sleplen Posted March 13, 2015 #176 Share Posted March 13, 2015 The head of the National Bank of Ukraine Valeriy Gontareva on Wednesday, March 11, held a crisis meeting with the heads of the National Bank of different times. Formally, according to reports Kyiv media, the reasons for conducting such meetings is not, as the hryvnia strengthened. However, at a meeting called almost all rukopozhatnyh glavbankirov Ukraine, which indicates that the current leadership of the NBU does not understand what is going on in the currency market and did not know what to do. Production rate of Kiev following: Lost Crimea and Donbas (at least 17% of GDP). Hawking goes banking system (only withdrawal of deposits damage GDP by 9%), and fourth in terms of assets bankruptcy "Delta Bank" will lead to what will soon have to bankrupt the state, "Oschadbank." According to official figures one third of industrial enterprises are not functioning. The country is in the midst of the redistribution of property, which is expressed in the new privatization and spinning assets from weak oligarchs. Weak are now all but Igor Kolomoisky, as Kolomoysky professional raider and it has its own armed forces - battalions. Consequently, pressing will he benefit of its approximate Boris Filatov knows the issues of ownership in the Kiev parliament. Total: patient under the name "Ukrainian economy" is dead, just dead body are not yet fully cooled. But good on a loan obtained, and it is more likely, yet give. It was under the IMF money hryvnia strengthened to 21.7 per 1 US dollar, and created the illusion of economic stabilization. Now you need to re-let the hryvnia to float freely, as the resources to keep the exchange rate is not (real money NBU 250-300 mln.), And the market has grown pent-up demand on the dollar for imports. At the same time the fall of the hryvnia on the arm of the oligarchy, which hopes to buy the assets of bankrupt competitors cheaply. However, as the oligarchy will run the enterprise data with crumbling monetary and banking systems - absolutely incomprehensible. Because the hryvnia will fall, and the reasons for this are as follows: The collapse of the economy. The absolute incompetence of administrative and political class in Ukraine. Priority business interests over public interests of the oligarchy. Kiev parallel need something to do with a bunch of armed men, who believe in the March-April to dissolve their homes within the promised demobilization. However, there is a problem: 1. Demobilized not replaced, since all wave mobilization ripped off, that is, if demobilize, then there is no one to fight for Kiev. 2. Waiver of demobilization would lead to riots (in the worst case for Kyiv) or a sharp drop in the motivation of soldiers and officers (at best). Consequently, it is impossible to dismiss the soldiers, and the best way to maintain motivation - send in the thick of the war, where they will not have time to think about the causes of war. That is, the soldiers need to re-establish the enemy, so that the enemy did not himself Kiev. Hence, the need to re-start the Kiev military actions that distract the masses from economic problems and will not carry out the promised demobilization. It is obvious that to get all the money from the IMF Ukraine can not, because the allocation of tranches tied to the performance requirements of the Fund, and the previous experience of cooperation between Kiev and the IMF did not differ constructive. And that Kiev can not understand. Therefore, from the standpoint of the Ukrainian elite, it would be logical to get money from the Fund at the beginning, and then again to provoke defrost fighting since before the next tranche still need to survive, and the collapsing economy will not allow it. It is because the head of the Kiev Finance Yaresko requested from the Fund of $ 10 billion. (And gave Kiev just 5 billion), this would increase the resource strength of the Ukrainian authorities on the eve of a new round of war. Because the fore go to Kiev two processes: Getting money from the IMF, which is the primary objective, and the most gentle rejection of the social obligations to the population. Forcing LDNR the resumption of active hostilities and disruption of the truce. Consequently, the amount of provocation should rise sharply, which will allow the US to continue sanctions pressure on Russia. At the same time it will accelerate the transition to chaos in Ukraine, therefore, will weaken Europe and Russia, strengthening the position of the United States. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
aztek Posted March 13, 2015 #177 Share Posted March 13, 2015 (edited) who started this war? rebels did. The war began in Kiev on independence square, with the support of the United States and Europe. show me the proof usa had anything to do with it??? the maidan revolution started in kiev, not a war, rebels started a war in donetsk, lugansk. they desided to sepatrate, this is a war for power, and rebels started it. Edited March 13, 2015 by aztek Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
