Thanato Posted September 30, 2013 #26 Share Posted September 30, 2013 I think having guns in the same house as there are children is irresponsible in and of itself. Yea they are kept "locked up," but all sorts of things can and do happen. Claiming to be a responsible parent and putting the child in such a situation is a contradiction, and one that has a good chance of ending is perpetual regret. Having kitchen knives is more dangerous then having firearms locked up where a child has no access to them. But then the firearms themselves are no more dangerous then a baseball bat without access to the ammunition which I have locked up separately. Also my firearms themselves have a lock on them which makes them again nothing more then clubs. To say that I am irresponsible for keeping a firearm locked up with triple redundancy locks (2 for the guns, 1 for the ammo) and is completely inaccessible to my child is a unfair when every kitchen has knives that will kill you faster then my firearms can. I am responsible for my firearms and I am responsible for my Child. I will not mix the two until I know my son is ready to respect the firearm. He will not own a firearm until I know he is capable of using it with respect and responsibility. These things are not toys, they are not something to be left laying about where anyone can get at them. 5 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
msmike1 Posted September 30, 2013 #27 Share Posted September 30, 2013 Yep, we need the government to come save us from ourselves. A few less than responsible parents leave a firearm out where a child can get to it and all of a sudden all guns need to be confiscated and destroyed. Please government, come save me from myself. This is also the same gov't that says it's ok to kill a child before it is ever born, but acts like the most caring people on earth when they have an agenda. Mike 2 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Sweetpumper Posted September 30, 2013 #28 Share Posted September 30, 2013 Please government, come save me from myself. It seems that a lot of people need that and welcome it. 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Kowalski Posted September 30, 2013 #29 Share Posted September 30, 2013 Please government, come save me from myself. It seems that a lot of people need that and welcome it. That's because their idiots.... 2 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
andy4 Posted September 30, 2013 #30 Share Posted September 30, 2013 I'm still waiting for someone to tell me why they are even necessary. It seems that some only want guns because its their right, and nothing more. What is the point in having them fully legal in today's society? Can someone give me a genuine reason, with valid points and sense thrown in as well? It's the 21st century here people, can't we drop the guns, along with the fear they propagate? 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
aztek Posted September 30, 2013 #31 Share Posted September 30, 2013 if you can't see it, than, prbly no one will explain any of those things. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
andy4 Posted September 30, 2013 #32 Share Posted September 30, 2013 if you can't see it, than, prbly no one will explain any of those things. No, I'm just yet to hear a reasonable argument to the problem with viable solutions. I will change my mind on the matter if someone can give me a full solution to the problem. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
J. K. Posted September 30, 2013 #33 Share Posted September 30, 2013 No, I'm just yet to hear a reasonable argument to the problem with viable solutions. I will change my mind on the matter if someone can give me a full solution to the problem. This issue bears some similarity to the abortion issue; the two sides don't agree on what the issue is. For one side, it is child safety; for the other side, it is ownership of weapons. Any argument that is made doesn't truly address both of those points. 2 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
FLOMBIE Posted September 30, 2013 #34 Share Posted September 30, 2013 This issue bears some similarity to the abortion issue; the two sides don't agree on what the issue is. For one side, it is child safety; for the other side, it is ownership of weapons. Any argument that is made doesn't truly address both of those points. I see your point, but it's not a fair comparison, though. In the gun debate, there is a middle ground. Regulation. 3 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Kowalski Posted September 30, 2013 #35 Share Posted September 30, 2013 I'm still waiting for someone to tell me why they are even necessary. It seems that some only want guns because its their right, and nothing more. What is the point in having them fully legal in today's society? Can someone give me a genuine reason, with valid points and sense thrown in as well? It's the 21st century here people, can't we drop the guns, along with the fear they propagate? Why on earth, do I feel the need to justify my Second Amendment rights to you ore anyone else? It's none of you or the government's business how many guns I own or why. Try getting raped or having your house broken into, and being beat in front of your little kids, then we'll see how you feel about gun ownership. After all, a liberal is just a conservative who hasn't been raped or mugged yet. Me and my family won't be made into victims just because you and a few idiots are scared of guns. You don't like guns, don't own one. That's your right. But don't tell me what I can and can't own. Down here, where I live, guns are a way of life. They protect us and our families, we use them to hunt and feed our families, and we can use them to defend ourselves from a tyrannical out of control government. That's why we have a Second Amendment. 3 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
