Is Obamacare on death's door?

[+OverSword]

I don't think I've wasted my time posting in this thread but to address the thread tite "is obamacare on deaths door" No it is not. It's not going anywhere.

[F3SS]

I would, and don't have any problem with paying a tiny sum of money over the year if it was being used to help others.

We all do that every year. It's called taxes and it's not necessarily chump change, for me at least. My beef is that good things aren't always being done to help. It's squandered and wasted and spent 3x over and I'm supposed to support the government instructing me how to handle more of my money?!

[acidhead]

Don't think about it - Just do it

Edited April 26, 2014 by acidhead

[F3SS]

Don't get informed. Just do what I say. Pompous ass. That was the funniest mash up of arrogance since this...

[F3SS]

Got a kick out of this one I just found when looking up that last one.

[andy4]

We all do that every year. It's called taxes and it's not necessarily chump change, for me at least. My beef is that good things aren't always being done to help. It's squandered and wasted and spent 3x over and I'm supposed to support the government instructing me how to handle more of my money?!

Yes we definitely do that every year, so what's the big problem?

Nothing goes as planned a lot of times, and Obamacare is no exception to that. But I don't see anywhere what money was being squandered or wasted on it at all.

You don't necessarily have to spend that money, just take the fine, and if you don't like the fine don't pay it, but live with the consequences.

Once again, all I see when it comes to people who are against this is personal selfishness. "My money, I don't care who's life it's saving."

[F3SS]

Yes we definitely do that every year, so what's the big problem?

Nothing goes as planned a lot of times, and Obamacare is no exception to that. But I don't see anywhere what money was being squandered or wasted on it at all.

You don't necessarily have to spend that money, just take the fine, and if you don't like the fine don't pay it, but live with the consequences.

Once again, all I see when it comes to people who are against this is personal selfishness. "My money, I don't care who's life it's saving."

Did I not just state what the problems are? It was general and nonspecific but comprehensive nonetheless.

We can just start at the beginning with a nearly one billion dollar website.

Actually, for some like me who pays quarterly and doesn't receive a W-2 or tax return there are no legal consequences. I covered that extensively in a thread called 'Do you have to pay the obamacare fine'. http://www.unexplained-mysteries.com/forum/index.php?showtopic=252534&hl=

Further, there are none for you either but they'll just garnish your tax returns and good luck avoiding that. You'd have to opt to pay your own taxes if you're employed by someone in order to get out of paying.

It's more like it's my money and I want to know that it's being spent properly and efficiently as possible and since those taking it from me work for me I have every right and sensibility to ask question after question and be an all around pain in the ass about it. If you trust the government so much with your money then send them extra and tell them to keep it. You can and they will.

Edited April 27, 2014 by F3SS

[+DieChecker]

I would, and don't have any problem with paying a tiny sum of money over the year if it was being used to help others.

I don't have a problem paying a tiny amount. I vote for local property tax increases all the time. To fund the police, the library, school construction....

But, I would like to see what the pricetag of the 2014 tax deduction/credits for the ACA is going to be for those in the Exchanges. Then I'd divide that number by the number of taxpayers, and see if it is a tiny number or if it is measured in thousands.

[Startraveler]

Some more things startraveler isn't talking about:

Two months before health insurers must submit rate proposals for 2015 to government regulators, WellPoint Inc. (WLP:US) fired a surprising shot across their bow by predicting it may ask for “double-digit plus” increases.

Yeah, not so much.

Insurer backs away from dire O-Care rate hike prediction

A major health insurer failed to embrace a prediction from one of its executives that premiums on ObamaCare's exchanges would rise by double digits next year.

Officials with Wellpoint, the biggest insurer in the new marketplaces, delivered an upbeat message about ObamaCare enrollment on a conference call with analysts Wednesday.

Chief Financial Officer Wayne DeVeydt said the company met or exceeded expectations when it came to how many people signed up on the exchanges and their mix of ages.

He predicted "less volatility in pricing" for Wellpoint members relative to people covered by other insurance companies.

"We're really pleased with our strategy and the affirmation of our pricing strategy," DeVeydt said."If you were to talk to our actuarial team, we fell really good about moving into the new market. We think we hit our sweet spot."