sleplen Posted March 13, 2015 #178 Share Posted March 13, 2015 show me the proof usa had anything to do with it??? the maidan revolution started in kiev, not a war, rebels started a war in donetsk, lugansk. they desided to sepatrate, this is a war for power, and rebels started it. These individuals, you have no proof? What they did on the Maidan? You make us think that these people defended the revolution? You know that near the Maidan, was Antimaidan?. Why are these people not heard Antimaidan? Where were the people of the Crimea and the Donbas. Do you think these people did not know about the upcoming blood massacre? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
sleplen Posted March 13, 2015 #179 Share Posted March 13, 2015 U.S. President Barack Obama said that the United States authorities acted as intermediaries with the change of power in Ukraine. He told this in an interview with CNN. http://cnnpressroom.blogs.cnn.com/2015/02/01/pres-obama-on-fareed-zakaria-gps-cnn-exclusive/ Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
aztek Posted March 13, 2015 #180 Share Posted March 13, 2015 (edited) so they were there, so what? being intermediaries does not mean being responcible for revolution. this is not a proof. there was not a single person waving american flag there, but we saw plenty of russian flags fly in ukraine. usa had nothing to do in starting maidan. so all evidence points to russia, not usa. Edited March 13, 2015 by aztek Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
sleplen Posted March 13, 2015 #181 Share Posted March 13, 2015 And this is also the mediation? We have invested 5 billion$ per revolution on the Maidan. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
sleplen Posted March 13, 2015 #182 Share Posted March 13, 2015 How do you need to do to Putin? 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
aztek Posted March 13, 2015 #183 Share Posted March 13, 2015 (edited) And this is also the mediation? We have invested 5 billion$ per revolution on the Maidan. lmao, if you heard the speech yourself, and understood english with no google translate, you'd know she never said usa invested 5b in maidan revolution, she said 5 mil was given to ukraine, since orange revolution. not a word about investing in maidan revolution. so again no proof, just propaganda. Edited March 13, 2015 by aztek Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
aztek Posted March 13, 2015 #184 Share Posted March 13, 2015 How do you need to do to Putin? that is a stupid picture, ukraine is a SEPARATE, SOVERGIEN country, not a child or smaller brother of russia. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
sleplen Posted March 13, 2015 #185 Share Posted March 13, 2015 They live in the light of the three brothers, three sons and Slav Mother native land. And the name of the brothers Russian, Ukrainian and Belarusian. From time immemorial they have lived a single family, every one of them had his apartment in his father's house, which peacefully lived with his wife and raise their children. They lived not grieve until the window to Europe is not hacked. Welcome to the door. And then the window. Yes, in addition unframed. In a window blowing, blowing the dirtiest! Yes, and climb through the window to Europe is very inconvenient. Well, okay, not the point. The fact that it got into the habit through the window to whisper in the ears of all the brothers. Russian whispered that he is a senior and is entitled to all the house of his father, he did not just Russian, Great Russians that his brothers were plotting against him is something that the Swedes, then the Poles. That the brothers de his Ukrainian with Belarusians claim to be part of his apartment. And his brother Ukrainian - a cunning and greedy, that actually call him that covets Crest and Crest on his savings. And that this is the crest gave him insulting nicknames: Moskal and Katsap! A brother Belarusian - lazy and generally foster child, father acquired it, whether with a beautiful Poland, then, whether the timber beauty Lithuania. And that actually call him Bulbash. And the dreams that lazy Bulbash, live at the expense of the brothers. Ukrainian whispered that he was not Ukrainian, and Great Ukr, but in addition he - European, and Russian - he did not brother and their mother begot him from the Mongols! And that Russian wants to deprive him of his apartment and secretly cohabiting with his Zhinkov! And it calls for the eyes - Crest! profit for adults and smart. Jul. 28th, 2014 at 9:33 PM They live in the light of the three brothers, three sons words and Mother native land. And the name of the