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Michelle

Son Died By Lighting Fireworks On His Head

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F3SS

When psyche wants to ban something he sure will state his case, see gun threads, but to point use this one lone beyond stupid incident isn't helping the case.

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DieChecker

It seems that by far the most of the posters on this thread seem to be in agreement that the population as a whole should not be punished because of ONE who died by doing something completely stupid while intoxicated, yet we have ONE arguing with the lot of us because he thinks we are all wrong and he alone is right.

Umm........ we can't fix stupid my fellow members with common sense, let us move on and stop feeding into the stupidity here.....

I don't think he is being stupid, he's just pointing out that Australia has taken such things away from their people, and less people died.

I entirely agree though that the vast majority shouldn't be punished for the stupid few. But then, maybe they have a bit more of a nanny state there in Australia?

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Yamato

If they took the guns away from Australia's military less people would have died too. That doesn't make doing it right or wrong. He was insisting on a double standard, on something that doesn't work for states and people alike. Which is unfortunate since the state is made up of people.

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Astral Hillbilly

Devon Staples, 22, was killed instantly this past 4th of July weekend after he attempted to light a firework off the top of his head. Staples became the first firework-related fatality in Maine since the state first legalized fireworks back in 2012. While some may see Staples’ unfortunate accident as a nominee for the Darwin Awards, his mother, Kathleen Staples, sees it as a call for stricter laws regarding who can and cannot handle explosives.

"At least it'd be a little bit more than, 'Here you go,'" the grieving mother told the Associated Press. "That's an explosive. They didn't just hand me a license and put me in the car."

According to authorities, Staples had been drinking with some friends at a friend’s home in Calais, Maine this past Saturday night when the group went out to the back deck to light fireworks. Staples died after a reloadable firework mortar tube exploded on the top of his head. Staples’ friends and his older brother Cory Staples said they tried to dissuade him, but he ended up going through with his fateful decision.

cont...

http://www.msn.com/e...laws/ar-AAcGx67

Sure, by all means, make the use of fireworks illegal, but don't mention alcohol, parties, and young people. Totally ignore the real reason it happened and instead concentrate on the item that killed him because of the decision he made while under the influence. If the Mom blamed the real reason, alcohol, then she might be indirectly responsible. By focusing on the fireworks, she passes off that blame to something she had no hand in. I guess it's easier for her to look in the mirror by blaming the fireworks.

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psyche101

You are fibbing.

No I am not how rude Myles.

I just googled go cart and got many like you show, but also just as many for yard use.

I got one on the emntire page, and it coul;d well have been a home job, bet you found the same.

Sams Club sells them.

Just Googled Sam's Club, it's like an online liquidator, they sell whatever crap that comes their way, it's not a specialist build by that company by any means.

Maybe they are banned down under, but they are very popular here.

I do not know of them being banned, I just cannot see the point what with ATV's readily available and can be purchased just about anywhere. People here just buy what is available - ATV's.

Fireworks do not cause people to drown.

Silly to suggest stuff, who said that?

I can do that too.

Do what? Debate a point?

Pools are responsible for more deaths than fireworks. A fence does not stop most of these.

Yes a fence does stop most of them, that is why the law is in place and why it stands. Where do you get that strange idea from?

LINK - Pool safety a step towards stopping drownings

The current Australian Water Safety Strategy aims to achieve a 50 per cent reduction in child drowning by 2020 but we at Royal Life Saving have been striving to achieve a 100 per cent reduction for 15 years. To reach a zero drowning goal we need to put both simple and complex measures in place. Registering a pool and ensuring it is safe, is a simple measure.

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psyche101

I'm missing something. How is this quote germane to the discussion?

The latter applies that which your quote managed to overlook.

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psyche101

Obviously it doesn't go far enough. There are still thousands of people dying each year from it, including innocent people who die because someone else was drunk.

Indeed, then I suggest you write to your local member of congress and insist the issue be furthered and or write up a better procedure that is safer for all to evaluate. Google is trying to address that problem with driverless cars, but if you have something better in the interim, you entire community will benefit from it the the ideal is sound and achievable.

You have the floor, let's hear how to better the system.

Society has to move at the pace of it's slowest member right? You want to ban fireworks when they don't even kill 50 people per year, alcohol kills thousands.

They kill 50-200 a year and injure about 10,000 people, not only the injuries are at stake, but the medical resources that could possibly save a life instead of attending to some idiot using a firework incorrectly.

