Harambasha Posted February 3, 2014 #1 Share Posted February 3, 2014 http://www.livescience.com/43051-step-pyramid-uncovered-in-egypt.html "The similarities from one pyramid to the other are really amazing, and there is definitely a common plan," said Gregory Marouard, a research associate at the University of Chicago's Oriental Institute who led the work at the Edfu pyramid. 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
cladking Posted February 3, 2014 #2 Share Posted February 3, 2014 Khufu may have felt politically secure in southern Egypt and saw no need to maintain or build pyramids there, Marouard said in the email. The "center of gravity of Egypt was then at Memphis for many centuries — this region draining resources and manpower from the provinces, all regions being put to use for the large construction sites of funerary complexes." At Wadi al-Jarf, a port found on the shore of the Red Sea that dates to Khufu's time, papyri (written documents) dating to the end of Khufu's reign were recently discovered that supports the idea that the pharaoh tried to converge all the resources he could toward Giza and the ancient wonder being constructed there. This is all speculative. There is nothing in Merrer's diary to confirm that the Great Pyramid is a tomb or that Khufu was marshalling resources for use at Giza. This same rag reported the other day that Lehner suggests pyramid builders lived on the Great Pyramid ramps. It's gettiung harder and harder to find real "science" or common sense. 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
+DieChecker Posted February 4, 2014 #3 Share Posted February 4, 2014 (edited) This is all speculative. There is nothing in Merrer's diary to confirm that the Great Pyramid is a tomb or that Khufu was marshalling resources for use at Giza. This same rag reported the other day that Lehner suggests pyramid builders lived on the Great Pyramid ramps. It's gettiung harder and harder to find real "science" or common sense. So you're saying that the documents they found are frauds? Or, that no such documents were found? Or, just that the "Experts" are reading them wrong???? The internet is crawling with references to these papyri. There is even pictures... http://amun-ra-egypt...ur-in-suez.html Edited February 4, 2014 by DieChecker Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
cladking Posted February 4, 2014 #4 Share Posted February 4, 2014 So you're saying that the documents they found are frauds? Or, that no such documents were found? Or, just that the "Experts" are reading them wrong???? The internet is crawling with references to these papyri. There is even pictures... http://amun-ra-egypt...ur-in-suez.html There's not one word in the document that supports ramps, tombs, or superstitious people who never changed. There's not one word that supports the concept that Khufu was marshalling his resources. There's nothing to sup- port any of the contentions. The only things it supports is that stones were brought by boat but this is easily deducible since the stones are on one side of the river and the pyramids are on the other. This "new" information is uteer- ly meaningless. It also supports the idea that Khufu is a king associated with a great pyramid (presumably G1), but this too is already very firmly established so is not of much importance. This provincial pyramid is of interest but it hardly defines a new pattern nor es- tablishes anything. It is a forgotten pyramid that didn't stand the ravages of time and sheds no new light on the Egyptians, what they believed, or how they accomplished what they did. People are simply trying to make every new fact fit a paradigm made of teflon. This story means only what it actually says and only to the degree that it's right. 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
+DieChecker Posted February 4, 2014 #5 Share Posted February 4, 2014 There's not one word in the document that supports ramps, tombs, or superstitious people who never changed. There's not one word that supports the concept that Khufu was marshalling his resources. There's nothing to sup- port any of the contentions. The only things it supports is that stones were brought by boat but this is easily deducible since the stones are on one side of the river and the pyramids are on the other. This "new" information is uteer- ly meaningless. It also supports the idea that Khufu is a king associated with a great pyramid (presumably G1), but this too is already very firmly established so is not of much importance. This provincial pyramid is of interest but it hardly defines a new pattern nor es- tablishes anything. It is a forgotten pyramid that didn't stand the ravages of time and sheds no new light on the Egyptians, what they believed, or how they accomplished what they did. People are simply trying to make every new fact fit a paradigm made of teflon. This story means only what it actually says and only to the degree that it's right. Doesn't it imply a lot of people were moving stones, and not just a handful as you often suggest? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