brothers Russian, Ukrainian and Belarusian. From time immemorial they have lived a single family, every one of them had his apartment in his father's house, which peacefully lived with his wife and raise their children. They lived not grieve until the window to Europe is not hacked. Welcome to the door. And then the window. Yes, in addition unframed. In a window blowing, blowing the dirtiest! Yes, and climb through the window to Europe is very inconvenient. Well, okay, not the point. The fact that it got into the habit through the window to whisper in the ears of all the brothers. Russian whispered that he is a senior and is entitled to all the house of his father, he did not just Russian, Great Russians that his brothers were plotting against him is something that the Swedes, then the Poles. That the brothers de his Ukrainian with Belarusians claim to be part of his apartment. And his brother Ukrainian - a cunning and greedy, that actually call him that covets Crest and Crest on his savings. And that this is the crest gave him insulting nicknames: Moskal and Katsap! A brother Belarusian - lazy and generally foster child, father acquired it, whether with a beautiful Poland, then, whether the timber beauty Lithuania. And that actually call him Bulbash. And the dreams that lazy Bulbash, live at the expense of the brothers. Ukrainian whispered that he was not Ukrainian, and Great Ukr, but in addition he - European, and Russian - he did not brother and their mother begot him from the Mongols! And that Russian wants to deprive him of his apartment and secretly cohabiting with his Zhinkov! And it calls for the eyes - Crest! Belarusians sang in his ears that he, too, and brother to his brothers, and that he was the fruit of love Slavs and other women. And the brothers consider him stupid and lazy, and call each other Bulbash. Brothers, at first, fended off-whisperers navetnikov. Getting even beat them, individually and collectively. But detractors vile themselves had views on the house brothers, abundant and rich, and complaining his dastardly deed. Began to pit and seduce their wives. Russian sang in his ears that his wife, a beautiful woman when he was at work, then at war, otimeli sons of Mongol - Tatars. And that part of his children - not at all. Ukrainian drummed into his head that while he understood the Poles, but with the Turks, he gave Zhinkov Russian. So that part of your children's children Moskal is rotten! And he wants Moskal all your fat away and Zhinkov your wishes continue to use! Belarusians have inspired the brothers that it is not needed and that they believe that his wife, from the Jews, Lithuanians, then the Poles lives. Long held brothers, at first, did not believe the gossip, slander yes. But, "water wears away the stone and". Believed harbored resentment fierce at each other. Steel oblique glances at each other, but on their wives. Sometimes went into the yard fight. Fought hard. But fought mostly Russian and Ukrainians. Belarusian - usually stood on the sidelines and watched the brothers. But did not intervene. Neighbors Chechen, Dagestani, Abkhazia, Adygea Kabardian, Cherkess, Tatar and others, watching all this mess, just shook their heads and wondered: What are these brothers suddenly began to fight and to share something! The brothers - Know yourself, each other ohazhivayut "under mikitki", as many across Eurasia lumps fly, but in America and Europe even fly! To be sure, slanderers-foe, decided to weaken the strongest of the brothers, Russian. Told him that their neighbor, Chechen, knife sharpening it. Slaughter intended it. Russian decided to figure it out and sent to the eldest sons of the Chechens, go, they say, and ask Uncle The Chechen - he sharpens knife at me. A Chechen who really sharpened dagger. But not for the fact that to kill a Russian, but for what would be a sheep to slaughter, cook barbecue, but fellow neighbors - the Russian, Ukrainians and Belarusians to his call, to treat and house its new show. And the Chechens, he ran "for a minute," whispered that are supposedly Russian sons, your house ruin. Chechen surprised, took a dagger and went to the door. Russian sons came, look, really - Uncle Chechen dagger in hand is worth it! Young and stupid were the sons of Russian! They attacked with fists on the Chechens ... beat sons Chechens. But Chechen - was a seasoned warrior. Half came sons - at once stabbed. A friend said: "go out of my house, and my father tell - let go down to talk about!". Came to the Russian Chechens. Found everything as it was. Sorry. Compensated for the loss of the Chechens. Zamira Russian Chechens and decided: slanderers no longer believe, and to dealing only with each other! After all, still they are old neighbors in Eurasia! Saw adversaries, that did not work bleed to death neighbors decided to continue to pit brother. Took up their