That is 509 deaths you are callously saying don't matter. Gee, lets hope it is not one of your family one day who do not matter huh? Just a statistic?

That is a disgusting outlook on the species as a whole. Are you honestly saying that 50 lives a year are no comparison to the ohh's and ahh's you get from a firework display?? That you should be allowed to pick and choose your own display and light the fuse - instead of professionals doing this at council public shows and that the people who died are worth sacrificing for the pleasure??

If you honestly feel that a life is worth the few moments of wonder whilst one watches a colourful explosion, I would seriously and honestly suggest you seek mental help.

There are rules on fireworks by the way.

Yes, in sensible places that use common sense like Australia. And Main - before 2012. Now Maine has disclaimers and some loose guidelines.

Surely you jest.

The laws don't go far enough, thousands of people are still dying because of it, obviously we should ban it completely for the greater good of society.

But it generates billions of dollars for the local economies, it employe millions of people it creates work, which is what the species needs. Why not find better lawes? Are you that small minded that you can only see two options??

Is that how you see the ban on fireworks?? Because of to do, that is incredibly stupid after all the effort I have expended to make you lot realise a ban on fireworks does not mean they go away, it means that people who are trained to use them do so. A ban would create a new industry in that state, it would introduce better safety guidelines overall for the manufacture of fireworks, and the displays would be bigger and badder than you have ever seen as professionals now have an industry to protect. They need to provide a more spectacular show as competition in industry has been introduced, you would ALL Win. The 2012 law to hand them back to the public was just a totally dumb idea.

Go read through all the post that I quoted you saying in my last post, and then please realize that you have absolutely no argument. I am using your logic in this post.

You do not seem to understand my logic, and saying I have no argument is a losers way of trying to back out of a debate that you have lost, Grow up a bit mate. If you can logically refute the points I have made, do so, if not, shut the F up and let grown ups discuss the issues. Do not pretend you can keep up with the grow ups if you cannot!! You freaking go read the entire thread, and try to bring yourself up to speed and stop being so goddam lazy and do you own work!! Read it again indeed! Get over yourself man!!

You saw that entire thing assabout, but I suspect that was your intention all along. We HAVE laws on alcohol MANY of them, and FOR A REASON, one idiot let us down, now we have to do a speed limit, - now try very hard to think for a moment and see if a glimmer shines through - this is what happened here - get it!! One idiot lets us down and highlighted the dangers with his life. That danger is now re-recognised after the initial ban was lifted and some are calling to put fireworks into the hands of trained professionals.

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Iron_Lotus

And put on firecrackers... "Warning: This is not a cigarette!"

ExplodingCigar.jpg

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psyche101

I would admit that fireworks, which are consumable, and go bad quickly, could be legislated at the production level, unlike guns which can be handed down for generations.

But, millions of people fire them off every year, so wouldn't that create a huge black market, and crime lords, and money going to criminals, instead of to government taxes? If people are going to use them anyway, then why shouldn't we allow them to use them responsibly, with minor restrictions? Isn't this the same logic that allows for marijuana to become legalized? People aren't hurt by fireworks if they use them correctly. Same with pot. Used incorrectly pot can hurt animals, children, careers, relationships......

Black markets just push the price of things out of the reach of the average person. I would not pay say $200.00 for a 20 dollar firework, but a 2000% increase is a given on a black market. For instance - Adam Lanza - that gun would have cost his mother about a thousand dollars, here the same thing would cost him about 35,000 dollars. If you have $35,000.00 you do not need to buy a gun for crime.

We have Firework bans in place, but like I say, the local council does about half a dozen events through the year, as well as private companies, it is not like anyone ,misses out, and the shows are spectacular. You get a display a thousand times more impressive than anything a home backyarder can muster, and in the moist safe conditions possible. Accidents would still happen, nobody seems to get that, just like cars, but the risk would be greatly reduced to the community overall.

GTY_sydney_fireworks_ml_141231_16x9_992.jpg

Edited by psyche101

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psyche101

It seems that by far the most of the posters on this thread seem to be in agreement that the population as a whole should not be punished because of ONE who died by doing something completely stupid while intoxicated, yet we have ONE arguing with the lot of us because he thinks we are all wrong and he alone is right.

Umm........ we can't fix stupid my fellow members with common sense, let us move on and stop feeding into the stupidity here.....

Yes you can fix stupid, it is why we have laws rules and regulations.

Alcohol makes people do stupid things mixed explosives and alcohol is by far stupider than putting the two together.

