Oera Linda Book and the Great Flood [Part 3]

[flashman7870]

It's been a couple of years, so it's time for me to do my re-reading of every last page of this drivel.

I don't believe in any of this ofc, but these threads really do turn up an incredible amount of obscure historical trivia. 

[Hanslune]

3 hours ago, flashman7870 said:

It's been a couple of years, so it's time for me to do my re-reading of every last page of this drivel.

I don't believe in any of this ofc, but these threads really do turn up an incredible amount of obscure historical trivia. 

I read a few pages but it seems a bit old, rancid and touched with a bit of intellectual lumbago. Let us know what INTERESTING obscure historical trivia you find, pls.

 

[Piney]

5 hours ago, Hanslune said:

I read a few pages but it seems a bit old, rancid and touched with a bit of intellectual lumbago. Let us know what INTERESTING obscure historical trivia you find, pls.

Probably the stuff I posted in response to the more racist and outright dopey dreck. 

[flashman7870]

On 8/8/2020 at 12:59 AM, Hanslune said:

I read a few pages but it seems a bit old, rancid and touched with a bit of intellectual lumbago. Let us know what INTERESTING obscure historical trivia you find, pls.

 

On Page 13. So far, the best stuff is Abe compiling his theory that it's all based on local toponyms. 

The Puzzler's searches through ancient mythology are always interesting, albeit used in the service of conclusion I find dubious, namely that all Greek myths are actually Celtic. 

Edited August 9, 2020 by flashman7870

[Piney]

4 minutes ago, flashman7870 said:

The Puzzler's searches through ancient mythology are always interesting, albeit used in the service of conclusion I find dubious, namely that all Greek myths are actually Celtic. 

Greek and Celtic myth have a common origin in the Proto-Indo European mythology. The Greeks borrowed heavily from the Minoans though. Then the various none I.E. Peoples they conquered. 

 

[flashman7870]

3 minutes ago, Piney said:

Greek and Celtic myth have a common origin in the Proto-Indo European mythology. The Greeks borrowed heavily from the Minoans though. Then the various none I.E. Peoples they conquered. 

I'm well aware. Puzz was just always fixated on the notion that all ancient greek myths were actually retellings of Celtic/Northern European stories that made their way down to Greece via the Amber Road. Lot of focus on Phaeton, that perennial favorite of fringe history. 

 

Here's a thought: in the chronology of the OLB, what is going on circa 1200-1100 during the Bronze Age Collapse?

[Piney]

26 minutes ago, flashman7870 said:

Here's a thought: in the chronology of the OLB, what is going on circa 1200-1100 during the Bronze Age Collapse?

That's a huge question isn't it?  

 

[Hanslune]

7 hours ago, flashman7870 said:

On Page 13. So far, the best stuff is Abe compiling his theory that it's all based on local toponyms. 

The Puzzler's searches through ancient mythology are always interesting, albeit used in the service of conclusion I find dubious, namely that all Greek myths are actually Celtic. 

On 10/24/2015 at 9:56 AM, The Puzzler said:

In the 19th century, writers such as Charles Dickens, Thomas Hardy and William Barnes advocated linguistic purism and tried to introduce words like birdlore for ornithology and bendsome for flexible. A notable supporter in the 20th century was George Orwell, who advocated what he saw as plain Saxon words over complex Latin or Greek ones, and the idea continues to have advocates today.

A noted advocate of English linguistic purism was 19th-century English writer, poet, minister, and philologist William Barnes, who sought to make scholarly English easier to understand without a classical education. Barnes lamented the "needless inbringing" of foreign words; instead using native words from his own dialect and coining new ones based on Old English roots. These included speechcraft for grammar, birdlore for ornithology, fore-elders for ancestors and bendsome for flexible.

https://en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/Linguistic_purism_in_English

Ah, yes this was interesting. I pride myself on having a good understanding of what was going on in England in the 1830-40 for my hobby and yet somehow I had missed Purism...so that counts as something interested Flashman - well done/

[Abramelin]

On 8/10/2020 at 12:10 AM, Piney said:

That's a huge question isn't it?  

 

It sure is. The only thing the OLB mentions is the visit of Ulysses.  Of the turmoil in Europe around 1200 bce not a word is mentioned in the OLB. No surprise, of course, because that became known more than a century after the OLB was published by Ottema.

Edited August 12, 2020 by Abramelin

[Piney]

22 minutes ago, Abramelin said:

It sure is. The only thing the OLB mentions is the visit of Ulysses.  Of the turmoil in Europe around 1200 bce not a word is mentioned in the OLB. No surprise, of course, because that became known more than a century after the OLB was published by Ottema.

The BIGGEST question is why didn't the Frisii have advanced agriculture, organic technology or advanced building skills?  

Maybe aliens only wanted to give it to us brown people? 

[Abramelin]

They built 'terps'. Does that count for advanced? But the Frisii, along with their buddies, the Chauci, raided the coasts of Atlantic Europe. They were Vikings before the real Vikings. It is said that the Skandinavian Vikings learned the art from these Frisii and Chauci.

But not a word about that in the OLB.

[Abramelin]

I have said it before, and I say it again: based on what I found about the Frisii, and their succesors, the Frisians (who were not related to the Frisii, but just adopted their tribal  name because it sounded cool), I could write a bestseller.

[Abramelin]

Another thing: like I said before, my only access to the internet is my smartphone. Meaning: I have no idea how to add likes to posts I like. And.. through the years I have collected a lot of info concerning the Frisii, and  the language they may have used. There are many clues they may have spoken Celtic, or something  between Germanic and Celtic, and some think they spoke a non-Indo-European language. But the language used in the OLB is 19th century Dutch with a Frisian flavor.

