Merkel still backs Juncker...

[keithisco]

They have had numerous incidents of supporters expressing racist and homophobic opinions on their websites - and that is only those who bother to post. Its not rubbish Keith its documented reality. I think Farage isn't as bad as his supporters but thats small conciliation if they get into power.

Br Cornelius

Sorry, you are still spouting rubbish - racist members are expelled from the Party, there is no equivocation.

[questionmark]

Sorry, you are still spouting rubbish - racist members are expelled from the Party, there is no equivocation.

Lately even the Front National stopped advocating burning a Muslim before breakfast... that does not mean that they have actually changed, just that if you say it too loudly you get kicked out.

[Guest]

You really are Naïve when it comes to what the Square Mile actually does... It is NOT all stock market speculation... the vast majority of all transactions are investments in Industrial and Technological innovation (look at the Sabre Engine), it is Lloyds Insurance, it is investment in SME's.

the square mile does very little real long term investment because quantitive easing has made it more profitable to seek short term speculative gains. All that money printed went straight into the hands of the investment bankers to use in their high speed high capacity gambling. Since the returns on long term investments are generally lower than the margins available on split second currency or commodity dealing - that is where the real money flows and starves the companies which have slower rates of return. Take a look at Germanys regional investment banks and how they support industrial growth and wonder why the industrial base of Germany is many times stronger than the UK's. There are two types of investment strategies and one supports the country in real productive capacity and the other drains the country by sucking investment capitol away from real growth sectors. Guess which one is followed in the UK and which is followed in Germany. Then guess which country managed to absorb a whole nation and weather a decade long recession without losing hardly any of its industrial capacity. Contrast that to what happened in the UK from 1980 onwards with the shift to Thatchers "service industry and financial services". the square mile is a parasite on the UK and the world in general.

Br Cornelius

Edited June 30, 2014 by Guest

[keithisco]

Lately even the Front National stopped advocating burning a Muslim before breakfast... that does not mean that they have actually changed, just that if you say it too loudly you get kicked out.

Why are you even equating the Front National with UKIP? The FN have been denied membership of the UKIP grouping. It is just another case of trying to insert a "sound bite" into a debate that is a logical fallacy. You really need to try harder with your arguments. This is not the QM that I know.

[keithisco]

the square mile does very little real long term investment because quantitive easing has made it more profitable to seek short term speculative gains. All that money printed went straight into the hands of the investment bankers to use in their high speed high capacity gambling. Since the returns on long term investments are generally lower than the margins available on split second currency or commodity dealing - that is where the real money flows and starves the companies which have slower rates of return. Take a look at Germanys regional investment banks and how they support industrial growth and wonder why the industrial base of Germany is many times stronger than the UK's. There are two types of investment strategies and one supports the country in real productive capacity and the other drains the country by sucking investment capitol away from real growth sectors. Guess which one is followed in the UK and which is followed in Germany. Then guess which country managed to absorb a whole nation and weather a decade long recession without losing hardly any of its industrial capacity. Contrast that to what happened in the UK from 1980 onwards with the shift to Thatchers "service industry and financial services". the square mile is a parasite on the UK and the world in general.

Br Cornelius

You are just not getting it... Thatcher is yesterday's news, the Square Mile invests in divers technological and industrial concepts. The amount of Venture Capital available within the City is unequalled on a Global Scale. Look at the de - mothballing (is that actually a word?) of the Steel Mills on Tyneside (exporting directly to Taiwan), the tin mines being re-opened, and the plans for re-opening some Coal Mines in Wales.,.

The future is bright for the UK

[questionmark]

Why are you even equating the Front National with UKIP? The FN have been denied membership of the UKIP grouping. It is just another case of trying to insert a "sound bite" into a debate that is a logical fallacy. You really need to try harder with your arguments. This is not the QM that I know.

I don't know what that has to do with it, but as sound bytes, the ones that came out of the FN, even when the Sr. was the boss, were never much worse than what came out of David Wycherley ('ban Islam and knock down all the mosques') , Roger Helmer (...Being gay is "abnormal and undesirable" and not to be "celebrated") or Farage saying that "it would be right to worry about your Romanian neighbors".

[Guest]

The future is bright for the UK

Tell that to the masses on part time work and zero hours contracts - I am sure they will agree with you.

Br Cornelius

[keithisco]

Tell that to the masses on part time work and zero hours contracts - I am sure they will agree with you.

