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RavenHawk

This is my rifle

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ellapenella

I served in the first GW. You come across as very young, please take no offense if I ask, do you remember what that was all about? It was kind of the preface to all this.

Everything that's happening now all started from the Gulf war . I hear lots of talk -chatter saying that all we ever do is wrong -and that it's come to this. Only I don't believe . I understand that we've armed rebels but I don't always understand who and why we armed them . You say it was kind of the preface . Where does that really lean to as being the cause of all this ?

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RoofGardener

......How many carrier groups do we have? The 11th, 13th, or even 15th MEU should be in the area. That is one of their functions, to go in and pull out US personnel. Whoever authorized this has just committed treason. If this originated from the Whitehouse, it is grounds for impeachment. This could be the last straw with the military. If you think I am p***ed off, you're right.

Why on EARTH would you want to send in a Marine Expeditionary Unit ? Yemen isn't an enemy nation. The embassy vehicles would have been left behind because it would cost more than their value to ship - let alone fly - them home. US troops are not allowed to carry guns in Yemen, any more than the Yemeni Ambassadurial Guards are allowed to carry AK47's in the streets of Washington. There are - therefore - only three choices: leave them in the (empty) embassy building, destroy them, or hand them over to the Yemeni authorities. It would be the same if the US withdrew its ambassador from London !

This gung-ho "this is my rifle" nonsense simply doesn't apply. It is an ambassadorial evacuation. That's it.... end of story.

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RoofGardener

............. And now those same wahhabis have roots in ISIS.

.....

Yeah, but where they REALLY Wahhabis, or just WahhanbiWahhabis ? :P

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ellapenella

@RoofGardener

I've read alot of your post on the threads and for whatever reason I've been asking you why is it that you say things like in defence of ISIS ? Seriously.

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ellapenella

@Roofgardener

Why did you say that isis has a right to agrue for something on the other thread ? I replied to you saying that NO they don't have a right to argue for anything And your other remark too where you commented that the chickens have came home to roost America -as if you meant it - and I asked you about that too -only you ignored it . I don't know about you but some of things you're saying are anti-American . Are you in support of the radicle islamist 'cause it seems like you are . You're talking like it was a normal thing for our troops to have to surrender their weapon or they couldn't leave . And b.t.w it's not normal for them to say we'll let you leave IF you give us your weapons . And obviously.they stole the vehicles -they had no rights to touch anything. I think your for the wrong side.

Anyway - our Mariners gave them nothing . They disembled and then destroyed their rifles OORA instead of handing them over as they were ordered to do by the state dept of America. To what get out of Yemen -why ? was there an attack going down again ?

Edited by Ellapennella
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ellapenella

Yeah, but where they REALLY Wahhabis, or just WahhanbiWahhabis ? :P

I find this to be an attempt at insult .no surprise from other things i've seen you say.

Edited by Ellapennella

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ellapenella

@ Taun and RavenHawk

Thank you both also for your service of our country. I love you guys and respect all that you've done and gave of yourselves . I just wanted to say that. I also shared that with Varelse . I always will display a public affection of gratitude openly for our Military . and my heart goes out to you and your families. ((ty ))

I hope each of you are well and getting through things from the after effects of war like PTSD and such . Please try to keep in mind that there are more people who love you all for what you've done, your bravery and courage then the few that would love to provoke and aggitate you all for being so awesom and great . A lot of us are Nothing but Proud of you , please remember that always.

(((Love to you guys/gals )))

Edited by Ellapennella

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ellapenella

@ Varelse

I just realized that the guys you were describing the 5 national drivers sitting cross legged with ear to ear grins on their face, two even bobbing to the beat. They were the wahabi's .

They probably were sizing everything and everyone up -absolutely. What I don't understand is why do we need others to drive us around when we really don't know who we can trust.

people I meet and know have always told me how concerned they are about training them and that they don't trust being around them at all , even if they're friendly. You just can't tell .

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Varelse

@ Varelse

What I don't understand is why do we need others to drive us around when we really don't know who we can trust.

This was the mission we were initially deployed with.

http://www.amazon.com/Baghdad-Express-Gulf-War-Memoir/dp/0873514505

Haven't read this book but I plan to soon.

We were friends with the Saudis, or so we thought, back then. And half or more of their labor force is from further east-like Taiwan, Malasia, the Philippines who had no dog in the fight. When the war was over they wanted us out asap and then some. So we used any means necessary to get the equipment back to the ports and off their land by contracting with Bin Ladin's dad's construction company to taxi our tanks, hummers, ect south on these 18 wheelers called lowboys. It worked and helped us all get home sooner.

