ambelamba Posted September 28, 2013 #1 Share Posted September 28, 2013 I started to wonder if John of Patmos indeed saw a vision of future. Except that the visions were not about one single continuous event. I wonder if he saw bunch of different visions about vastly different time periods and thought that they were all connected together, and he was wrong. What he saw were a bunch of non-related future events that just poured into his feeble brain like metaphysical buckcake. (hahaha) Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Jodie.Lynne Posted September 28, 2013 #2 Share Posted September 28, 2013 Or perhaps he was merely a religious zealot and full of delirium dreams caused by fasting and flagellation?? 3 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Ogbin Posted September 28, 2013 #3 Share Posted September 28, 2013 Ambelamba, Revelation 1:3 "Blessed is he that readeth, and they that hear the words of this prophecy, and keep those things which are written therein: for the time is at hand." Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Rlyeh Posted September 29, 2013 #4 Share Posted September 29, 2013 Ambelamba, Revelation 1:3 "Blessed is he that readeth, and they that hear the words of this prophecy, and keep those things which are written therein: for the time is at hand." Someone can quote verses. 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Sir Wearer of Hats Posted September 30, 2013 #5 Share Posted September 30, 2013 Ambelamba, Revelation 1:3 "Blessed is he that readeth, and they that hear the words of this prophecy, and keep those things which are written therein: for the time is at hand." Well the time that was at hand has been at hand for a fair while now. Is it more at hand today then it was when John wrote what he did? 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Copen Posted September 30, 2013 #6 Share Posted September 30, 2013 Revelation is very orderly and understandable. "For the time is at hand..." is later broken down into 3 eras given Rev. 1:19: (1) write the things thou has seen concerning the events up to that time which he did when he wrote Rev. 12; (2) write things that presently are concerning the 7 churches and God's message to them; and (3) the things that shall be hereafter, which is end time prophecy. Every time the angel said to John, come up here - - it was like climbing to the top of a hill or mountain to see what was happening on the other side. Every time John went up to heaven he could see the events that were going to happen in the future. God bless. 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Grandpa Greenman Posted September 30, 2013 #7 Share Posted September 30, 2013 Mushroom soup . 3 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Ogbin Posted September 30, 2013 #8 Share Posted September 30, 2013 (edited) Sir Wearer of Hats, Yes I do believe that the time is at hand, more now than when John wrote the book Revelation. Since the death, resurrection and ascension of Christ Jesus, every generation has said Christ is going to return in their time. However this generation is seeing all the signs happening at once, unlike all the other generations before it. The book of Daniel and the book of Revelation are now being understood for the first time since they were written. The state of mind towards Israel is getting worse. Nations and peoples that were written about thousands of years ago are seen today aligning themselves against Israel just as written. And the fact that Israel is a nation once again after two thousands years is just amazing, in fact it's a Miricle. edit: The reason for prophey is this, John 14:29 "And now I have told you before it come to pass, that, when it is come to pass, ye might believe." edit: spelling Edited September 30, 2013 by Ogbin 2 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Jodie.Lynne Posted October 1, 2013 #9 Share Posted October 1, 2013 And the fact that Israel is a nation once again after two thousands years is just amazing, in fact it's a Miricle. A miracle? Not so much. More like a mandate from the United Nations in 1948 http://www.theocracywatch.org/christian_zionism_israel_forms.htm 2 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Frank Merton Posted October 1, 2013 #10 Share Posted October 1, 2013 A miracle? Not so much. More like a mandate from the United Nations in 1948 http://www.theocracy...srael_forms.htm People do manage to make events fit whatever fantasy they have in front of them if they want to. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ambelamba Posted October 1, 2013 Author #11 Share Posted October 1, 2013 Revelation is very orderly and understandable. "For the time is at hand..." is later broken down into 3 eras given Rev. 1:19: (1) write the things thou has seen concerning the events up to that time which he did when he wrote Rev. 12; (2) write things that presently are concerning the 7 churches and God's message to them; and (3) the things that shall be hereafter, which is end time prophecy. -snip. sorry.- Are you suuuuure? Seriously, have to tried to visualize every single verses in the Revelation and connect them altogether? To me, the later part of the document looks really, really incoherent. 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Frank Merton Posted October 1, 2013 #12 Share Posted October 1, 2013 Revelations seem to me an example (there was a lot of stuff like this written back then) of the ancient world's example of fantasy literature. As I understand it the author's purpose was a veiled attack on the Roman Empire and has nothing to do with us. 3 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ambelamba Posted October 1, 2013 Author #13 Share Posted October 1, 2013 Revelations seem to me an example (there was a lot of stuff like this written back then) of the ancient world's example of fantasy literature. As I understand it the author's purpose was a veiled attack on the Roman Empire and has nothing to do with us. That's the textbook answer and I don't dispute it. What I am really wondering is what kind of chemicals motivate this John of Patmos character. Or did he even visit Patmos at all? 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Imaginarynumber1 Posted October 3, 2013 #14 Share Posted October 3, 2013 Revelations makes perfect sense.... assuming you have eaten mushrooms. I have seen things..... 2 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Lion of Judah Posted October 6, 2013 #15 Share Posted October 6, 2013 You fail to realise that it was the Angels who were showing him the visions which are coming to past in our time and are now in rev. 5 or 6 where it says the 4 horsmen released from hell and the souls dressed in white are under the alter waiting for the second coming Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Skep B Posted October 6, 2013 #16 Share Posted October 6, 2013 You just made this so you had an excuse to use the phrase "metaphysical bukake", didn't you? 