Harte Posted April 20, 2014 #1126 Share Posted April 20, 2014 Seeder beat me to it but I was going to point out that if you put enough men on the job anything can be accomplished by hand that can be done with power tools. Well obviously you couldn't weld steel girders by hand. Maybe this is why the ancients used big rocks instead On further reflection, I hope you aren't suggesting that a tree will grow to fast for me to chop it down with an ax. Even at my age I can clear a few a day alone Steel girders can be welded by hand. By use of a forge, an anvil and a hammer. Harte 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
spacecowboy342 Posted April 20, 2014 #1127 Share Posted April 20, 2014 Steel girders can be welded by hand. By use of a forge, an anvil and a hammer. Harte I'm not sure you could get enough heat to weld true steel girders that way, at least with the penetration required for building purposes but it is a good point that forge welding was accomplished in the middle ages. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
questionmark Posted April 20, 2014 #1128 Share Posted April 20, 2014 I'm not sure you could get enough heat to weld true steel girders that way, at least with the penetration required for building purposes but it is a good point that forge welding was accomplished in the middle ages. Long before the MA, we have some examples of forge welding dating from the late Roman times. Heating the girders probably would have been the smaller problem, handling them and work them before the cease to be white hot would be a much greater one. 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
seeder Posted April 20, 2014 #1129 Share Posted April 20, 2014 (edited) I'm not sure you could get enough heat to weld true steel girders that way, at least with the penetration required for building purposes but it is a good point that forge welding was accomplished in the middle ages. But you could rivet them together. Odd fact: The Vikings in their day, used iron rivets in their wooden ships... a similar time to PP . Edited April 20, 2014 by seeder 2 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
cladking Posted April 20, 2014 #1130 Share Posted April 20, 2014 But many men with axes could do it, lets say a tree is felled after an hour of chopping. Erm, how much did that tree grow in an hour? remember that places like the UK were once ALL forest... and the amount of forest used for building or cleared for farming was done BEFORE modern tools and machinery. Orthodoxy seems to always miss the alts' points. Of course if you have enough men with axes you can deforest the entire planet just as if you have enough monkeys with keypads one will write "War and Peace". There's no evidence there were enough men to do all this work just as there's not enough room in the universe to get a monkey to write War and Peace. We sit in nice comfy chairs and condemn the ancients to a lifetime of incredibly hard work and never notice there still weren't enough people to do all this work. Many things just don't add up. If anyone could duplicate exactly some specific procedure then we could get an estimate of the amount of work required. But just saying something was easy with lots of men is pencil whipping a problem and assuming the conclusion. Every man assigned to a lifetime of grinding a stone is one fewer men able to grow food for all the stone polishers. 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
spacecowboy342 Posted April 20, 2014 #1131 Share Posted April 20, 2014 Orthodoxy seems to always miss the alts' points. Of course if you have enough men with axes you can deforest the entire planet just as if you have enough monkeys with keypads one will write "War and Peace". There's no evidence there were enough men to do all this work just as there's not enough room in the universe to get a monkey to write War and Peace. We sit in nice comfy chairs and condemn the ancients to a lifetime of incredibly hard work and never notice there still weren't enough people to do all this work. Many things just don't add up. If anyone could duplicate exactly some specific procedure then we could get an estimate of the amount of work required. But just saying something was easy with lots of men is pencil whipping a problem and assuming the conclusion. Every man assigned to a lifetime of grinding a stone is one fewer men able to grow food for all the stone polishers. There is no evidence that forests have been cut down? Long before the MA, we have some examples of forge welding dating from the late Roman times. Heating the girders probably would have been the smaller problem, handling them and work them before the cease to be white hot would be a much greater one. Yeah but the Romans steel wasn't the same as what we use today Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
seeder Posted April 20, 2014 #1132 Share Posted April 20, 2014 There's no evidence there were enough men The Tiwanaku civilization and the use of these temples appears to some to have peaked from 700 to 1000 CE. by which point the temples and surrounding area may have been home to some 400,000 people http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Pumapunku#Peak_and_decline I think there were enough people, else, it wouldn't have been built to start with would it? Dont do a zoser and think these were dumb cavemen, I have provided many examples of FINER ancient structures, built 1000 of years before PP, at least Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
spacecowboy342 Posted April 20, 2014 #1133 Share Posted April 20, 2014 While we are on the subject of evidence where is the evidence aliens were around to build anything? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
scorpiosonic Posted April 20, 2014 #1134 Share Posted April 20, 2014 While we are on the subject of evidence where is the evidence aliens were around to build anything? On the Ancient :alien: TV Show. 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Harte Posted April 20, 2014 #1135 Share Posted April 20, 2014 But you could rivet them together. Odd fact: The Vikings in their day, used iron rivets in their wooden ships... a similar time to PP An even odder fact is they, enigmatically, used wooden rivets in their iron ships. Didn't go over well. Ah, well. Live and learn. Harte Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Windowpane Posted April 21, 2014 #1136 Share Posted April 21, 2014 Argument about where fragments from Puma Punku might have come from. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
questionmark Posted April 21, 2014 #1137 Share Posted April 21, 2014 An even odder fact is they, enigmatically, used wooden rivets in their iron ships. Didn't go over well. Ah, well. Live and learn. Harte Nah, but they used wood anchors 'cause metal anchors were way too heavy to carry in those flimsy boats.... in fact horses can't swim 'cause their iron shoes drag them down.... so I guess now we had all seaman yarn spun.... 3 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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