Br Cornelius

Tell that to the people in your Country first.

[stevewinn]

Lets just say steve, quantitative easing is a path to disaster paved with good intentions. The day of reckoning for Stirling is fast approaching. Its only the shocking state of the world economy outside of Asia which makes it look anything other than a real basket case. GDP growth is easy to manufacture when you can fiddle the books - but it aint real growth thats happening outside of London and even in London its largely a stock market fuelled fantasy.

Dream on.

Br Cornelius

...........and this from someone who supports the EU institution whose never had their accounts signed off, and turned a blind eye to Greek membership of the Euro everyone knew the Greeks were cooking the books, but EU expansion at any cost. literally to the point you put the whole EU project in jeopardy. look at the Eurozone still not out of the woods'

You go on about London - 12% of GDP comes from London. so 88% of GDP comes from outside of London.

Lately even the Front National stopped advocating burning a Muslim before breakfast... that does not mean that they have actually changed, just that if you say it too loudly you get kicked out.

If anyone in UKIP is racist they are removed from the Party within Hours. your foolish if you think UKIP are the only ones who have to deal with members with certain views. During the whole European Election when UKIP where being called Racist, in the background Labour where fighting their own racism storm. but it never made mainstream NEWS. http://www.bbc.co.uk...london-22485739

Edited June 30, 2014 by stevewinn

[keithisco]

I don't know what that has to do with it, but as sound bytes, the ones that came out of the FN, even when the Sr. was the boss, were never much worse than what came out of David Wycherley ('ban Islam and knock down all the mosques') , Roger Helmer (...Being gay is "abnormal and undesirable" and not to be "celebrated") or Farage saying that "it would be right to worry about your Romanian neighbors".

And yet, he was not wrong... in Spain the Romanians are here to rob, steal, and intimidate. Some (but a very small minority) want to be accepted as regular immigrants, but the majority bring 15 or 20 family members and use their little kids as decoys.

You have to live the life before commenting on it.

[Guest]

Tell that to the people in your Country first.

I am not in denial about my country

Br Cornelius

[Space Commander Travis]

Lets see, off the bat:

Austria Freiheitliche Partei, Bundniss Zukunf Oestereich

Belgium Flams Belang, Lijst Djedecker

Bulgaria Communists Union, NFSB, Attack

Britain UKIP, BNP

Croatia Croatian Party of Rights

Czech Republic ODS

Cyprus New International Left

Denmark People's Movement against the EU

Estonia Independence Party, Center Party

Finnland Finns Party, Communist Party of Finland, Workers Party of Finland

France Front National, Gaullist Debut Party, Popular Republican Union

Germany AfD

Greece Communist party, Golden Dawn

Hungary Jobbik

Ireland Sinn Fein, United Left Alliance

Italy 5 Stelle

Latvia National Alliance

Lithuania Order and Justice

Malta Libertas Malta

Netherlands PVV

Poland Congress of the New Right, Ruch Narodovy

Portugal National renovator party

Romania Greater Romania Party

Slovakia Slovak National Party

Slovenia National Party

Spain Candidatura d'Unitat Popular,

Sweden Swedish Democrats, Left Party of Sweden, IND/DEM Group

And that without attempt to list them all.

No vote is no vote. And the only reason I can think of for not voting is that you either are incapacitated or you could not be arsed, therefore have no opinion.

You refuse to consider that no vote might mean that you don't support the whole system as it is, then? And that people might not wish to vote for any of the "alternatives" listed above (National Front, Communist Party, Hermetic Order of the Golden Dawn and so on), as not really floating their boat and/or being slightly nutty? But no, you might be right that people may not feel antagonistic enough towards the EU to vote against it, but it really is living in something of a delusion to believe that that means a general satisfaction with it. At most or worst, it's indifference. Is that the best that the Eu and its proponents can hope for? That a majority of the people feel indifferent to it?

[questionmark]

You refuse to consider that no vote might mean that you don't support the whole system as it is, then? And that people might not wish to vote for any of the "alternatives" listed above (National Front, Communist Party, Hermetic Order of the Golden Dawn and so on), as not really floating their boat and/or being slightly nutty? But no, you might be right that people may not feel antagonistic enough towards the EU to vote against it, but it really is living in something of a delusion to believe that that means a general satisfaction with it. At most or worst, it's indifference. Is that the best that the Eu and its proponents can hope for? That a majority of the people feel indifferent to it?

