qxcontinuum Posted September 4, 2014 #1 Share Posted September 4, 2014 (edited) This time is official. Exactly as many of us noticed the curiosity rover was not curious enough and did not make itself useful under a poor management. There is no scientific data published that can help science much and to justify a such astronomical cost of production and operations. Basically in a funny way it was ordered to stop being a Remote Controlled toy Racing from point A to point B without adding more values between these trips and take detailed pics of its findings. "The Curiosity rover's continued mission to explore Gale Crater was singled out as "lack[ing] specific scientific questions to be answered, testable hypotheses, and proposed measurements" in a harsh report by a recent NASA review panel [download the PDF of the full report]." I love in special this fragment; The report also criticized the Curiosity mission's leadership for perceived hubris, calling out Project Scientist John Grotzinger for failing to appear in person to answer the panel's inquiries. That, combined with a lack of clarity on the science goals of the extended mission, left the panel "with the impression that the team felt they were too big to fail." http://www.planetary.org/blogs/casey-dreier/2014/0903-planetary-missions-survive-senior-review.html A big thank you for valuing our money invested in this 2mega pixels 3 billion dollars walking camera, that refuses to take detailed pictures or to get closer to mysterious sightings when the public is asking for it, under the pretext of rushing to whatever obscure goals planners might have Edited September 4, 2014 by qxcontinuum Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
bmk1245 Posted September 4, 2014 #2 Share Posted September 4, 2014 (edited) This time is official. Exactly as many of us noticed the curiosity rover was not curious enough and did not make itself useful under a poor management. There is no scientific data published that can help science much and to justify a such astronomical cost of production and operations. Basically in a funny way it was ordered to stop being a Remote Controlled toy Racing from point A to point B without adding more values between these trips and take detailed pics of its findings. "The Curiosity rover's continued mission to explore Gale Crater was singled out as "lack[ing] specific scientific questions to be answered, testable hypotheses, and proposed measurements" in a harsh report by a recent NASA review panel [download the PDF of the full report]." I love in special this fragment; The report also criticized the Curiosity mission's leadership for perceived hubris, calling out Project Scientist John Grotzinger for failing to appear in person to answer the panel's inquiries. That, combined with a lack of clarity on the science goals of the extended mission, left the panel "with the impression that the team felt they were too big to fail." http://www.planetary...ior-review.html A big thank you for valuing our money invested in this 2mega pixels 3 billion dollars walking camera, that refuses to take detailed pictures or to get closer to mysterious sightings when the public is asking for it, under the pretext of rushing to whatever obscure goals planners might have You failed to read actual report: it talks about extended mission, not a primary. Another thing, panel may not be aware of all details about remaining MSL reserves/capabilities.And yeah, chasing after every "discovery" of internet-sofa-woowoo-researchers, Curiosity would have been a pile of scrap metal long time ago... Edited September 4, 2014 by bmk1245 6 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
toast Posted September 4, 2014 #3 Share Posted September 4, 2014 This time is official. Exactly as many of us noticed thecuriosity rover was not curious enough and did not make itself useful under a poor management. There is no scientific data published that can help science much and to justify a such astronomical cost of production and operations. This is incorrect and unsubstantial gibberish. The MSL mission targets and the still by the MSL generated results, so the scientific data, are published and all future results will be published as well. "The Curiosity rover's continued mission to explore Gale Crater was singled out as "lack[ing] specific scientific questions to be answered, testable hypotheses, and proposed measurements" in a harsh report by a recent NASA review panel [download the PDF of the full report]. The report also criticized the Curiosity mission's leadership for perceived hubris, calling out Project Scientist John Grotzinger for failing to appear in person to answer the panel's inquiries. That, combined with a lack of clarity on the science goals of the extended mission, left the panel "with the impression that the team felt they were too big to fail." This is the statement of a blogger, simply just that. But also on multi billion USD space missions there are always various and different opinions about the to be conducted mission targets, during the phase of planning the full and final mission set up and it is normal that not all parties will get satisfied. Well yes, it think