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ellapenella

Some of the Saudis are our allies or friends ? and some are radicals though. right . either way they can't be trusted.

Edited by Ellapennella

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ellapenella

This was the mission we were initially deployed with.

http://www.amazon.co...r/dp/0873514505

Haven't read this book but I plan to soon.

We were friends with the Saudis, or so we thought, back then. And half or more of their labor force is from further east-like Taiwan, Malasia, the Philippines who had no dog in the fight. When the war was over they wanted us out asap and then some. So we used any means necessary to get the equipment back to the ports and off their land by contracting with Bin Ladin's dad's construction company to taxi our tanks, hummers, ect south on these 18 wheelers called lowboys. It worked and helped us all get home sooner.

Oh that book. I usually don't like to read war stuff but that looks like I'd like it. What's interesting to me is the man and his life that's telling the story.. thanks for sharing.

Edited by Ellapennella

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RavenHawk

Why on EARTH would you want to send in a Marine Expeditionary Unit ?

To defend sovereign US soil and personnel. Plus for the theatrics of it. This action sends a loud and clear message to our enemies, just like pulling out of the Mog did for Bin Laden. This piece of $-hit we have for leadership of this nation hasn’t learned a thing. He is still bent on destroying this nation. Every week, another pawn falls. And what’s more, he is obviously blatant about it.

Yemen isn't an enemy nation.

Ever since the civilian government fell, it has become an enemy state. The doublespeak coming from Psaki and Earnest should be causing them to spontaneously combust. How can they live with themselves? People keep jumping ship.

The embassy vehicles would have been left behind because it would cost more than their value to ship - let alone fly - them home.

Then they should have been destroyed if possible. Obviously they weren’t able to. We’re not coming back unless it is via an invasion force. We lose more ground every day. And that only eggs on a major conflict on the horizon.

US troops are not allowed to carry guns in Yemen, any more than the Yemeni Ambassadurial Guards are allowed to carry AK47's in the streets of Washington. There are - therefore - only three choices: leave them in the (empty) embassy building, destroy them, or hand them over to the Yemeni authorities. It would be the same if the US withdrew its ambassador from London !

They can carry then in order to discharge their duties which are to defend US sovereign soil. There are a couple of ways to remove weapons from the embassy. Either packed in a diplomatic container and shipped through normal means or picked up by incoming Sea Stallions or Ospreys.

This gung-ho "this is my rifle" nonsense simply doesn't apply. It is an ambassadorial evacuation. That's it.... end of story.

Yes, it does apply! It applies 24x7. Being an Embassy Marine is to be gung-ho and you can’t be anything less. Do you understand that? If it was just an ambassadorial evacuation then the vehicles would be left parked inside the compound and taxis would have been used to get to the airport. But that’s not what happened. They fled because no one had their back. It wasn’t because none was there; it was because it was ordered not to go, just like Benghazi. This was an act of cowardice at the highest levels. And I’m sure the MSM will do their best to cover it up. But it will come out. The military knows and perhaps for the first time in our history, thoughts of a coup are crossing the mind of many.

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Imaginarynumber1

Just more of your rhetoric and fear mongering.

It's just going to be a giant circle jerk in the forums if a rep get elected next.

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Varelse

To defend sovereign US soil and personnel. Plus for the theatrics of it. This action sends a loud and clear message to our enemies, just like pulling out of the Mog did for Bin Laden. This piece of $-hit we have for leadership of this nation hasn't learned a thing. He is still bent on destroying this nation. Every week, another pawn falls. And what's more, he is obviously blatant about it.

Ever since the civilian government fell, it has become an enemy state. The doublespeak coming from Psaki and Earnest should be causing them to spontaneously combust. How can they live with themselves? People keep jumping ship.

Then they should have been destroyed if possible. Obviously they weren't able to. We're not coming back unless it is via an invasion force. We lose more ground every day. And that only eggs on a major conflict on the horizon.

They can carry then in order to discharge their duties which are to defend US sovereign soil. There are a couple of ways to remove weapons from the embassy. Either packed in a diplomatic container and shipped through normal means or picked up by incoming Sea Stallions or Ospreys.

Yes, it does apply! It applies 24x7. Being an Embassy Marine is to be gung-ho and you can't be anything less. Do you understand that? If it was just an ambassadorial evacuation then the vehicles would be left parked inside the compound and taxis would have been used to get to the airport. But that's not what happened. They fled because no one had their back. It wasn't because none was there; it was because it was ordered not to go, just like Benghazi. This was an act of cowardice at the highest levels. And I'm sure the MSM will do their best to cover it up. But it will come out. The military knows and perhaps for the first time in our history, thoughts of a coup are crossing the mind of many.