If we did things how you suggest, everyone should be allowed the drive blind drunk, I bet s few people think that is a brilliant idea. Most of us do not - that's the general idea here that you are struggling with.

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Iron_Lotus

let us move on and stop feeding into the stupidity here.....

if only we could :)

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DieChecker

Black markets just push the price of things out of the reach of the average person. I would not pay say $200.00 for a 20 dollar firework, but a 2000% increase is a given on a black market. For instance - Adam Lanza - that gun would have cost his mother about a thousand dollars, here the same thing would cost him about 35,000 dollars. If you have $35,000.00 you do not need to buy a gun for crime.

We have Firework bans in place, but like I say, the local council does about half a dozen events through the year, as well as private companies, it is not like anyone ,misses out, and the shows are spectacular. You get a display a thousand times more impressive than anything a home backyarder can muster, and in the moist safe conditions possible. Accidents would still happen, nobody seems to get that, just like cars, but the risk would be greatly reduced to the community overall.

GTY_sydney_fireworks_ml_141231_16x9_992.jpg

Nice firework displays. :tu:

I'd not say 2000% though. Drugs are illegal and cost only 200% to 400% (roughly) what they would cost if made commercially. Guns and fireworks should probably be the same. We have a super easy to cross southern border with roads that lead directly to fireworks distributors. Australia does not. Fireworks would have to be brought in on a ship, if shipped in any large quantity, and so your borders are much more secure, making contraband very much harder to bring in. The only cost of bringing in illegal drugs/guns/fireworks from Mexico is basically just the cost of gas for a truck.

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psyche101

When psyche wants to ban something he sure will state his case, see gun threads, but to point use this one lone beyond stupid incident isn't helping the case.

I think this one lone incident only highlighted a very real problem, and exposed an extraordinarily stupid law that was re-enacted that should never have been.

Honestly, I just do not believe the posters here have not done a stupid thing in their lives,many of which are lucky to be here, just like me, We all do something stupid, people do not deserve to die for that, but many expressed just that sentiment, which I find extremely disheartening.

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psyche101

I don't think he is being stupid, he's just pointing out that Australia has taken such things away from their people, and less people died.

Thank you very much my good man, I can always count on your for a rational outlook, and you make a good moral compass too.

I entirely agree though that the vast majority shouldn't be punished for the stupid few. But then, maybe they have a bit more of a nanny state there in Australia?

I think we just see the entire community things differently, we have a greater concern for the majority, which does not seem to be the case at all with the US, that seems far more individual. I find the concept as foreign as much as I am sure others find our concepts.

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psyche101

If they took the guns away from Australia's military less people would have died too.

That's not the case, how do you come to that conclusion Yam?

That doesn't make doing it right or wrong.

Yes it does, it is fantastic that the gun ban ended public massacre.

He was insisting on a double standard, on something that doesn't work for states and people alike. Which is unfortunate since the state is made up of people.

I think my concepts are just beyond your own values, which I have to say I find selfish and uncaring.

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F3SS

I think this one lone incident only highlighted a very real problem, and exposed an extraordinarily stupid law that was re-enacted that should never have been.

Honestly, I just do not believe the posters here have not done a stupid thing in their lives,many of which are lucky to be here, just like me, We all do something stupid, people do not deserve to die for that, but many expressed just that sentiment, which I find extremely disheartening.

One's ability to recognize another's dumb idea does not equate to an inability to realize ones own.

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Wickian

I think this one lone incident only highlighted a very real problem, and exposed an extraordinarily stupid law that was re-enacted that should never have been.

Honestly, I just do not believe the posters here have not done a stupid thing in their lives,many of which are lucky to be here, just like me, We all do something stupid, people do not deserve to die for that, but many expressed just that sentiment, which I find extremely disheartening.

I can honestly say that none of my stupid ideas have come anywhere near as bad as deciding to light a rocket filled with gun powder on my head.

There's ideas that afterwards you can think, "Man, that was a really dumb idea. Good thing I got lucky."

Then there's ideas that you don't get to think that afterwards because they had a 100% mortality rate. People who have ideas that bad and then follow through with them without a single second thought of the consequences don't deserve pity or "safety" laws passed on their behalf.

If anything is to blame besides the victim though, I'd say it's alcohol.

Edited by Wickian
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psyche101

One's ability to recognize another's dumb idea does not equate to an inability to realize ones own.

No, but as I keep saying, society can only walk at the pace of it's slowest member.