the report can be discussed but it should not be used just as a basis to put a general, and a causeless one as well, blame on the MSL mission development responsible persons and/or department/s. Basically in a funny way it was ordered to stop being a RemoteControlled toy Racing from point A to point B without adding more values between these trips and take detailed pics of its findings. (...) A big thank you for valuing our money invested in this 2mega pixels 3 billion dollars walking camera, that refuses to take detailed pictures or to get closer to mysterious sightings when the public is asking for it, under the pretext of rushing to whatever obscure goals planners might have What a "finding" is and what not is (fortunately) rated by the missions responsible scientists and not by the GPSC (Global Pareidolia Suffering Community). And, the MSL is an over years planned and developed planetary exploration mission with a defined schedule and not a device to be just used as a public accessible remote web cam for the GPSC. And BTW, I cannot see a connection in between the thread title and yr first post here. 7 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
DONTEATUS Posted September 4, 2014 #4 Share Posted September 4, 2014 Thats a fact Jack ! get off MSL`s back . They are great people !!!! Doing great research,and for penny`s compaired to the total waist in out other hair brained missions here on earth !AKA Wars 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
kitco Posted September 4, 2014 #5 Share Posted September 4, 2014 (edited) Perhaps we could fake an alien invasion too bump up spending on space missions. Maybe then we could have decent pictures http://www.bibliotecapleyades.net/exopolitica/esp_exopolitics_ZZE.htm Thats a fact Jack ! get off MSL`s back . They are great people !!!! Doing great research,and for penny`s compaired to the total waist in out other hair brained missions here on earth !AKA Wars Edited September 4, 2014 by kitco Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Rafterman Posted September 4, 2014 #6 Share Posted September 4, 2014 (edited) The primary target for Curiosity is Mount Sharp and they are still several months away from getting there so, in actuality, the "real" mission really hasn't even started yet. As it states in the piece you linked: The report made a series of recommendations for ways in which Curiosity could improve its science return, including reducing its time spent driving so the team could spend more time on science operations. This would necessarily delay the rover's arrival at the upper layers of Mt. Sharp, one of the stated goals of the mission. Your personal assessment seems to be at odds with the Very Good/Good rating the mission received by the review board (if only the rest of government could get a very good/good rating, right?). As for not stopping and investigating every thigh bone, squirrel, or whatever some arm chair UFO nut thought they saw in a photograph, remember, Curiosity only has a limited number of sample cups (74 I believe) and once they've been used, they're done. And given that the main goal is to get to the top of Mt. Sharp, then you really can't use your expendable resources up before you get there. Regarding scientific impact, here's a piece also from the Planetary Society about the Curiosity presentation at last December's AGU meeting in San Francisco about all of the good science coming out of the mission. http://www.planetary...age-dating.html Edited September 4, 2014 by Rafterman 5 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
stereologist Posted September 4, 2014 #7 Share Posted September 4, 2014 Isn't it wonderful that Curiosity is as transparent a process as we see and that it is not subject to every pointless whim by those that have little to no idea what is happening. 7 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
toast Posted September 4, 2014 #8 Share Posted September 4, 2014 Perhaps we could fake an alien invasion too bump up spending on space missions. Maybe then we could have decent pictures Perhaps you can fake one, just only one, comment per month that contains something meaningful and constructive. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
kartikg Posted September 7, 2014 #9 Share Posted September 7, 2014 Maybe it's just frustration building up because no life or overwhelming evidence of once life existed on mars. With so many robots and satellites and studies IMO the time may soon come when we conclude that mars is and was a dead planet. Of course of course there are other things to learn about mars but that won't be catching the attention of general public. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
badeskov Posted September 8, 2014 #10 Share Posted September 8, 2014 Maybe it's just frustration building up because no life or overwhelming evidence of once life existed on mars. With so many robots and satellites and studies IMO the time may soon come when we conclude that mars is and was a dead planet. Of course of course there are other things to learn about mars but that won't be catching the attention of general public. Actually, to the best of my knowledge neither NASA nor anybody else is currently looking for life on Mars. They are looking for life enabling conditions for life as we know it, i.e. water and so on. Cheers, Badeskov 3 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
