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Davros of Skaro

Y'all Just Want To Sin

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Paranoid Android

Sometimes you need visual imagery to convey a point better than words.

I'm not a visual learner :tu:

I've always felt that in christianity nothing you every did was good enough.

To one extent that is true, there is nothing we personally can do. In another extent, choosing life is always a choice. Depends what your choice is, I suppose.
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Rafterman

Have you ever received the circular logic from a Theist that you just want to be held unaccountable for your actions or that you do not want to submit to a higher authority?

I have but they are dodging the burden of proof that they are not under a delusion.I do my best not to harm others, help others when I can and I do not need a relationship with something that's imaginary for that.

I enjoyed the vid and I hope you do too.

Atheist Debate commentary with Matt Dilahunty "Yall Just Want To Sin".

I too find it humorous as they often try to come from the perspective that christians don't sin. After the guy killed those three muslim students in North Carolina recently and it was reported that he was an atheist, I recall seeing a lot of commentary along the lines of "well what do you expect, he's an atheist". Right, because christians have never killed anyone.

Want to really watch their heads explode? Throw the argument at them that "doing good" is an evolutionary development of humans to ensure longer and healthier lives.

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Galahad

" longevity has its place" Martin Luther King.. A man who put himself in harms way because " I just want to do Gods will"

He was serving a higher purpose than himself that brought great reform.

Reference: " I have been to the mountain top" speech.

He was killed the following day.

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joc

On the other hand, if a person is doing what they do just because they're both hoping to avoid punishment and they are kingdom seeking...does that really make them morally superior? Wouldn't it be more spiritually advanced to do things for others just because you care...and not because you're trying to impress some invisible being you aren't certain exists?

Hmmm...reminds me of something Jesus said....

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joc

Joc, love you man!

What we have is spiritual salvation. I would suggest a quick review of New Covenant, ( even on wiki) sin and judgement are stalled until the final judgment..we operate on credit, payed for by Jesus, but we continue to borrow..until the end of the earth or age. ( the sinful earth ends...it's not the actual end of the earth!, The age length is questionable) .the original sin from the fall is still there, becoming a christian and being reborn does not wipe your slate of the original sin. Even Saint Paul strugled with it " I see another law in my members..." That's the original sin.

Well...I'm glad you love me man...but you may not love me as much after this post.... ;)

You don't have to be 'reborn'. You don't have to be a Christian. Because of Adam...every man became a sinner. No club to join there...it is your right by birth. You are a sinner. Because of Jesus...you are forgiven...you don't have to believe it...you don't have to ask for it...you don't have to join a club. It is your birth right! That...my friends...is the good news...that...is the Gospel. No hoops to jump through. Nada

We still have evil in our hearts...the only difference is...God forgave us for it. Because one man Jesus...made the choice Adam couldn't make. One man got us into this. One man got us out of it. It doesn't matter what you believe...what you do...what you don't do. The original sin of Adam was forgiven on the Cross. That's it. All the rest of it is just religion.

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Imaginarynumber1

I too find it humorous as they often try to come from the perspective that christians don't sin. After the guy killed those three muslim students in North Carolina recently and it was reported that he was an atheist, I recall seeing a lot of commentary along the lines of "well what do you expect, he's an atheist". Right, because christians have never killed anyone.

Want to really watch their heads explode? Throw the argument at them that "doing good" is an evolutionary development of humans to ensure longer and healthier lives.

Explaining altruism is really at the center of sociobiology. I think the kin selection hypothesis is a good explanation. Helping those with similar genes increases the inclusive fitness of said genes, ensuring their survivability. Though most people see sociobiology and its offshoots as to reductionist, the generalized nature of it may hold some truth.

Religion, at it's heart, is a social construct that exists to increase social cohesion and may mold or be molded by the society in which it is present. Ultimately, it is nothing but another symbolic representation. Good, bad, etc, is all a matter of social perspective.

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Blood_Sacrifice

Have I sinned?

Well, I don't have any gods before God, because I am an atheist, so that doesn't count as a sin right? Then again, I'm pretty sure the bible has kind of an all-or-nothing policy on disbelief, so they get you either way.