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Ben Masada Posted October 7, 2013 #17 Share Posted October 7, 2013 (edited) I started to wonder if John of Patmos indeed saw a vision of future. Except that the visions were not about one single continuous event. I wonder if he saw bunch of different visions about vastly different time periods and thought that they were all connected together, and he was wrong. What he saw were a bunch of non-related future events that just poured into his feeble brain like metaphysical buckcake. (hahaha) IMHO and that of the Catholic translator of the NBA version of the Bible in the preface to the Book of Revelation, the book was not written by John the Apostle but by several anonymous authors and all of them Christians according to the gospel of Paul. Edited October 7, 2013 by Ben Masada Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
spiritualghosthaunting Posted October 7, 2013 #18 Share Posted October 7, 2013 the book was not written by John the Apostle but by several anonymous authors and all of them Christians according to the gospel of Paul. Where in the gospel of Paul? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ambelamba Posted October 7, 2013 Author #19 Share Posted October 7, 2013 Angels do love to get people punkd, aren't they? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Ben Masada Posted October 8, 2013 #20 Share Posted October 8, 2013 Where in the gospel of Paul? The book of Revelation, according to the preface to it by the Catholic scholar editor of the NAB St. Joseph's edition asserts that it was written by several anonymous authors in the 2nd Century and not by John the Apostle. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Ben Masada Posted October 8, 2013 #21 Share Posted October 8, 2013 Angels do love to get people punkd, aren't they? No, they don't. Angels are emanations and there are no emotions in emanations. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Copen Posted November 17, 2013 #22 Share Posted November 17, 2013 (edited) Are you suuuuure? Seriously, have to tried to visualize every single verses in the Revelation and connect them altogether? To me, the later part of the document looks really, really incoherent. The Book of Revelation is easy to put in an outline form. When you get to Chapter 12 it is a flashback of the beginning of the New Testament era with the birth, and ministry of Jesus to the spiritual woman (the true church). From there it focuses on the woman and tells of her travail and how Christianity was saved by two wings of an eagle. When Roman gov't endorsed the Christian religion it saved her from being completely wiped out. In spite of that persecution continued. This time by the established church. So the woman fled across the Atlantic were she was preserved by the 2nd wing of the eagle - - Colonial America. America at that time was a wilderness. And the woman (spiritual Israel - - the true church) was in the wilderness. Next time we see the woman -- the true church -- she is coming out of the wilderness she had gone into. Now, she is rich. She is merchandising trinkets, crosses, idols of Jesus, and into your money to finance her pet projects and gain worldly influence with the kings of the earth. With the arm of man and his money, she has become a harlot church with estates so large that sons inherit their ministries. A harlot sells herself to survive. Think about that next time you see her selling some religious trinket on TV and sponsoring bake sales, cruises, Holy Land Experiences, etc. Revelations then details events that are going to happen. God will have to ordain 144,000 Jews to preach. Enoch and Elijah will have to come and preach and be killed. (These are the only two who have been raptured into heaven without dying -- all have sinned and come short of the glory of God --- all must die ----- these two will have to die.) Then 144,000 Gentiles will be ordained to preach. Much blood and guts and persecution of the true church. Then judgment, and sentencing. I read the end of the book. Jesus wins!!! In the events, start an outline of each of the woes, each of the trumps, etc. You might remember the much touted teachings that at the trump of God the church is going to be raptured before persecution. But I Cor.15:52 says this will happen at the last trump. There are at least 7 trumps in Revelation and they are well past blood and guts persecution of the church. God bless. Edited November 17, 2013 by Copen Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Jack Skellington Posted November 17, 2013 #23 Share Posted November 17, 2013 Or perhaps he was merely a religious zealot and full of delirium dreams caused by fasting and flagellation?? Or a dream caused by pizza and flatulation? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
UrantianX Posted January 6, 2014 #24 Share Posted January 6, 2014 This is the only thing that the Urantia Revelation tells us about the book of Revelation of John the apostle: 139:4.14 (link) When in temporary exile on Patmos, John wrote the Book of Revelation, which you now have in greatly abridged and distorted form. This Book of Revelation contains the surviving fragments of a great revelation, large portions of which were lost, other portions of which were removed, subsequent to John’s writing. It is preserved in only fragmentary and adulterated form. But for more on the Apocalypse, I recommend part of the research of Ernest P. Moyer and other authors like Clinton Ortiz. (...) LuisMarco, 29, Mexico City Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Copen Posted January 7, 2014 #25 Share Posted January 7, 2014 Ambelamba, Revelation 1:3 "Blessed is he that readeth, and they that hear the words of this prophecy, and keep those things which are written therein: for the time is at hand." The sequence of the bk of Revelation is: (1) things thou, John, have seen, (2) things which are, and (3) things which shall be hereafter. Rev 1:1-20 is what John saw. Then chapter 2 and chapter 3 to the churches were the things which are. Starting with chapter 4 is the things which shall be hereafter. When you get to chapter 12 you get a flashback. Chapter 13 starts with the future. Every time an angel says "come up here" it is like going to the top of a mountain to see what is on the other side and what is coming. The united states is in there three times. Blessings Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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