NATO no match for Russia military

[Ichihara]

If Russia wants to invade the parts of the Ukraine that have voted to disassociate from Ukraine and rejoin Russia it can do so it will, no one could stop Russia from this.

http://www.presstv.ir/detail/2014/08/13/375186/nato-no-match-for-russia-on-its-turf/

[+and-then]

If Russia wants to invade the parts of the Ukraine that have voted to disassociate from Ukraine and rejoin Russia it can do so it will, no one could stop Russia from this.

http://www.presstv.i...ia-on-its-turf/

NATO without the US makes this a true statement. NATO WITH the US would make this a nuclear war. Unless Vlad backed his ego down - which seems difficult for the diminutive little fellow to do

[Ichihara]

Paul said in Europe. NATO is all over the world. Russian army is in Europe. But we will not see WW3 (or WW4 as Russians use to say).

Read this paradox:

http://en.wikipedia....ability_paradox

edit: imo Paul just spreading fears for higher budget, for Cold war 2.0. Putin showed that he is ready to sacrifice lifes of own citizens just for the politic cause and personal gain. Psychopat.

Edited August 13, 2014 by Ichihara

[Stardrive]

I stopped reading right here......

Essentially what the American stooge government in Kiev is doing in Ukraine

No offense Ichihara.... but there are propaganda buzz words one learns to recognize over time and stooge is one of them. American stooge governtment in Kiev, heehee yeah right, and all this time I thought they were seeking EU membership.

[Ichihara]

I stopped reading right here......

No offense Ichihara.... but there are propaganda buzz words one learns to recognize over time and stooge is one of them. American stooge governtment in Kiev, heehee yeah right, and all this time I thought they were seeking EU membership.

dont kill the messenger.

[Sir Smoke aLot]

I stopped reading right here......

No offense Ichihara.... but there are propaganda buzz words one learns to recognize over time and stooge is one of them. American stooge governtment in Kiev, heehee yeah right, and all this time I thought they were seeking EU membership.

EU is big player in Ukraine. I would not blame US but the EU for the same reasons. As for propaganda - even in Kiev it wasn't clear what's going on at first, until first automobile tire was put on fire. Those don't drop from sky so rioters can use them, don't they

As for military strength, it doesn't matter what Russia or NATO have got because it will always be pawns who will do their 'wars'.

[Stardrive]

dont kill the messenger.

My apologies if you took what I said personally.

EU is big player in Ukraine. I would not blame US but the EU for the same reasons. As for propaganda - even in Kiev it wasn't clear what's going on at first, until first automobile tire was put on fire. Those don't drop from sky so rioters can use them, don't they

Here's the bottom line. The Ukraine wants to join the EU. The Ukraine owes Russia alot of money and it would put the EU right at thier doorstep. The rest is simple math.

Used tires are usually stored in a garage or warehouse until they can be properly disposed of. My guess would be the people in Kiev know where these tires are stored (they live there afterall). But I may be misunderstanding your point. We live in different countries and we probably have different ways of expressing ourselves.

As for military strength, it doesn't matter what Russia or NATO have got because it will always be pawns who will do their 'wars'.

Not always, and people will act on thier own. But aside from that, Russia and Nato both have powerful military assets at thier disposal and either side is capable of winning/losing in a conflict with the other. Balance of power, and it is important we have it.

Edited August 14, 2014 by Stardrive

[Helen of Annoy]

EU is big player in Ukraine. I would not blame US but the EU for the same reasons. As for propaganda - even in Kiev it wasn't clear what's going on at first, until first automobile tire was put on fire. Those don't drop from sky so rioters can use them, don't they

As for military strength, it doesn't matter what Russia or NATO have got because it will always be pawns who will do their 'wars'.

We could both show up with at least dozen tires to burn if there was an uprising to our taste in the neighbourhood.

Lean to the Russian side if you really must, but don’t you say we’re such idiots we couldn’t throw an uprising on our own. And collect enough garbage to burn.

Russia has no match in their own country. (Fortunately and contrary to Russian indoctrination, no one wants any part of Russia.)

And no chance in keeping any patch of land they invade.

There was very complex set of reasons why Russia was able to hold Eastern Europe for half a century and most of them have changed. Destroying their chance to control their last political and economic satelites is just one among consequences of their bizarrely aggressive expansionist attempt. But it’s their problem.

[Finity]

Russia has a big millitary. But it's no match for NATO or the EU (they would annoy both by invading Ukraine) in either size, technology or training. It's unlikely to go that far though. Plus there is a lot of political unrest in Russia, but obviously this is kept quiet by Russian media.

Edited August 14, 2014 by Finity

[Mr.United_Nations]

Alot the equipment is in storage and outdated though

[Ichihara]

We could both show up with at least dozen tires to burn if there was an uprising to our taste in the neighbourhood.

Lean to the Russian side if you really must, but don’t you say we’re such idiots we couldn’t throw an uprising on our own. And collect enough garbage to burn.

Russia has no match in their own country. (Fortunately and contrary to Russian indoctrination, no one wants any part of Russia.)

And no chance in keeping any patch of land they invade.