I don't worship any images, or even images representing gods or whatnot, so I am safe there.

I don't used God's name in vain. I usually have a damn good reason to use it. Even so, I find there are much cleverer and wittier ways to curse. Still, if we are using even casual, god-derived variants, like "Geez", or Maya Angelou's "by the way,", then yeah, guilty as well.

I regularly work on Sundays, whether at home or work-work.

I'm pretty law abiding (except taxes) and I respect my mom and dad, so good there.

Haven't murdered yet.

No adultery (to the best of my knowledge), unless you include porn, in which case we ain't going to Hell, we are in Hell.

Not sure about the stealing (unless you count taxes). I can say I have never taken anything I didn't fell I had earned through my labor.

False witness? Nope. Nothing particularly moral about it. I'm just a really bad liar.

Covet? Hell, yes.

I don't know. Seems like I'm just living life between making myself happy and making the people around me happy. Whether what I do is a sin or not doesn't really feel like a very significant detail.

May I know why a person with such a high moral integrity like yourself will evade taxes? Unbelievable and dissapointing.

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LostSouls7

according to Christian religion I am going to hell

and would've been burned at the stake many times in history.

Then again I don't hurt anyone... I live my life peacefully magically and blissfully

I'm more of a drunk hippie. I love the butterflies flying and the birds singing.. and cats playing in my yard..

even if they do eat my veggies... ahh the tomatoes... those I do love! I am getting hungry

ON ward to the magical garden!!! embrace nature...

embrace the day.... forget about hell...

create your heaven on earth..and enjoy

and that's all I have to say about that :yes:

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Podo

I think the question only makes sense when being asked by a Christian, Jew, Muslim, or any other monotheistic religion. I am not an atheist because I want to be free from sin, because that implies that I acknowledge sin as a thing, which I resoundingly do not. So, if sin isn't real, then the question breaks down into meaninglessness as there is no sin to be unaccountable for.

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Grandpa Greenman

Homosexuality=sin

Slavery=not sin

Killing=sin

Killing your disobedient child=not sin

Working on the sabbath=sin

Laying waste to an ecosystem=not sin.

Judging others=sin

Judging non christians= not sin

Shall I go on?

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Podo

Homosexuality=sin

Slavery=not sin

Killing=sin

Killing your disobedient child=not sin

Working on the sabbath=sin

Laying waste to an ecosystem=not sin.

Judging others=sin

Judging non christians= not sin

Shall I go on?

Religion being contradictory and having horrible, horrible standards? Never!

:tu:

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GoldenWolf

Homosexuality=sin

Slavery=not sin

Killing=sin

Killing your disobedient child=not sin

Working on the sabbath=sin

Laying waste to an ecosystem=not sin.

Judging others=sin

Judging non christians= not sin

Shall I go on?

Millions labeled as the anti-christ, bearing false witness= not sin

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aquatus1

May I know why a person with such a high moral integrity like yourself will evade taxes? Unbelievable and dissapointing.

Couple of reasons. The major one is that I have a really hard time with numbers and generally avoid them at all costs. The second is that I really don't like paperwork, and figuring out who I owe which nickel annoys me to no end.

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Grandpa Greenman

May I know why a person with such a high moral integrity like yourself will evade taxes? Unbelievable and dissapointing.

I don't think not paying your tax is listed as an actual sin, is it? If it is there is going to be a lot of Right Wing Christians that are going to be in big trouble.

Edited by GreenmansGod
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aquatus1

I'm pretty sure the bible directly commands you to submit yourself to your government. Don't know if that counts as a sin, but then, in my experience, a sin can be translated into pretty much anything that any bible-follower disapproves of. Actual biblical justification is kind of secondary.

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XenoFish

So. Religion is basically just another form of slavery. Though willful in most cases.

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psyche101

So. Religion is basically just another form of slavery. Though willful in most cases.

:D

Edited by psyche101
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SophiaStar

according to Christian religion I am going to hell

and would've been burned at the stake many times in history.