While I could feel your pain, I'm over it. It's their land. Their house. Their rules. Sure we could've evacuated everyone and everything in style with a few plush LCATS backed up by birds and hawks in the sky. We'd be outnumbered thousands to one while risking lives on both sides. When the easy, safe way to exit was there all along.

Had he gone in playing Marion Mitchell Morrison The story would be "Obama Blows 20 Billion on Yemen Evacuation That Could Have Gone Peacefully For 1.5 Mil." "Obama Removes Key Components of The Navy's 7th Fleet Leaving S. Korea Vulnerable When All He Needed Was A 747. ! !11!111!

And while I don't consider myself a fan of the man considering all the insiders in the military and intel services working against him I'd say been decent on the ME policy so far.

Want to have a conversation that should make you sick? Imagine if 20-25 service people were being killed in action every. single. day.

22 x 7 = 154/week

22 x 365 = 8030 dead per year.

That's how many of our brothers and sisters in arms are killing themselves every year because they don't have or didn't get access to good mental health care before it was too late. Out of those 8000 a minute few get super bent like I suspect Eddie Ray Routh and several others have done - taking out their families or random people in public.

And you're worried about image? Yeah. That's macho.

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ellapenella

Want to have a conversation that should make you sick? Imagine if 20-25 service people were being killed in action every. single. day.

22 x 7 = 154/week

22 x 365 = 8030 dead per year.

That's how many of our brothers and sisters in arms are killing themselves every year because they don't have or didn't get access to good mental health care before it was too late. Out of those 8000 a minute few get super bent like I suspect Eddie Ray Routh and several others have done - taking out their families or random people in public.

whoa ... I never knew the numbers .-it's devasting. definitley needs much more caring attention given -why hasn't money ever been propery invested into sufficient care after war was something i've wondered about . i'd rather taxed money go towards investing in this dire area of concern instead of some of the ridiculous wasteful spending it goes towards.

(((hug))) peace and be well...

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Varelse

whoa ... I never knew the numbers .-it's devasting. definitley needs much more caring attention given -why hasn't money ever been propery invested into sufficient care after war was something i've wondered about . i'd rather taxed money go towards investing in this dire area of concern instead of some of the ridiculous wasteful spending it goes towards.

(((hug))) peace and be well...

There's this small attempt-which won't be so bad if followed up by more like it in the next few months. But I doubt it. Honestly this smells more like showing off for the cameras. "Well we tried b-b-b-buuuuuut it was just an insurmountable problem"...or "we really didn't have the funds to follow through"...or whatever.

Funny how money and resources are never an issue when we need to bomb someone, bail out a crooked bunch of bankers or raise congress' pay and benefits.

http://www.10news.com/news/obama-to-sign-veterans-suicide-prevention-bill

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ellapenella

There's this small attempt-which won't be so bad if followed up by more like it in the next few months. But I doubt it. Honestly this smells more like showing off for the cameras. "Well we tried b-b-b-buuuuuut it was just an insurmountable problem"...or "we really didn't have the funds to follow through"...or whatever.

Funny how money and resources are never an issue when we need to bomb someone, bail out a crooked bunch of bankers or raise congress' pay and benefits.

http://www.10news.co...prevention-bill

honeslty...I'm so confused about everything. But I'm not confused about the care that really needs to be invested in the VA . Our country has plenty to invest in it . I've never understood why it's never been top priority .-I'm the type of person that will stop a soldier and say hey -thank you and take the time to listen to them they tear up at times I know there is a need out there. And they will talk and open up with me . One guy was telling me that he was just back and having a really hard time transitioning to civilian life again. I'm genuinely sincere when I say I care about it. and also - I have a family member who's dad did turn on them. So yeah . It does happen.

I have to add this -I also have a family member -these are not my side but in laws when he came back from Afghanistan this is when 9/11 first was -he enlisted not knowing . He did like maybe 4 yrs or so there and when he came back -he was so not the same. - he was a paratrooper he experienced his friend his buddy in the field die right next to him. -he was a genius still is but has these problems now that he never had and all his schooling still no one wants him now to work for them. I feel so bad for him. -he's such a great guy.

One more thing -one of the strangest things he would do -was back pack his stuff and walk far distances - like from one county to the other and sleep in the woods on his journey. -his dad would have to go and find him - was very difficult when he got back.

Edited by Ellapennella

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ellapenella

So - I'm not buying it that there's no funding . I was wondering do you think rand paul would make a better president. And get these things passed and into working progress ? I do. I think he would do better than the last two presidents. I realize it should of been done years ago.