There was very complex set of reasons why Russia was able to hold Eastern Europe for half a century and most of them have changed. Destroying their chance to control their last political and economic satelites is just one among consequences of their bizarrely aggressive expansionist attempt. But it’s their problem.

exactly. watch this about so popular Putin.

http://www.unexplained-mysteries.com/forum/index.php?showtopic=270868

[skookum]

Alot the equipment is in storage and outdated though

That's what I understand.

Russia has suffered decades of under investment and they admitted themselves a few years ago it would take at least another decade to bring their kit up to date. Last year was the first time in Donkeys years they have spent more than the UK on their military (68 Billion as opposed 58 billion of the UK).

I really can't see them being able to do a complete re-fit of their forces for that money or in that time scale.

[+Hammerclaw]

If Russia wants to invade the parts of the Ukraine that have voted to disassociate from Ukraine and rejoin Russia it can do so it will, no one could stop Russia from this.

http://www.presstv.i...ia-on-its-turf/

The Russians at the height of their Conventional Military Power couldn't even handle Afghanistan. Chechnya gave them hell. They haven't been in a real standup fight since WW2. M.A.D. is what they still have going for them, not an arsenal aging armor and an obsolete tactical doctrine.

[seeder]

Alot the equipment is in storage and outdated though

Is it indeed?

Russia displays military might

http://rt.com/news/179812-russia-moscow-arms-expo/

http://www.voanews.com/content/russia-shows-modern-military-in-ukraine-crisis/1904464.html

[questionmark]

Is it indeed?

Russia displays military might

http://rt.com/news/1...scow-arms-expo/

http://www.voanews.c...is/1904464.html

I guess you are aware that Russia Today is the Kremlin mouthpiece?

To the thing itself: It is not uncommon that people near to the military industrial complex keep warning us about how strong ......... (put in as needed) is because we don't buy enough weapons. If the cold war is anything to go by: As shown after the East block collapsed at no point they had a real chance to beat the West despite having more soldiers and tanks.

[seeder]

I guess you are aware that Russia Today is the Kremlin mouthpiece?

To the thing itself: It is not uncommon that people near to the military industrial complex keep warning us about how strong ......... (put in as needed) is because we don't buy enough weapons. If the cold war is anything to go by: As shown after the East block collapsed at no point they had a real chance to beat the West despite having more soldiers and tanks.

yeh I know all about RT.com, But lets try Forbes instead!

7 Reasons Why America Will Never Go To War Over Ukraine (and do read the 7 reasons)

Russia is a nuclear superpower. Russia has an estimated 4,500 active nuclear warheads, according to the Federation of American Scientists. Unlike North Korea or perhaps Iran, whose nuclear arsenals couldn’t inflict substantial damage, Russia could totally devastate the U.S. as well as the rest of the planet. U.S. missile defenses, assuming they even work, are not designed to stop a massive Russian strike.

http://www.forbes.com/sites/michaelpeck/2014/03/05/7-reasons-why-america-will-never-go-to-war-over-ukraine/

The article ends with

This doesn’t mean that war is impossible. If Russia invades the Baltic States to “protect” their ethnic Russian minorities, the guns could indeed roar. Estonia, Latvia and Lithuania are NATO members. What would Ronald Reagan have done if the Soviets had invaded West Germany? Barack Obama would face more or less the same question in a Baltic crisis, or if a Ukraine conflict spills over into fellow NATO member Poland.

[keithisco]

Does anyone actually know what condition their nuclear arsenal is in? I suspect the enormous costs of maintaining all of these have been beyond Russia's means for several years now, and they possibly have only a fraction of their declared assets actually functional.

[questionmark]

Does anyone actually know what condition their nuclear arsenal is in? I suspect the enormous costs of maintaining all of these have been beyond Russia's means for several years now, and they possibly have only a fraction of their declared assets actually functional.

et hic canis septus est.

Having a dozen bombs build 20 years ago is equivalent to not having them if you have not spend about the same amount of the manufacturing cost in maintenance. It is not as easy as the old Hiroshima types anymore.

[keithisco]

et hic canis septus est.

Having a dozen bombs build 20 years ago is equivalent to not having them if you have not spend about the same amount of the manufacturing cost in maintenance. It is not as easy as the old Hiroshima types anymore.

Exactly, I wonder what Janes has to say about this? Describing Putin and his war machine as a "fenced in dog" is just about right, growl as much as you like, because the reality is that he cannot hurt us without destroying his own economy.

[skookum]

Does anyone actually know what condition their nuclear arsenal is in? I suspect the enormous costs of maintaining all of these have been beyond Russia's means for several years now, and they possibly have only a fraction of their declared assets actually functional.

It should also be said that the Americans have consistently over estimated Russian capability. The US military does a good job of this as it is an excellent way of guaranteeing new kit to counter a threat which isn't there. The Bomber gap was a famous one that led to the development of both the U2 and S-71 Blackbird. After all the billions spent it was discovered there was no bomber gap, the USSR had just been sticking different numbers on their bombers and then letting them be seen.

Like the big parades they use to do, the tanks use to drive around the block and join the back again to make it look like they had far more. A little trick they learnt from Hitler and the Nazi war machine.

Last thing I read about Russian ICBM's was they are incredibly complicated to maintain and get ready for use. The fuel is actually corrosive so they have to store them empty. Whether they could have maintained such an arsenal on the shoe string they had to work with for decades is anybodies guess.