children, but for the wives of children. A child is still quite young, not experienced, they have no more life experience sophistication! That's detractors began to stir up the water: to persuade the middle children of Ukrainians in that they de, in fact, the Europeans and the need to live completely separate from the Russian and Belarusian. Older children went Ukrainians in the yard, started jumping and shouting: "hto not skochet that Moskal!" Demanded from his father - hang locks on the doors that lead to the Russian and Belarus, and western wall - generally carry! Came to them their older brothers began to convince, but to persuade, but the middle brother, pohvatali staves, stones, yes pripasёnnye Molotov cocktails and began to beat and burn their brethren. Seeing the window, what's going on in the yard of their home, younger children Ukrainians zaprerlis in his room, and decided: we must our uncle, Russian ask for help. And at their door, already bursting middle brother, shouting: "You're not brothers to us, and Muscovites klyatyh! Vatnik filthy!" Became the youngest children Ukrainets ask his uncle, Russian: "Uncle Russian! Save us! We are your consanguineous nephews! Though our detushek save me!" Break through the wall. Some of the children and wives saved. And then - burst into the room and the middle brother began to beat and kill ... Upon this ends my story. Because the end of the tale no one knows except the Lord God! Do reconciled brothers or devour each other, to the delight of the adversary, leaving an empty and ruined, who had once been rich and hospitable ... where once there was music, and in the evenings, sometimes, all large and friendly family gathered at one big table and ate borscht, dumplings with cherries, drinking tea with raspberry jam. Sometimes they went to visit neighbors and then ate khinkal and barbecue, drank chacha and wine, sang songs, danced. Then they drank and Karachay with echpechmakami peremyachami ... Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
aztek Posted March 13, 2015 #186 Share Posted March 13, 2015 (edited) lol, what does that suppose to mean??? it sure does not prove anything, and definatlty does not show ukraine owes anything to russia,. another worthless peice of propaganda. for the tird time, what country are you citizen of? Edited March 13, 2015 by aztek Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Thanato Posted March 13, 2015 #187 Share Posted March 13, 2015 There were protestors in Kiev. The government cracks down on protestors. Protestors protect themselves and do not break. The parliament of the Ukraine, and now this is important here sleplen, impeached the president of the Ukraine who fled to Russia. An intern government was set up and new elections held, yes democratic elections. A new president was elected. Eastern Ukraine doesn't like it and revolts, they star seizing government property and military hardware. The government of the Ukraine responded and is engaged and thus civil war. Oh let's not forget the Russian invasion of the Ukraine, which was the conquest an annexation of the Ukrainian territory Crimea. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
bmk1245 Posted March 13, 2015 #188 Share Posted March 13, 2015 C'mon, aztek, don't feed a troll... a guy/gal with zero English joins English website - thats a red flag.... Apparently, sleplen is just a Russkie fascist, trying to paint himself in white color. 3 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
sleplen Posted March 14, 2015 #189 Share Posted March 14, 2015 Aztec, read, written under your avatar, Lugansk LNR. For you, this country is not? This I am happy. Thanato,Maidan this scenario,the project,the order of the oligarchs of Ukraine with support of the United States and Europe. See the translation, readings Leonid Roytman Thanato, Russia saved the Crimea from the inevitable blood. What happens in the Donbass, should be in the Crimea. bmk1245, you probably already fed to the full, so you eat only the notes. Stop me being rude in return, will receive from me just POLITENESS. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
sleplen Posted March 14, 2015 #190 Share Posted March 14, 2015 Thanato, your logic: Kiev protested against the Yanukovych government. This well. Protestors protect themselves and do not break. Donbass did not participate in the presidential elections and protests against the illegal regime. And you say it's bad. Why is it so? Don't you think that there is no justice? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Thanato Posted March 14, 2015 #191 Share Posted March 14, 2015 Thanato, your logic: Kiev protested against the Yanukovych government. This well. Protestors protect themselves and do not break. Donbass did not participate in the presidential elections and protests against the illegal regime. And you say it's bad. Why is it so? Don't you think that there is no justice? The majority of te nation voted for the Ukrainian government. It is legal the legal and legitimate government of the Ukraine. i do find it odd how often you are on the Internet for supposedly being in what was a combat zone. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
