You're going to hell! Join us or die ?

[Leonardo]

Hell or hades only means the grave.

When we get old we are all going to "hell" one day.

Even Jesus was in Hell The Grave.

It's not a magical place with Eternal fire and devils feeding homer simpson donuts.

Is that the best they can do? Join the church or go to hell?

I am tired of these fools saying if you do magic or you believe this or that you are going to hell.

Well of course, because we will all go to the grave one day.

Unless you are an undead vampire or something.

Let the games commence.

While Hell may have become confused with the lake of fire, into which those not "written into the book of life" will be cast to suffer eternal torment after the rapture and second resurrection, that does not mean the bible does not promise that the unbelievers will not be doomed to suffer this eternal torment.

It promises exactly that.

[White Crane Feather]

While Hell may have become confused with the lake of fire, into which those not "written into the book of life" will be cast to suffer eternal torment after the rapture and second resurrection, that does not mean the bible does not promise that the unbelievers will not be doomed to suffer this eternal torment.

It promises exactly that.

I thought it was a garbage pit in Israel. http://www.newworldencyclopedia.org/entry/Gehenna

[White Crane Feather]

I live next door to two JW's they never brother me. They are really good neighbors. The Baptist I know are much worse. I never had a JW dump me as friend because of my religion. I have with Baptist. I never said anything about their religion all I did was say I'm a Pagan. I know why the Bible atheist are so anti religion, they are treated very poorly by Bible belt Christians, as are Pagans. Just try to organize a Pagan festival in the Bible belt and the Christians well do all they can to stop it. I am sure the atheist encounter the same oppositions when they try to have a public get together. Many Bible belt Christians have a bad habit of thinking freedom of religion only applies to them. So can you blame atheist from the Bible belt for being rather testy.

Oooooooo that's sounds like a lot of fun. Really. Organizing pagan festivals in the Bible Belt. It would be a good premis for a reality tv show.

[Michelle]

I live next door to two JW's they never brother me. They are really good neighbors. The Baptist I know are much worse. I never had a JW dump me as friend because of my religion. I have with Baptist. I never said anything about their religion all I did was say I'm a Pagan. I know why the Bible atheist are so anti religion, they are treated very poorly by Bible belt Christians, as are Pagans. Just try to organize a Pagan festival in the Bible belt and the Christians well do all they can to stop it. I am sure the atheist encounter the same oppositions when they try to have a public get together. Many Bible belt Christians have a bad habit of thinking freedom of religion only applies to them. So can you blame atheist from the Bible belt for being rather testy.

I've never had any problem at all being an atheist in the Bible Belt and have never lost a friend, but I've never been an in your face with it kind of person. I know very few Christians that even mention their religion...even our neighbors the preacher or the five Christian school teachers so I'm in no way testy. I'm not sure why atheists would have a public get together though. I have enough people in my life that I have other things in common with without seeking out others who the only thing we may have in common is that we don't believe in God. It's not like it's some kind of activity you can participate in or interesting conversation and I don't need a support group.

[scowl]

I've never had any problem at all being an atheist in the Bible Belt and have never lost a friend, but I've never been an in your face with it kind of person. I know very few Christians that even mention their religion...even our neighbors the preacher or the five Christian school teachers so I'm in no way testy.

My nearly three years in Indiana as a athiest/former Jew was not fun at all. Everyone I met was a practicing Christian and belonged to the best church in town (theirs). People minimized their socialization with people who didn't belong to their church. I had never seen anything like it.

They talked about their church but never about Christianity or religion. I eventually discovered why: no one knew anything about it. I was used to having theological discussions with other Jews, sometimes looking things up. These people knew next to nothing about the Bible, only affirmative verses from it and sometimes they didn't even get those right. They never told me I was going to hell, but they didn't have to.

I was very glad to get out of there.

[Michelle]

My nearly three years in Indiana as a athiest/former Jew was not fun at all. Everyone I met was a practicing Christian and belonged to the best church in town (theirs). People minimized their socialization with people who didn't belong to their church. I had never seen anything like it.

