Gobekli Tepi roof?

[232]

Every time I look at images of what Gobekli Tepi would have looked like completed, I can't help but think..... there would be a wooden roof on top of that.

Yet I don't think I've ever heard anyone say as much.

Could there have been a wooden roof on Gobekli Tepi? Would all trace of it be lost over time or would there still be evidence left of it if there was one?

I'm not familiar enough with how wood ages over time while buried so I'm only left wondering, hopefully someone else here more knowledgeable could chime in.

To me, the t shaped columns just look perfect for supporting a wooden roof of some sort.

Edited July 15, 2014 by 232

[+and-then]

I think you could be right. It looks a lot like a "kiva" without the roof.

[Hanslune]

Well rationally speaking, they may have used pole covered with skins/existing tent materials, as they were probably mobile, could have been grass covered also

Fringe irrationally speaking, they used anti-grav to levitate a structure of diamond ribs and Nephilim skin.....

[232]

Well rationally speaking, they may have used pole covered with skins/existing tent materials, as they were probably mobile, could have been grass covered also

Fringe irrationally speaking, they used anti-grav to levitate a structure of diamond ribs and Nephilim skin.....

Guess something like that could perhaps make more sense and leave even less of a trace, that or maybe a thatch roof made of plant material.

Second bit..... makes sense too I uh.... suppose.

[+DieChecker]

It is possible I guess. The area did have a lot more forest/trees back when the site was first occupied.

[Harte]

Well rationally speaking, they may have used pole covered with skins/existing tent materials, as they were probably mobile, could have been grass covered also

Fringe irrationally speaking, they used anti-grav to levitate a structure of diamond ribs and Nephilim skin.....

Hans graces us with his presence.

Hey Hans.

Harte

[Hanslune]

Hans graces us with his presence.

Hey Hans.

Harte

Hey Harte I didn't remember that you posted here too. I was just looking through all my old links to forums and I remember this one and KMT-SESH?? and a few others, sorry I no longer have time to devote to such fine places these days.

[Harte]

Kmt_Sesh is busy moderating here, I guess.

Either that or I've just not seen his posts.

Saw his mod edit earleir today, though.

Harte

[lightly]

Sure 232, makes sense to me .. I'd guess that some sort of roofs would be very likely ? They are obviously built to last... sometimes it rains.. hmmmmmm ... how about a roof?

Even a removable skin roof... sort of like Wimbledon .

( I hope Kmt_Sesh is feeling good now.)

[Gingitsune]

Could there have been a wooden roof on Gobekli Tepi? Would all trace of it be lost over time or would there still be evidence left of it if there was one?

I'm not familiar enough with how wood ages over time while buried so I'm only left wondering, hopefully someone else here more knowledgeable could chime in.

To me, the t shaped columns just look perfect for supporting a wooden roof of some sort.

There could even be a second floor for all we know.

[Harte]

Nah.

Hammocks.

Harte

[Leonardo]

According to information available online, the earliest phase of construction at G-T comprised of upright pillars up to 6m high in circular arrangements of between 10 and 30 metres in diameter. These dimensions would suggest these circles were not enclosed by a roof and were not intended to be. Lack of post holes for additional supporting poles also suggests the same.

Some later constructions were considerably smaller in both height and area, as well as having smooth, polished, floors. It is possible that some of these later constructions may have been roofed.

The argument for the structures generally being unroofed is also strengthened by the view - unconfirmed - that the site held a ritual purpose (perhaps one of many) for excarnation or "sky-burial" - hence the vulture motif common on some pillars.

[PersonFromPorlock]

How about palm fronds? We know palms grow in the Middle East today, so why not in Anatolia back then?

[lightly]

Leonardo makes excellent points about the SIZE of the constructions, and the lack of evidence of Post holes, strongly suggesting there were no Permanent roofs on the larger (older) ones. ... and due to the sizes, temporary roofs would be a challenge as well ?

I notice in some pictures that the TOPS of some of the T columns are chiseled into a "pecked" pattern .. it would be odd to do that and them cover them up?