bmk1245 Posted March 14, 2015 #192 Share Posted March 14, 2015 2 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
stevewinn Posted March 14, 2015 #193 Share Posted March 14, 2015 (edited) There were protestors in Kiev. The government cracks down on protestors. Protestors protect themselves and do not break. The parliament of the Ukraine, and now this is important here sleplen, impeached the president of the Ukraine who fled to Russia. An intern government was set up and new elections held, yes democratic elections. A new president was elected. Eastern Ukraine doesn't like it and revolts, they star seizing government property and military hardware. The government of the Ukraine responded and is engaged and thus civil war. Oh let's not forget the Russian invasion of the Ukraine, which was the conquest an annexation of the Ukrainian territory Crimea. You cannot serious believe that's what happen not after witnessing History in the making. Its not like you had to rely on a History Book. and no way can you call it Democracy by any stretch of the imagination. Always omitted was the tug of war between the EU and Russia over influence in Ukraine which had been going on for well over a decade, When it came to crunch time the same President who was the EU's best friend up until he decided to postponed the signing of EU agreement decided to shun the EU and in the process leaned instead towards Russia. - what followed was anything but democracy. The EU decided to use soft power and started to get involved in a sovereign countries affairs, they started by backing the small protests, backing a minority opposition, who lets remind ourselves was made up of an Ex-boxer (Klitchkov) a Eurovision Song contest winner (Ruslana) and a dubious politician but more importantly to the WEST he was pro-EU Mr Arseniy Yatsenyuk, (who later resigned when he didnt become president) The EU/USA decided with the democratically elected President and government still in office to undermine the serving government, by first flying in the EU's Foreign affairs commissioner one Cathy Ashton, - to walk amongst the protesters, (picture below) The the Yanks decided they had to get involved because the EU are hopeless, So the Yankee Doodles flew in none other than John "i cant lift my arms" McCain to speak at the protests, (pictured below) When things started heating up they Flew in Victoria Nunland Secretary of State for European and Eurasian Affairs. and we all know her thoughts on the EU in that leaked phone call. And all this when the Democratically elected President and Government were in office. - IT was the EU and USA WHO decided the Government needed replacing NOT the Ukrainian people and set about that process by continuing to undermine the government of the day by spending millions on supporting the opposition protests. - "peaceful protests" which when they didn't work turned violent, and now with the fullness of time Its been established the first gun shots fired came from the protesters and not the riot police as was reported at the time in the western media giving the image the Police where firing on unarmed "peaceful" protesters. Make no mistake about it, It was a coup d'etat by the EU/USA. for self interest, they didn't want Ukraine with its industrial and agricultural resources falling into Russian influence, by Ukraine joining Russia's new Union instead of the European Union. Cathy Aston Protesters. on her right is Arseniy Yatsenyuk, Who for his efforts was made Prime Minister, which he later resigned from because He was hoping for the top Presidential position. But he served his usefulness for the EU, but still he was deemed unsuitable, because of his views on homosexuality and a myriad of other views deemed unsuitable in the west. John McCain The Ousted Ukrainian President Viktor Yanukovych in Happier Times. When he was playing ball with the EU, and in turn the EU turned a blind eye to all the reported corruption because he was their man and towing the EU line. (how times change) EU President Van Rompuy and head of the commission Barroso with ousted democratically elected leader President Viktor Yanukovych Cathy Aston with her best friend President Viktor Yanukovych soon to be enemy. (Cathy Ashton EU Foreign Affairs commissioner) Edited March 14, 2015 by stevewinn Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
