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CIA ends secretive climate research project


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The CIA has pulled the plug on a project designed to investigate climate-related security threats.

The program, which was known as Medea ( Measurement of Earth Data for Environmental Analysis ), was launched back in 1992 under the George H. W. Bush administration.

Read More: http://www.unexplained-mysteries.com/news/281848/cia-ends-secretive-climate-research-project

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Soooo.... the CIA have seen all the evidence, spoken to all the experts (after all, they have access to everybody ), and have realised that the whole thing is a hoax, and there is no danger to America.

Or... they are so frightened with what they have found that the project has been converted into a "black" operation in order to restrict access to their conclusions.

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Guest Br Cornelius

More likely that the CIA have decided they now understand the threat and have made their plans to deal with it. Their objectives are not the same as the scientific community and they have a limited brief to study national threat. Once you understand the threat well enough there is no real need to spend your budget further.

I find it strange that you would jump to the conclusion that this would naturally be because its a hoax - I suppose you are preloaded to jump that way.

Br Cornelius

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why does it have to be kept "secretive" ? i suppose we can't know any findings of the research? The truth is always just too dangerous to be public knowledge?

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Guest Br Cornelius

The original article from which this was culled, which places a rather different emphasis on the story:

Still, it's possible Medea had outlived its useful life, said Rolf Mowatt-Larssen, a 23-year veteran of the CIA who had first-hand knowledge of the program before leaving the agency in 2009. He said he was not surprised to see Medea close down.

"In my judgment, the CIA is not the best lead agency for the issue; the agency's 'in-box' is already overflowing with today's threats and challenges," he said via email. "CIA has little strategic planning reserves, relatively speaking, and its overseas presence is heavily action-oriented."

http://www.motherjones.com/environment/2015/05/cia-closing-its-main-climate-research-program

Br Cornelius

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why does it have to be kept "secretive" ? i suppose we can't know any findings of the research? The truth is always just too dangerous to be public knowledge?

But the very fact that we can actually talk about the project shows that it was not secret. If it had been secret we wouldn't even have known about it !

Giving scientist access to new data is a good thing, isn't it ?

The information that the CIA shared with civilian scientists was used to make the reports that shows us that climate change is a danger. Those reports are public knowledge.

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Thats super weird considering that the Central Intelligence Is primarily made up of analyst's and operative's. Who basically translates information and decides whether or not it's important.

I wonder what everyone was thinking when they sent highly trained bilingual agents into a frozen wasteland to collect core samples. Wait they didnt, then why was the CIA involved?

I doubt the CIA had any important research to conclude the hypothesis in any way. A civilian watching a satellite take pictures of the north pole sounds familiar... Oh yeah, Google earth.

What a joke.

Edited by MeOnlyMe
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More likely that the CIA have decided they now understand the threat and have made their plans to deal with it. Their objectives are not the same as the scientific community and they have a limited brief to study national threat. Once you understand the threat well enough there is no real need to spend your budget further.

I find it strange that you would jump to the conclusion that this would naturally be because its a hoax - I suppose you are preloaded to jump that way.

Br Cornelius

Oh do chill out Br..... I was making a joke about the Scarey Intelligence Agency.

Still, you posted an interesting quote. "action oriented" huh ?

Edited by RoofGardener
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I doubt the CIA had any important research to conclude the hypothesis in any way. A civilian watching a satellite take pictures of the north pole sounds familiar... Oh yeah, Google earth.

What a joke.

Did google earth exist in 1992 when the programme started ?

Does google earth provide information on things like temperatures, wind speed, humidity etc. ?

Are all images on google earth updated so you can track changing weather patterns ?

Hint: The answers are no, no and no !

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Guest Br Cornelius

Thats super weird considering that the Central Intelligence Is primarily made up of analyst's and operative's. Who basically translates information and decides whether or not it's important.

I wonder what everyone was thinking when they sent highly trained bilingual agents into a frozen wasteland to collect core samples. Wait they didnt, then why was the CIA involved?

I doubt the CIA had any important research to conclude the hypothesis in any way. A civilian watching a satellite take pictures of the north pole sounds familiar... Oh yeah, Google earth.

What a joke.

Almost all of the data was collected incidentally to other intelligence gathering operations and military operations. the CIA decided which bits were appropriate to release for secondary purposes (climate research) and which were not. Take for example the data obtained by Arctic subs on sea ice depth - its primary purpose was to ensure that in case of war the subs knew where to surface to fire their missile - but this data was of equal importance to climate researchers who need to know the thickness of the ice sheet.

There is nothing mysterious in the CIA having this data - it was just joined up thinking to use it for climate research as well as security.

Br Cornelius

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Guest Br Cornelius

Oh do chill out Br..... I was making a joke about the Scarey Intelligence Agency.

Still, you posted an interesting quote. "action oriented" huh ?

Here's a hint Roofy, humour doesn't carry well through text until you flag it as such. Going on your past form I didn't read any humour at all :tu:

Br Cornelius

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Perhaps I should use a different colour for the humerous bits ?

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Perhaps I should use a different colour for the humerous bits ?

Just a little smiley will do. :innocent:

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Did google earth exist in 1992 when the programme started ?

Does google earth provide information on things like temperatures, wind speed, humidity etc. ?

Are all images on google earth updated so you can track changing weather patterns ?

Hint: The answers are no, no and no !

Did you just fact check my satire? It was a joke dude, it wasn't meant to empirically accurate. Wind speed, temperature and humidity wouldnt really conclude any amount of research without years worth of data. And a whole spectrum of attributes come into play, its not so black and white, global warming is extremely complicated.