DONTEATUS Posted September 8, 2014 #11 Share Posted September 8, 2014 Actually, to the best of my knowledge neither NASA nor anybody else is currently looking for life on Mars. They are looking for life enabling conditions for life as we know it, i.e. water and so on. Cheers, Badeskov They are Looking for that little spider monkey still,! 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
qxcontinuum Posted September 9, 2014 Author #12 Share Posted September 9, 2014 Actually, to the best of my knowledge neither NASA nor anybody else is currently looking for life on Mars. They are looking for life enabling conditions for life as we know it, i.e. water and so on. Cheers, Badeskov Indeed ... Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
+Noteverythingisaconspiracy Posted September 9, 2014 #13 Share Posted September 9, 2014 The primary target for Curiosity is Mount Sharp and they are still several months away from getting there so, in actuality, the "real" mission really hasn't even started yet. As it states in the piece you linked: The report made a series of recommendations for ways in which Curiosity could improve its science return, including reducing its time spent driving so the team could spend more time on science operations. This would necessarily delay the rover's arrival at the upper layers of Mt. Sharp, one of the stated goals of the mission. Your personal assessment seems to be at odds with the Very Good/Good rating the mission received by the review board (if only the rest of government could get a very good/good rating, right?). As for not stopping and investigating every thigh bone, squirrel, or whatever some arm chair UFO nut thought they saw in a photograph, remember, Curiosity only has a limited number of sample cups (74 I believe) and once they've been used, they're done. And given that the main goal is to get to the top of Mt. Sharp, then you really can't use your expendable resources up before you get there. Regarding scientific impact, here's a piece also from the Planetary Society about the Curiosity presentation at last December's AGU meeting in San Francisco about all of the good science coming out of the mission. http://www.planetary...age-dating.html Great post Rafterman Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
toast Posted September 10, 2014 #14 Share Posted September 10, 2014 NASA will host a telecon at 10 a.m. PDT (1 p.m. EDT) Thursday, Sept. 11, to discuss mission status and the future science campaign for the Mars rover Curiosity mission. Participants in the teleconference will be: -- Jim Green, director, Planetary Science Division, NASA Headquarters, Washington -- John Grotzinger, Curiosity project scientist, California Institute of Technology, Pasadena -- Kathryn Stack, Curiosity Rover mission scientist, NASA's Jet Propulsion Laboratory, Pasadena. California Audio of the teleconference will be streamed live at:http://www.nasa.gov/newsaudio http://www.jpl.nasa.gov/news/news.php?release=2014-305&1&utm_source=iContact&utm_medium=email&utm_campaign=NASAJPL&utm_content=daily%2Fbreaking20140909 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
toast Posted September 11, 2014 #15 Share Posted September 11, 2014 (edited) NASA will host a telecon at 10 a.m. PDT (1 p.m. EDT) Thursday, Sept. 11, to discuss mission status and the future science campaign for the Mars rover Curiosity mission. Participants in the teleconference will be: -- Jim Green, director, Planetary Science Division, NASA Headquarters, Washington -- John Grotzinger, Curiosity project scientist, California Institute of Technology, Pasadena -- Kathryn Stack, Curiosity Rover mission scientist, NASA's Jet Propulsion Laboratory, Pasadena. California Audio of the teleconference will be streamed live at:http://www.nasa.gov/newsaudio http://www.jpl.nasa....reaking20140909 Now! Edited September 11, 2014 by toast 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
HDesiato Posted September 11, 2014 #16 Share Posted September 11, 2014 You can still watch the recorded version of the Curiosity Mars Rover Science Campaign Teleconference. (running time 1:02:43) Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
DONTEATUS Posted September 11, 2014 #17 Share Posted September 11, 2014 Quite interesting ! I Love NASA`s work ! Keep looking Up ! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