cladking Posted February 4, 2014 #6 Share Posted February 4, 2014 Doesn't it imply a lot of people were moving stones, and not just a handful as you often suggest? No! Absolutely not. A specific number of people are required to haul Turah limestone from the quarry whether they used ramps or not. A set number are required necessary whether their descendents were superstitious or not. Nothing changes just because we know a few details of one of the stones movers' life. We already knew there mustta been stone movers and there must have been details to their lives. 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
+DieChecker Posted February 4, 2014 #7 Share Posted February 4, 2014 No! Absolutely not. A specific number of people are required to haul Turah limestone from the quarry whether they used ramps or not. A set number are required necessary whether their descendents were superstitious or not. Nothing changes just because we know a few details of one of the stones movers' life. We already knew there mustta been stone movers and there must have been details to their lives. I thought just the titles alone on the Giza workers tombs told you that there was no ramp? I'd think a great deal can be deduced from even a partial account. The number of people needed to drag the stones could be deduced and if much more then that was in evidence, then maybe they were dragging them further then just the pyramid base. 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
cladking Posted February 4, 2014 #8 Share Posted February 4, 2014 I'd think a great deal can be deduced from even a partial account. The number of people needed to drag the stones could be deduced and if much more then that was in evidence, then maybe they were dragging them further then just the pyramid base. When you start with the assumption they dragged stones all roads lead to ramps. You can't deduce how far they dragged stones by how many people they had unless you know they dragged stones. If you put the cart before the horse you go nowhere. Everything does not confirm your beliefs. It just seems that way because of the nature of "belief". Leon Russell -Magic Mirror I'm standing by the highway Suitcase by my side There's no place I want to go I just thought I'd catch a ride Many people look my way And many pass me by In moments of reflection I wonder why To the thieves I am a bandit The mothers think I'm a son To the preachers I'm a sinner Lord I'm not the only one To the sad ones I'm unhappy To the losers I'm a fool To the students I'm a teacher With the teachers I'm in school To the hobos I'm imprisoned by everything I own To the soldier I'm just someone else who's dying to go home The general sees a number, a politician's tool To my friends I'm just an equal in this whirlpool Magic mirror won't you tell me please Do I find myself in anyone I see? Magic mirror if we only could Try to see ourselves as others would To policeman I'm suspicious it's in the way I look I'm just another character to fingerprint and book To the censors I'm pornography with no redeeming grace To hooker I'm a customer without a face The sellers think I'm merchandise, they'll help me for a song The left ones think I'm right, The right ones think I'm wrong And many people look my way And many pass me by And in my quiet reflection I wonder why Magic mirror won't you tell me please Do I see myself in anyone I meet? Magic mirror if we only could Try to see ourselves as others would We see our beliefs regardless of what's in front of our eyes. Leon Russell looks like some kind of kook so I'd just keep driving. 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Rhino666 Posted February 4, 2014 #9 Share Posted February 4, 2014 How can you lose a pyramid? Its not like it fell down the back of the couch. 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
scorpiosonic Posted February 4, 2014 #10 Share Posted February 4, 2014 Interesting read, I like how they say, "uncovered" and not "discovered" as it was never lost, just covered. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
kmt_sesh Posted February 5, 2014 #11 Share Posted February 5, 2014 http://www.livescien...d-in-egypt.html "The similarities from one pyramid to the other are really amazing, and there is definitely a common plan," said Gregory Marouard, a research associate at the University of Chicago's Oriental Institute who led the work at the Edfu pyramid. Hey, Harambasha, welcome to UM. I see you've started several threads with links to articles, but how about providing some content of your own? What are your thoughts? It's important for the sake of the thread that you also weigh in, considering you started it. Thanks much. 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
+DieChecker Posted February 5, 2014 #12 Share Posted February 5, 2014 (edited) When you start with the assumption they dragged stones all roads lead to ramps. You can't deduce how far they dragged stones by how many people they had unless you know they dragged stones. If you put the cart before the horse you go nowhere. It would seem to me that logically, if you want the delivery rate to be steady, and you have to drag the stones twice as far... say up a sprial ramp.... then you'd need twice as many people as would be needed just to drag them to the base. Is that true or not? Edited February 5, 2014 by DieChecker Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