If there is no party that you feel represents you, and you have an opinion, you create your own. That is what has been done by many thousands of Europeans over the last years who feel that they can be arsed.

Inactivity is just that: no interest.

Besides, as I said before, despite of some of those parties being extreme most of them are not and many are mainstream (just in the minority).

[keithisco]

If there is no party that you feel represents you, and you have an opinion, you create your own. That is what has been done by many thousands of Europeans over the last years who feel that they can be arsed.

Inactivity is just that: no interest.

Besides, as I said before, despite of some of those parties being extreme most of them are not and many are mainstream (just in the minority).

Sometimes you are so Naïve... it needs money, a lot of money to create a party that can afford to pay for publicity, and even more, to simply pay the Deposit required to field a single candidate. This is not Democracy, this is a sham that is being perpetuated by the major parties who over decades, or centuries, have managed to offer sufficient payola to their main backers to ensure that they are "properly Compensated" for their financial backing should they win.

[questionmark]

Sometimes you are so Naïve... it needs money, a lot of money to create a party that can afford to pay for publicity, and even more, to simply pay the Deposit required to field a single candidate. This is not Democracy, this is a sham that is being perpetuated by the major parties who over decades, or centuries, have managed to offer sufficient payola to their main backers to ensure that they are "properly Compensated" for their financial backing should they win.

We know, we know: If it does not go as we like it, it is a sham.

[Guest]

Keith - Ireland sent mainly independent's to the European parliament, so your belief that to send a principled alternative is always expensive seem to be a bit wide of the mark.

Br Cornelius

[keithisco]

We know, we know: If it does not go as we like it, it is a sham.

But my comment totally negates your surmise.

[keithisco]

Keith - Ireland sent mainly independent's to the European parliament, so your belief that to send a principled alternative is always expensive seem to be a bit wide of the mark.

Br Cornelius

You have a principle, but you are financially poor, then no way can you actually take part in an election. The "Big Guns" with their propaganda machine, on the street support will always beat you into submission. This is what Democracy has become.

It is a sad comment on todays Political Scene

Edited June 30, 2014 by keithisco

[stevewinn]

Keith - Ireland sent mainly independent's to the European parliament, so your belief that to send a principled alternative is always expensive seem to be a bit wide of the mark.

Br Cornelius

Independents even have backers. both monetary and parliamentary. I for instance cant just throw my hat into the ring the cost of the deposit in the UK is £500 the cost for the European Union is €1,800. (£1,440) thats big money for your ordinary man or woman on the street.

[Guest]

You have a principle, but you are financially poor, then no way can you actually take part in an election. The "Big Guns" with their propaganda machine, on the street support will always beat you into submission. This is what Democracy has become.

It is a sad comment on todays Political Scene

So how did those independents get elected ?

Br Cornelius

[keithisco]

We know, we know: If it does not go as we like it, it is a sham.

Naïveté is the real sham here. You support the status quo because as an immigrant to Greece you are vulnerable to changes in your status.

[keithisco]

So how did those independents get elected ?

Br Cornelius

Simple, they had financial backing, or sufficient personal funds that were of little consequence should they lose their deposit. This is not an option for most hard working people.

[keithisco]

Keith - Ireland sent mainly independent's to the European parliament, so your belief that to send a principled alternative is always expensive seem to be a bit wide of the mark.

Br Cornelius

3, this is not many

LINK: http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/European_Parliament_election,_2014_(Ireland)

Edited June 30, 2014 by keithisco

[Guest]

Simple, they had financial backing, or sufficient personal funds that were of little consequence should they lose their deposit. This is not an option for most hard working people.

I don't expect average working people to seek election to the European parliament, but one of the people who did get elected had no significant income or resources. A bit of a character our Ming the Merciless.

That deposit is small beer for anyone who can get enough support to stand any chance of running.

Br Cornelius

[questionmark]

But my comment totally negates your surmise.

It certainly does not. In the UK, with a return of 36%, that means that of roughly 40m eligible voters 14m actually bothered to vote. It sounds very fishy to me that if the 26m remaining actually wanted to change something they could not come up with enough money to get themselves known, organize themselves and create a voting platform by forfeiting a few beers. In Germany all they have to do is create a party and the tax payer pays for the campaign based on the returns and so on, and so on.