JimOberg Posted September 11, 2014 #18 Share Posted September 11, 2014 My friend Tom Jones from the STS-80 crew opened his blog last week for a discussion of the notorious "ufo circle" video. We posted the URL all over the ufo websites and youtube postings -- and to date, NOT ONE VISIT TO ASK ANY QUESTION. Do you need a more graphic demonstration that UFO enthusiasts are deliberately reality-averse? What other explanation is there? 5 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Merc14 Posted September 12, 2014 #19 Share Posted September 12, 2014 (edited) This time is official. Exactly as many of us noticed the curiosity rover was not curious enough and did not make itself useful under a poor management. There is no scientific data published that can help science much and to justify a such astronomical cost of production and operations. Basically in a funny way it was ordered to stop being a Remote Controlled toy Racing from point A to point B without adding more values between these trips and take detailed pics of its findings. "The Curiosity rover's continued mission to explore Gale Crater was singled out as "lack[ing] specific scientific questions to be answered, testable hypotheses, and proposed measurements" in a harsh report by a recent NASA review panel [download the PDF of the full report]." I love in special this fragment; The report also criticized the Curiosity mission's leadership for perceived hubris, calling out Project Scientist John Grotzinger for failing to appear in person to answer the panel's inquiries. That, combined with a lack of clarity on the science goals of the extended mission, left the panel "with the impression that the team felt they were too big to fail." http://www.planetary...ior-review.html A big thank you for valuing our money invested in this 2mega pixels 3 billion dollars walking camera, that refuses to take detailed pictures or to get closer to mysterious sightings when the public is asking for it, under the pretext of rushing to whatever obscure goals planners might have Wrong again. Guess you didn't really read the article as it was about future funding and a lack of detailed planning. I'm curious, is english a second language for you? No slur intended just wanted to know. BTW, they still won't be chasing shiny objects, that remains ridiculous. Edited September 12, 2014 by Merc14 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
DONTEATUS Posted September 12, 2014 #20 Share Posted September 12, 2014 (edited) We do know this, All the UFO nuts out there will never open the minds to actual research and factual evidence. Maybe this is why we have them in our world? To Keep the ones that do follow a logic based train of thought, and not get run over all the time by the , I know what I saw,and IT was E.T. ! Right? Well not exactly, theres always room for one really unknown thing in our world. It gives us hope of something New to crunch the numbers ! Edited September 12, 2014 by DONTEATUS Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
qxcontinuum Posted September 12, 2014 Author #21 Share Posted September 12, 2014 (edited) Wrong again. Guess you didn't really read the article as it was about future funding and a lack of detailed planning. I'm curious, is english a second language for you? No slur intended just wanted to know. BTW, they still won't be chasing shiny objects, that remains ridiculous. Well that is too bad , because they are loosing measurable credibility year by year. While most of its missions were very successful in the past, the most recent ones are certainly lacking enthusiasm and the premises of the targeted discoveries planned and data extraction is already known being mentioned ahead of time so there is much less level of response from public. Even more criticized on their costs, management, poor data extraction and novelty discoveries. What the heck is the point to send another rover if everything is known of Mars already? I a And guess who is paying for this missions . So they should start to be looking to be more receptive to our wishes and to entertain us more in the future ... Edited September 12, 2014 by qxcontinuum Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Merc14 Posted September 12, 2014 #22 Share Posted September 12, 2014 (edited) Well that is too bad , because they are loosing measurable credibility year by year. While most of its missions were very successful in the past, the most recent ones are certainly lacking enthusiasm and the premises of the targeted discoveries planned and data extraction is already known being mentioned ahead of time so there is much less level of response from public. Even more criticized on their costs, management, poor data extraction and novelty discoveries. What the heck is the point to send another rover if everything is known of Mars already? I a And guess who is paying for this missions . So they should start to be looking to be more receptive to our wishes and to entertain us more in the future ... Wow, you couldn't be more wrong. Let's look at some recent missions: Cassini Huygens - Blown us all away with new discoveries in the Saturnian system and still going strong. Kepler - Has changed our view on how prolific planet formation is in our galaxy and how many habitable planets may possibly exist. Spirit & Opportunity - What can you say about these troopers. Curiosity - Definitively determined that early Mars was very earth like with seas full of fresh water MRO - Unparalleled images of Mars and a great communication satellite for all the missions visiting the red planet. LRO - Images of the Moon never seen before and still going strong. Grail - Redefined what we know about the Moon and its creation Smarter folks than I can relay more but you want to chase sun glints and mineral deposits on rocks so what