World 'needs Plan B' on climate - UN

[regeneratia]

You have nothing practical to offer me so it really isn't worth discussing further.

I personally don't believe that such a thing exists in a functional form at the moment. I have at various times tracked the whole free energy field and have seen people repeatedly make claims which they failed to deliver on and generally ripped people off along the way. Until someone brings one to the commercial market I will not be paying any more attention to any more free energy device claims.

Br Cornelius

OK. I will put the scalar and torsion field book back. No problem.

FYI, I don't go to the internet, personally, for this information. I buy the books with this stuff in it, hard copy. I admit that I don't understand it all. But I certainly wade thru the books.

I suggest you do the same.

Bringing this stuff to commercial market is waiting too long, dear. You KNOW this stuff WILL BE repressed, just like my favorite immunotherapy treatment has been grandly repressed (yet it survives, and can be used to advantage in Europe the way I would apply it).

Edited April 19, 2014 by regeneratia

[bmk1245]

[...]

He, his wife and a small army of tractors, cultivators and other equipment gets the job done. His tomatoes are planted in elevated rows to make management easier. He weeds by hand, but can do it while seated on a small tractor, throwing the weeds onto a trailer and composting them.

Doug

Ok, thanks for clarification.

Anyway, while the yields of fruits and vegetables in organic and conventional farming are on the par (more or less), with main crops - corn, wheat - organic farming, in overall, falls behind by 20% (if I remember correctly).

[Doug1029]

Ok, thanks for clarification.

Anyway, while the yields of fruits and vegetables in organic and conventional farming are on the par (more or less), with main crops - corn, wheat - organic farming, in overall, falls behind by 20% (if I remember correctly).

I know of a 1200-acre wheat field in Colorado. One farm. That would be a tough thing to apply organic farming methods to. If you're going to farm that, you need mechanization and finding that much animal waste and trucking it in might well cost more than you'd get back in ten years. Also, that farm does not have irrigation - it's a dry farm on the high plains. You can't put fertilizers on through the irrigation water. In short, I don't think that field could be farmed using organic methods.

IU think the optimum mix is going to include both farming methods. Inorganic works well in some places and mechanized farming works better in others (Actually, even organic farming is quite mechanized.).

Doug

Edited April 20, 2014 by Doug1029

[bmk1245]

[...]

IU think the optimum mix is going to include both farming methods. Inorganic works well in some places and mechanized farming works better in others (Actually, even organic farming is quite mechanized.).

Doug

So true

[regeneratia]

Plan B is to adapt to it.

[MysticStrummer]

Plan B is to adapt to it.

Yup. Shut up and get used to it, because change is bad if it means a tiny minority of people will make less money along the way.

[Frank Merton]

I'm hopeful that technology, especially solar, will save us in spite of ourselves by just naturally becoming the cheapest source of most energy and from that we will go to electric or hydrogen cars.

This may however come too late so some insurance in the form of subsidies pushing it and other technologies along (especially the new reactors that can't be used for bombs that are spreading in India).

[Bavarian Raven]

I'm hopeful that technology, especially solar, will save us in spite of ourselves by just naturally becoming the cheapest source of most energy and from that we will go to electric or hydrogen cars.

This may however come too late so some insurance in the form of subsidies pushing it and other technologies along (especially the new reactors that can't be used for bombs that are spreading in India).

Problem with solar is that it is not a very clean source of energy , what with rare earth metal extraction etc

[Guest]

Problem with solar is that it is not a very clean source of energy , what with rare earth metal extraction etc

A life cycle analysis comparing the impact of solar per kw to coal per kw over its entire life - would show that it is still streets ahead even when the initial production is accounted for.

Br Cornelius

[Frank Merton]

I read an article today about the difficulties associated with becoming dependent on natural gas for electricity generation (which is heads and shoulders better than coal and even getting to be cheaper). The problem is coal is easy to transport and store when there are supply disruptions from a given source. If a pipeline providing natural gas goes down the power generation stops right away unless it has alternatives, which are rarely present.

[Guest]

We are dealing with monopoly interests here who like to do things big and simply. This makes for vulnerable supply chains which are easily disrupted and cause significant outages when they fail. Gas is the best form of reliable energy supply at the moment so everyone wants to use gas. But the whole Fracking thing means that we are in a classic boom bust cycle which will leave us in a very vulnerable position when the initial spurt of easy gas has tailed off. Its so temporary a fix as to represent a very costly distraction to the real game of de-carbonizing the electricity supply.

The other siren call from the slavering dogs of the Nuclear industry is even more risky since they represent monolithic supply to the max and they spend large amounts of time offline which means a nuclear system has to have massive excess capacity to cope with taking down a single Nuclear power station.

The reality is that a diverse small scale dispersed grid - with millions of individual micro generators, is the best future - but it is less profitable for monopolies and less easy for monopolies grid systems to administer. There will be significant resistance to moving into the inevitable future because it breaks the supply model so fundamentally and kills some of the biggest industries along the way.

Br Cornelius

[Frank Merton]

Well with that in mind I recall an item where Oklahoma had given permission to charge those with solar and other power systems permission to charge for attachment to the grid. I doubt such a rule would be conceivable in most states but Oklahoma and maybe Texas.