cladking Posted February 5, 2014 #13 Share Posted February 5, 2014 It would seem to me that logically, if you want the delivery rate to be steady, and you have to drag the stones twice as far... say up a sprial ramp.... then you'd need twice as many people as would be needed just to drag them to the base. Is that true or not? No. More importantly it's not at all relevant unless you're trying to make some point that I can't see. A ramp that's twice as tall requires much more than twice the work. As the ramp gets higher it requires more material and there are more corners to drag stones around (on a pyramidal structure). There's no reason to even maintain a steady rate of delivery. It could taper off to next to nothing and still finish on scedule. Ramps are debunked anyway based on the evidence. Unless you can bring this back to topic I must refrain from posting further. 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
+DieChecker Posted February 5, 2014 #14 Share Posted February 5, 2014 (edited) No. More importantly it's not at all relevant unless you're trying to make some point that I can't see. A ramp that's twice as tall requires much more than twice the work. As the ramp gets higher it requires more material and there are more corners to drag stones around (on a pyramidal structure). There's no reason to even maintain a steady rate of delivery. It could taper off to next to nothing and still finish on scedule. Ramps are debunked anyway based on the evidence. Unless you can bring this back to topic I must refrain from posting further. That is total rubbish.... Tail off to nothing and still finish? What are going on about. The rate of delivery is the cornerstone of every single delivery method theory. To disregard that fact is to just start walking into fantasy land. Off topic? The topic is specifically about the discovery of this pyramid and references the notes from the Egyptian dock master. Which goes directly to more labor being collected. Which goes directly to what the labor was used for at Giza. The fact is that we all know that the amount of stone that needed to be taken to the base would require a certain amount of people, and if the number of laborers was twice that it would indicate additional work, such as dragging either twice as much stone (Not the case) or twice as far, would have to be happening. How is "Leon Russell -Magic Mirror" on topic? Edited February 5, 2014 by DieChecker Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
kmt_sesh Posted February 5, 2014 #15 Share Posted February 5, 2014 Moderator's note: People, give it a rest. Cladking, do not hijack the thread. You have your own thread to expound on your ideas, so keep it in there. kmt_sesh 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
kmt_sesh Posted February 5, 2014 #16 Share Posted February 5, 2014 Moderator's note: Thread cleaned. I've removed several posts subsequent to my previous warning. I'm going to give you folks the benefit of the doubt that you just missed my previous warning. Stay on topic to the OP. So far the posts have been anything but relevant to it. One more infringement and I will close the thread. kmt_sesh Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
MissJatti Posted February 5, 2014 #17 Share Posted February 5, 2014 been to egypt on holiday back in 2006, been told by tour guides that there is 80% of ancient egypt still buried in the sand. KV6 and cario sun temple was found whist i was on holiday there.. 2 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Eldorado Posted February 6, 2014 #18 Share Posted February 6, 2014 (edited) A lot of hard graft went into those. Am wondering if it was a labour of love. And also wondering how they'd feel to know that their work is still standing. Sorry folks, merely dreaming aloud. Edited February 6, 2014 by Eldorado Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
coolguy Posted February 6, 2014 #19 Share Posted February 6, 2014 Awseome they found it, 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
+DieChecker Posted February 8, 2014 #20 Share Posted February 8, 2014 I found it interesting that the site just now had a fence put around it to keep out looters. They've known it was there, like, forever and only now protect it from looters? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Eldorado Posted February 8, 2014 #21 Share Posted February 8, 2014 (edited) I found it interesting that the site just now had a fence put around it to keep out looters. They've known it was there, like, forever and only now protect it from looters? From the article: "It didn't look like a pyramid he said, and people in a nearby village even thought the structure was the tomb of a sheikh, a local Muslim saint." Until they read UM. (lol) Publicity brings good people and bad people. Edited February 8, 2014 by Eldorado 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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