The call focused on the company's results in the first quarter of this year. Wellpoint raised its 2014 forecast again on Wednesday, pushing shares closer to their all-time high.

The news came one month after a Wellpoint executive made headlines for predicting strong rate hikes on the exchanges next year.

Major Obamacare insurer backs away from double-digit rate hike prediction

What could have changed in the past month? Toward the end of enrollment, the average age of enrollees came down in a “meaningful fashion,” said chief financial officer Wayne DeVeydt. Wellpoint said it's seeing other positive enrollment trends. People are generally flowing to "bronze" and "silver" health plans, as the company expected. The company’s 2014 expectations for enrollment have pretty much been met. “We hit the sweet spot,” he said.

Maybe it's time for a deathwatch for the Obamacare deathwatch.

[Merc14]

Yeah, not so much.

Insurer backs away from dire O-Care rate hike prediction

Major Obamacare insurer backs away from double-digit rate hike prediction

Maybe it's time for a deathwatch for the Obamacare deathwatch.

Keep predicting and posting BS data from HHS, it doesn't matter because reality is your enemy now.

[Startraveler]

Keep predicting and posting BS data from HHS, it doesn't matter because reality is your enemy now.

Er, that data is from Wellpoint.

What you quoted from 6 weeks ago is based on their data before the enrollment surge. What I quoted from today is obviously after that surge.

Welcome to reality!

[Merc14]

Er, that data is from Wellpoint.

What you quoted from 6 weeks ago is based on their data before the enrollment surge. What I quoted from today is obviously after that surge.

Welcome to reality!

Enrollment surge my ass. They couldn't tell us how many had paid or joined for months but when Barry's due date hit they could guess to the nearest 100,000 how many had joined. LOL and bull. Only an idiot is still buying into the lies and I will guarantee that rates will be rising and rising over the coming years just as the cost of this debacle will continue increasing every year for decades. Post your drivel, it is, as I said, irrelevant now as reality is proving my point for me. See Barry's poll numbers for how popular his programs and policies are. .1% growth in the economy. Oy.

Edited May 1, 2014 by Merc14

[+DieChecker]

The insurance companies will make their money somewhere. If they don't increase rates, then they will increase deductibles and increase copays, or lower yearly and lifetime limits. I've yet to hear of a corporation that smiled and said thank you when you they were looking at decreasing earnings, or even decreasing growth.

Edited May 1, 2014 by DieChecker

[Merc14]

By the way star, this kind of casts a shadow on your data but nothing new in that, is there?

Data provided to the committee by every insurance provider in the health care law’s Federally Facilitated Marketplace (FFM) shows that, as of April 15, 2014, only 67 percent of individuals and families that had selected a health plan in the federally facilitated marketplace had paid their first month’s premium and therefore completed the enrollment process.

Nationwide, only 25 percent of paid enrollees are ages 18 to 34

…

On April 17, 2014, President Obama declared the success of his law, claiming that 8 million Americans had signed up for health insurance, but data from the insurance providers reveals that the president’s figure is largely misleading. As of April 15, 2014, insurers informed the committee that only 2.45 million had paid their first month’s premium for coverage obtained through the federally facilitated marketplace. While the administration has relied on questionable nationwide figures to boast the law’s success, the state-by-state breakdown compiled by the committee underscores the serious problems facing some states…

“In a sad reversal away from its vows of transparency, the Obama administration, from inside the Oval Office on down, has gone to extraordinary lengths to keep basic details of the health law from the public. Tired of receiving incomplete pictures of enrollment in the health care law, we went right to the source and found that the administration’s recent declarations of success may be unfounded,” commented full committee Chairman Fred Upton (R-MI). “We need a complete picture of how this law is working. We will continue to strive for transparency and hold the administration accountable for this law’s shortcomings and broken promises.”

Edited May 1, 2014 by Merc14

[+DieChecker]

By the way star, this kind of casts a shadow on your data but nothing new in that, is there?

Data provided to the committee by every insurance provider in the health care law’s Federally Facilitated Marketplace (FFM) shows that, as of April 15, 2014, only 67 percent of individuals and families that had selected a health plan in the federally facilitated marketplace had paid their first month’s premium and therefore completed the enrollment process.