bmk1245 Posted March 14, 2015 #194 Share Posted March 14, 2015 [...] Make no mistake about it, It was a coup d'etat by the EU/USA. for self interest, they didn't want Ukraine with its industrial and agricultural resources falling into Russian influence, by Ukraine joining Russia's new Union instead of the European Union. [...] Make no mistake, Yanukovich promised strategic partnership with EU/US, not with Russia. That is a fact. Without that promise, he wouldn't have been elected as a president of Ukraine. Period. 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
stevewinn Posted March 14, 2015 #195 Share Posted March 14, 2015 Make no mistake, Yanukovich promised strategic partnership with EU/US, not with Russia. That is a fact. Without that promise, he wouldn't have been elected as a president of Ukraine. Period. Well do you know what happens when a leader breaks a promise you vote them out at the next election. Its called democracy but democracy never happened did it. what did happen was a coup d'etat. Okay Crimea sacrificed, Eastern Ukraine in conflict but the EU got their Association Agreement signed in the end With their man. It just shows the lengths this European Union will go to in their expansionist plans risking conventional conflict in Europe and as it turned out they did bring war and conflict to Europe the likes we thought we seen the last off. Happy faces all round. masking an Absolute Disaster. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
bmk1245 Posted March 14, 2015 #196 Share Posted March 14, 2015 [...] Well do you know what happens when a leader breaks a promise you vote them out at the next election. Its called democracy but democracy never happened did it. what did happen was a coup d'etat. [...] Nice try, stewie... (sorry, couldn't resist the urge).The main point is, Yanukovich rose to the power solely on "russian language" promises plus EU/US strategic partnership. You may engage in "coup d'etat" rhetorics, that doesn't change a thing. 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
sleplen Posted March 14, 2015 #197 Share Posted March 14, 2015 stevewinn all right, but I should have clarified. Recently, just a year ago, Ukraine and Russia were absolutely normal relations, not including disputes concerning small theft of Russian gas from the pipe. It was all the cause-noble, Yanukovych turned tail between the EU and Russia, all life was quiet and peaceful. When Europe made their demands on European integration, and Yanukovych rejected them because they were really extreme, Ukraine rose a wave of outraged supporters of the Euro-any-price. Rode from Germany Klitschko. All poper on Euromayday, and that's when it all started. Burning tires, Molotov cocktails, killed policemen (which then around and accused). Yatsenyuk/Turchynov/Klitschko kicked Yanuca and divided between Ukraine. The battle begins oligarchs that entails the emergence of many private armies and gangs. In the country where the chaos begins. Civilians in shock, but quickly bullied to silence. To scare turned out to be almost all but the activists of Donbass, which went to the principle and picked up the first stick and then firearms. Yatsenyuk/Turchinov did not like it, and they sent a detachment of militia to quell people's riot (well, not bandits Kolomoisky to pacify?). To pacify failed. Sent yet. And yet. And yet... That's how it was. It would seem, than Russia? Putin? A simple question. The first six months of the event all Russian bloggers drove a wave Putin for what he does not interfere in what is happening in Ukraine. Yet, there are our fellow Ukrainians, and Russians there, Bob, why are you silent? Vova was silent. Up until the Donetsk "separatists" 't have weapons taken from the cops and the Ukrainian military forces sent to suppress the rebellion, and until they started these weapons use the active. Then went the first convoy of humanitarian aid. It is possible and not only humanitarian, although by that time the "separatists" have learned to easily take away the weapons and equipment from lazy Ukrainian warriors. Then there was the Crimea, after which Obama turned grey. Then there was a Malaysian aircraft in the crash which immediately accused Russia. Then there was a lot of ****, which traditionally began to accuse Russia, and which has suffered specifically to accuse Russia. Russia became the scapegoat in all of this Ukrainian crap, though the cause of all this ****, and protagonists of all this ****, were and are Ukrainians. But Russia is not to blame? We all know that everywhere and in everything, who is to blame Russia. Whatever it was. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Helen of Annoy Posted March 14, 2015 #198 Share Posted March 14, 2015 Nice try, stewie... (sorry, couldn't resist the urge). The main point is, Yanukovich rose to the power solely on "russian language" promises plus EU/US strategic partnership. You may engage in "coup d'etat" rhetorics, that doesn't change a thing. It’s kind of amusing that UKIP guy supports the ideology behind people who are refusing to learn the language of the country in which they live. Russians or French or Nepalese, who cares, people are people, but I’d feel retarded if I spent my whole life in a country and didn’t learn the language. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