DeWitz Posted September 30, 2013 #36 Share Posted September 30, 2013 (edited) Although I may be in a minority, which means little if anything to me, my concern is that errors, mistakes in judgment, 'asleep at the switch' kinds of explanations for these rare cases of children harming with guns is akin to a loose nuke or an accidental anthrax exposure: The consequences of the rare occurrence are unjustifiable. They are final. Just as we cannot legislate morality, we cannot legislate stupidity or caution. This is all true. At the same time, no other advanced, highly industrialized nation on earth has the kind of per capita gun deaths/injuries/problems as the USA does. Why is that? When 'mainstream' America agrees upon a way to interpret the Fourth Amendment of the Constitution so that firearm seizures blanket Chicago, New Orleans, Houston, Los Angeles and other hubs of mayhem without either 'The TEA Party' or Al Sharpton going ballistic, then we will have made progress. Until then, creeping gun control will continue to be perceived by legitimate gun owners, concealed carry citizens, sportsmen and women, Olympic and other target shooters as egregious offenses upon their rights. A common law 'force majeure' or "extenuating circumstances" legal argument could go far in this regard. Gun violence must be stopped in the hands of the gun violent. But no one, "right," "left" or "center" has the brass cojones to take such a minimal step to "stop the violence." So I'll continue to plink along with bows and arrows and my two .22's. Also, I'll continue to stockpile larger caliber ammo, cases of coffee and access to opioids and other painkillers, to be ready to trade during the inevitable showdown some have already billed "the Apocalypse." Edited September 30, 2013 by szentgyorgy Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
msmike1 Posted September 30, 2013 #37 Share Posted September 30, 2013 I'm still waiting for someone to tell me why they are even necessary. It seems that some only want guns because its their right, and nothing more. What is the point in having them fully legal in today's society? Can someone give me a genuine reason, with valid points and sense thrown in as well? It's the 21st century here people, can't we drop the guns, along with the fear they propagate? Really? You need a reason not to let the government control every aspect of your life? Like was said before, if you don't get it nobody will ever be able to explain it to you. I myself am an avid hunter. I am also an avid shooter. Some are very serious competition shooters. Others just like to collect older collectible firearms such as old war guns, not to mention self defense and home defense of myself and my family. In case you have not noticed the world is not getting any safer. If you don't shoot, hunt, collect, etc.. then you won't get it. Mike 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
J. K. Posted September 30, 2013 #38 Share Posted September 30, 2013 Down here, where I live, guns are a way of life. They protect us and our families, we use them to hunt and feed our families, and we can use them to defend ourselves from a tyrannical out of control government. That's why we have a Second Amendment. I'm not against gun ownership, and if you choose to protect your home with a firearm, that's fine with me. What bothers me is the continuing problem of children having access to loaded weapons. What is your solution to that problem? 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
andy4 Posted September 30, 2013 #39 Share Posted September 30, 2013 (edited) Ok, here's my full solution to the problem, no holds barred. Guns for hunting; if you use your guns for hunting, that's great, more power to you. I see nothing at all wrong with this. If you enjoy hunting, a one shot muzzleloader should be plenty effective enough, and you'd get to practice hitting a target knowing you only have one shot. I'd imagine one would be very proficient at shooting at that point. You should also have to prove that you hunt in a certain given time, if hunting is what you like to do. So basically, a hunting license. Check people in when they go hunting, to verify that's what they are using it for. You must also prove that your gun is locked in a very secure location, so that the layman thief won't have access to it. Violate this, your hunting right is revoked. Home defense; make those tasers that shoot darts 20 feet legal for home protection. It's just as effective as a gun, and is substantially less lethal. This is where I'd agree that education would be effective. Even if all aren't listening, it's considered non- lethal, so very few deaths would occur if an accident does happen. If you have children, you must prove that the child has zero access to it, kind of how children aren't allowed to live in unsuitable conditions in everyday life. If you misuse the taser in any form, your right to have one is revoked for life. Illegal guns; if you get caught with an illegal gun you have two options; life imprisonment or a death penalty. I guarantee you nobody in their right mind would want to be caught carrying one at that point. That may sound