I wonder if the tops might be 'finished' for a specific reason... something to do with sky burials?¿? A body would fit nicely on the tops of the T's? Dunno.. just thinking . The areas between the walls are thought provoking too. (grunt grunt)

[Leonardo]

Leonardo makes excellent points about the SIZE of the constructions, and the lack of evidence of Post holes, strongly suggesting there were no Permanent roofs on the larger (older) ones. ... and due to the sizes, temporary roofs would be a challenge as well ?

I notice in some pictures that the TOPS of some of the T columns are chiseled into a "pecked" pattern .. it would be odd to do that and them cover them up?

I wonder if the tops might be 'finished' for a specific reason... something to do with sky burials?¿? A body would fit nicely on the tops of the T's? Dunno.. just thinking . The areas between the walls are thought provoking too. (grunt grunt)

It's speculative, but I make a suggestion one reason the "T"-shaped columns were made that way was to provide roosts for vultures waiting to feed.

Edited July 21, 2014 by Leonardo

[+DieChecker]

something to do with sky burials?

vultures waiting to feed.

Both of those suggestions seem very good ideas to me.

I wonder if they test the tops of the columns if they can find any staining, or traces that would prove either idea? Or, has too much time passed, so that all those organic remains would be long gone?

[questionmark]

Whatever (and if it) covered the Gobeliki buildings was removed when the installation was buried (yes, buried. Not abandoned) so we can speculate until we are blue in the face

[lightly]

.. just a couple links that contain some interesting info... ( most has been discussed here before )

http://www.newsweek....n-history-75101

Whatever mysterious rituals were conducted in the temples, they ended abruptly before 8000 B.C., when the entire site was buried, deliberately and all at once, Schmidt believes. The temples had been in decline for a thousand years—later circles are less than half the size of the early ones, indicating a lack of resources or motivation among the worshipers. This "clear digression" followed by a sudden burial marks "the end of a very strange culture," Schmidt says. But it was also the birth of a new, settled civilization, humanity having now exchanged the hilltops of hunters for the valleys of farmers and shepherds. New ways of life demand new religious practices, Schmidt suggests, and "when you have new gods, you have to get rid of the old ones."

http://en.wikipedia....ki/Göbekli_Tepe

Layer II[edit]

Creation of the circular enclosures in layer III later gave way to the construction of small rectangular rooms in layer II. Rectangular buildings make a more efficient use of space compared with circular structures. They are often associated with the emergence of the Neolithic.^[23] But the T-shaped pillars, the main feature of the older enclosures, are also present here, indicating that the buildings of Layer II continued to serve as sanctuaries

Edited July 22, 2014 by lightly

[Capt.]

Nothing "scientific" about this observation but has anyone else noticed a similarity between the reconstructed Gobekli Tepe and the Maryhill reconstructed Stone Henge?

If one had some sort of roof then it looks likely that both did. Giant stone "tent poles" does not sound improbable and there might have been enough now extinct mega-fauna left to make a tent covering that we are just not able to picture right now.

[Hanslune]

I would say that they thatched the roof. A skin tent like structure would have been to heavy to move around or store, while grasses would have been easy to gather and use.

http://files.abovetopsecret.com/files/img/tq4f4d9241.jpg

Similar to the Incan Raqchi or Viracocha temple, a reconstruction is shown in the image above.

[Capt.]

I would say that they thatched the roof. A skin tent like structure would have been to heavy to move around or store, while grasses would have been easy to gather and use.

http://files.aboveto.../tq4f4d9241.jpg

Similar to the Incan Raqchi or Viracocha temple, a reconstruction is shown in the image above.

Today there is not a whole lot of anything growing around either Gobekli Tepe or Stone Henge to thatch a roof with. Maybe there was and that is why they were abandoned(?)

Skin tents would not necessarily have been too heavy to transport. The gas bags in most of the giant airships like the Akron, Macon, and Hindenberg were gold seal which is the thin large intestine linings of thousands of oxen. Extinct mega-fauna might have simply have had much larger large intestines making the process more practical. Also, since Gobekli Tepe was used for thousands of years there might have been several different roof types.