Then again I don't hurt anyone... I live my life peacefully magically and blissfully

I'm more of a drunk hippie. I love the butterflies flying and the birds singing.. and cats playing in my yard..

even if they do eat my veggies... ahh the tomatoes... those I do love! I am getting hungry

ON ward to the magical garden!!! embrace nature...

embrace the day.... forget about hell...

create your heaven on earth..and enjoy

and that's all I have to say about that :yes:

Sounds good to me. Why not create your own ways,

where you can actually have some influence on your own.

Grow something..

To me that is kind of only spiritualism there is.

One thing we can be sure is that we are under natural laws and these have affect upon us.

Man might really benefit the form of spirituality that respects the nature and it cycles.

There are great allegories in seasonal changing :)

Edited by SophiaStar

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SophiaStar

I have problem with this topic.

It seems that I have zero interest in sin :D

I don’t believe the whole concept.

Christian movement has shaped our culture over 2000 years and is going to do so for a long time after we’re finished.

Currently most of the western people are considered lucky because they can decide their own behalf what to think and how to think.

Some, of course will want to define others the correct way.

Such people will always be there.

These are the people of ’’one book’’

They are the ones that will burn all the other books just to make their point clear.

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Border Collie

If I have "sinned", by which I mean have done wrong to people, then I strive to forgive myself and hope to achieve forgiveness from others.

The concept of "sinning" against omnipresent, all-knowing, all-powerful (etc) being is so ridiculous I don't worry about it.

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Rafterman

If I have "sinned", by which I mean have done wrong to people, then I strive to forgive myself and hope to achieve forgiveness from others.

The concept of "sinning" against omnipresent, all-knowing, all-powerful (etc) being is so ridiculous I don't worry about it.

A being that knew you were going to commit that sin 100 billion years before you were even born.

Edited by Rafterman
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Imaginarynumber1

A being that knew you were going to commit that sin 100 billion years before you were even born.

It really just gets dumber and dumber the more you think about it.

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Davros of Skaro

What is this "circular logic" may I ask? I wasn't able to view the video, sorry if it's explained there.

One thing though, if you presume God is real you would submit to a higher authority, conversely if you presume there's no God there is no higher authority to submit to. Not saying that you're wrong, but hypothetically, what if you are and you're not submitting? Or, conversely, what if you're right and submitting? Which is the most destructive?

If God is real and you do not submit, I suppose you only hurt yourself. Whereas there's an argument that if God is/isn't real and you do submit you will try and submit others though what, wars? Therefore, the latter is the most destructive? What do you think?

Edited to protect the circus freaks.

Circular logic from my memory of watching the video was not mentioned but it's my observation.The circular logic is that the Theist sees the Bible as evidence and sees the Atheist as accepting the evidence but ignoring it which is ridiculous.

Show actual evidence of a God, then we will talk.

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Davros of Skaro

I too find it humorous as they often try to come from the perspective that christians don't sin. After the guy killed those three muslim students in North Carolina recently and it was reported that he was an atheist, I recall seeing a lot of commentary along the lines of "well what do you expect, he's an atheist". Right, because christians have never killed anyone.

Want to really watch their heads explode? Throw the argument at them that "doing good" is an evolutionary development of humans to ensure longer and healthier lives.

Spot on RM.

Take an Egg and put it in front of a Chicken.The Chicken will not harm it.Now break the Egg and the Chicken will feast on it.We would not be here today if everyone were total homocidal maniacs in the past.

Some people need to read "Evolution For Dummies".

You should hear the A** backwards things the Duck Dynasty dude said in a speach recently that I will not repeat here.

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Rafterman

Spot on RM.

Take an Egg and put it in front of a Chicken.The Chicken will not harm it.Now break the Egg and the Chicken will feast on it.We would not be here today if everyone were total homocidal maniacs in the past.

Some people need to read "Evolution For Dummies".

You should hear the A** backwards things the Duck Dynasty dude said in a speach recently that I will not repeat here.

Yeah, he's the PERFECT spokesman for that crowd. Sadly, I think in 50 years we're just going to be a country of humanists and people like him.

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