I must live in one of the most progressive cities in the South. I may know some other atheists, certainly a lot of people who don't attend church, but it isn't something that comes up in casual conversation. Occasionally people will ask what church you attend, but it isn't delved in to when I say we don't belong to one. They are much more interested in talking about hobbies, art, work, pets or people we know in common and what they've been up to if we've lost touch with them. Recently, due to having a new sister-in-law, we've been socializing with her friends that all belong to an Episcopal church. There is a group of about twenty of them who have been inviting us to all kinds of parties this last year. Let me tell you, these people are fun and they know how to party! A bunch of us rented cabins in the mountains together on a few weekends and eight of us are trying to plan a cruise this summer. The concept of being alienated simply because you aren't a Christian is totally foreign to me and something I simply can't relate to. I hate to think there are people like that out there and I figure I'm better off not knowing them.

[Grandpa Greenman]

Oooooooo that's sounds like a lot of fun. Really. Organizing pagan festivals in the Bible Belt. It would be a good premis for a reality tv show.

They would have to do it on HBO. . Actually if you put one on reality TV most of the Pagans wouldn't show up. At most festivals if you carry a camera you have to wear an arm band and sign a paper that you have to get permission to shoot anybodies picture naked or not. Teachers and people who work with children can lose their job for coming out of the broom closet. Spouses have been known to use someones Pagan status in custody battles. That is why we have the Lady Liberty League.

https://www.circlesanctuary.org/index.php/our-work/lady-liberty-league

[Gunn]

I just started answering my door naked like with anyone who comes to my door.

i figure people either come to accept it, or I just dont have to deal w/ their presence.

Aaah c'mon now, that's the lazy/easy way.

Seriously though, the reason I suggested the "No Jehovah's Witnesses" sign to Beany, in my lame joking way, is because they have a map they each work off and keep records of.

Each Jehovah Witness is given a map of certain areas with X marks (houses) marked on it. They go to each and every house on that map. When they go to knock on your door, if you don't answer, they of course leave a pamphlet at your door and put down on the map something like; not home - come back later. If you answer the door and are rude to them, spit on them, tell them to "F" off, say demonic things to them, they will either not write anything down about your residence, in which they let the next Jehovah Witness, who doesn't know anything about you, come knock at your door, because they trade maps with each other, or they will write something down to where it explains that you need convincing to why you need to convert; especially if you try and debate with them.

But that one sign with the words "No Jehovah's Witnesses" on it, usually keeps them from knocking on your door and sometimes they don't even leave a pamphlet at your door. Best method, IMO.

P.S. If you start taping their pamphlets to your sign, that seems to stop them from leaving more. I just tried that recently, seems to work.

Edit: Although I gotta say, I had this friend who was in Amway and for some reason they kept away from his house, after he tried to convince them a couple of times to get into Amway. Best part, he wasn't trying to run them off. He actually wanted to get them into Amway so he could sponsor them as his Amway distributors. I think it was more of a disappointment for him then it was for them, when it didn't go the way they both thought it was gonna go.

Edited January 6, 2014 by Purifier

[Dougward5]

I still like the " what are you bringing to hell " aspect of this thread. ...

Lil bit oh moonshine and some slow smoked pork loin alright ?

[Mr Walker]

While Hell may have become confused with the lake of fire, into which those not "written into the book of life" will be cast to suffer eternal torment after the rapture and second resurrection, that does not mean the bible does not promise that the unbelievers will not be doomed to suffer this eternal torment.

It promises exactly that.

Not if you accept revelations as a part of the bible, and not if you look at the wording and context of messages on this issue. It is interesting that many groups who actually make a study of the bible do not accept the existence of hell either now or after judgement as a place of torment but simply as death. God promises that sin and sinners will no longer exist after the establishment of the new earth. If both are 'alive and well in some form of hell, then god has not kept his promise. Revelations says that the unsaved will die the second death "of body and soul" ie they wiil entirely cease to exist whereas before while their body died their soul remained asleep. The gospels say clearly that , "the wages of sin is death " not some form of eternal punishment. And as the poster pointed out, all the biblical translations of hell refer to the pit, or the grave, or the place where bodies were burned outside jerusalem eg sheol, gehenna

This concept was added into biblical understanding, like many other concepts, through catholic doctrinal alterations to biblical truths.

[White Crane Feather]

They would have to do it on HBO. . Actually if you put one on reality TV most of the Pagans wouldn't show up. At most festivals if you carry a camera you have to wear an arm band and sign a paper that you have to get permission to shoot anybodies picture naked or not. Teachers and people who work with children can lose their job for coming out of the broom closet. Spouses have been known to use someones Pagan status in custody battles. That is why we have the Lady Liberty League.

https://www.circlesanctuary.org/index.php/our-work/lady-liberty-league

Yes. The HBO documentary " friends of Christ comes to mind". It dosnt have to be about the festival itself, just a little bit, but the organizing of it and getting permits and things. I certainly would watch it.