Nationwide, only 25 percent of paid enrollees are ages 18 to 34

…

On April 17, 2014, President Obama declared the success of his law, claiming that 8 million Americans had signed up for health insurance, but data from the insurance providers reveals that the president’s figure is largely misleading. As of April 15, 2014, insurers informed the committee that only 2.45 million had paid their first month’s premium for coverage obtained through the federally facilitated marketplace. While the administration has relied on questionable nationwide figures to boast the law’s success, the state-by-state breakdown compiled by the committee underscores the serious problems facing some states…

“In a sad reversal away from its vows of transparency, the Obama administration, from inside the Oval Office on down, has gone to extraordinary lengths to keep basic details of the health law from the public. Tired of receiving incomplete pictures of enrollment in the health care law, we went right to the source and found that the administration’s recent declarations of success may be unfounded,” commented full committee Chairman Fred Upton (R-MI). “We need a complete picture of how this law is working. We will continue to strive for transparency and hold the administration accountable for this law’s shortcomings and broken promises.”

That's probably because these people don't have any money. They're not going to use insurance that has a deductible on it. They're just going to go wait at the ER for free like they always have.

2008 = Transparency!!!

2012 = Translucency?

2014 = Opaque?

On the Plus side, if only 3 million or so people are getting exchange insurance, that will be a lot less Tax credits/deductions that the FedGov will have to pay out from the taxes they collect from me. Maybe some of that can then NOT be spent and used to adjust the Deficit....

Edited May 1, 2014 by DieChecker

[Merc14]

That's probably because these people don't have any money. They're not going to use insurance that has a deductible on it. They're just going to go wait at the ER for free like they always have.

2008 = Transparency!!!

2012 = Translucency?

2014 = Opaque?

On the Plus side, if only 3 million or so people are getting exchange insurance, that will be a lot less Tax credits/deductions that the FedGov will have to pay out from the taxes they collect from me. Maybe some of that can then NOT be spent and used to adjust the Deficit....

In star's world that is a big win!! WTF over?

[Merc14]

Here you go star, spin this into some happy news will ya?

Success! 2.45 Million Obamacare Enrollees Paid Their Premiums By April 15.

Remember the Obama administration's much-touted statistic that 8.1 million Americans had signed up for Obamacare? Yeah, about that…

As of April 15, 2014, insurers informed the committee that only 2.45 million had paid their first month's premium for coverage obtained through the federally facilitated marketplace.

If you have a statistic that seems artificially inflated for more than four weeks, consult your doctor immediately.

When it comes to Obamacare, always check the fine print:

Just 67 percent of Americans who purchased insurance through federal-facility ObamaCare exchanges have paid their premiums, according to information insurers participating in the program gave to Congress.

The information was compiled by the GOP-led House Committee on Energy and Commerce, as Americans wait to learn enrollment details from the Obama administration, two weeks after the April 15 enrollment deadline.

The age group with lowest percent of enrollees who have paid their first month's premium is the 65-and-older group. Just one percent of those paid, according to information supplied by all 160 insurance companies in the federally-facilitated ObamaCare exchanges.

Texas had the lowest percentage of payers by state, at 42 percent, in the committee's nationwide breakdown of the numbers, as of April 15.

President Obama, in the days following the deadline, declared his signature health care law a success, saying in a press conference that more than eight million people enrolled in the first six months, exceeding the goal of seven million.

But the president has yet to announce several key figures, including the age breakdown for enrollees and how many have paid, which would likely provide a more accurate picture of the 2010 law's success.

The age group breakdown is considered important because the success of ObamaCare is based on having a high percentage of young Americans signed up to cover older enrollees, who typically need more health care.

Only 25 percent of that key demographic, 18-to-34-year-olds, has so far paid, according to the data supplies by the committee.

[+DieChecker]

Remember the Obama administration's much-touted statistic that 8.1 million Americans had signed up for Obamacare? Yeah, about that…

As of April 15, 2014, insurers informed the committee that only 2.45 million had paid their first month's premium for coverage obtained through the federally facilitated marketplace.

Technically doesn't that make Obama's statement true? There is 8 million signed up. They simply haven't paid yet and so many of them are actually uninsured.

Doubtless some program will be created that will "float" those payments, so people can be "insured" without ever having actually paid anything to anyone. The FedGov will promise to pay the money for them and then with the failure to complete 50000 pages of documents that will needed to actually collect anything will force insurance industry loses. And boy do insurance companies love losses. They just love it when they loose money. NOT.