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Wickian

Why is it OK to have guidelines for alcohol, but not for explosives?

There already are guidelines. You're supposed to be an adult to handle and/or purchase either of them.

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CrimsonKing

I'm gone 3 days and this has turned into a full on argument...

I have read valid points made on both sides,i honestly never knew fireworks were such an issue of freedoms in this country though lol...I personally got bored with them years ago but to

each their own.

I have seen alot of people do stupid things with fireworks and really it does kind of amaze me that just anyone can get them...

I understand everything that can hurt someone canot be banned it's impossible...Cars,guns,knives,the list can go on forever...But fireworks as far as i'm concerned really do not serve much of a purpose other than ones visual enjoyment two or three times a year.

I am not saying yes or no to them one way or the other,lets just make a list of the pros and the cons of fireworks and see what we can come up with.

I will start Pro no 1 they look cool...Con no 1 several fires a year are started by fireworks

Who is next?

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psyche101

Best post in the thread so far Crimson King

Two things are REALLY annoying some people here

1 - I am making good points

2 - I am foreign.

Your list is much more productive. The information matters here, but people are making it personal, because they perceive that they will "personally" lose something.

Pro no 1 they look cool...Con no 2 safety, as the stats show, young people comprise a great deal of the injured, they cannot be held responsible for the disclaimers and expected to have common knowledge, and leaving in the hand of the guardians has not worked out too well, they still get injured at an alarming rate

Pro no 1 they look cool...Con no 3 fireworks are known pollutants

Pro no 1 they look cool...Con no 4 they distress animals pets and breeders alike have serious problems with them

Pro no 1 they look cool...Con no 5 the nuisance factor, particularly for shift workers and the elderly

Pro no 1 they look cool...Con no 6 mess created that public money has to pay to clean up

Banning fireworks WILL create a new industry, It will give people jobs to monitor, test, design and instigate massive displays that are properly organised by authorities so the biggest baddest shows are free to all and the risk is greatly minimised.

LINK - Spencer On Fire: Why Fireworks Are Banned In Iowa

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CrimsonKing

Doesn't matter where your from man,i can see your points on the issue and you have clearly defined them.

If others can come up with more good reasons why just anyone can buy them than reasons stated against them maybe we can all see the good and the bad more clearly...

I'm still stuck with "they look cool" lol

That's why i wanted to start this little exercise just to see everyone elses points instead of just attacking yours...

Edited by CrimsonKing
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psyche101

Doesn't matter where your from man,i can see your points on the issue and you have clearly defined them.

If others can come up with more good reasons why just anyone can buy them than reasons stated against them maybe we can all see the good and the bad more clearly...

I'm still stuck with "they look cool" lol

That's why i wanted to start this little exercise just to see everyone elses points instead of just attacking yours...

Brilliant mate, one cannot ask for more, I did try to ask what the advantage was but was lost in the fray I think.

Well done, I will look forward to the list to see what people can come up with, I am not adverse to changing my mind on the matter if a good argument can be presented.

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CrimsonKing

Always two sides to every coin,but i prefer to actually see both sides clearly instead of seeing one side and being told the other exist...

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Myles

No I am not how rude Myles.

I got one on the emntire page, and it coul;d well have been a home job, bet you found the same.

Just Googled Sam's Club, it's like an online liquidator, they sell whatever crap that comes their way, it's not a specialist build by that company by any means.

I do not know of them being banned, I just cannot see the point what with ATV's readily available and can be purchased just about anywhere. People here just buy what is available - ATV's.

Silly to suggest stuff, who said that?

Do what? Debate a point?

Yes a fence does stop most of them, that is why the law is in place and why it stands. Where do you get that strange idea from?

LINK - Pool safety a step towards stopping drownings

The current Australian Water Safety Strategy aims to achieve a 50 per cent reduction in child drowning by 2020 but we at Royal Life Saving have been striving to achieve a 100 per cent reduction for 15 years. To reach a zero drowning goal we need to put both simple and complex measures in place. Registering a pool and ensuring it is safe, is a simple measure.

C'mon, you are better than this. Claiming that go carts are not sold for home use is BS. Claiming I was not being truthful about what came up when I Googled is BS too.

You are also wrong about Sam's Club. It is also a brick and mortar store. Over 500 locations in the USA. Each spring they sell Go Carts. Pretty good ones too.

Fences DO NOT stop drunk people who are already using the pool, from drowning. You are twisting your story. Even with fences in place, pools cause more deaths than fireworks.

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