom used around here (so far as I know) and calling a woman "Madam" would probably indicate to her you thought she ran a house of prostitution... And I agree... I don't see why some people get upset over these things... in virtually every case you can tell the intent of the title used by the person's tone... Politeness should never be criticized, even if the usage is incorrect... Well yes, if they are only trying to be polite in their own way, so be it.. If they were rude and trying to push you out of the way and so on, that's a different matter. 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
danielost Posted June 19, 2013 Author #32 Share Posted June 19, 2013 I also use please, thank you, open doors and let people in front of me while shopping if I have a big load and they only have a few items. I don't mind letting people in front of me in lines. What I do mind is the person who thinks their intitled to being in front of me. You, see I am handycapped, but you couldn't tell just by looking at me. That is before I got wheel chaired bound. I am sure there are others out there like me. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
danielost Posted June 19, 2013 Author #33 Share Posted June 19, 2013 The Vietnamese language has up to maybe sixty words that translate "you." It is not all that hard for Westerners though as the most important ones are also relative words. Still, in my opinion English has all the world beat on that subject, with just one word to use and no rules (unless you are speaking to God or are a Quaker). Yes, but you lose a lot in translation. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Beckys_Mom Posted June 19, 2013 #34 Share Posted June 19, 2013 (edited) I don't mind letting people in front of me in lines. Sometimes that can cost you..The odd time when being polite and letting people push in front of you doesn't always make you feel good.. Check this out, I saw it on then once.. Florida lottery: 84-year-old widow scoops biggest lottery win in US history The Florida pensioner, who lives in a small shack, admitted she had only won because someone had let her push in front of them in a shop http://www.mirror.co...3#ixzz2Wgrf7p1z I can't imagine how the lady who let the old woman push in front when waiting to buy a lottery ticket. feels. I have had a good few old people push in front of me in supermarkets etc, I normally say - Oh no problem. But after watching that on the news it i making me think twice lol I was at the dentist a few days ago, waiting for ages to speak to a receptionist . An elderly man came barging in..The lady behind the desk said -" Ok, who's next ?" and before I could move forward, he pushed right in front of me.. I didn't say a word but I felt like saying something...Sometimes the elderly can be rude and don't give a rap... Not all elderly people would be that rude, but some can be..... I think, once rude, always rude for some out there Edited June 19, 2013 by Beckys_Mom Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
danielost Posted June 19, 2013 Author #35 Share Posted June 19, 2013 (edited) As for the loto winner, she would have picked the same numbers and so would the nice lady who let her in front. Assuming neither let the computer to pick the numbers. The lady who let her in front, was there with her daughter. She said it was a good lesson in manners for her daughter. Edited June 19, 2013 by danielost Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
danielost Posted June 19, 2013 Author #36 Share Posted June 19, 2013 I use sir and ma'am. But I hate titles and last names. So if I know their first, I use that or ma'am or sir. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Beckys_Mom Posted June 19, 2013 #37 Share Posted June 19, 2013 (edited) The lady who let her in front, was there with her daughter. She said it was a good lesson in manners for her daughter. I read somewhere that it was her young son. Well it doesn't matter now anyway.. Edited June 19, 2013 by Beckys_Mom Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
freetoroam Posted June 19, 2013 #38 Share Posted June 19, 2013 Its what I was brought up to say to show respect to others. Its free to say. I find it rude when customers come in to ask for something without saying please and there is nothing worse than them expecting you to say thankyou after! I am not that rude, so instead of saying thankyou I say "please" instead, they looked confused at first then it hits them! ......oh and I always smile. 2 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Beckys_Mom Posted June 19, 2013 #39 Share Posted June 19, 2013 Its what I was brought up to say to show respect to others. Its free to say. I find it rude when customers come in to ask for something without saying please and there is nothing worse than them expecting you to say thankyou after! I am not that rude, so instead of saying thankyou I say "please" instead, they looked confused at first then it hits them! ......oh and I always smile. I agree wholeheartedly with you on that ...The word PLEASE doesn't cost us a thing...Neither does a thank you... 3 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
spud the mackem Posted June 19, 2013 #40 Share Posted June 19, 2013 "COURTESY" is FREE, its costs nothing,but you cant buy it.It must be GIVEN. 4 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Kazahel Posted June 20, 2013 #41 Share Posted June 20, 2013 I pretty much always say please and thankyou. I'm not a big fan though of when I hear parents say that line "what do we say" after their child receives something. I think those words should just naturally be used by the child from hearing it. So it always seems fake to me when I hear a parent saying that line in front of others. To me it just comes across as if the parent is just trying to draw attention to their own ap/parent skill. It kinda makes me shudder. 2 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
danielost Posted June 20, 2013 Author #42 Share Posted June 20, 2013 I pretty much always say please and thankyou. I'm not a big fan though of when I hear parents say that line "what do we say" after their child receives something. I think those words should just naturally be used by the child from hearing it. So it always seems fake to me when I hear a parent saying that line in front of others. To me it just comes across as if the parent is just trying to draw attention to their own ap/parent skill. It kinda makes me shudder. Maybe, but you have to teach the child to use them before they can do so with out thinking about it. 2 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Kazahel Posted June 21, 2013 #43 Share Posted June 21, 2013 Maybe, but you have to teach the child to use them before they can do so with out thinking about it. But by just using it yourself you are teaching them. They simply hear you say it and then they say it. That's why some kids might say a swear word, they haven't been formally taught it but have just picked it up. 2 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Frank Merton Posted June 21, 2013 #44 Share Posted June 21, 2013 I don't know that teaching children certain habits of manners is such an important thing. What counts is teaching them respect for others and an ability to discern what others feel and to be compassionate. The cultural forms of communicating all this will follow automatically. 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
danielost Posted June 21, 2013 Author #45 Share Posted June 21, 2013 (edited) Kazal I would agree with you on children eight and older. But, younger they get excited because mom just bought them a candy bar. When I sold ice cream off of a truck. I usually gave the change back to the person who gave me the money even if mom an dad was there with them. Teaches them a little patience. Teaching someone manners is teaching them to respect others. Edited June 21, 2013 by danielost Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Kazahel Posted June 21, 2013 #46 Share Posted June 21, 2013 Kazal I would agree with you on children eight and older. But, younger they get excited because mom just bought them a candy bar. Yes true the very young might just get excited and forget at the time but they are starting to learn. I just think its better if it flows naturally rather than stopping the child to point it out. I've noticed that usually the parents that stop the child, for some strange reason seem to make their voices louder as they tell their children "what do we say". They rarely say that line at a normal volume, which imo kinda says everything. Anyway each to their own. Teaching someone manners is teaching them to respect others. Yes, which can just be done by example. 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Frank Merton Posted June 21, 2013 #47 Share Posted June 21, 2013 Setting a good example is necessary, since when you don't things you've taught are undermined. However, pro-active teaching is also needed. Example is rarely enough. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Ugly1 Posted June 21, 2013 #48 Share Posted June 21, 2013 Oh ya. Please and thank you! I still get people telling me "Don't call me Sir!, or Ma'am!" Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
MissMelsWell Posted June 22, 2013 #49 Share Posted June 22, 2013 I always say please and thank you. I also use sir, ma'am, Mr. and Mrs. and Miss. Along with other old timey favorites like pardon, excuse me, and may I. My mother was raised in central Mississippi and proper manners and grammar were not negotiable for my sister and I. LOL. I was pinched more than once as a kid when I forgot those rules. hahaha. 2 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Frank Merton Posted June 22, 2013 #50 Share Posted June 22, 2013 There is a line to walk between courtesy and patronization. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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