Edited May 1, 2014 by DieChecker

[Merc14]

Technically doesn't that make Obama's statement true? There is 8 million signed up. They simply haven't paid yet and so many of them are actually uninsured.

Doubtless some program will be created that will "float" those payments, so people can be "insured" without ever having actually paid anything to anyone. The FedGov will promise to pay the money for them and then with the failure to complete 50000 pages of documents that will needed to actually collect anything will force insurance industry loses. And boy do insurance companies love losses. They just love it when they loose money. NOT.

I doubt they have an accurate count of who signed up for what because the website is still broken. No one really knows since the whole thing is so shrouded in lies and BS now. Some are speculating that just starting an application, a necessity for getting on the unsecured site, is counted as enrolled. Regardless, until you pay it doesn't count for anything but the lies and fabrications get deeper and deeper every day.

[F3SS]

Big money and vague repairs...

Price Tag for Healthcare.gov Repairs Jumps to $121 Million; 'Back End' Still a Mess

Obama administration soliciting 2015 contractors based on race and gender.

After shelling out $677 million to build the federal health care website, the government will spend an additional $121 million in 2014 to repair it -$30 million more than previously estimated- the Washington Times reported last night. This comes just as the Obama administration is starting the hunt for next year's diverse group of contractors.

CGI Federal, the original lead contractor awarded $93.7 million, was replaced by Accenture this past January. Accenture received an initial payment of $45 million—an amount that was supposed to double by year's end, according to the Washington Post. But yesterday, Accenture Federal Services announced their final agreement of $121 million for work through January 10, 2015.

The search for Accenture's successor has commenced, and the administration has some specific criteria on its applicants' gender, race, and socioeconomic status. From the New York Times yesterday:

More---

http://www.weeklystandard.com/blogs/price-tag-healthcaregov-repairs-jumps-121-million-back-end-still-mess_788895.html

Edited May 2, 2014 by F3SS

[Merc14]

Ninja and Star role model

http://www.truthrevolt.org/news/carney-obamacare-enrollments-we-dont-have-hard-numbers-we-dispute-their-numbers

[ninjadude]

MEMORANDUM

April 30, 2014

To: Committee on Energy and Commerce Democratic Members and Staff

Fr: Committee on Energy and Commerce Democratic Staff

Re: Misleading Republican Report on ACA Enrollment

This evening the Republican staff of the Energy and Commerce Committee released a fundamentally misleading report on enrollment in the Affordable Care Act’s (ACA) Federally Facilitated Marketplaces (FFM). The report claims that only 67% of enrollees have paid their premiums. The data underlying this claim is so flawed that it is essentially worthless.

The Republican report is based on premium payment data from April 15, 2014. By April 15, 8 million people had enrolled through the ACA exchanges, but less than 5 million were required to have paid their premiums. For more than 3 million individuals, premiums were not due until the end of April or beyond. Many individuals pay their premiums shortly before they are due, as more recent data from health insurers indicates.

Federal regulations provide that insurers may not require individuals to pay their premiums until the day before coverage becomes effective.[1] Individuals who sign up for coverage by the 15th of a month have coverage that is effective on the first of the following month.[2] For example, an individual who signed up for coverage on March 5 would have their coverage effective April 1 and would likely have their premium due no earlier than March 31. In many cases, insurers provided additional grace periods so enrollees would have additional time. However, an individual who signed up for coverage after the 15th of a month would not have their coverage become effective and would not have their premium become due until the first of the following month at the earliest.[3] For example, an individual who signed up on March 16 would not have their coverage become effective or their premium come due until May 1. In many cases, insurers provided additional grace periods so enrollees would have additional time.

As of April 15, premiums had only come due for individuals who had signed up for coverage before March 15. Five million individuals had enrolled in coverage through the marketplaces as of March 17.[4] On April 17, the President announced that 8 million Americans had signed up for coverage through the marketplaces.[5] That means that more than 3 million enrollees – or nearly 40% of all enrollees – did not have premiums due by April 15 and therefore were not required to have paid them by that point.