Almost all of the data was collected incidentally to other intelligence gathering operations and military operations. the CIA decided which bits were appropriate to release for secondary purposes (climate research) and which were not. Take for example the data obtained by Arctic subs on sea ice depth - its primary purpose was to ensure that in case of war the subs knew where to surface to fire their missile - but this data was of equal importance to climate researchers who need to know the thickness of the ice sheet.

There is nothing mysterious in the CIA having this data - it was just joined up thinking to use it for climate research as well as security.

Br Cornelius

That makes a little more sense, the CIA sorting out the information and sending it to the right agencies.

I still dont like the idea of assigning environment and global warming to a bunch of desk analysts at the firm. The article was pretty inconclusive so I cant say that it was a waste of money, but it sure looks that way; the only thing I got out of that was that; was like mentioned before, a highly trained civilian watching a satellite take pictures.

My point is, shouldn't the CIA be out recruiting spies or fighting terrorism and rival agencies? Leave the global warming thing to like.. The EPA?

Edited by MeOnlyMe
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Guest Br Cornelius

Did you just fact check my satire? It was a joke dude, it wasn't meant to empirically accurate. Wind speed, temperature and humidity wouldnt really conclude any amount of research without years worth of data. And a whole spectrum of attributes come into play, its not so black and white, global warming is extremely complicated.

That makes a little more sense, the CIA sorting out the information and sending it to the right agencies.

I still dont like the idea of assigning environment and global warming to a bunch of desk analysts at the firm. The article was pretty inconclusive so I cant say that it was a waste of money, but it sure looks that way; the only thing I got out of that was that; was like mentioned before, a highly trained civilian watching a satellite take pictures.

My point is, shouldn't the CIA be out recruiting spies or fighting terrorism and rival agencies? Leave the global warming thing to like.. The EPA?

Obviously the CIA agree with you since they have closed the division down.

Br Cornelius

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This is why it was done by the CIA.

From the OP article.

It was re-launched under the Obama administration in 2010, with the aim of providing security clearances to roughly 60 climate scientists. Those scientists were given access to classified information that could be useful for researching global warming and tracking environmental changes that could have national security implications. Data gathered by the military and intelligence agencies is often of much higher quality than what civilian scientists normally work with.

http://www.motherjones.com/environment/2015/05/cia-closing-its-main-climate-research-program

If they know something that should tell us. They may not though since it was republicans that wanted this stopped, insisted on it. See the article.

I do agree climate change is a threat to national security. Water and food wars anyone.

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The science is out there in the open - published so that anyone who wants to read it can do so. So why is a secret agency involved?

In defense terms: the Mediterranean has been in a drought for over a decade. This causes small-time farms to fail. The farmers move to the cities where they expect their governments to help them. But the governments don't (or can't). In frustration the displaced farmers turn to people like ISIS.

So climate change is a defense issue.

Doug

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Did you just fact check my satire? It was a joke dude, it wasn't meant to empirically accurate. Wind speed, temperature and humidity wouldnt really conclude any amount of research without years worth of data. And a whole spectrum of attributes come into play, its not so black and white, global warming is extremely complicated.

Thats why people should use smileys when they are joking or are being sarcastic. See post #13 please.

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Maybe they created the research project simply for the acronym. Whatever they funded was nothing more than a toll booth somewhere in the Ohio State park that nobody ever drove through. To pass the inspection checks they bought manuscripts from the local weather newsman and highlighted random quotes with a lime green highlighter pen. They found if they flashed the folder fast enough and used 10 scientific sounding words they'd get a free bloated paycheck year in and year out. The project ended when someone actually looked into the project a little deeper. That's what I think what happened.

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Well they found out the obvious, climate is changing, weather will change for certain parts of the world, as Antartica once had a tropical atmosphere, yet is an ice cube.

Project is draining budget for perhaps useless data for such agency. Lots of reasonable arguments to why is it being shut down.

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Guest Br Cornelius

Antarctic was semitropical at a very distant point in time and it became an ice cube because of continental drift. It is a complete red herring in a discussion of current climate change since continental drift is not a factor and wont be for hundreds of thousands of years.

Also the data that this department accumulated will still be collected, but unless there has been official channels established for passing it to climate scientists without the CIA's involvement, it will simply not reach the people who could usefully use it in climate research. It may very well be a false economy to shut this department down and there seems to be a GOP anti-science hand in this outcome.

Br Cornelius

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Antarctic was semitropical at a very distant point in time and it became an ice cube because of continental drift. It is a complete red herring in a discussion of current climate change since continental drift is not a factor and wont be for hundreds of thousands of years.

Also the data that this department accumulated will still be collected, but unless there has been official channels established for passing it to climate scientists without the CIA's involvement, it will simply not reach the people who could usefully use it in climate research. It may very well be a false economy to shut this department down and there seems to be a GOP anti-science hand in this outcome.

Br Cornelius

Or maybe it's just another $600 hammer.

Doug

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Guest Br Cornelius

Or maybe it's just another $600 hammer.

Doug

I don't intrinsically trust much that the CIA does (since their primary function seems to be to kill people), but I will give them the benefit of the doubt on this one.

Br Cornelius

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Antarctic was semitropical at a very distant point in time and it became an ice cube because of continental drift. It is a complete red herring in a discussion of current climate change since continental drift is not a factor and wont be for hundreds of thousands of years.

Also the data that this department accumulated will still be collected, but unless there has been official channels established for passing it to climate scientists without the CIA's involvement, it will simply not reach the people who could usefully use it in climate research. It may very well be a false economy to shut this department down and there seems to be a GOP anti-science hand in this outcome.

Br Cornelius

Yes I do hope that they open channels to make any useful data they have available to those who need it since the project isn't a secret any longer. It would be a shame if it all got circular filed.

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Saying the primary function of the CIA is to kill people might be doing the Central Intelligence Service a slight disservice.

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