"Eskimos" used to make featherlight rain gear out of seal and fish intestines so there is some technological precedence.

[Hanslune]

Today there is not a whole lot of anything growing around either Gobekli Tepe or Stone Henge to thatch a roof with. Maybe there was and that is why they were abandoned(?)

Skin tents would not necessarily have been too heavy to transport. The gas bags in most of the giant airships like the Akron, Macon, and Hindenberg were gold seal which is the thin large intestine linings of thousands of oxen. Extinct mega-fauna might have simply have had much larger large intestines making the process more practical. Also, since Gobekli Tepe was used for thousands of years there might have been several different roof types.

"Eskimos" used to make featherlight rain gear out of seal and fish intestines so there is some technological precedence.

Agreed, it will be interesting when they excav the rest of the site and perhaps find out more about the people who did the work. I'm particularly waiting for them to find the garbage dump and food preparation areas.

One technical note wasn't it called gold beaters skin?

[Capt.]

Agreed, it will be interesting when they excav the rest of the site and perhaps find out more about the people who did the work. I'm particularly waiting for them to find the garbage dump and food preparation areas.

One technical note wasn't it called gold beaters skin?

I have also seen gold seal called by more descriptive names like gold beater since that is what it was originally used for. I first read about in some old book about zeppelins so gold seal stuck in my memory. http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Goldbeater%27s_skin

I am not sure that we are going to be lucky enough to find the usual garbage dump at Gobekli Tepe: http://gbtimes.com/travel/gobekli-tepe-oldest-religious-structures-earth

"No evidence of residential use, such as fire pits, hearths or vessels for storing food, has been discovered and the few tools found on the site are simple stone implements which could not have been responsible for extracting the masses pieces from quarries over 100 meters away."

I hate the archeology habit of explaining everything odd as "religious" but with absolutely no fire pits at Gobekli Tepe it is hard to argue that it was solely a temple and one of great importance at that. It is an amazing find and I cannot beleive how few people know about it.

[Hanslune]

I have also seen gold seal called by more descriptive names like gold beater since that is what it was originally used for. I first read about in some old book about zeppelins so gold seal stuck in my memory. http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Goldbeater%27s_skin

I am not sure that we are going to be lucky enough to find the usual garbage dump at Gobekli Tepe: http://gbtimes.com/travel/gobekli-tepe-oldest-religious-structures-earth

"No evidence of residential use, such as fire pits, hearths or vessels for storing food, has been discovered and the few tools found on the site are simple stone implements which could not have been responsible for extracting the masses pieces from quarries over 100 meters away."

I hate the archeology habit of explaining everything odd as "religious" but with absolutely no fire pits at Gobekli Tepe it is hard to argue that it was solely a temple and one of great importance at that. It is an amazing find and I cannot beleive how few people know about it.

Well lots of things use to be religious based, modern western life is curiously devoid of it.

People have to eat - especially laborers. Somewhere there is food prep area, perhaps where the water source(s) are/is. They'll find it. The DAI is not only slow but methodical, it took them 100 years to fully excavate (well as much as they were able to do) Baalbek. I suspect Teutonic thoroughness at GT too.

Added note: I was a big fan of Strasser and Zeppelins and read pretty much everything written on the use of airships in WWI especially the Italians and British efforts.

Edited September 8, 2014 by Hanslune

[Capt.]

"People have to eat - especially laborers. Somewhere there is food prep area, perhaps where the water source(s) are/is. They'll find it. The DAI is not only slow but methodical, it took them 100 years to fully excavate (well as much as they were able to do) Baalbek. I suspect Teutonic thoroughness at GT too."

I feel better knowing that I am not the only one who has noticed that this dig is the model of German thoroughness (but slow).

If I could figure out how to e-mail it, I recently found an N-Class US Naval blimp operations manual on disc that you might enjoy. I was looking for an M-Class manual but there seems to only be two copies known and niether library wants to share. There were only 4 of the M-Cass blimps delivered and they had such a large control car that I would just like to know more about them. You might like little side thread: http://www.thesteampunkempire.com/group/naca