My sister never talks much about her beliefs but a while Ago Im certain she was practicing Wicca, and that is exactly what her x husband was doing in court. He was acting a little strange then but called her a witch in court and actually proceeded to try an prove it. The judge practically laughed in his face. But this is CA. In the mid west a judge might take that seriously. Even here though I am in the closet for the most part. I keep my shamanistic tendencies, experiences, and beliefs to myself. It's a shame really that people are that way, but in some ways I find it educational to have to hide something about myself from most of the people around me. It gives me pride to join the ranks of something that is taboo to a lot of people. In a strange way it makes me feel closer to other groups that deal with similar situations. I have the awesome opportunity to give a workshop once a year at an earth magic class ran by a Wiccan priestess. The acceptance there is so wonderful I find myself craving to meet with them each year. I run into the various members throughout the year at random places and they are so glad to see me. We embrace and say hi and it's like we are all carrying this wonderful little secret around with us. Several times a year the group sends me someone in particular need of guidance. They seek me out then we talk covertly in some corner of a coffee shop and hash out a plan to deal with their particular set if issues. Occasionally I am asked to do a death concealing. Someone is terminal and wants to hear about some of the things I have to say. It's sort of a bitter sweet ministry but I find myself so very grateful for the opportunity to set someone's mind at ease at such a harsh reality.

Yes, I guess I'm a closet shamanic mystic. I have avoided the label but that's what they call me. Ill never come out fully. I would alienate all my clients, in laws, a few friends, and even a mentor.

[scowl]

I must live in one of the most progressive cities in the South. I may know some other atheists, certainly a lot of people who don't attend church, but it isn't something that comes up in casual conversation.

I may just have had bad luck. This was a small wealthy town with not much to do. Downtown was a ghost town after 5PM and on the weekends. The employees at the division were proudly Christian and all seemed to have known each other from high school or colleges.

They are much more interested in talking about hobbies, art, work, pets or people we know in common and what they've been up to if we've lost touch with them.

Ugh, just remembered all of their pets had Biblical names. One had a big dog named Samson. I joked "Oh so this must be the dumb one." They laughed politely then asked why I thought he was dumb. Uh, Samson is by far the dumbest character in the Bible, fooled by Delilah by the same trick over and over until he slowly figured out she was plotting against him. Not one of them actually knew the story of Samson and Delilah. They only knew that Samson was powerfully strong. Sigh.

The concept of being alienated simply because you aren't a Christian is totally foreign to me and something I simply can't relate to. I hate to think there are people like that out there and I figure I'm better off not knowing them.

The biggest problem I had is that Christianity seemed more like a social club than a religion to them. I think that's what it's becoming. Yeah, going to parties, renting cabins, going on cruises -- that's exactly what Jesus told his followers to do. No one can party harder than those Christians!

[regeneratia]

Since I believe that heaven and hell are on earth. In the lives we already live, there is no going to it. A stillbirth was hellish. The death of a parent was hellish. The birth of a child and his early years were heaven. Gardening is heaven. Nature is heaven. Living in the city is hellish.

I believe the afterlife to just be another school. There we are all surrounded with love, the killer and the saint. The objectivity about ourselves is where our judgement day appears. For all, I think the afterlife is heaven. Our own judgement of ourselves and the life we just lived, regardless of the lives we have led, is not heaven or hell. Our judgement day is immersed in pure objectivity and openness.

Heaven and hell are not out there somewhere. They are inside all of us at certain points in life.

We are all, ... all of us, eternal, regardless of the religion we follow.

Edited January 7, 2014 by regeneratia

[Michelle]

I may just have had bad luck. This was a small wealthy town with not much to do. Downtown was a ghost town after 5PM and on the weekends. The employees at the division were proudly Christian and all seemed to have known each other from high school or colleges.

Ugh, just remembered all of their pets had Biblical names. One had a big dog named Samson. I joked "Oh so this must be the dumb one." They laughed politely then asked why I thought he was dumb. Uh, Samson is by far the dumbest character in the Bible, fooled by Delilah by the same trick over and over until he slowly figured out she was plotting against him. Not one of them actually knew the story of Samson and Delilah. They only knew that Samson was powerfully strong. Sigh.