is the point. There are no extraterrestrials hanging around in our solar system and we have a lot to learn so let's get on with the science. Edited September 12, 2014 by Merc14 2 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Sir Wearer of Hats Posted September 12, 2014 #23 Share Posted September 12, 2014 Well that is too bad , because they are loosing measurable credibility year by year. While most of its missions were very successful in the past, the most recent ones are certainly lacking enthusiasm and the premises of the targeted discoveries planned and data extraction is already known being mentioned ahead of time so there is much less level of response from public. Even more criticized on their costs, management, poor data extraction and novelty discoveries. What the heck is the point to send another rover if everything is known of Mars already? I a And guess who is paying for this missions . So they should start to be looking to be more receptive to our wishes and to entertain us more in the future ... Frankly, if NASA listened to "the people paying for it", they'd never have gone to the moon. And if it's "entertainment" you're after, read a book. This is SCIENCE not KEEPING UP WITH THE CARDASSIANS. 2 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
toast Posted September 12, 2014 #24 Share Posted September 12, 2014 Well that is too bad , because they are loosing measurable credibility year by year. I will not ask you for data to back this claim as it would be insignificant in general. Research and science always, means since the beginning on humans touched these fields, had advocacies and opponents as well. There will never be a 100% endorsement in the public but this fact will not influence the track. Research and science was on the track in the past, is on track in the present and will be on the track in future, including research and science in relation to space exploration. While most of its missions were very successful in the past,the most recent ones are certainly lacking enthusiasm and the premises of the targeted discoveries planned and data extraction is already known being mentioned ahead of time so there is much less level of response from public. Lacking enthusiasm? What do you you wanna see, dancing mission managers? Even more criticized on their costs, management, poor dataextraction and novelty discoveries. The key question is, who criticize. Is it ppl who are involved in projects, is it ppl who do have the needed level of knowlege or is it ppl who think the Pythagorean theorem is a greek restaurant. I would bet the most criticism is from the last named group. What the heck is the point to send another rover if everythingis known of Mars already? No, it isn`t. And guess who is paying for this missions . This is the standard nonsense argument of the stupids. Did you ever calculated yr individual annual due from the taxes you are paying (if so), that are invested in space exploration science and technology by the country you are living in? No? Do it! If done, pls investigate the percentage of the GDP in yr country thats generated by the space exploration industry, including suppliers and services. If you have these figures on hands, you will see that the tax argument is a very stupid one. So they should start to be looking to be more receptive to our wishes and to entertain us more in the future ... This thread is about NASA and not about Warner Bros./Disney World/Sony Entertainment and similar companies but nevertheless the work and the publications of space agencies like NASA, ESA, JAXA and others are entertaining very much but to get entertained it requires at least a level of intelligence to know that the Pythagorean theorem is not a greek restaurant. 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
stereologist Posted September 12, 2014 #25 Share Posted September 12, 2014 Well that is too bad , because they are loosing measurable credibility year by year. While most of its missions were very successful in the past, the most recent ones are certainly lacking enthusiasm and the premises of the targeted discoveries planned and data extraction is already known being mentioned ahead of time so there is much less level of response from public. Even more criticized on their costs, management, poor data extraction and novelty discoveries. What the heck is the point to send another rover if everything is known of Mars already? I a And guess who is paying for this missions . So they should start to be looking to be more receptive to our wishes and to entertain us more in the future ... I still remember the protests in which people protested going to the Moon. They wanted to stop the space program and keep money on Earth. Bet those same people now expect satellites to track storms and prevent disasters from hurricanes. That's just one example of the benefit of the space program. Now that we made it to the Moon there is the real possibility of powering the world for more than a thousand years if we can begin to mine the Helium 3 that lies on the surface. Need any more examples? 3 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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