Edited by Ellapennella

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ellapenella

@Varelse

I thought this would be the best place to post this . I heard a report for the first time it suggested that while Chris Kyle and friend Chad Littlefield sat in their vehicle texting back and forth to one another about Eddie routh -while Eddie Routh sat in the back seat.

The report stated that Chris and Chad's phone text converstaion found stated that they thought Eddie Routh was crazy -If so -why would they take him to a shooting range?

If Eddie Routh was suffering badly with PTSD a range would of been the last place to bring him for help , right ? -knowing that you don't really know if everyone else around you at a range are completely of sound mind and careful is enough to consider -but to actually take a man suffering with severe PTSD to one doesn't seem logically wise or helpful for the individual struggling with the syndrome of . You mentioned some things and something struck a cord in me about this .

Eddie Routh's uncle said that he had lost desire for life .

Edited by Ellapennella

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ellapenella

Ella... To a military person (such as myself and others here) handing over your weapons is a sign of surrender... The initial reports of this made it seem as though the Marines had been ordered to surrender their weapons - that is (I believe) what had the OP upset..

I absolutely agree . And as for any military personal to object to the notion of why they never surrender is nothing more but a dishonor. I realize they were given orders . Which were none other than unbelievable.

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ellapenella

While I could feel your pain, I'm over it. It's their land. Their house. Their rules. Sure we could've evacuated everyone and everything in style with a few plush LCATS backed up by birds and hawks in the sky. We'd be outnumbered thousands to one while risking lives on both sides. When the easy, safe way to exit was there all along.

Had he gone in playing Marion Mitchell Morrison The story would be "Obama Blows 20 Billion on Yemen Evacuation That Could Have Gone Peacefully For 1.5 Mil." "Obama Removes Key Components of The Navy's 7th Fleet Leaving S. Korea Vulnerable When All He Needed Was A 747. ! !11!111!

And while I don't consider myself a fan of the man considering all the insiders in the military and intel services working against him I'd say been decent on the ME policy so far.

Want to have a conversation that should make you sick? Imagine if 20-25 service people were being killed in action every. single. day.

22 x 7 = 154/week

22 x 365 = 8030 dead per year.

That's how many of our brothers and sisters in arms are killing themselves every year because they don't have or didn't get access to good mental health care before it was too late. Out of those 8000 a minute few get super bent like I suspect Eddie Ray Routh and several others have done - taking out their families or random people in public.

And you're worried about image? Yeah. That's macho.

I don't get how you figure that Ravenhawk was being macho . I think i know why you may have said what you did though. Just not sure about. I see it as a display of honor and of what it all meant to be a marine . There's a BIG difference in honor and being plain ol' macho. As for people dieing each year -please I think maybe the prescription pills have that outnumbered. It's like 100,000 a year.

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RavenHawk

While I could feel your pain, I'm over it. It's their land. Their house. Their rules. Sure we could've evacuated everyone and everything in style with a few plush LCATS backed up by birds and hawks in the sky. We'd be outnumbered thousands to one while risking lives on both sides. When the easy, safe way to exit was there all along.

Are you sure you’re not twisting it too much? What’s this about plush LCATS? A nation that we have an embassy in can certainly request that we leave. But until then, it is our house and our soil, just as sovereign as anything on Mainstreet, USA. We are required to defend it as such at whatever cost. There are protocols in place to protect both sides. There is a difference between having a safe way to exit and fleeing from being captured, paraded, and executed. The government had collapsed so the safe way ceased to exist. We were left with disengaging in the face of the enemy and we took the cowardly way to leave. It may have saved lives in the short term but it will cost far more down the road. It has enabled others that will follow in other nations.

Had he gone in playing Marion Mitchell Morrison The story would be "Obama Blows 20 Billion on Yemen Evacuation That Could Have Gone Peacefully For 1.5 Mil." "Obama Removes Key Components of The Navy's 7th Fleet Leaving S. Korea Vulnerable When All He Needed Was A 747.

I seriously doubt anyone would mistake him for John Wayne or even Ronald Reagan. And what do you think would have happened if the detachment had been taken prisoner and killed just as in Benghazi? Would Obama be trying to blame “American Sniper” for it? Why does Obama have to remove key components from S Korea? There’s usually enough force in the Gulf region as there is without having to pull from the Western Pacific.

And while I don't consider myself a fan of the man considering all the insiders in the military and intel services working against him I'd say been decent on the ME policy so far.