[Guest]

Well with that in mind I recall an item where Oklahoma had given permission to charge those with solar and other power systems permission to charge for attachment to the grid. I doubt such a rule would be conceivable in most states but Oklahoma and maybe Texas.

Koch pushed that legislation and the TEA PARTY (Koch funded) has opposed it. Such is the dishonesty of the Koch brothers push for deregulation and the risks of trying to manipulate Libertarians towards a monopolistic agenda.

Br Cornelius

Edited May 10, 2014 by Guest

[Guest]

A very good study on Life Cycle analysis of Solar PV;

http://esu-services.ch/fileadmin/download/jungbluth-2008-LCA-PV-web.pdf

Br Cornelius

[Doug1029]

Well with that in mind I recall an item where Oklahoma had given permission to charge those with solar and other power systems permission to charge for attachment to the grid. I doubt such a rule would be conceivable in most states but Oklahoma and maybe Texas.

When businesses can't make it in a free market, they want government to step in and protect their investments. Then they cry about regulations. Why don't capitalists actually want to live under a capitalist society?

Doug

[Doug1029]

There is NO Planet B.

Doug

[nichryan]

One thing is for sure,we need to act for our beloved Earth! If only people aren't that greedy. Too sad..

[Phaeton80]

http://wattsupwiththat.com/2014/06/04/the-pause-continues-still-no-global-warming-for-17-years-9-months/

[psyche101]

I get emailings from free energy people who are themselves creating free energy devices. I have the specs, to store for later use. Naming them would certainly lead to their demise. Not going to go it.

I wrote about Michael Ruppert not long ago on a forum thread, and now he is dead. Hmmmm!

My brother in law is making a perpetual motion machine.

For the last ten years, it's only been one week away from completion. He says he will be rich any day now, I have my doubts though. He has even rung me for electrical advice, and I have offered what I could.

Still one week away from finished. I think it will still have "one week's work" left on it when he gets buried.

He is positive that he is right, and tells anyone who wants to know all about it. But it's been one heck of a long week though, ten years and counting.

[Doug1029]

http://wattsupwithth...years-9-months/

This guy needs to do some reading on climate change. That old anti-science Tea Party agenda doesn't cut it. There is really no mystery here, except in Watts' head.

In the late 90s a system of warm sea surface temps developed in the western Pacific. That warm water has been fueling typhoons for a dozen years, including the big one last year in the Phillipines. When El Nino arrived, the equatorial current couldn't push additional water ahead of it, so it slid UNDER the warm water. That's what is driving the rise is sea temps and that is where the "missing" heat is going.

But not all of it. Since 2005, global atmospheric temps have continued to rise. Watts doesn't have his information right.

Back in 1998 El Nino screwed up the climate system (or at least, changed it). It looks like we're about to get another El Nino later this summer. In fact, it may already have started. After years of drought, we got 4 inches of rain last week with another 4 predicted for this week. That's the kind of thing El Nino does. If it disperses the hot water in the western Pacific, or mixes it with deeper water, we could see warming return with a vengeance. At any rate, if things are about to change, we should have some indications by the end of the year.

Doug

[Phaeton80]

This guy needs to do some reading on climate change. That old anti-science Tea Party agenda doesn't cut it. There is really no mystery here, except in Watts' head.

In the late 90s a system of warm sea surface temps developed in the western Pacific. That warm water has been fueling typhoons for a dozen years, including the big one last year in the Phillipines. When El Nino arrived, the equatorial current couldn't push additional water ahead of it, so it slid UNDER the warm water. That's what is driving the rise is sea temps and that is where the "missing" heat is going.

But not all of it. Since 2005, global atmospheric temps have continued to rise. Watts doesn't have his information right.

Back in 1998 El Nino screwed up the climate system (or at least, changed it). It looks like we're about to get another El Nino later this summer. In fact, it may already have started. After years of drought, we got 4 inches of rain last week with another 4 predicted for this week. That's the kind of thing El Nino does. If it disperses the hot water in the western Pacific, or mixes it with deeper water, we could see warming return with a vengeance. At any rate, if things are about to change, we should have some indications by the end of the year.

Doug

Please be so kind as to provide a basing to your claims with actual data.

Edit: Meaning data that would prove the provided RSS satellite data incorrect.

Edited June 8, 2014 by Phaeton80

[regeneratia]

The world needs a Plan B on climate change because politicians are failing to reduce carbon emissions, according to a UN report.

It warns governments if they overshoot their short-term carbon targets they will have to cut CO2 even faster in the second half of the century to keep climate change manageable.

If they fail again, they will have to suck CO2 out of the atmosphere.

http://www.bbc.co.uk...onment-26922661

that plan b should be :

adapt.

Edited June 8, 2014 by regeneratia

[Guest]

that plan b should be :

adapt.

Adapting is only really successful if you know with certainty that you are going to enter a new stable steady state. When change is rapid and continuous the more likely outcome is extinction rather than a successful adaptation. The only real adaptation that works is stop forcing the change in the first place and that gives you at least a fighting chance of reaching a new steady state to which you can adapt to.

Adapt as used by the denialist camp is a rather stupid notion.

Br Cornelius