stevewinn Posted March 14, 2015 #199 Share Posted March 14, 2015 Nice try, stewie... (sorry, couldn't resist the urge). The main point is, Yanukovich rose to the power solely on "russian language" promises plus EU/US strategic partnership. You may engage in "coup d'etat" rhetorics, that doesn't change a thing. Nice try? Anyway - Its unbelievable events unfolded in front of people and yet it seems no one can see what happened and with time its all being jumbled up. a coup d'etat is exactly what happened and it changes everything, you may wish to gloss over the fact, But to any one who believes in Democracy and thinks the whole affair was Democratic then god help us all. It might pass as democracy in such places as Lithuania or Croatia sadly. 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Helen of Annoy Posted March 14, 2015 #200 Share Posted March 14, 2015 Nice try? Anyway - Its unbelievable events unfolded in front of people and yet it seems no one can see what happened and with time its all being jumbled up. a coup d'etat is exactly what happened and it changes everything, you may wish to gloss over the fact, But to any one who believes in Democracy and thinks the whole affair was Democratic then god help us all. It might pass as democracy in such places as Lithuania or Croatia sadly. A rant for you because you deserved it: It took him a while, but God did help us here in Croatia and we had first democratic elections in 1990. Greater Serbian chauvinists were frothing at the very idea of Croatia having elections, with Croatian *gasp* parties other than Communist party, that was above nation hypocritically. I mean, theoretically. The official reason why chetniks were frothing at elections was their fear of WWII rerun, like their Prince Pavle was not kissing Hitler’s butt while it looked like a good idea. But the real reason why Serbia was afraid of elections was that their ideologists, simple and not particularly literate as they were still knew they have no chance to keep the Serbian hegemony and quasi-communists in power with that democracy thing actually at work. I still feel funny when I’m voting, like some ghost of totalitarian quasi-commie past will jump at me and bite my pen-holding hand No, seriously, when you grow up in paranoid society, you stay that way forever. And you are forever very sensitive to the plight of the people who share the same experiences with you. We also had the independence referendum in 1991 and while I’m sure Greater Serbian chauvinists would call that a coup too, it was the decision of the majority of the Croatian citizens (Croats and the minorities) to declare Croatian independence and dissolution of association with Yugoslavia, now very much former failure of a state. It was like mini USSR, complete with mini gulags and mini Stalin, our beloved leader, the greatest son of our nations and minorities. Yep, you were supposed to say that hilarious phrase with straight face. So we had the elections and the referendum, so the death of Yugoslavia became official, so the most equal of ex-Yu nations applied scorched land strategy against us, in their chauvinist frenzy. They would repeat it, if only they could. The intensity of Greater Serbian insanity provoked by the recent Russian bout of imperialism is astonishing. They truly believe Putin will give them their importance back, along with South Stream, formerly occupied territories and whatnot. Fortunately, their childish fervour is also hilarious, but it’s also quite creepy to have something like that in the neighbourhood. In short for everyone else: And what is not democratic (demos, the people + kratia, rule) in elections held after the president has abandoned his office and duty? That’s what Janukovich did. Fled to Russia with millions in cash. Why? Because he got scared of the People who were not willing to put up with his crap (in the golden toilet while the nation is near starving) anymore. You don’t need a coup when the president and/or government screws up that hard. While you can’t have a coup – at least not with lasting effect – if the People are satisfied (or at least not repulsed) with the president’s and/or governments work. I don’t mind sane theories, convincing conspiracies included, but I do mind when they’re underestimating Eastern European intelligence. We might be stupid, but not that stupid. We can tell what evil is the lesser one. And that’s exactly how this fight started... 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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