crazy to some, but it would seem like it would be very effective. You wouldn't have to worry about someone with an illegal gun breaking into your house or robbing you, because it would be insane to be caught with one. Sure some may still have them, but your chances of this occurring would be significantly lower than what it currently is. If you want to collect guns, that's fine. However it must be rendered ineffective, and if you want to hunt with it or go to a gun range, you have to bring it somewhere to render it to be able to shoot with. Also, if you get caught with a gun, wouldn't that be considered possibly wanting to commit a muder anyways? Or some other type of hard crime? If they were illegal in this scenario, you wouldn't have it for show. They are used to kill, after all. That is my honest opinion on what should be done, and I also know that it is just that, an opinion. I'm just giving what I feel would be the best option for the current problem. Edited September 30, 2013 by andy4 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
aztek Posted September 30, 2013 #40 Share Posted September 30, 2013 i don't agree with any of that. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Agent0range Posted September 30, 2013 #41 Share Posted September 30, 2013 i don't agree with any of that. Surprise surprise. What exactly is bad about his hunting recommendation? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Michelle Posted September 30, 2013 #42 Share Posted September 30, 2013 Illegal guns; if you get caught with an illegal gun you have two options; life imprisonment or a death penalty. I guarantee you nobody in their right mind would want to be caught carrying one at that point. That may sound crazy to some,\ That is my honest opinion on what should be done, and I also know that it is just that, an opinion. I'm just giving what I feel would be the best option for the current problem. Yes, it does sound crazy. Murderers and rapists don't even get life in prison or the death penalty most of the time and you want that sort of punishment for a non-violent crime. With rabid logic like that don't expect to be taken seriously. 2 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Uncle Sam Posted September 30, 2013 #43 Share Posted September 30, 2013 Seriously... it is a onslaught of gun control pushes by the government. This is getting to be annoying and downright an assault on my amendment... we need to remove these clowns from office who are keeping this up. This is like the 18th gun control debate! 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
questionmark Posted September 30, 2013 Author #44 Share Posted September 30, 2013 Seriously... it is a onslaught of gun control pushes by the government. This is getting to be annoying and downright an assault on my amendment... we need to remove these clowns from office who are keeping this up. This is like the 18th gun control debate! Could that be because some blokes are incapable of controlling their guns? 3 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Drayno Posted September 30, 2013 #45 Share Posted September 30, 2013 Half of the stories mentioned in the first post are examples of irresponsible gun-owners. Gun-owners with or without children must lock up their weapons with ammunition separate. Whether it's a box with a lock or a safe - a responsible gun owner knows how to properly store a firearm. My heart aches for the children; it reminds me of the movie The Six Sense when you see the kid who says, "Want to see my dad's gun?" Then he turns and half his head is missing, revealing that he's a ghost.. 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
questionmark Posted September 30, 2013 Author #46 Share Posted September 30, 2013 Half of the stories mentioned in the first post are examples of irresponsible gun-owners. Gun-owners with or without children must lock up their weapons with ammunition separate. Whether it's a box with a lock or a safe - a responsible gun owner knows how to properly store a firearm. My heart aches for the children; it reminds me of the movie The Six Sense when you see the kid who says, "Want to see my dad's gun?" Then he turns and half his head is missing, revealing that he's a ghost.. Elementary my dear Watson, but if you want to have a gun control discussion it should not be what gun to control but what to do about irresponsible, incapable and brain amputated. A competition in lack of empathy (as at the beginning of this thread) is little helpful. And that is the crux of the matter. 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
aztek Posted September 30, 2013 #47 Share Posted September 30, 2013 Surprise surprise. What exactly is bad about his hunting recommendation? single shot muzzleloader. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Leonardo Posted September 30, 2013 #48 Share Posted September 30, 2013 How many of those defending the Constitution as if it is religious scripture that is inerrant and permanent, also support WBC's literal interpretation of some of the bible's scripture? 2 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
questionmark Posted September 30, 2013 Author #49 Share Posted September 30, 2013 single shot muzzleloader. can't shoot or something? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
aztek Posted September 30, 2013 #50 Share Posted September 30, 2013 can't shoot or something? like trolling much?? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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