The data submitted by WellPoint, an insurer with a substantial presence in the marketplaces, makes the flaws in the Republican data abundantly clear.[6] In their submission to the Committee, WellPoint indicated that 70% of enrollees in their plans offered in Federally Facilitated Marketplaces had paid their premiums as of April 15. In a call today detailing their first quarter earnings, WellPoint indicated the 90% of their total enrollees had paid their premiums.[7]

WellPoint noted these flaws in the data in their submission to the Committee. They stated:

The data includes enrollees whose policies have effective dates of April 1, May 1, and June 1; the premiums for those policies are generally due on April 10, May 10, and June 10, respectively. Thus, the data includes enrollees who have completed the application process but whose first month premium is not yet due. Therefore, more complete data will be available by May 19, 2014.[8]

Other insurers providing data to the Committee also made clear that the data would likely soon become out of date and inaccurate. Cigna wrote, “Customers who purchased a Cigna insurance product on an exchange have a grace period to pay their first month's premium.”[9] Humana stated, “adjustments and reconciliations to responsive data will occur within the FFM and Humana's records for some time after the production dates. Thus, the data being provided in this submission ... does not represent final verified numbers.”[10]

The Republican report is also inconsistent with recent statements by the insurance industry’s main trade association. The Blue Cross Blue Shield Association, whose member companies offer plans in almost every ACA marketplace, indicated that between 80% to 85% of individuals had paid their premiums.[11] And the CEO of America’s Health Insurance Plans, the industry trade group, stated this week that 85% of individuals enrolled in exchange plans have paid their premiums.[12]

[1] 78 Fed.Reg. 242, 76218

[2] 45 CFR 155.410

[3] Id.

[4] Comparison of Affordable Care Act and Medicare Part D Enrollment Rates, Committee on Energy and Commerce Democratic Staff (Mar. 18, 2014) (online at http://democrats.energycommerce.house.gov/...).

[5] President Obama: 8 Million People Have Signed Up for Private Health Coverage, The White House (Apr. 17, 2014) (online at: http://www.whitehouse.gov/...).

[6] Letter from Attorney E. Desmond Hogan, Counsel for WellPoint Inc., to Rep. Henry Waxman (Apr. 18, 2014).

[7] 3 Reasons Why Obamacare’s Outlook is Rosy for Insurers, National Journal (Apr. 30, 2014) (online at www.nationaljournal.com/health-care/3-reasons-why-obamacare-s-outlook-is-rosy-for-insurers-20140430).

[8] Letter from Attorney E. Desmond Hogan, Counsel for WellPoint Inc., to Rep. Henry Waxman (Apr. 18, 2014).

[9] Letter from Attorney Michael Bopp on behalf of Cigna Corporation to Rep. Henry Waxman (Apr. 18, 2014).

[10] Letter from Attorney David Ransom on behalf of Humana Inc. to Rep. Henry Waxman (Apr. 18, 2014).

[11] Blue Cross Says ‘80-85’ Percent of Obamacare Enrollees Are Paying, Forbes (Apr. 2, 2014) (online at www.forbes.com/sites/bruceJapaneseen/2014/04/02/blue-cross-plans-say-80-to-85-percent-of-obamacare-enrollees-are-paying/).

[12] Briefing by Karen Ignagni, President and CEO of America’s Health Insurance Plans, to Politico Pro Health Care Breakfast (Apr. 29, 2014).

[Merc14]

Yikes, a democrat memo. Must be legit, just like the Benghazi video that started the "riots" that never happened in Libya and the fake obamacare enrollment numbers. Credibility.....ZERO. Try harder ninjaboy

Hillary being truthful. Campaign posters covering the US with "What difference does it make!" and "If you like your healthcare you can keep your healthcare."

Edited May 2, 2014 by Merc14

[Frank Merton]

To repeal Obamacare the Republicans will need both houses of Congress, the Senate by at least sixty votes, and the Presidency. The process would also disrupt the American economy for a couple more years of uncertainty.

[Merc14]

To repeal Obamacare the Republicans will need both houses of Congress, the Senate by at least sixty votes, and the Presidency. The process would also disrupt the American economy for a couple more years of uncertainty.

Yeah, the economy is doing so well now. I have no idea, Frank, how we get out of this mess. Very depressing that the mouth breathers voted this stool back into office

Edited May 2, 2014 by Merc14