The biggest problem I had is that Christianity seemed more like a social club than a religion to them. I think that's what it's becoming. Yeah, going to parties, renting cabins, going on cruises -- that's exactly what Jesus told his followers to do. No one can party harder than those Christians!

Jeez, they can't win can they? Either they're so prudish they close the town down at 5 and there is nothing to do or they are trying to outdo each other with their partying. I wonder if they are also having a contest on how many "heathens" they can claim to have made "friends" with?

Edited January 7, 2014 by Michelle

[XenoFish]

There is supposed to be a separation of church and state in the U.S. anyone seen it? As for life being hell, I agree. Subtle joys and agonizing pains. Death is our reward. If you can live through hell you deserve an eternal rest.

[Grandpa Greenman]

You know what they say when life gives lemons make lemonade. When I was in rehab and in a wheelchair I drove the nurses nuts by organizing the wheelchair races down the hall. Everybody was having so much fun with it they let us have a hall when the therapy section closed for the night. I been through some dark times, but it seem to balance out. There are good times, too. I don't worry about what comes after death. I had some experiences that makes me think the Universe recycles. What ever happens I am going to make the best of what I have in the here and now.

Ok, so far for those of us who are going to hell we got; wings, deviled eggs, moonshine, and BBQ pork. Anybody want to do the tater salad?

Edited January 7, 2014 by GreenmansGod

[Michelle]

Ok, so far for those of us who are going to hell we got; wings, deviled eggs, moonshine, and BBQ pork. Anybody want to do the tater salad?

I make a mean tater salad and I'll bring some more moonshine. We wouldn't want to run out of that. I even have some with cherries in it and don't think the cherries won't get you loopy on their own. Many a souls have gone under the table thinkin' that very thing.

I'll leave the door open for ya.

[Grandpa Greenman]

Cherry moonshine, I bet we have one a hell of a hang over. Don't forget your drum, we'll have a big fire and do a drum circle. Marshmallows, somebody bring marshmallows. This is starting to become a Pagan festival! I got a bottle of homemade mead for the Gods and Goddesses.

[Michelle]

My rain stick and flute too!

[Ogbin]

Matthew 25:41 "Then shall he say also unto them on the left hand, Depart from me, ye cursed, into everlasting fire, prepared for the devil and his angels:"

Revelation 19:20 "And the beast was taken, and with him the false prophet that wrought miricles before him, with which he deceived them that had received the mark of the beast, and them that worshiped his image. These both were cast alive into the lake of fire burning with brimstone."

Revelation 20:10 "And the devil that deceived them was cast into the lake of fire and brimstone, where the beast and false prophet are, and shall be tormented day and night forever and ever."

Revelation 20:12-15 "And I saw the dead, small and great, stand before God; and the books were opened: and another book was

opened, which is the book of life: and the dead were judged out of those things which were written in the books, according to their works. And the sea gave up the dead which were in it; and death and hell delivered up the dead which in them: and they were judged every man according to their works. And death and hell were cast into the lake of fire. This is the second death. And whosoever was not found written in the book of life was cast into the lake of fire."

Revelation 21:8 "But the fearful, and unbelieving, and the abominable, and murderers, and whoremongers, and sorcerers, and idolaters, and all liars, shall have their part in the lake of fire and brimstone: which is the second death."

Edited January 8, 2014 by Ogbin

[Awake2Chaos]

Jehovahs are easy.

I just throw the math at them.

7 million followers; 144,000 to be saved.

How you guys gonna hammer that out?

That usually does the trick.

[XenoFish]

Ok, so far for those of us who are going to hell we got; wings, deviled eggs, moonshine, and BBQ pork. Anybody want to do the tater salad?

I'll bring the marshmallows.

Revelation 21:8 "But the fearful, and unbelieving, and the abominable, and murderers, and whoremongers, and sorcerers, and idolaters, and all liars, shall have their part in the lake of fire and brimstone: which is the second death."

Guess I'm screw since I practice "sorcery". Oh, well.

[Davros of Skaro]

Jehovahs are easy.

I just throw the math at them.

7 million followers; 144,000 to be saved.

How you guys gonna hammer that out?

That usually does the trick.

They got it worked out that the 144,000 will be the 1st class, and the rest will be 3rd class, and the nonsaved will be no class.The 3rd class will say; "It's better to serve God, and the 1st class in Heaven, than being no class in Hell".