[Abramelin]

I do wonder about where the socalled 'regulars' are hanging out now. I know of one posting on the Stormfront site,  but that was years ago.  Normally one of them would have responded to my posts.

Have they been  banned?

 

[Piney]

8 hours ago, Abramelin said:

I have said it before, and I say it again: based on what I found about the Frisii, and their succesors, the Frisians (who were not related to the Frisii, but just adopted their tribal  name because it sounded cool), I could write a bestseller.

The originally ones were totally wiped out by the Romans. They found some of the slaughter sites.

The current Frisians are Saxons. 

[Piney]

8 hours ago, Abramelin said:

Another thing: like I said before, my only access to the internet is my smartphone. Meaning: I have no idea how to add likes to posts I like. And.. through the years I have collected a lot of info concerning the Frisii, and  the language they may have used. There are many clues they may have spoken Celtic, or something  between Germanic and Celtic, and some think they spoke a non-Indo-European language. But the language used in the OLB is 19th century Dutch with a Frisian flavor.

I think they were a German-Celtic blend. 

[Piney]

9 hours ago, Abramelin said:

They built 'terps'. Does that count for advanced? But the Frisii, along with their buddies, the Chauci, raided the coasts of Atlantic Europe. They were Vikings before the real Vikings. It is said that the Skandinavian Vikings learned the art from these Frisii and Chauci.

The Balts, Finns and Estonians were also pre-Viking Vikings.

[Abramelin]

1 hour ago, Piney said:

The originally ones were totally wiped out by the Romans. They found some of the slaughter sites.

The current Frisians are Saxons. 

No, the Frisii were not wiped out by the Romans, at some point they even served in the Roman army. And two of their leaders (one of them was called Malorix) were even invited by the Roman senate.

Closely related tribes like the Chauci and the Menapi settled in Ireland, and there is a good chance the Frisii did too.

[Piney]

12 minutes ago, Abramelin said:

Closely related tribes like the Chauci and the Menapi settled in Ireland, and there is a good chance the Frisii did too.

The Chauci were probably soaked up by the Saxons. 

[jaylemurph]

15 minutes ago, Abramelin said:

No, the Frisii were not wiped out by the Romans, at some point they even served in the Roman army. And two of their leaders (one of them was called Malorix) were even invited by the Roman senate.

Closely related tribes like the Chauci and the Menapi settled in Ireland, and there is a good chance the Frisii did too.

You know, I swore off posting in this thread more than a decade ago, it seems, because it generated tons of pure bull**** and the other people posting in it were immune to basic common sense and allergic to actual learning. 

On what evidence, exactly, are you claiming the Menapii — who refused to leave their homeland to the point of protracted violence with Julius Caesar — went to Ireland? Indeed, you even cite them as still a part of the Empire in the third century CE.

I mean, there was a similarly named tribe in Ireland, but there’s no single shred of evidence connecting them and the Romans were notorious for not bothering to parse details of different cultures. I can even point to the Amoric and Adrianic tribes of the Venetii who have the same name but no formal connection; English speakers do the same with Spanish and Georgian Iberia. 

—Jaylemurph

[Abramelin]

Well, evidence... I was thinking of what Ammianus Marcellinus mentioned about where the Gauls came from. He had learned from druids that part of the Gauls came from islands north of the Rhine. And that they had fled because of the many floods. I assume they may also have ended up in Ireland. And, long before Caesar's time.

[jaylemurph]

So your source for a pre-Caesar time period speculation is from someone writing four hundred years later, and involves substituting unknown, purely theoretical events that might have happened 1,000 miles away for actual, known islands in the Rhine?

Let’s look at what Ammanius himself said (emphases mine):

Some asserted that the people first seen in these regions were indigenous [...] Others stated that the Dorians, following the earlier Hercules, settled in the lands bordering on the Ocean. The druids say that a part of the people was in fact indigenous, but that others also poured in from the remote islands and the regions across the Rhine, driven from their homes by continual wars and by the inundation of the stormy sea. Some assert that after the destruction of Troy a few of those who fled from the Greeks and were scattered everywhere occupied those regions, which were then deserted.

But the inhabitants of those countries affirm this beyond all else, and I have also read it inscribed upon their monuments, that Hercules, the son of Amphytrion, hastened to destroy the cruel tyrants Geryon and Tauriscus, of whom one oppressed Spain, the other, Gaul. Having overcome them both he took to wife some high-born women and begat numerous children, who called by their own names the districts which they ruled.

But I must not discuss varying opinions, which often causes satiety. 

(Loeb Ammanius, 15.9, Rolf, trans.)

To get to your theory, you have to actively read against the text and support a position the author himself won’t confirm and goes against the claims of the people speaking for themselves. It is, in academic terms, a highly problematic reading. 

—Jaylemurph 

[Abramelin]

As far as I remember Marcellinus used Timagenes' History of the Gauls. And Timogenes lived during Caesar's time.

 

Edited August 13, 2020 by Abramelin

[jaylemurph]

How accurate can it be if its single surviving citation couldn’t even present it without qualification?

—Jaylemurph 

[Abramelin]

Some scholars think that the Urnfield culture of northern Germany and the Netherlands represents an origin for the Celts as a distinct cultural branch of the Indo-European family. This culture was preeminent in central Europe during the late Bronze Age, from ca. 1200 BC until 700 BC, itself following the Unitice and Tumulus cultures. The Urnfield period saw a dramatic increase in population in the region, probably due to innovations in technology and agricultural practices. *** The Greek historian Ephores of Cyme in Asia Minor, writing in the 4th century BC, believed that the Celts came from the islands off the mouth of the Rhine and were "driven from their homes by the frequency of wars and the violent rising of the sea".***

 

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Celts