I’d say that the military and intel services had been working as usual to defend this nation and Obama has been dismantling it and going for the low hanging fruit to puff himself up, like getting Bin Laden. He’s pulling out of wars (not ending them) with no status of forces agreement, which is causing a more widespread war. And not stopping Iran which is like dousing a lit fuse with kerosene. Instead of providing stability, he is creating chaos.

Want to have a conversation that should make you sick? Imagine if 20-25 service people were being killed in action every. single. day.

22 x 7 = 154/week

22 x 365 = 8030 dead per year.

That's how many of our brothers and sisters in arms are killing themselves every year because they don't have or didn't get access to good mental health care before it was too late. Out of those 8000 a minute few get super bent like I suspect Eddie Ray Routh and several others have done - taking out their families or random people in public.

Oh yeah, I am p-issed off at this. Our veterans should be getting the best care there is, but they aren’t and that has rarely been the case. But this is a separate issue. Their care is the basis for Obamacare for the rest of us. It is a disgrace. They aren’t being cared for, they’re being disposed of just like what they want to do to us when we get elderly. It’s heading toward a cross between Logan’s Run and Soylent Green.

And you're worried about image? Yeah. That's macho.

Many times, image is what saves lives. You have to make it undesirable for your enemy to want to attack you. “Macho” carries an implication of fake. Our image and reputation is more important than something that is fake. But Obama has destroyed that and setting the stage for more attacks on us.

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RoofGardener

So what was Obama to do ?

Turn the Embassy into an armed camp ? Prepare for a seige ?

I seem to recall that the LAST time they tried that in the face of a Shia uprising,it didn't work out too well. Remember Iran ?

The embassy is 200 miles from the coast. It's not very big. I couldn't be maintained by helicopter food/equipment drops because... there are no US air bases in the region, and the carriers are too far away, and would take too long to arrive. And THEN... those helicopters would be illegally invading Yemenese airspace, and could be (legally) fired on at will.

"This is my rifle..."

Oh really ? Jolly nice. Now HERE are the WW2-era artillary canons that the Shia rebells have just moved into range of the embassy buildings. The embassy would be a pile of burning rubble within a day. What could the marine guard do about it ? Nothing !

Well, of course, America COULD do something; it could mount a fully-fledged invasion from its carriers. Except... how many troops does a carrier carry ? A few hundred ? What about tanks and APC's ? They come on seperate ships, which are NOT in the area.It would take a week or so to assemble the forces for an illegal invasion that would have to penetrate 200 miles to reach the embassy, secure the area, and then pull out again.

Obama - and the Ambassadorial staff - did the only sensible (and legal) thing. Once those marines left the embassy compound, they became illegal immigrants, without any license to carry guns. The newspaper headlines where - in my opinion - outrageously foolish, and entirely unfair to Obama.

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and then

So what was Obama to do ?

Turn the Embassy into an armed camp ? Prepare for a seige ?

I seem to recall that the LAST time they tried that in the face of a Shia uprising,it didn't work out too well. Remember Iran ?

The embassy is 200 miles from the coast. It's not very big. I couldn't be maintained by helicopter food/equipment drops because... there are no US air bases in the region, and the carriers are too far away, and would take too long to arrive. And THEN... those helicopters would be illegally invading Yemenese airspace, and could be (legally) fired on at will.

"This is my rifle..."

Oh really ? Jolly nice. Now HERE are the WW2-era artillary canons that the Shia rebells have just moved into range of the embassy buildings. The embassy would be a pile of burning rubble within a day. What could the marine guard do about it ? Nothing !

Well, of course, America COULD do something; it could mount a fully-fledged invasion from its carriers. Except... how many troops does a carrier carry ? A few hundred ? What about tanks and APC's ? They come on seperate ships, which are NOT in the area.It would take a week or so to assemble the forces for an illegal invasion that would have to penetrate 200 miles to reach the embassy, secure the area, and then pull out again.

Obama - and the Ambassadorial staff - did the only sensible (and legal) thing. Once those marines left the embassy compound, they became illegal immigrants, without any license to carry guns. The newspaper headlines where - in my opinion - outrageously foolish, and entirely unfair to Obama.

The exasperation he is feeling is from the absolute (seemingly) indifference which our nation is regarded in this region under Obama's watch. By ANY measure this man has degraded our strength and thrown away the faith of our allies. In fact that seems to be his goal. The points you make are right on - it would be a blood bath and we'd probably lose anyway but that isn't really the point. The point is that under almost any former president this simply would NOT BE HAPPENING. My friend there is very real and vocal RAGE at the actions of this base little man. And I would suggest to you that it is far from being only America he is harming/ has harmed. His devious actions are setting the whole world up for an explosion.
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